Talk:Anna Paquin

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Pronunciation[edit]

How is her surname pronounced? I always want to say it as if it were French, but that's doubtless wrong. Does anyone know? Opera hat (talk) 00:36, 23 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Pack-win. -Duribald (talk) 06:29, 23 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]
How disappointing. But thank you. Opera hat (talk) 23:16, 25 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Sister[edit]

Her sister Katya is in a de facto relationship with Russel Norman the co-leader of the Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand (third largest party in NZ Parliament). Should the article mention this?

No, why should it? -Duribald (talk) 12:06, 26 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I note that the article does mention this fact now. How are the political leanings of her sister's partner relevant to the principle subject? Expecially in a section titled "early life" since the marriage did not, in fact, occur during her early life. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 118.90.118.29 (talk) 07:05, 4 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Katya does not have a separate Wikipedia article. I don't think it is particularly undue to mention a single fact about her in the context of Anna Paquin's family, and since at present, the "Early life" section is the only place her family is mentioned, that is the only place possible to mention her sister's relationship. Elizium23 (talk) 08:33, 4 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

First sentence[edit]

The first sentence was just edited today from 'Anna Paquin is a New Zealander actress' to '... is an actress from New Zealand'. I was about to revert it but I figured I should get what most people prefer first. So...which one? Or something different, perhaps? Depor23 (talk) 11:39, 10 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I prefer the second wording, actually. The term "New Zelander" seems awkward to me, although it is probably correct English. But, revert the sentence if you want; both ways seem equally valid to me. 155.99.222.93 (talk) 22:55, 5 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]
The term "New Zealand actress" doesn't fit, because she doesn't act only in New Zealand. It's like calling President Obama a "Hawaii politician". He might be a Hawaiian politician, but not a Hawaii politician, because he isn't in Hawaii anymore.
Besides, according to this article Paquin lived in New Zealand only from age 4 to age 13. So I don't see why New Zealand should be in the first sentence of the article at all. If it has to be, why not just say "Anna Helene Paquin is an actress from Canada and New Zealand"? — Lawrence King (talk) 06:06, 23 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
No, Obama would still be called an American president, unless New Zealand is a state within a larger country, which I hadn't heard about. She became notable while a New Zealand resident and the description as "a Canadian-born New Zealand actress" is entirely proper. Wildhartlivie (talk) 21:05, 23 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Do you have any citations to support the idea that in 2010, people still think of Paquin as "a New Zealand actress"? If you do, you should cite them. I agree that it would be correct to describe Paquin as a "New Zealander", but that's not what the sentence says right now. It doesn't describe her as a New Zealander. Instead, it describes her profession as "New Zealand actress". And that is false -- she has not been a New Zealand actress since 1995. So the introductory sentence is fifteen years out of date. It is analogous to calling Michael Jackson as "a California musician", or Barack Obama as "an Illinois politician". Jackson and Obama did become notable while residents of California and Illinois, respectively... but that does not describe what they became later. — Lawrence King (talk) 04:30, 25 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
It doesn't matter what a citation says about what people think, this is specifically covered by MOS:BIO which says:
"Context (location, nationality, or ethnicity);
1. In most modern-day cases this will mean the country of which the person is a citizen or national, or was when the person became notable."
In the case of Anna Paquin, her notability as an actor was established with her role in The Piano and she won her Academy Award in 1993 and that defines notability. This is exactly how we handle a situation such as this one. Paquin was decidedly a national of New Zealand at the point in time she became notable, i.e., was nominated for and won an Academy Award in 1993. Further, she became a New Zealand citizen in 2001. [1], so that covers any equivocation about the wording. She's a New Zealand citizen, too. But if you insist, see here, also on same website, here, here, here, here and here. Note that the majority of those links are current, including one written in April of this year. And the introduction doesn't identify her profession as "New Zealand actress", her profession is actress, her country when she became notable was New Zealand. As I said before, unless you are contending that New Zealand is a state that is part of another country, your analogy of Michael Jackson as a California musician or Barak Obama as an Illinois politician is logically flawed. They became notable while living in the United States, they are American. You're applying statehood examples to a situation regarding country of residency. Not the same thing. In fact, if one follows MOS:BIO to the letter, it says "Similarly, previous nationalities and/or the country of birth should not be mentioned in the opening sentence unless they are relevant to the subject's notability." Technically, Canada shouldn't be mentioned in the lead paragraph. Wildhartlivie (talk) 06:38, 25 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]
But even if I change California/Illinois to United States / American, the analogy remains the same. You can say "Michael Jackson is an American musician," because semantically American is an adjective and describes Jackson. But you cannot say "Michael Jackson is an America musician"! Because America is a noun, there is no way in English grammar to parse "Michael Jackson is an America musician" as two separate claims about Jackson (that he is American and that he is a musician). The only way to parse it is that he is an "America musician" -- whatever that means. And that's what you are doing here. Paquin is indeed a New Zealander and and actress, so it would be 100% correct and proper to say "Anna Paquin is a New Zealander actress". But the current article says "Anna Paquin is a New Zealand actress". This says nothing about her nationality -- it asserts that her profession is "New Zealand actress", which is either a meaningless term, or it refers to an actress who works in New Zealand. — Lawrence King (talk) 18:22, 25 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

MTS not MCI?[edit]

This looks a little sketchy - weren't the 1994 telephone company commmericals for Manitoba Telecom Services (MTS), not MCI? (Commercials noted for the tag line "Welcome to the future" whispered by Paquin.) And if she was living in NZ at the time, why would a Winnipeg-based company go to the other side of the world to get an actor for a commercial, even if it was her natal city? --Wtshymanski (talk) 14:03, 29 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Photos[edit]

Does anyone have a photo of this woman that is not of the side of her face? All three pictures on this page are side views. Probably not the best photos for a Wiki article. -hsxeric 8:52 May 4, 2012

full-face photo of Anna Paquin
There are a number of photos at commons:Category:Anna Paquin and some of them have full-face shots. File:Anna Paquin 1 (2009).jpg might be suitable, perhaps to replace the middle picture of the three in the article. You are welcome to make this replacement yourself.-gadfium 23:17, 4 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

English variant?[edit]

The template {{Use British English}} is at the top of this article, but I find it curious because Paquin has no strong ties to Great Britain. Per WP:ENGVAR, shouldn't we use instead {{Use New Zealand English}} or even {{Use Canadian English}}? Elizium23 (talk) 02:29, 22 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I would be happy with New Zealand English. It's rare that there's much difference in written language between NZ and British English. I think there's no point in using Canadian English as she moved to NZ when she was four years old.-gadfium 03:56, 22 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Anna Paquin moved from Canada to New Zealand at 4 and left New Zealand at age 13.... She's lived the last 16 years in the US, graduated high school in the US, went to university in the US, currently lives and works in the US, was married in the US, has 2 step children in the US, is going to give birth to twins in the US, etc. Except for a single child role she did, all the projects that have made her famous are US-based films and TV series. What's all this silly talk of British English, New Zealand English, and Canadian English?Udibi (talk) 09:50, 18 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah it makes sense the article should be in American English so why wasn't that done? Crazy. 70.190.200.191 (talk) 15:31, 9 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
The first variant of English used in this article was American English, as well as mdy dates, so that's also an argument for converting it back at this point. Elizium23 (talk) 10:49, 18 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]
You seem to have a vested interest in this article so change it to American English please...geez 70.190.200.191 (talk) 15:31, 9 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Canadian[edit]

Bryantriplex (talk · contribs) has edit warred on this article (and got a block for edit warring), repeatedly replacing "Canadian" with "Canadian-born". A cited source quotes Paquin: "I am still a Canadian citizen." A Canadian citizen by definition is Canadian. Bryantriplex initially argued that being Canadian-born didn't necessarily make her a Canadian. When I added the source with her quote about Canadian citizenship, he immediately reverted again. After he came off his block for edit warring, he reverted again. Now his argument is that "This Wiki page has almost always described her as a "Canadian-born New Zealand" actress and it was never deemed incorrect. Somebody changed it." Does anyone have a rational objection (as opposed to a bizarre obsession with simply winning an argument) to describing her as Canadian? If so, please provide your rationale in light of the unequivocal evidence of Canadian citizenship. Sundayclose (talk) 00:14, 28 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

  • Canadian-born New Zealand actress appears to be the best description for Anna Paquin. She may have dual-citizenship and can claim citizenship to both countries.-- Kayoty (talk) 01:14, 28 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
    • She does have dual citizenship. So why can't she be described as Canadian-New Zealand actress? Is anyone born in Canada automatically a Canadian citizen? Sundayclose (talk) 01:26, 28 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
      Agree. Can’t just say New Zealander actress if she has dual citizenship. Also her father was Canadian so not only being born there she has a right to citizenship though himUrgeback (talk) 20:27, 29 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Canadian-born, according to many talk pages and descriptions here on Wikipedia, does not imply that the person was simply born in Canada without citizenship. "Canadian-born New Zealand" does seem to be the best way and also the most accurate way of describing her, as she was born in Canada but raised in New Zealand and not in Canada. She did not grow up as a Canadian. Many sources evens describe her as being a "Canadian-born New Zealand" actress, including ones that are used on this Wikipedia article. Two of those sources are the ones right next to the sentence that describe her as a "Canadian-New Zealand" actress. The introduction sentence describes her as one thing while the two sources right next to it describe her as something else, which should not be the case, ever.

Being "Canadian-born" can mean that the person was born a Canadian citizen. Bryantriplex (talk) 02:39, 28 June 2015 (UTC)Bryantriplex[reply]

  • This could get more complex if she also has American citizenship. Maybe the sentence should be rewritten. For example: "Anna Paquin is an actress who was born in Canada, began her acting career in New Zealand at the age of eleven and now lives in California."-- Kayoty (talk) 07:11, 28 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Problem is according to this article she has Canadian citizenship as well. She was born there and has the citizenship. She was mostly raised in New Zealand and has that citizenship as well. Now she no longer lives there and now lives permanently in the US. So it seems like Canada, New Zealand is merely a place she used to live. Why if she had dual nationality is she only New Zealander? She wasn’t born there and doesn’t live there anymore, so why is the New Zealand citizenship override her Canadian one? I feel Canadian-New Zealander is the more appropriate term. But she certainly can’t be considered just a Canadian-born New Zealander if she holds dual nationality. Also for the first four years of her life she DID grow up Canadian, but for the rest of her life it seems she won’t live as a New Zealander if she lives in US.Urgeback (talk) 20:25, 29 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The lead already notes her being born in Canada, Winnipeg specifically. It seems kind of redundant to call her a "Canadian-born New Zealand actress" and then once again note that she was born in Winnipeg, Canada. Plus, "-born" terms are usually avoided per WP:ETHNICITY. She gained notability while in New Zealand on a New Zealand co-produced film and her career has been primarily in America/Hollywood, not Canada. She resides in California as of 2020[2] but she isn't confirmed to have American citizenship. Clear Looking Glass (talk) 01:42, 2 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

In the US and Canada, you can not hold citizenship from three countries at once. AntonFMD (talk) 05:35, 3 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Also to add further information to the discussion: according the the article she was born in Canada (retaining the citizenship) moved to New Zealand at age 4 (4 years raised as a Canadian), moved to the US at age 16 (12 years raised as a New Zealander) and has lived there since (24 years.) By far the county she has a resided in mostly is America. Yes she was in New Zealand 8 years longer than Canada, but it’s not the country where she has spent most her life. By far that is the US. Granted there is no citation for her having an American citizenship, but by point of bringing it up it using 8 years in New Zealand and 4 in Canada while she has dual nationality and call her Canadian-born New Zealander seems inappropriate. Also adding to the fact that she had an Canadian father and a New Zealand mother also makes her both by ethnicity. I just don’t understand why the Canadian part of her is replaced with the New Zealand part because of 8 more extra years. Urgeback (talk) 11:40, 30 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Hi @Urgeback - This has been discussed over 13 years ago with user @Wildhartlivie pointing out why New Zealand is the country she gained notability in and first worked as an actress. And other users seemed to agree on "New Zealand" (with the alternative wording of "New Zealander" causing some debate). Adding "Canadian-born" is redundant because the lead already notes that she was born in Winnipeg.
In respect to guidelines MOS:LEADBIO and WP:ETHNICITY, she may have dual Canadian citizenship, but Paquin achieved notability not as a Canadian actress or even in Canada, but rather in New Zealand. Her first major role was in 1993's The Piano, a film with a New Zealand director and filmed in New Zealand.[3] It is also considered a New Zealand co-production with two other countries (Australia and France) that aren't Canada or the United States. Furthermore, filming took place by the time Paquin was living in New Zealand:
Paquin was born in Canada but raised in New Zealand and it was in New Zealand where she got her start[4]
This discussion here seems to point at her being called "Canadian-born New Zealand actress", which is what several sources describe her as:
Canadian-born True Blood actress ... Starring Canadian-born, New Zealand actress Anna Paquin[5][
Canadian-born Kiwi Anna Paquin [6]
Canadian-born New Zealand actress[7]
But again, WP:ETHNICITY states against mentioning birth place unless particularly relevant and the wording of those sources all puts emphasis on her being from New Zealand, as the "Canadian-born" seems to be more of a side fact. The opening paragraph already notes her birth in Winnipeg.
Looking at her provided filmography and career, it has been largely in American/Hollywood productions and of course The Piano, her first major role and the film that launched her to stardom. It's a New Zealand co-production and filmed there. She was living in Los Angeles as of 2020[8] but it doesn't appear that she has American citizenship and not every passport a notable person possesses or possessed needs to be added to the lede anyways. Clear Looking Glass (talk) 01:23, 2 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Actually according to this [1] she has lived in America since she was 16 which would make it since 1998-onwards. The high school she attended was an American one, so she has lived in the United states through virtually all her adolescence and her entire adult life. To look at Olivia Newton-John she is considered a English-American singer/actress. This is despite the fact she spent almost her entire childhood in Australia and was well-known an an Australian. The fact that she was born there and had citizenship can’t be ignored regardless of people think she is from. Mel Gibson was introduced as an Australian actor, but was later known that he was in fact, American. Tina Turner was well-known as an American singer, but the fact she did in fact renounce her citizenship and become a citizen of another country means she cannot be listed as an American anymore. Paquin has never renounced her Canadian citizenship and despite what “popular opinion” is the fact being she is a Canadian as well, by birth and citizenship. Urgeback (talk) 05:36, 2 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Also some further links that refer to her as Canadian-New Zealander:
[2]
[3]
[4]
[5] Urgeback (talk) 05:51, 2 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The lead sentence should say either "Canadian and New Zealand" (the use of "and" reduces ambiguity per MOS:ETHNICITY) or "Canadian-born New Zealand" IMO. Saying only "New Zealand" sounds incomplete. She's a citizen of both countries but currently lives in neither. Thedarkknightli (talk) 20:46, 5 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Agreed but isn’t the proper term for someone from New Zealand, New Zealander? Urgeback (talk) 22:08, 12 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]
New Zealander is a correct demonym, but as an adjective, New Zealand is the correct form. Clear Looking Glass (talk) Clear Looking Glass (talk) 04:38, 7 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]
@Thedarkknightli - it's not true that she doesn't consider New Zealand her home anymore or doesn't visit the country regularly. It might not be her primary residence, but she said she still travels back to New Zealand every year according to a 2019 interview with 1 News.[9] She still calls New Zealand home, and gets back at least once a year so her children can spend time with their cousins. [At the 3:45 mark of the video].
I don't see why it's "incomplete" to just call her a "New Zealand actress". We already note her Winnipeg (Canada) birth in the subsequent sentence. New Zealand is the country she is largely identified with, the one she first gained notability in, and she still visits New Zealand regardless on America being her current home. It was agreed upon that someone like Nina Dobrev is just "Canadian" despite her Bulgarian-birth and dual Canadian/Bulgarian citizenship because she was raised in Canada and did not gain notability in Bulgaria despite being proud of her origins. Quite frankly, she seems like a rather similar scenario to Paquin but everything is based on discussion.
Here's a Canadian media outlet noting that while Paquin was born in Canada and has dual Canadian citizenship, she is primarily associated as being a New Zealand national[10] ​The first Canadian-born actress to win an Oscar in over 60 years, Anna Paquin is actually an arguable inclusion here. While born in Winnipeg, her family moved to New Zealand when she was four and she is generally associated with the latter as a nationality. Further evidence is the New Zealand government calling her the first New Zealand actress to win an Academy Award for acting.[11] Eleven-year-old Anna Paquin became the first New Zealander to win an Academy Award for acting
@Urgeback - Even the Canadian interview you provided describes Paquin as a "New Zealander", but she also mentions her primary residence in America and how her cosmopolitan life and how it affects her self-identity.[12] the little New Zealander But I wouldn't put much faith on media profiles, since they seem all over the place. One even calls her "New Zealand-Canadian-American"[13]. Clear Looking Glass (talk) 04:24, 7 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]
The New Zealand government can call her what they want. It doesn’t make her so. Olivia Newton John called australia home and is still listed as an English-Australian singer. Again she only spent roughly 10 years in New Zealand, wasn’t born there. Alfred Hitchcock was an american citizen yet is listed as British. You can’t just ignore her birthplace and citizenship because she is known as something Urgeback (talk) 10:44, 7 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I’ve changed my mind. Now I agree with your arguments, @Clear Looking Glass. Sorry for my ignorance. I’ve realized Canada isn’t that important to Paquin’s identity. Also, a lot of reliable sources simply describe her as a “New Zealand / Kiwi actress”. Let’s ignore the other stuff. Btw, shall we take the issue to WP:DRN?
Regards, Thedarkknightli (talk) 19:05, 27 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ https://www.theglobeandmail.com/arts/just-a-small-town-girl-with-a-taste-for-the-undead/article20387150/
  2. ^ https://people.com/tag/anna-paquin/
  3. ^ https://www.female.com.au/celebrities/anna-paquin.htm
  4. ^ https://www.mintychauthentics.com/collections/anna-paquin/wes-craven
  5. ^ https://thetvdb.com/people/310353-anna-paquin

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