Talk:Western Sydney Wanderers FC/Archive 2

Archive 1

Archive 2

Sydney Rovers FC

Is the section about Sydney Rovers FC really relevant to this article? I dont believe it should be there.Simione001 (talk) 00:06, 30 June 2012 (UTC)

I believe it should stay, as it helps to explain the history of the A-League bid process before the team itself was announced. It's roughly equivalent to things like Manchester United F.C. having a section on it's early years as Newton Heath. I suspect that the Rovers article may suffer an AFD in the future, so keeping something on the Wanderers page will help in the event that takes places. Macktheknifeau (talk) 08:38, 11 July 2012 (UTC)

The Sydney Rovers bid has nothing to do with this. Its a completely different club. Portillo (talk) 08:36, 3 August 2012 (UTC)

I agree with Portillo. Sydney Rovers is a expansion bid made by a separate consortium of individuals that have nothing to do with Western Sydney Wanderers.Simione001 (talk) 08:10, 11 September 2012 (UTC)

I have since re-worded the section as it had nothing specific to do with Western Sydney Wanderers, though I have expanded in general on past attempts to establish a Western Sydney A-League club as suggested by Macktheknifeau. --2nyte (talk) 04:03, 22 April 2013 (UTC)

Userfied Sydney Derby

The old article was deleted. A userfied version exists at Sydney Derby. Macktheknifeau (talk) 08:38, 11 July 2012 (UTC)

Nationalities of Elrich

Please don't add incorrect information. The note at the top of the squad list says: "Flags indicate national team as has been defined under FIFA eligibility rules." According to FIFA, Elrich is an Australian under their eligibility rules. Playing in a non-official match does not change this. Hack (talk) 07:34, 11 September 2012 (UTC)

He was in there squad for 2014 FIFA World Cup qualification – AFC Fourth Round and played for the senior team in a friendly against a club side therefore his highest level of representation is with Lebabnon not Australia. He choose to play for another country and he did.Simione001 (talk) 08:08, 11 September 2012 (UTC)

He was named in the squad but was unable to play because he is not eligible to play for them according to FIFA. The unofficial match has nothing to do with FIFA. Hack (talk) 08:19, 11 September 2012 (UTC)

Fair enough.Simione001 (talk) 08:26, 11 September 2012 (UTC)

Internationally capped players table

Alza08 recently added a table which included internationally capped players and their international stats, which I think we should remove. It's trivial information about the players that has no relevance to Western Sydney Wanderers FC. The information can easily be found on the individual player articles or on the national team articles. Why does it have to be here? It has no place being in this article. So should we remove the table? I say yes. --2nyte (talk) 10:24, 30 April 2013 (UTC)

On my opinion, that table should stay. The vast majority of the Wikipedia articles about Super Rugby teams, like the Melbourne Rebels and the Southern Kings for example, all have sections listing their internationally capped players. Seeing as nobody has any objections about those sections staying on those articles, I don't see why anybody should object to having that same section in this article.--Alza08 (talk) 07:28, 6 May 2013 (UTC)

Yes, but the vast majority of the Wikipedia articles about association football teams, like Manchester United F.C., Boca Juniors, FC Barcelona and Real Madrid C.F. for example, do not have sections listing their internationally capped players. As I said above it's trivial information that has no relevance being on an article about the club. This article is about the club, not the players, so that information is irrelevant here. --2nyte (talk) 12:51, 6 May 2013 (UTC)

I've just noticed you've added internationally capped tables to all A-League articles. From my reasons above I think they should be removed. --2nyte (talk) 12:59, 6 May 2013 (UTC)

TP Picture Caption

He is pictured on this article in his coaching kit from when he was assistant coach at Sydney FC, not in WSW kit. The picture Caption probably needs to be altered slightly to reflect this. --TinTin (talk) 02:15, 10 May 2013 (UTC)

 Done I have changed the caption to "Tony Popovic, current head coach of the Wanderers". Ideally we should get a more recent image of Popovic. --2nyte (talk) 03:53, 10 May 2013 (UTC)

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Western Sydney Wanderers FC/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Casliber (talk · contribs) 00:31, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Right, I will be reviewing this one and making straightforward copyedits as I go (please revert if I accidentally change the meaning) - I will jot queries below. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 00:31, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Football NSW stated its dislike to Lowy's autocratic style - dislike of

 Done--2nyte (talk) 11:01, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

These forums helped shape the club to a specific culture and style. - the idea of supporters' forums deciding how a club can play I find hard to digest. Supporters can wish for bright attacking football (doesn't everybody?) but surely that is up to the coach and players?

Feel free to re-word it. I wanted to specify that the club is and desires to be very community oriented; community engagement is a primary focus to the club and has been from establishment. Source--2nyte (talk) 15:50, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Yeah - I re-read the source. I rejigged it a little but tried to keep true to the source. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 20:56, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

I'd mention the tanking of the Rovers some years previously. Only needs one or two sentences.

 Done; added brief note on FFA's attempt of pursuing a second Sydney club.--2nyte (talk) 15:31, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

The main of these were in moving the club from Parramatta Stadium to the Sydney Football Stadium in the Sydney CBD - mentioned two sentences before. Can this be streamlined or abbreviated?

 Done; streamlined the section.--2nyte (talk) 15:31, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Para 3 in Foundations is very repetitive - several sentences are repetitious and could be trimmed. If you want me to take a crack at it I am happy to.

Again, feel free to re-word it. I do agree that it could be trimmed down.--2nyte (talk) 15:50, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

After a history making start, the club appeared in the Cup finals and won their first A-League Premiership - I was about to add a hyphen to make "history-making" but then wondered why the start was history-making.....

 Done; re-worded the second sentence.--2nyte (talk) 15:31, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Do the club have any relationship with other local western Sydney clubs such as Marconi or Sydney United etc.?

No specific relation to any local clubs, though it is well supported by the western Sydney community including local governments and Marconi Stallions FC (again no specific relationship with club besides the casual acknowledgment).--2nyte (talk) 15:50, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

To give the article balance, I think the Inaugural season section is too brief really. A few more sentences would be good.

I summarised that section, and wouldn't really know what to expand on.--2nyte (talk) 15:50, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Any particular thrilling wins? biggest win? memorable matches?

NB: Don't forget to tweak the formatting of the licence on this photo - File:New Sydney A-League Club Announcement.jpg

More in morning. I will try to copyedit later and am trying to give it as big a shove as possible towards FAC.....polishing up quite nicely...Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 15:10, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

Query

What's the status of this review? It's been over three weeks since anything was posted. There do seem to have been a number of edits to the article in the interim... Thanks. BlueMoonset (talk) 14:56, 1 September 2013 (UTC)

1. Well written?:

Prose quality:

Manual of Style compliance:

2. Factually accurate and verifiable?:

References to sources:

Citations to reliable sources, where required:

No original research:

3. Broad in coverage?:

Major aspects:

Focused:

4. Reflects a neutral point of view?:

Fair representation without bias:

5. Reasonably stable?

No edit wars, etc. (Vandalism does not count against GA):

6. Illustrated by images, when possible and appropriate?:

Images are copyright tagged, and non-free images have fair use rationales:

Images are provided where possible and appropriate, with suitable captions:

Overall:

Pass or Fail: - look, I think the article is nearly there. A little bit on some of the opening season and i'd be happy. However, the ongoing issues with soccer/football terminology lead me to wind this up now and re-examine in future once the debate is settled. I will be happy to re-review at a later date. Cas Liber (talk · contribs) 12:42, 8 September 2013 (UTC)

This is a soccer club

User:Macktheknifeau is clearly being deliberately and provocatively confrontational in repeatedly changing the description of this club from a soccer club, as agreed for all Australian clubs at Soccer in Australia, to a football club. In my Edit summary for my last change back to the national consensus I asked him to discuss it. He didn't, which is very bad form, he is edit warring, and on the verge of a breach of the Three revert rule.

We have had multiple failed attempts to change the name of the game to "football" at Soccer in Australia. I see no reason why this club should be treated any differently from any other in Australia. Yes, the hard core fans from the Sydney side of the Barassi Line want it changed, but I doubt if anybody else does. And it's against consensus at the national article.

Not only is the change wrong. It is, as I said at the beginning, deliberately and provocatively confrontational, and not discussed here. Macktheknifeau's behaviour here is like that of a spoilt child who won't accept the umpire's decision.

Now, this is the wrong place to debate whether football is the right or wrong name. We cannot do that for every individual club. But it's right place to point out that Macktheknifeau's behaviour is unacceptable. HiLo48 (talk) 05:53, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

You are the one starting an edit war by constantly reverting legitimate edits because you refuse to WP:DROPTHESTICK. No, it's not a soccer club. It's a football club. That is what the name of the club stands for, it's the official name of the sport for the international organisation committee, the official name for the Asian federation, the official name for the East Asian Football Federation, the official name for Football Federation Australia and for Football New South Wales. It is also what the media in Sydney call the club and what the people who run and support the club call it and the sport. This is an article about a Sydney club, what people in Melbourne in the AFL bubble call the club has no bearing. The AFL is irrelevant. Other pages are irrelevant. Using Football linked as such: football, along with other obvious context means there is no confusion except for people who choose to deliberately ignore the context in order to push their Melbourne-centric agenda. Please drop the the stick and stop reverting legitimate edits. Please note that you or an associate of yours would be the one breaching the Three revert rule as any subsequent revert to my legitimate edits would be the 3rd revert by you or one of your friends. Any attempt to revert my edits a 3rd time regardless of which specific users it is will be reported as a breach of the Three revert rule by a collective group trying to game the system in order to breach the intent and spirit of 3RR without a technical breach. Thank you. Macktheknifeau (talk) 06:36, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

Let's stick to one piece of logic. There have been repeated discussions at Talk:Soccer in Australia about changing the name for Australian articles to "football". Those discussions have not succeeded. It's pointless and stupid to repeat that debate at the article for every club in Australia. We won't do it. You need to take your case to Talk:Soccer in Australia. Oh, and WP:3RR refers to changes within 24 hours. I have made only one revert in the past 24 hours, so another by me right now would not breach the rule. However, in good faith (something you have not shown), I have given you the opportunity to discuss it here, something you should have done to begin with. You have presented no reason why this club should be treated differently from any other, and as already stated, we cannot have this debate at the article for every club. We MUST all accept what was agreed at Talk:Soccer in Australia. The only argument you can present here is why this club should be treated differently from any other in Australia. You have not done so yet. HiLo48 (talk) 07:02, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

This is a Sydney article about a football club. Your discussions about what to call a certain topic on a completely different article are irrelevant. This article is not about an AFL club in Melbourne, or a topic that remotely involves AFL, or even a topic that remotely involves multiple sports other than football. The sport is called football in Sydney across the community, media and officially. The other sports in Sydney are called Rugby Union, Rugby League and AFL. What the AFL project calls sports in another article has no basis whatsoever for deciding what to call football on a page for a club that is commonly called Western Sydney Wanderers Football Club, that plays in a football competition organised by Football Federation Australia and also plays in the Asian Football Federation, Asian Champions League competition. Please do not revert edits further or I will report you and the rest of the AFL project and other related users for edit warring. Macktheknifeau (talk) 11:08, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

Wikipedia can make decisions on style for one country, but not for one club. That would be completely stupid and impractical. And Soccer in Sydney doesn't exist, so you can't do it for just Sydney. Please broaden your horizons and take your thought to Talk:Soccer in Australia, or nowhere. HiLo48 (talk) 21:53, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

Hi Mack. Just letting you know that I have reverted your last edit. There was an RM at Talk:Soccer in Australia in August, where it was determined that soccer should be used when referring to the sport in Australia. You may think the result of that RM is irrelevant to this article, but the very fact that people are still debating the issue six months on tells you your edits are going to be controversial and need to be discussed first.

You can report my two reverts here and my "vandalism" here or here. Cheers. Jevansen (talk) 22:15, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

Hey Macktheknifeau - I thought it was just so ironic that your insistence that this naming issue is all about how local people describe the club, when its very next game was in Melbourne, where the common name for the game is definitely soccer. Did you go to the game? Have you ever been to a game in Melbourne? (And the pub brawl must have been fun.) HiLo48 (talk) 22:38, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

The pub brawl was started by idiots from Melbourne. I've been to games in Melbourne before, and spend as little time in Melbourne as possible. Macktheknifeau (talk) 03:45, 2 January 2014 (UTC)

I guess that means that you're in no position to comment on the broader use of the names football and soccer in Melbourne, or anywhere on that side of the Barassi Line. That's around half the Australian population. HiLo48 (talk) 03:56, 2 January 2014 (UTC)

It's less than half the population. Never forget that. Your boganball chip scrapping game is only really popular in one state, the rest are just tagalongs. Macktheknifeau (talk) 12:29, 4 January 2014 (UTC)

I like many sports, including soccer and Aussie Rules. I enjoy watching a good game a rugby, either kind. American football confuses me, but I can still get pleasure from watching it. Gaelic football can be enjoyable too. Enjoying all these sports means I have made an effort to learn about them and see the merits in them all. How about you? HiLo48 (talk) 22:39, 4 January 2014 (UTC)

Macktheknifeau is at it again. Two changes of "soccer" to "football" already today in the lead of the article. I suggested in my most recent Edit summary that AN/I might be next. HiLo48 (talk) 03:32, 13 January 2014 (UTC)

Why is "football" not acceptable to use? The word is in context and it is linked to Association football. Besides that, the club is a 'Football Club', governed and owned by Football Federation Australia, which has renamed the sport to "football" since 2005. There is no problem with the use of the word, as any other on wikipedia.--2nyte (talk) 03:53, 13 January 2014 (UTC)

This is not the place to discuss it. The RfCs at Soccer in Australia set policy for Australian articles by consensus. Until consensus changes at Soccer in Australia, that's the name of the game in Australian articles. We cannot debate the matter at every single article. Please don't waste time trying. HiLo48 (talk) 04:02, 13 January 2014 (UTC)

Your consensus is invalid meatpuppetry, POV spamming and not applicable to a single topic article such as this. Do whatever you want on articles involving more than just one sport, but this isn't one of them. Macktheknifeau (talk) 15:10, 13 January 2014 (UTC)

This is not the place to discuss it. HiLo48 (talk) 20:34, 13 January 2014 (UTC)