Talk:Bulbasaur/Archive 1

Random Help
I moved the following from the main page to here:

For more information:

Pokemon Information

Wikipedia is not a collection of links. -- Zoe

You're right, and I'm working on the rest of the article texts. For now, though, these DO provide the info... AnnieKat

There, first of 151+... AnnieKat

If you need more information, pop into this Pokemon's Talk page. - what does this mean? -- Zoe

Heh, I'll link it to this. Since you've stuck the links in here...

Ru/Sa is coming out soon. New Pokefreaks will arise. And perhaps they'll wish to know about pooor Bulbie.

Anyone want to help out with developing a standard entry format for Pokemon (like the standard formats for countries, chemical elements, species and the like)? I've converted the Bulbasaur page to a first attempt, but it's a "written at 4:30am" kind of attempt, really, and needs work. ^_~ -- Schnee 02:36, 8 Sep 2003 (UTC)

I don't think it looks good that there are 2 Biology sections. Newguineafan 22:51, August 10, 2005 (UTC)

Maybe a paragraph about its abilities, techniques and attacks with a detailed description could be useful and cool for both the Fan and the non-Fan. 212.98.150.6 13:36, 7 January 2006 (UTC)

Names in other languages
It would be interesting if someone adds in this article all the language variations of "Bulbasaur" (German, Korean...). First, few languages have their own names of pokemons, and second, many articles about anime characters include names in other languages (see The Smurfs). CG 20:09, 11 January 2006 (UTC)


 * We've got German, French and Japanese... --Cel e stianpower háblame 20:34, 11 January 2006 (UTC)


 * Yes, but the explanation for the german name is missing. Along with the Korean name which you can find it here. CG 18:09, 13 January 2006 (UTC)


 * Don't panic!! I've just done the German name origin. NP Chilla 11:19, 17 January 2006


 * Some jerk has deleted all but the Japanese names from all of the pokemon pages --Almighty Rajah


 * Could you give us an example? H ig hway Return to Oz...  18:59, 2 August 2006 (UTC)

Template:Spoken Article
The infobox for signalling that this is a spoken article should be at the top. It's pretty pointless for a blind guy to use a speech synthesizer all the way to the end before finding out theres a recording. I'm not too sure where to put it though, without weirding out the layout. I'll leave this to other guys. - Hahnchen 22:36, 13 January 2006 (UTC)


 * Yeah - I saw that too. Is there a way of putting it right of the TOC? --Cel e stianpower háblame 08:51, 14 January 2006 (UTC)


 * There is. Make a table with two horizontal cells. Put in the left one and  in the right one.[[Image:Weather rain.png]] Soothing  R  09:39, 14 January 2006 (UTC)


 * So User:ALoan has moved the spoken article back to the bottom because of whitespace in IE. Is that where it's going to stay? - Hahnchen 21:41, 21 January 2006 (UTC)


 * I'd rather it was at the top. What do others think? --Cel e stianpower háblame 22:32, 21 January 2006 (UTC)


 * The rules as to the spoken box's location are pretty vague--personally I think they should always be at the top of an article (they require a lot of work, and are way more important than "Links and References"). I'd say put it at the top, but being a featured article candidate, it may be best to leave it just to be sure the article looks the best it can :). -WAZAAAA 01:19, 28 January 2006 (UTC)

Where do the French and German names keep disappearing to?
How come this is the only Pokemon page without German and French names at the beginning of it? I have tried to put them on at various moments, but they keep vanishing. Why is this? NP Chilla 09:11, 1 February 2006


 * I suggest you add them in a "Bulbasaur in other languages" section at the bottom ofthe article. CG 15:51, 1 February 2006 (UTC)


 * They were removed through a discussion at Featured article candidates/Bulbasaur. Please comment there if you disagree. --Cel e stianpower háblame 20:22, 1 February 2006 (UTC)


 * It was argued that names in other languages aren't important information. That's why they shouldn't be put in the intro of the article. But many anime characters have an "in other languages" section (see The Smurfs). CG 20:33, 1 February 2006 (UTC)


 * The Smurfs are animated, surely, but whatever “anime” is, exactly, I don’t think they’re it. :-P -- WikidSmaht (talk) 13:50, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

But this is absolutley inconsistent: every single Pokémon has German and French names following its Japanese name, but Bulbasaur is the only one that doesn't. Why is this? NP Chilla 17:23, 9 March 2006 (UTC)


 * Personally, I think it's the other articles that have a problem - Japanese and English are almost exclusively the names used for Pokemon as they are created in Japan and widely marketed in the US, and this is the English Wikipedia, not German or French. —Cuiviénen (Cuivië) 18:20, 9 March 2006 (UTC)


 * But why does this one have to be different? This is the only creature out of 395 that has its Deutsch and Français names at the end of the article; whilst all other monsters have theirs at the beginning, where it catches the attention of a browser. (And, let's not forget, it's not a featured article candidate anymore, so it doesn't have to be different anyway.) NP Chilla 20:49, 10 March 2006 (UTC)


 * Ummm, yes it is.--Cel es tianpower háblame 22:19, 10 March 2006 (UTC)


 * Put it this way: change the other ones if there's a problem with this one being different. — Cuivi é  nen , 14:01, 12 March 2006 (UTC)


 * I've removed the French/Korean/German names from the three Kanto starters and their evolutions. I'm going in order based on the National Pokedex, so this may take a long time. AceticAcid 08:57, 22 April 2006 (UTC)


 * By the end of August all Pkemon articles will have their French and German names added at the front of the article. From Wikipedia: Pokemon Adoption Center/ Style -- This should say that the Pokémon is a fictional character from the Pokémon franchise and what its name is in Japanese (and German and French, if possible). --71.193.71.50 16:13, 26 July 2006 (UTC)


 * Please do not add the French or German names to Pokémon articles, they aren't important. English is our language, and japanese is their original name, French and German have little impact. H ig hway Return to Oz... 16:22, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

Twiddly points
Isn't it usual to use "straight" quotes rather than “curly” ones? And shouldn;t the footnotes appear after the puntuation, not before? And finally, can someone convert to the &lt;ref> style (see m:Cite/Cite.php)? -- &mdash;The preceding unsigned comment was added by ALoan (talk &bull; contribs).


 * Either is acceptable according to the Manual of Style. I think the curved typographical quotes look more professional, especially in a Featured Article candidate, which, as some of the best work Wikipedia has to offer, may someday make it into print in 1.0. Most articles use straight marks, but that’s likely just because few contributors want to make the effort.


 * If you don’t like the footnotes, check the Manual of Style and correct them, as for the citation parsers, I don’t know how to do that, if you do, maybe you could? -- WikidSmaht (talk) 18:27, 24 February 2006 (UTC)


 * Typewriter, or "straight" quotes are by far more common, although there is no consensus on which version to use. Since there is no consensus, a mass conversion is improper unless there is consensus for that particular article to do so. Yes, the footnotes should appear after the punctuation. As for converting to, that needs to be agreed upon first.  Pagra shtak  22:28, 24 February 2006 (UTC)

Ketchum
What’s with the change from “Ash” to “Ketchum”? I can see mixing them up for variety, but as his surname is little-used, it seems inappropriate to me, and frankly sounds a little ridiculous( my opinion). Is there something in the Manual of Style that states a preference for surname even when a person or fictional character is almost exclusively called by his given name? -- WikidSmaht (talk) 13:50, 26 February 2006 (UTC)


 * I agree - "Ketchum" is rarely mentioned - "Ash" is used almost exclusively. Could we change it back? --Cel es tianpower háblame 13:53, 26 February 2006 (UTC)


 * Will do. -- WikidSmaht (talk) 16:14, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

Computer worm
If a reference can be found, this would be a good indication of Bulbasaur’s cultural impact, and should be restored. -- WikidSmaht (talk) 18:48, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

Google &rarr;Symantec:

VBS.Saur.A ... Also Known As:  Bulbasaur Type: Worm ... Number of infections: 0 - 49 Number of sites: 0 - 2 Geographical distribution: Low Threat containment: Easy Removal: Easy ... ...the worm copies itself to \bulbasaur.bat. Then, the worm creates and executes \Bulbasaur.vbs using a temporary file calld BulBasaur1.vbs...

HTH. -- ALoan (Talk) 19:01, 28 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Someone should restore that, then. Perhaps I will. Or not. -- WikidSmaht (talk) 13:21, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

Wait. A virus with less than 50 reported infections distributed over 2 or less sites? That's waaaaaaaaay below what's worth mentioning even in passing. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 02:26, 9 April 2006 (UTC)

No Japanese article
Amazingly, this article is a featured article in English but appears to be completely non-existent in the Japanese Wikipedia. Any fellow Japanese speakers care to double-check? I did a brief run through the Japanese version and couldn't find anything under フシギダネ or any other name. Alexthe5th 11:30, 12 March 2006 (UTC)


 * That's because the Japanese Wikipedia has all its Pokemon articles in one great long list; .  smurray  inch e  ster (User), (Talk) 13:41, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

Anime
Can someone cite DVDs or episodes with production numbers, instead of or in addition to the Serebii.net episode guide? I think it is extremely inappropriate for a Featured Article to use a fan site( even a high-quality one like that) as the only source for some of its info. By adding the DVD info, we can cite the episodes themselves as primary sources, and get around that. In addition, the episode summaries, while accurate, are TERRIBLY written, I believe by a non-native speaker of English. I consider the site quality because of its scope and accuracy, but the English is often quite poor. -- WikidSmaht (talk) 13:21, 13 March 2006 (UTC)


 * I'm trying to go through the articles to find the relevant episodes as references. However I only have part of the first season as the DVDs weren't made available this side of the Atlantic. --

OverlordKain (talk) 11:44, 16 March 2006 (UTC)
 * They’re listed at the bottom in the notes section, just commented out. Go to the editing page and scroll way down. -- WikidSmaht (talk) 23:55, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

Spoken article
The quality of the spoken article is VERY VERY bad, with some changes of volume very depleasant. It is almost unlistenable (or more precisily, unundersatndable for a French!)!
 * I recorded it and yes it is bad: it was my first ever one. I hope to rerecord at some point but don't hold you're breath ;) --Cel es tianpower háblame 18:03, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
 * If you do, keep in mind that you can’t pronounce Japanese words as though they’re English. Fushigidane, for instance, is more like “foo-shee-gee-dah-nay”( hard g, not sure where to put the stress, but I usually stress the penultimate syllable, as that’s a pretty common stress pattern in the Japanese language). You also nelected to update the file information and the template when you re-recorded it. I fixed it in the article, you might want to tackle the file details. -- WikidSmaht (talk) 22:32, 14 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Listening to some of the Japanese videos, it is difficult to note stress, as stress is less pronounced in Japanese than in English, but it sounds like Rika Matsumoto (the Japanese voice actor for Ash/Satoshi) is saying FU-shi-gi-da-NE with stress slightly falling off then picking up; admittedly I was straining to hear any sort of stress differences at all. I've certainly never heard fu-shi-gi-DA-ne. --Kain 13:50, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Well, I hadn’t listened to it before today, but yes, the volume thing is a problem, among others. I’ve been meaning to record it myself for a while actually, since it’s changed so radically. It needs it even more now that it’s featured, but I haven’t had access to a computer with a mic. -- WikidSmaht (talk) 22:32, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

Trivia
The fact that it's the first Pokémon in the Pokédexes is mentioned in the infobox.

The translated names aren't really relevant, and it was decided during the FA candidacy to remove them. I feel they're unencyclopedic, and typically, similar articles about other fictional characters don't have this information.

The worm...I dunno. Mention it in the intro or something. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 03:24, 8 April 2006 (UTC)
 * I agree on the first count.
 * The names are in many articles, about many different subjects. Perhaps in this case we could have a "The name Bulbasaur" section, like here (sorry, first one that popped into my head.
 * We could do that, but articles are always being criticised for introducing comething in the lead which is never mentioned afterwards. And what about the name origin? --Cel es tianpower háblame 07:50, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

Line
This line has been bothering me for a while now:

During the grass field battle of the Indigo League tournament, a battle competition that takes place on the Indigo Plateau, Ash’s Bulbasaur defeated two of the opponent’s three Pokémon on its own (a Beedrill and a Scyther), despite little fighting experience as a part of Ash’s team.

I don't understand the last part. Bulbasaur was part of Ash's team for the majority of the first season. If anything, the victories were notable in that Bulbasaur defeated two Pokemon in a row whom he had a type disadvantage against (Bug is strong against Grass). Anyway, I would be bold and change it, but since this is a FA now, I wanted to see if there were any objections first. Acetic Acid 07:13, 21 April 2006 (UTC)
 * I think what it means( how I read it, anyway,) is that Ash didn’t use it in battles very often before the League competition. Though for that matter, Beedrill’s other type is Poison, and Scyther’s is Flying, so they Both had a double advantage! Unless Poison is resistant to Poison... hmm... I think it is, actually... -- WikidSmaht (talk) 21:20, 21 April 2006 (UTC)
 * It is, partially. In the games, a poison attack like Poison Sting is not very effective on Bulbasaur. He still did use Bulbasaur a bit though. Bulbasaur fought Tangela for the Rainbow Badge, despite losing. Didn't it fight Ditto, too? And then that Rhyhorn, in the episode where it almost evolved. And Venonat, which it beat (again, a type disadvantage). AceticAcid 08:42, 22 April 2006 (UTC)
 * In the original Red/Blue/Yellow series of games, Bulbasaur was strong against Poison attacks because it was part Poison itself- this took precedence over Grass's weakness. After Pokemon Stadium and in all subsequent games, the two multipliers simply cancel each other out- Grass type makes the Poison attack twice as effective, Poison type makes the Poison attack half as effective, so the net effect on the attack's strength is zero. The same applies if you use Bug type, since the same weaknesses and strengths apply. Also, as a long term player of the game, I can tell you right now that a Bulbasaur beating a Beedrill, Venonat or Rhyhorn is nothing special- the first two are rather ineffective as offensive players and don't have any moves which are super effective against Bulbasaur, apart from Venonat's Psychic-type moves, which they never use in the anime(IIRC), and Rhyhorn has a double weakness against Grass types, making them four time as effective, and low Special stat/Special Defence Stat, depending on generation. Scyther also has a very sparse movepool that's actually strong against Bulbasaur- Wing Attack is the only one is learns naturally, IIRC, and it doesn't do much good, considering Bulbasaur's respectable Physical Defence stat, and the low base attack of Wing Attack(60, boosted to 90 by STAB)- and this is all academic anyway if that Scyther didn't use it. Scyther also had a *BEEP*ing atrocious Special Stat in the original games, meaning it's resistance, which meant half instead of quarter damage in that generation, was cancelled out, so Bulbasaur didn't really have a net type disadvantage against Scyther in that generation. Anyway, as far as low battle experience goes, maybe Ash had Exp All, or that Rhydon was very high level- I can see Bulbasaur being able to beat a Rhydon that was 15 or 20 levels above it, since it would be a OHKO if the Rhyhorn first attack missed or was just plain rubbish. Also, we don't know how much experience Bulbasaur had before joining Ash's team, and starter Pokemon are always have higher base stats than regular Pokemon, anyway. Signed, Anonymous, who is Legion

Removing of "da ne" interpretation
So...CelestianPower, was it? o.o Why was that removed? And even more strange, why did you edit my corrections to the template:nihongo, which was used incorrectly on every count? urutapu 00:35, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Because you'd removed the nihongo completely. Plus, I don't see the characters for "da" or "ne" in the Japanese name for Bulbasaur. Therefore, I thought that it was vandalism. If I was wrong, sorry, but we get a lot of vandalism here - and this is a featured article. --Cel es tianpower háblame 07:31, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
 * ...I used hiragana as opposed to katakana for the interpretation of "da" and "ne" because katakana are like..never used in that case. And every single template:nihongo was incorrect before I came along.


 * I'll show them so you can compare...hiragana on left, katakana on right.
 * だ da → ダ da
 * ね ne → ネ ne
 * urutapu 07:42, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
 * If it's rarely used then why would it be used in the name of Bulbasaur?
 * If they're badly formatted then could you fix them? They didn't look bad to me - they did the job. Don't just remove them please. --Cel es tianpower háblame 07:48, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Because it's part of a name. It's difficult to explain--I'd recommend giving the katakana article a good once-over, and any other Japanese language articles that might help. urutapu 07:53, 20 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Hmmm - okay. But bear in mind that many other non-Japanese people mihgt have the same queries. As to the nihongo templates, thanks! --Cel es tianpower háblame 08:03, 20 May 2006 (UTC)