Talk:Denard Robinson

Kudos to a clever vandal
Though it has rightfully been removed, I have to give credit to one of the most clever acts of Wikipedia vandalism that I have seen. As Robinson completed his 502-yard game against Notre Dame, an unnamed poster added the following comment (since removed): "Denard is way faster than me or any other man on earth or in the universe. Aliens ain't got shit on Denard. Literally, a supercomputer making calculations for eternity cannot calculate his speed. He also is really awesome as a human being"--Usain Bolt

"Denard's speed makes me want to be a better president"--Barack Obama

"Denard Robinson has done way more for planet earth than me"--Gandhi While we don't want to encourage vandalism, I have to admit this was clever. Cbl62 (talk) 00:04, 12 September 2010 (UTC)

Michigan's all-time single game total offense leaders
I don't know how exactly this list was compiled, but it seems incomplete. For example, in the 2008 Capital One Bowl vs., Florida, Chad Henne passed for 373 yds, and lost 24 on the ground (sacks), for a total of 349. Why isn't this on the list? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Slaunius (talk • contribs) 20:39, 16 September 2010 (UTC)
 * Slaunius, I compiled the list from the data at the Michigan Football Statistic Archive Query Page. Not sure how I missed the Henne game you referenced, and I've now added it to the list.  Also, I will go back to the database to make sure there are no others that have been omitted. Thanks for calling attention to the error.  Cbl62 (talk) 21:58, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

Let's fix that nickname
Denard "Shoelace" Robinson? Perhaps Denard "Velcro" Robinson would be more appropriate? 110.174.174.155 (talk) 06:26, 26 September 2010 (UTC)
 * Reliable sources from the media have confirmed that his nickname is "Shoelace". Vodello (talk) 16:20, 8 October 2010 (UTC)
 * Agreed. See WP:OR; this is an encyclopedia talk page for improvements to the article not a nickname designation forum. Obamafan70 (talk) 17:44, 8 October 2010 (UTC)

Rushing touchdowns by a quarterback
What are the Michigan and Big Ten records. Tebow had 23 in 2007 in 13 games which seems out of reach, but maybe the school or conference records are within reach (he has 12 in 8 games).--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 01:06, 4 November 2010 (UTC)


 * Looks like Robinson is tied with Rick Leach and Steve Smith for the Michigan QB record at 12. Not sure what the Big Ten record is.  The Big Ten media guide doesn't break out QB-only rushing touchdowns and the overall rushing top-10 list (all running backs) cuts off at 21.  Antwaan Randle El rushed for 13 TDs twice for Indiana. Jweiss11 (talk) 03:53, 4 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Was 13 the prior record?--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 20:18, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

Single-half passing yards
Do we know whose record he broke?--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 02:16, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

Heisman finish
Should we put the 6th place Heisman finish in the infobox? It is probably as important as being a semifinalist for the awards that are mentioned.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 20:33, 12 December 2010 (UTC)

Infobox bloat
It is standard for All-conference recognition to remain in the infobox for the duration of a college career. All detail of All-American recognition should remain for the entire career, IMO. I have done several college athletes who now have this infobox content as professionals including Sherron Collins, Brandon Graham (American football), Zoltan Mesko (American football), and Evan Turner.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 01:51, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
 * In terms of general length concerns, I feel we should include the proper content and let the length fall where it may. Think about infobox content for Jack Kemp (who has two long infoboxes) or even just a Tyrone Wheatley, which is a WP:FA.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 01:55, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I disagree. With an athlete like Robinson, there is a need for selectivity in which honors should be placed in the Infobox to avoid what you have aptly called "Infobox bloat."  Some honors are easy and should be included for anyone, e.g., first-team All-American, major award winner.  Other honors are, IMO, equally easy and should be excluded, e.g., "honorable mention" honors which fall below 1st team, 2nd team and even 3rd team honors.  Other honors are in a grey area and should be evaluated in the context of the particular player so that the Infobox focuses on what's really important, e.g., All-Conference selections, major award finalist lists, etc.  If you take a Hall of Fame player with four years of college honors and 15-20 years of NFL honors (e.g., Jerry Rice or Dan Marino), you need to have some selectivity or the Infobox will go on for more than a page.  That defeats the purpose of a Infobox, which is to give a brief overview of the most important points about a person. Cbl62 (talk) 03:09, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I don't feel the honorable mentions are as unimportant as you might think. In some cases selectors have a first team and honorable mention (which is sort of a 2nd team). In other cases an hm selection may be like 6th or 8th team.  Regardless, look at a Mouton, who would be quite happy to get an hm after leading the Big Ten in Tackles.  I have been adding these types of selections to numerous athletes and have never had anyone say that some levels of AA should be pruned from a multilevel detail.  Look at the pro articles I mention above.  Of the 10 AA teams named so far, he has only received 4 recognitions in any way.  We should recognize his 4 selections.  When he goes pro, most of the records will be removed and the All-Conference honors as well as award finalist recognitions may be removed.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 03:31, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
 * It's not that I'm completely dismissive of an "Honorable Mention" honor. But most selectors have 1st, 2nd, and 3rd teams, with HM being a fourth tier.  The issue is what honors are so important that they need to be highlighted in the Infobox.  I don't object to mentioning an HM in the body of Denard's article, but it clearly doesn't rise to the level of one the major honors that should be in the Infobox.  Cbl62 (talk) 03:45, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I just notice you re-inserted "honorable mention" all-conference honors. I don't think Honorable Mention All-American designation belongs in the Infobox, and Honorable Mention All-Conference honors is really out there. Cbl62 (talk) 03:48, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
 * In a certain sense, hm is informative to the reader as a clarification of what honors he failed to get. It is clearly far less prestigious. Including all levels enables the reader to feel he has complete information.  Keep in mind many readers just want to see the infobox and WP:LEAD.  It is entirely consistent with every other athlete bio review I have gone through.  The various levels are a set.  Basically, I think you describe his AA recognitions in their entirety or not at all.  For example, just saying he was first team would lead the reader to wonder about all other selectors. I certainly hope Denard achieves the level of professional success where all-conference recognition becomes removable from the infobox, but while in college they belong and the reader deserves a complete set.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 05:24, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I don't think I've ever seen another Infobox for a player who has received major awards that also lists All-Conference "Honorable Mention" honors. Can you direct me to the multiple examples you rely on when you say that including this information is "entirely consistent with every other athlete bio review"? Cbl62 (talk) 05:40, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
 * If you can name some players who were hm All-conference, but who won major awards, I can run throught the list, but it is kind of an unusual accomplishment.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 07:04, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I don't have such a list, but assumed you did since you had indicated that the practice of including Honorable Mention honors in Infoboxes was consistent with every other athlete bio review you'd worked on. It's not an unusual circumstance, as players often progress as they advance through their college careers from an Honorable Mention to a first-team honor.  The issue isn't that it's uncommon, just that HM All-Conference (or even HM All-American) is not typically not sufficiently notable to put in an Infobox.  Are there any examples you have where HM All-Conference honors have been included in an Infobox of a good or featured article?  Cbl62 (talk) 19:36, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I mentioned some infoboxes on the original post of this thread. Although Graham might use some pruning, it should not come from the hm.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 20:03, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I looked at those. None of those has an Honorable Mention All-Conferenece honor listed.  Cbl62 (talk) 20:53, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Some of them have hm AA remaining. For athletes with AA recognition, All-conference is commonly removed after going pro.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 22:42, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
 * You're not getting my point. I'm fine with first-team All-Conference honors being included in the Infobox, but inclusion of "Honorable Mention" All-Conference strikes me as ridiculous.  The Big Ten coaches have 24 players who are first-team All-Conference, 24 more who are second-team All-Conference, and almost 50 others who are "Honorable Mention" All-Conference.  See here.  At the QB position, the coaches picked a first-team QB (Persa), a second-team QB (Tolzein), and three more QBs (Pryor, Cousins and Robinson) got "Honorable Mention". There's neither precedent nor a strong argument that Honorable Mention All-Big 10 honors (bestowed on the 50 players who don't rank in the top 2 at their positions in a conference) are sufficiently notable to include in an Infobox for a player like Denard Robinson. The Infobox should summarize the key honors, and "Honorable Mention" designations are simply not key in a case like Denard's. Cbl62 (talk) 23:14, 21 December 2010 (UTC)
 * My preference would be to include hm All-conference while the players is still a college player. I will bring it up during the GAC review when we have a captive third party.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 00:43, 22 December 2010 (UTC)

Youtube of Robinsons 6.81
Do we want this in the external links?--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 23:25, 13 February 2011 (UTC)

NCAA totals or Big Ten/Michigan totals
Given that the 2011 Western Michigan game totals don't count in his NCAA stats, but count in Big Ten/Michigan stats, what totals should we present to the reader and how should we asterisk the tables if at all?--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 04:48, 20 November 2011 (UTC)
 * I think it depends on the context. The Big Ten Conference and U of M both count the stats from the 2011 WMU game.  So, when reporting Big Ten or Michigan school records, the stats from the WMU should be included.  The NCAA does not count the stats from that game, so when reporting NCAA records, the stats from the WMU game should be excluded.  In either case, explanatory footnoting is appropriate. This is an unfortunate discrepancy resulting from inconsistent decisions by the various officials, and I think we need to deal with it on a case-by-case basis as noted above. Cbl62 (talk) 20:58, 20 November 2011 (UTC)

Update request
Needs update on the post season. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.119.117.88 (talk • contribs) 17:44 (UTC)
 * WP is not responsible for a game by game summary of his career. His bowl game performance was non-notable. He had 130 yards of total offense as a quarterback who played the whole game. Gardner did not even take a snap, as I recall. Despite the fact that a wide receiver was MVP, I am not really feeling pressed to detail his performance.  Since it is a bowl game, I would not be averse to something being included, but I can go either way on this one.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 19:32, 14 April 2012 (UTC)

Robinson's position (OW)
Please see discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject National Football League. ~ Richmond 96   T  •  C   23:00, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

External links modified
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External links modified
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July 2016 driving incident
There is currently quite a bit of news coverage of an incident in which he drove into a pond and the police had trouble rousing him as he and a passsenger slept in the sinking car. Should it be mentioned in the article? See, , ,. Or is it not worth mentioning since a policeman determined he was not impaired, no citation was issued and Robinson later Tweeted that he was just tired? Edison (talk) 03:49, 6 July 2016 (UTC)
 * The sheriff is questioning the actions of the officers on the scene. Edison (talk) 20:02, 8 July 2016 (UTC)
 * My initial take: Based on the officers' report, this was a minor incident in which no one was injured, no one was charged with a crime, and no one was even cited for a traffic infraction. Given the minor nature of the incident, it should either not be included in the Wikipedia article (my inclination), or any mention should be quite brief to avoid WP:UNDUEWEIGHT. Cbl62 (talk) 21:14, 8 July 2016 (UTC)

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