Talk:Fifteenth Dynasty of Egypt

Sheshi
Why isn't Sheshi listed here? His article says he was a fifteenth dynasty ruler. P Ingerson (talk) 16:42, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Well, this isn't a list as much as a sucession order, and unless we have his position or argued position in the order, we can't put him in. In all likelyhood, however, he's probably a duplicate of someone like salatis. Thanatosimii 20:27, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

Move discussion in progress
There is a move discussion in progress which affects this page. Please participate at Talk:Tenth dynasty of Egypt - Requested move and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RM bot 23:20, 14 March 2012 (UTC)

Merge to Hyksos
Hi, you reverted my attempt to redirect this article to Hyksos with the explanation None of the rulers and their identification is covered in the Hyksos article. However, there is an entire section on this, see Hyksos.Ermenrich (talk) 17:17, 25 June 2020 (UTC)

None of the articles on the rulers are linked, their seals are not included, their dates are not included. Everything that the dynasty article has. Dimadick (talk) 17:23, 25 June 2020 (UTC)
 * The rulers are linked as they appear in the text. The dates are uncertain: no one agrees on them. The seals are unimportant, particularly given that only one source thinks two of them belong to Hyksos rulers, and they can be added if you think they're important. I'm not sure I understand your fundamental objections. The information at Hyksos is clearly much better than what's found here, and I'm not just saying that because I wrote it. It uses many more sources than here.--Ermenrich (talk) 17:30, 25 June 2020 (UTC)

Additions
The text that's been added relies heavily on a single work, that of Kim Ryholt and some other works, such as the Encylopedia of Ancient Egypt, which were originally printed in the early 90s. While many of Ryholt's conclusions have been generally accepted (that the sixteenth dynasty aren't Hyksos, for instance, but Thebans) many have not. The study of the second intermediate period has advanced substantially since the 90s due to new archaeological discoveries and new consensus positions.

Just a few examples:
 * 1) Ryholt's claim that Hyksos wasn't a title used by the Hyksos kings or that only the initial Hyksos kings used it at all is disputed
 * 2) Ryholt's description of the range of Hyksos rule and the idea that they invaded and replaced the 14th Dynasty are disputed
 * 3) Ryholt's ordering of the Hyksos kings is disputed
 * 4) The idea that Khyan conquered all of Egypt is disputed and I believe generally disfavored now
 * 5) The notion that Hyksos destroyed temples or "ruled without Re" has been generally refuted

More recent sources are cited at Hyksos in the relevant sections, which include some statements of WP:RS/AC on them as well. Most of the sources can be found via google books, Academia.edu, or JSTOR. I'm also happy to provide sources for each of my points.

I am also somewhat concerned that this now just duplicates information found at Hyksos, but that's probably more of a point for the merger discussion.--Ermenrich (talk) 12:38, 27 June 2020 (UTC)

Transclusion tag added to Talk page, July 2024
Please see the tag for link to discussion on relevant talkpage. Neatly95 (talk) 17:05, 7 July 2024 (UTC)