Talk:Flash Airlines Flight 604

Passenger/Crew numbers
The --131.170.90.6 (talk) 03:15, 23 June 2013 (UTC)passenger and crew numbers mentioned in the article are in conflict with the accident description and the BBC News article. Clarification is needed and/or a reference for the quoted numbers in the article. Panthro (talk) 23:02, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Egyptian Public
Making a broad statement like the Egyptian public does does no believe an Egyptian pilot kill 142 or was responsible for the death of 142 is not needed unless like EgyptAir 990 there is a significant bilateral diplomatic disruption and even then without polls it is opinion of one person. The Fact the the Egyptian Goverment disagrees is enough considering it speaks for the people. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.67.182.5 (talk) 13:27, 5 February 2009 (UTC)

Additional French stuff
Some more BEA links: http://www.bea.aero/en/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/index.php WhisperToMe (talk) 20:11, 13 May 2010 (UTC)

Egyptian files
From http://www.civilaviation.gov.eg/NEWS-ENG.html:
 * http://www.civilaviation.gov.eg/NEWS-FILES/1%20Flash%20Accident_Final%20Report_%20content+Factual%20Information.pdf
 * http://web.archive.org/web/20060709171116/http://www.civilaviation.gov.eg/conf/files/1%20Flash%20Accident_Final%20Report_%20content+Factual%20Information.pdf
 * http://www.civilaviation.gov.eg/NEWS-FILES/2%20Flash%20Accident_%20Final%20Report_%20Analysis.pdf
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zZkb7Bqh
 * http://www.civilaviation.gov.eg/NEWS-FILES/3-4%20Flash%20Accident_Final%20Report_%20Conclusion+Recommendations+.pdf
 * http://web.archive.org/web/20060709171550/http://www.civilaviation.gov.eg/conf/files/3-4%20Flash%20Accident_Final%20Report_%20Conclusion+Recommendations+.pdf
 * http://www.civilaviation.gov.eg/NEWS-FILES/flash.pdf
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zZkqZRHj
 * http://www.civilaviation.gov.eg/WEB-ARABIC/NEWS_AVIATION/NEWS-FILES/Addendum%201%20to%20FR%2020%20July,%2005.pdf
 * http://web.archive.org/web/20060511184933/http://www.civilaviation.gov.eg/Addendum%201%20to%20FR%2020%20July,%2005.pdf

Some stuff is listed at http://web.archive.org/web/20060703092929/http://www.civilaviation.gov.eg/conf/conf1.htm WhisperToMe (talk) 04:38, 20 June 2011 (UTC)

Egypt

 * http://www.civilaviation.gov.eg/NEWS-ENG.html
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zllbmq7I

France English

 * http://www.bea.aero/en/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/charm.el.cheikh.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlmCAOpG
 * http://www.bea.aero/en/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/moyens.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlmDVrMr
 * http://www.bea.aero/en/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/rapports.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlmEhl8c
 * http://www.bea.aero/en/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/sea.search.operations.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlmJTPeP
 * http://www.bea.aero/etudes/sea.search.operations/sea.search.operations.pdf
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlmKTFtc
 * http://www.bea.aero/en/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/fdr.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlmMHXrJ
 * http://www.bea.aero/en/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/cvr.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlmNme70
 * http://www.bea.aero/en/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/bea.observations.pdf
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlmOxVfH
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20060517092010/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/tmp/partie2.pdf - http://www.webcitation.org/6IyLIzOzj

France English press points/releases:
 * http://www.bea.aero/en/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/info08january2004.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlnf8tHf
 * http://www.bea.aero/en/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/pressrelease17january2004.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlng1O56
 * http://www.bea.aero/en/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/pressrelease18january2004.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlnhF6gc
 * http://www.bea.aero/en/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/pressrelease21january2004.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlnmQJFi
 * http://www.bea.aero/en/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/pressrelease03march2004.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlnnaD0f
 * http://www.bea.aero/en/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/pressrelease21april2004.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlnoY910
 * http://www.bea.aero/en/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/pressrelease10november2004.php (French)
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlnpXNcO
 * http://www.bea.aero/en/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/pressrelease19november2004.php (French)
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlnqbnZP
 * http://www.bea.aero/en/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/info25march2006.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlnrzYKA

France French

 * http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/charm.el.cheikh.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlmQ7odZ
 * http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/moyens.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlnCATxa
 * http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/operations.de.recherches.en.mer.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlnDBJ6B
 * http://www.bea.aero/etudes/operations.de.recherches.en.mer/operations.de.recherches.en.mer.pdf
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlnE1jI1
 * http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/fdr.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlnFaEpj
 * http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/cvr.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlnH6B5N
 * http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/rapports.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlnIOxkw
 * http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/observations.pdf
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlnJulyU
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20061013155904/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/video2.htm - http://archive.is/uAvQz
 * Unfortunately B737_FlashAir_SU-ZCF_800x600_442kbps.avi was NOT archived
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20061013155945/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/video.htm - http://archive.is/MhZzg
 * fdr524kbps.avi and fdr215kbps.avi were NOT archived
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20040804050925/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/photos.htm - http://archive.is/9CdKj
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20040414125535/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/FDR01.jpg - http://archive.is/vRklR
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20040804050925/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/FDR02.jpg - http://archive.is/vfSc9
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20040414170626/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/FDR03.jpg - http://archive.is/rwq2m
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20040414172729/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/FDR04.jpg - http://archive.is/6BFSi
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20041030055907/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/photoscvr.htm - http://archive.is/fzsJ7
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20041031113552/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/CVR01.jpg - http://archive.is/IawUP
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20041031130154/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/CVR02.jpg - http://archive.is/u28DN
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20041031110045/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/CVR03.jpg - http://archive.is/vulvM
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20041031111121/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/CVR04.jpg - http://archive.is/JMSA8
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/*/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/* lists other archives
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20041030055907/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/photoscvr.htm - http://archive.is/fzsJ7
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20041031113552/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/CVR01.jpg - http://archive.is/IawUP
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20041031130154/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/CVR02.jpg - http://archive.is/u28DN
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20041031110045/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/CVR03.jpg - http://archive.is/vulvM
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20041031111121/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/CVR04.jpg - http://archive.is/JMSA8
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/*/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/* lists other archives
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20041031111121/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/CVR04.jpg - http://archive.is/JMSA8
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/*/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/charm/* lists other archives

France French press points/releases: WhisperToMe (talk) 03:31, 28 June 2011 (UTC)
 * http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/info08janvier2004.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlnvghdC
 * http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/com17janvier2004.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlnwejsY
 * http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/com18janvier2004.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlnxjS1v
 * http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/com21janvier2004.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlnywHVq
 * http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/com03mars2004.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlnzzXS7
 * http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/com21avril2004.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlo166W7
 * http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/com10novembre2004.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlo26Kzq
 * http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/com19novembre2004.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlo4TI1L
 * http://www.bea.aero/fr/enquetes/charm.el.cheikh/info25mars2006.php
 * http://www.webcitation.org/5zlo6qm3W
 * http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20061013155739/http://www.bea.aero/francais/actualite/com20040421.html - http://archive.is/1XGcL

BEA Spanish documents: WhisperToMe (talk) 08:32, 5 February 2013 (UTC)
 * "Operaciones de búsqueda en el mar." (Archive)

Removed vertigo from info box
I removed the term "vertigo" from the infobox because the interim accident report notes that pilots frequently use that term (erroneously) when they are talking about spatial disorientation, which is something quite different:


 * "Type I spatial disorientation:

Unrecognized spatial disorientation. No conscious perception of SD. Distractions are often antecedents to the accident. Crash with no distress or concern expressed. No mayday or other than routine communications. Unusual or inappropriate aircraft attitude, but pilot does not make any appropriate corrective action. Pilot is apparently oblivious to the situation.


 * Type II recognized:

Conscious manifestation of a problem. Pilots often incorrectly refer to this experience as vertigo. Pilot recognizes conflict between perceived and intended or expected attitude. Can assume that the instruments are operating incorrectly. Might not properly react because of difficulty accepting indicated correct control input or might just be puzzled about the situation. Confusion might persist after recovery and lead to compounding of SD problem." [pg 70 of the interim report]


 * "Vertigo /ˈvɜː(ɹ)tɨɡoʊ/ (from the Latin vertō "a whirling or spinning movement"[1]) is a subtype of dizziness in which a patient experiences the perception of motion (usually a spinning motion) despite actually being still.[2][3] The symptoms are due to an asymmetric dysfunction of the vestibular system in the inner ear.[3] It is often associated with nausea and vomiting as well as a balance disorder, causing difficulties standing or walking. There are three types of vertigo. The first is known as objective[4][5] and describes when the patient has the sensation that objects in the environment are moving; the second is known as subjective[4][5] and refers to when the patient feels as if he or she is moving, and the third is known as pseudovertigo,[6] an intensive sensation of rotation inside the patient's head. While appearing in textbooks, this classification has little to do with the pathophysiology or treatment of vertigo." [] 71.93.90.163 (talk) 22:06, 5 January 2013 (UTC)

Cited source for airplane history
I added the citation for the plane history information (the accident report by Egypt) as well as expanded on the information there. The original cited TACA as the airline who owned the plane, but it had been leased to Egyptian Air since 2001, making the sale irrelevant to the history of the plane. Added flight hours and cycles, which is more relevant to the history of the plane.

Viccivarner (talk) 18:42, 4 December 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
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 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090228052147/http://www.dailystaregypt.com/article.aspx?ArticleID=1010 to http://www.dailystaregypt.com/article.aspx?ArticleID=1010

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Possible Rudder Hardover
I watched this crash here (the first 49 minutes)... Link, and it seems that this is a classic case of a rudder hardover. A bad PCU, that controls the rudder, would have been the mechanical problem, jamming the rudder to one side, placing the plane into an uncontrollable bank, and making the it useless even with the autopilot. Here are similar incidents with the 737... Link, and the problem explained at the end of this video... Link. I'm surprised that neither the video or this wikipedia article mentioned it. The evidence is in 3,000 feet of water and still retrievable. Lord Milner (talk) 02:05, 6 January 2023 (UTC)


 * Theres no proof that the PCU failed in mid flight Lucasoliveira653 (talk) 02:56, 22 June 2023 (UTC)