Talk:Hydrotherapy/Archive 1

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This article is or was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): ArjavS, Zn15. Peer reviewers: Vfang3.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 00:07, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

Ambiguous following term
The phrase, "The following matterial..." sounds as if it is talking about the rest of the article rather than [what I suppose it is talking about] the link. --jce —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.0.143.146 (talk • contribs) 14:47, 13 June 2006

Merger proposal
I am a physiotherapist working in hydrotherapy. Hydrotherapy is in fact very different from balneotherapy in that balneo encompasses a multitude of treatments and methods not necessarily related to physiotherapy. Hydrotherapy is essentially physiotherapy in an aquatic environment and can involve any physiotherapeutic modality excepting electrotherapy of course. It is also important to note that hydrotherapy involves hot water - we keep our pool at approx. 32degrees celsius.

Some information on Balneotherapy can be included in the hydrotherapy page. Otherwise, these therapies need their own page. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Travisthurston (talk • contribs) 06:43, 28 June 2006 UTC

Water therapy seems to be completely different, so I don't understand why the merger is suggested. I'm removing it. However, I am suggesting a new nmerger as there's little or no difference between balneotherapy and hydrotherapy, as reading the two articles makes clear. The water is often irrelevant as heat or cold is what's sought, but thermotherapy is does not mean the same thing. Balneotherapy on google gets 159,000 results, hydrotherapy 2,400,000. Brinerustle 14:56, 14 September 2007 (UTC)

I manage aquatic rehabilitation services. Balneotherapy is not to be confused with hydrotherapy, and ought not be merged as topics. Water is only one factor in hydrotherapy. Hydrostatic pressure, neuro-sensory integration and Proprioceptive trainings are correlated to hydrotherapy. These two are as different genres in allied health as physiotherapy and pilates exercise. —Preceding unsigned comment added by RHenryO (talk • contribs) 22:14, 29 February 2008 (UTC)


 * Since most oppose the merger, with good arguments, and no discussion is going on for the last three months, I removed the merge template. Kraaiennest (talk) 00:49, 11 June 2008 (UTC)

year?
Is that year correct? I saw somebody changed it recently, but it was reverted - does anyone know for certain when it was published?

A quick search has turned up any of 1886, 1894 or 1910. I'm guessing the original was 1886 and the others are various translations.

Nomenclature?
"sturdy order of chronic invalids well able to bear a rigorous regimen and the seventies of unrestricted crisis"--What are "The seventies"? They are referenced twice. They make no sense in this context.Mzmadmike 00:33, 21 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I've replaced it with "severities", which makes sense. I'm assuming this article has been scanned in from the 1911 Enc. Brittanica, and the OCR software used wasn't sure whether it was "n" or "ri", and went for "seventies" as the more common (yet nonsensical) word. Thomjakobsen 19:06, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

Using wikipedia
I want using article Hydrotherapy and smiliars, what something to do.Cairned1234 15:07, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

An Rheum Diseases reference
This claim was added here and I searched here but couldn't see any relevant reviews. I suspect this was just a hoax. Tim Vickers (talk) 02:04, 28 May 2008 (UTC)

i dont c y this article dosent explAIN ITSELF QUITE LIKE IT SHOULD —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.129.75.240 (talk) 01:41, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

custom shower door hinged tub deck — Preceding unsigned comment added by 103.167.134.104 (talk) 11:52, 19 September 2022 (UTC)

On article improvement
I offer some thoughs on improving this article, or at least kick-starting the improvement of it. Not because it's a particularly bad article, but because in my view the article has considerable potential, and its current status limits that potential.

There is a wealth of information throughout the article. That is, it is very information dense. However, the bulk of the material is verbatim from the Encyclopædia Britannica Eleventh Edition. This means much of the structure is per that text, and that much of both the history and knowledge of hydrotherapy as described in this article is limited to what was in the 1911 publication, editor contributions notwithstanding. And of course, there were inevitable errors, although I do not know them to be extensive, and doubt that they are. I have corrected a couple that I became aware of, simply because I was able to find the relevant information online.

We now have the benefit of internet access to a large body of work from that era, and more, and we are now in a position to flesh out many articles from the 1911 publication. True, some relevant information,past or present, is pay-per-view, but a huge amount is not. And some sites, like the British Medical Journal, require no more than free registration to access articles from their archives. Others, like the London, Scottish, and Irish Gazettes, can be freely accessed with or without free registration. From this, we can verify and cite, and where appropriate or necessary, correct errors, and otherwise develop articles like this.

So as a heuristic, my tendency is to first find and add citations. At some point, I think portions of the text would be better broken into smaller, more readable and more manageable sections. What sort of structure I find hard to say. Here my tendency is to go for broad structure that doesn't hamper further article development, or put people off wanting to contribute because they can't see where their info would fit, even if it seems relevant. Sometimes that is more than enough. Sometimes finer structure develops. These are just considerations, and indications of how I for my part will try to contribute to this article.

Another heuristic I try to follow, is to create relevant links to other articles as I go, and if they are a bit wanting, divert at that point and do some work on those. Sometimes this pays off with further information back to the original article from which I diverted my attention. Sometimes not. But it matters not, as the collective information base grows nevertheless.Wotnow (talk) 10:01, 30 November 2009 (UTC)Wotnow


 * This is a difficult article to understand, since it's unclear how much is merely sourced from EB11 (and thus only of historical interest) and how much is currently relevant material. For example, Modern revival of hydrotherapy might perhaps better read 18th century revival of hydrotherapy. -- Resuna (talk) 17:00, 28 April 2015 (UTC)

Possible resources
Having created this section, I'm going to park any resources here which may be useful, but which I can't justify using at the time I find them, for whatever reason. E.g., supporting text may not exist, or it may not be clear that a citation found supports existing text in its current wording, as is the case for the Wilson Fox text at time of this section creation. Anyone else who can resolve these issues is welcome to do so.


 * Supports his use of cooling baths, but does it tell us he introduced this to England? If not, what citation can tell us that? Otherwise, just amend text. Wotnow (talk) 01:22, 28 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Supports his use of cooling baths, but does it tell us he introduced this to England? If not, what citation can tell us that? Otherwise, just amend text. Wotnow (talk) 01:22, 28 April 2010 (UTC)

Distinction between the two Wilson's
If putting vital date after James Wilson is not sufficient distinction from Erasmus Wilson someone please strengthen. Michael P. Barnett (talk) 02:48, 5 April 2011 (UTC)

Mention of book by Shorter
I found the reference when looking for verification of Lord Lytton's connection to Malvern. I think it unnecessary to put it in Malvern article, and do not know how putting more detail about hydrotherapy clinics as way round British Asylum laws in this article might tread on NPOV. If anyone wants to know what Shorter wrote they just need to click.Michael P. Barnett (talk) 13:25, 7 April 2011 (UTC)

Examples of hydropathic establishments
What encyclopaedic purpose does this list serve? I propose it's removal. AIR corn (talk) 06:49, 13 April 2012 (UTC)
 * removed AIR corn (talk) 02:22, 27 April 2012 (UTC)

Hydrovescent
Hamsard Ltd has filed a trademark for the word "Hydrovescent" to refer to bathtubs featuring air jets and, by extension, hydrovescent therapy to refer to hydrotherapy administered via air jets in bathtubs. Its current trademark filing basis is 1(b), intention to use a mark in commerce. Is there call to mention this word in this article or an independent page? Disclosure: I am employed by a marketing agency used by one of the companies held by Hamsard Ltd. Clay Cazier (talk) 07:50, 26 February 2014 (UTC)

Ostoearthritis
The following was recently added. I have moved it here for possible inclusion with more encyclopedic phrasing and better reference.

Those suffering from osteoarthritis in the knees can also benefit from hydrotherapy through warm water therapy. Physical therapists and doctors continue to actively seek methods to mitigate the problems inherent with osteoarthritis. One of the newest techniques they are employing is osteoarthritis pool therapy. Because most recreational swimming pools have a water temperature that is too cold to feel comfortable for patients with osteoarthritis, it's best to perform rehabilitation exercises in a specialized fitness therapy pool where the water temperature can be adjusted.

"can also benefit" needs much better MEDRS source. "continue to actively seek" not significant for an encyclopedia unless quality sources discuss it, what they are seeking to mitigate doesn't belong until there are significant published results. "it's best to" "too cold to feel comfortable" not encyclopedic and needs MEDRS sourcing. The source provided is not reliable but involved and promotional. - - MrBill3 (talk) 01:18, 28 October 2014 (UTC)

Article rearrangement
I moved a lot of content in this article to make it conform to the manual of style for medical content. Previously and in my opinion, this article presented hydrotherapy as if it were a mostly historical practice, and instead I would like to emphasize that it is something relevant today as a treatment in both conventional and alternative medicine. In conventional medicine, it especially has a place in rehabilitation.  Blue Rasberry  (talk)  20:10, 3 November 2014 (UTC)

Hydrotherapy is NOT naturophaty
Father Sebastian Kneipp passed away on the 17 June 1897.

The term naturopathy was coined in 1895 by John Scheel.

Benedict Lust around 1900, purchased the name Naturopathy from his colleague Dr John Scheel.

In 1901, Lust founded the American School of Naturopathy in New York.

In 1902 the original North American Kneipp Societies were discontinued and renamed "Naturopathic Societies".

The Merriam-Webster Dictionary states that the first known use of the word "naturopathy" in print is from 1901.

This of-course was a very sad event by Benedict Lust to rename the Kneipp Societies in America to his purchased name of Naturopathy.

This was a sad event and one whereby Hydrotherapy was being rebranded into something else.

Kneipp Hydrotherapy was created long before the word Naturopathy was invented. Thus Kneipp Hydrotherapy has nothing to do with naturopathy.

In fact no one knows what naturopathy is, and Dr Jon Wardle who has a clinical backgrounds in naturopathy and nursing and postgraduate training in public health and law, and is a lecturer at the UTS Faculty of Health, holds visiting positions at the School of Medicine, University of Washington and the School of Medicine, Boston University, stated the following:

“Naturopathy too broad description thus becoming a dumping ground for anything alternative” Dr Jon Wardle (Channel 10 News of Australia July 2016) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gabirro (talk • contribs) 18:42, 4 November 2016 (UTC)
 * The sources at Naturopathy and Sebastian Kneipp  seem clear and reliable. We should get some more sources and content about the Kneipp and naturopathy into this article.
 * Do you have any sources for the viewpoints above that are relevant to the content in this article? --Ronz (talk) 20:36, 4 November 2016 (UTC)
 * Please respond. --Ronz (talk) 15:05, 5 November 2016 (UTC)

Adding to the Article
Hi, I'd like to add more to the article on hydropathy about the history of Vincent Priessnitz, Sebastian Kneipp, and hydropathy in America. I would like to focus on the cultural components such as religion with an emphasis on aversion to traditional medicine. Specifically about how Priessnitz and Kneipp came to become such important figures in hydropathy, and then how it made its way to America and the effects that it had there.

I would mostly be drawing from sources in HistoryToday, a paper published in The Journal of Alternative and Complementary Medicine, as well as the book The great American water-cure craze: a history of hydropathy in the United States by Harry B. Weiss and Howard R. Kemble. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Schen95 (talk • contribs) 20:33, 28 February 2017 (UTC)


 * Hello Schen95. Your edits are really well written! Some comments: Your writing is well structured by itself, but within the larger article, you are rehashing some things that are already said. It would be great if you incorporated your new content by moving parts of the original article around, and deleted or combined any repetitions. For example, after your segment on Kneipp, there is a bit more about Priessnitz that should be moved into your section on him. More details on how successful Kneipp was would make your comments about his success more impactful. A picture of Kneipp would be great! Azhu8 (talk) 17:31, 16 March 2017 (UTC)


 * Hi there, I'm glad you added information on Priessnitz and Kneipp, who are indeed important figures in hydropathy. I'd suggest wiki-linking Vincent Preissnitz and Sebastian Kneipp, seeing as they do already have their own Wiki pages, and perhaps adding Preissnitz under the "See Also" section (Kneipp is already listed there). In addition, I think it's worth mentioning that Preissnitz systemized hydropathy, and Kneipp advocated a systematic/controlled application of hydropathy that in his system would be administered by doctors.
 * There are hints of it throughout, but it would also be awesome to see hydrotherapy more in the context of wider alternative medicine, perhaps even a separate section on it and perhaps drawing upon ideas from the entire book that our Whorton reading came from (Nature cures: The history of alternative medicine in America). Another small thing that could be added: John Harvey Kellogg articulated his views on hydropathy in his work The Uses of Water in Health & Disease (1867), which may be worth mentioning here. Another student went into more detail on Kellogg's hydropathy views under Kellogg's own Wiki page. Vfang3 (talk) 20:43, 16 March 2017 (UTC)


 * Hi! I really liked that you added sections on Priessnitz and Kneipp because I definitely think adding some more background on the people who popularized and practiced hydrotherapy was needed and helps to give readers more context. Everything was well-written and well structured. If you're looking to add any more to this page, I would maybe discuss the appeal of hydropathy to women specifically. I know in class we discussed that hydrotherapy was a lot more accepting of women's health than other philosophies so it might be interesting to find more information on that, since I didn't see any of that in the current page. Zn15 (talk) 03:24, 17 March 2017 (UTC)


 * Overall, I think that your edits are a positive contribution to this page! I definitely believe that some of the sentences could be broken apart for clarity as some tended to run on. I think putting hydrotherapy in the context of very notable practitioners of it was a great addition. I am not sure about how deep the sources you had were, but maybe these sections could be expanded a bit with a few more specifics about why these individuals thought hydrotherapy was a proper course of medicine. ArjavS (talk) 05:27, 17 March 2017 (UTC)

Further Edits
Hello,

One thing that you should add to your article is how hydropathy also empowered women and was a gentler therapy compared to the other therapies. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jpunnoo1 (talk • contribs) 04:03, 17 March 2017 (UTC)

History Section
The Modern revival of hydrotherapy section is well written, clear and concise. However, at the end of the Sebastian Kneipp section, it starts to get confusing. The last three paragraphs of that section seem unrelated to Kneipp and more related to Preissnitz. Great job overall! Achow3 (talk) 14:24, 22 March 2017 (UTC)

Potential Edits
Hello! I have read your section on hydropathy and think it looks great! I like the detail about Vincenz Priessnitz's early life that you added. I think that perhaps you can write more about what caused his rise to fame by perhaps explaining more of the historical context such as the rise of the germ theory and backlashes against it. Similar story for Sebastian Kneipp. Your use of reliable sources is also great. Thanks! Scarycheerio123 (talk) 03:04, 27 March 2017 (UTC)Scarycheerio123

Hey, your article looks great, I would add a comment on the adaptation of Hydrotherapy beyond Europe. A comment on hydrotherapy within the US would be really cool! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Adwowk1 (talk • contribs) 14:16, 4 May 2017 (UTC)

Why does "contrast shower" link to this article?
I clicked a "contrast shower" link because I wanted to know what a contrast shower is, but this article doesn't contain the word "contrast" at all. --Peter Knutsen 01:50, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Agreed. If "contrast shower" is going to redirect to this article, contrast showers should be detailed in it. And if details of contrast showers are outside the bounds of this article, it shouldn't be redirected to from that keyword. 75.26.174.94 (talk) 10:49, 12 July 2008 (UTC)
 * The problem was in the Contrast shower article; someone redirected it here instead of waiting for verification of the information in that article. -- SEWilco (talk) 03:10, 13 July 2008 (UTC)

the problem seems not to have been fixed- contrast shower still redirects to this article — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2600:1700:5F20:2A50:3023:F42A:10D1:EA41 (talk) 11:09, 4 December 2018 (UTC)


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 * They involve to fraud me they talking to say boy is fraud all bit he won't be alone he will be boss and gangs and policeman 41.116.67.184 (talk) 09:42, 6 September 2023 (UTC)

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