Talk:Kamen Rider Kabuto

Plot Hole section
I added a Plot Hole section, which was deleted Floria L who claimed they were not plot holes. I'd love to know why they aren't plot holes.

--Plot Holes-- In the early episodes, the Worms were said to be able to mimic only the humans that they killed, perhaps as a result of the tentacle penetration that the Worms in those early episodes used. This fact was again repeated by the Worm who mimiced Kagami Arata's little brother. However, the Worms are often shown to assume the form and memories of humans they have not killed yet. To add to the confusion, the tentacle aspect of Worms was dropped and they instead began spraying an acidic-foam onto their victims, which makes it more difficult to understand how the Worms are inheriting their victims memories. Also in the early episodes, ZECT employees are shown to have special goggles that detect Worms. For some peculiar reason, these goggles (which are obviously the most efficient way to find a Worm in human form) are not used in later episodes, such as Episode 14 and Episode 16 where a whodunit type of detective work is instead required to figure out who is a Worm. --Teram10 21:37, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Ignoring that, You can't put up something that you came up with all on your own. Find a third party source that has published that information, such as Tv-asahi's website. Otherwise, its against WP:OR. Im sure you must've missed the second part of the edit summary. Also, plot holes are distinct twists in the plot such as someone saying, these are Rider belts, and in the next episode, they suddenly wear them as necklaces. Thats a plot hole. The ones you stated are simply things that they CAN do, but choose not to do in situations. Thats up to the writer, but its not a plot hole. Floria L 23:33, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

It is a plot-hole actually, and you may wish to look at Wikipedia's own article on plot holes for clarity. Secondly, it's not original research because anyone who has actually watched and paid attention to the episodes can see the plot holes I mentioned are present in some episodes. You are trying to say you can't cite statements made by characters in the television series the article is based on and how later story elements contradict the statements made by the characters. That's silly. --Teram10 01:06, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

The television never explicitly stated those statements. Besides, plot holes would fall under trivia, something thats against WP:TRIVIA. Floria L 10:32, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

Never, explicitly stated? It is a fact that ZECT has goggles that immediantly detect Worms, as it is also a fact these goggles are not always used when logically it would be most effective to use them to find the Worms rather than having ZECT members follow people around and wait for them to transform into a Worm. It is also a fact that, according to several characters in the series, Worms inherit the memories of those whom they kill, and that they sometimes do it (like in Episode 15) without having yet killed the individual is a plothole. If this is not a plothole then why did the Worms need to go through an elaborate process of eliminating specific individuals to gather information about other individuals in Episode 14? Logically, it makes no sense if they can just suck people's memories without having to actually contact the individual they are wanting to mimic.

Secondly, your interpretation of the WP:Trivia to this matter is faulty, because this is not a trivia section like "Kendou likes to cook Japanese food and here is information about Japanese food". This is "many of the episode plots are inconsistent with one another and here's why". The information is directly related to the subject of the article, and therefore not meaningless trivia.

Not that WP:Trivia means a darn thing really, since it is not a guideline or a policy.

I find it very interesting that you have such a problem with information about plot holes in the storyline being included in the article. I'm trying to add information which may be of interest to fans of the show. The information is no less "trivial" than pointing out Kabuto uses the Rider Kick as a special attack. --Teram10 12:35, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

The "plot hole" section that you are pushing is what most definitely falls under No original research. Unless you have a critical commentary on Kamen Rider Kabuto from a Japanese critic that points out these plot holes, they should in no way be mentioned in the article. Whether it falls under WP:TRIV or WP:TRIVIA is unnecessary. If you made it up yourself by watching the series, we can't put it on Wikipedia.— Ryūlóng ( 竜龍 ) 19:00, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

Why does it need to be a Japanese critic? That sounds kind of racist to me. And again, it's not original research. The information is taken directly from the series, directly from the dialogue of the characters in the TV show. I find it interesting neither of you have a problem with the information on the character biography page despite NONE of those articles having any source reference except the TV show. --Teram10 23:28, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

Simple statement. Your analysis, is simply what it is. Its an ANALYSIS of what happened in the show, and what was cited. Biography pages: direct story details, no ANALYSIS. As in, no interpretation, plain facts. What Ryulong means by Japanese critic is an official person who is paid to review tv-shows. Thats called a 3rd party source, and attributable analysis. Wikipedia editors who are not professional critics cannot provide analysis that comes out of their own minds. Floria L 23:44, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

It is a fact that the established rules for how ZECT operatives search for Worms changes. It is also a fact the established rules for how Worms mimic humans changes without any explanation as to why. These aren't interpretations. These are direct-story details. Your reasons for why plot inconsistencies cannot be pointed out seem like nit-picking to me --Teram10 00:21, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Plot inconsistencies are not important in the long run of anything. What you are putting forward is original research. We need attributable information. Not stuff of the top of your head.— Ryūlóng ( 竜龍 ) 02:05, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Uchiyama Masato(Kageyama Shun)
He was also in Ultraman Nexus as Senjyu Ren(ep 26 - final), and in Kamen Rider 555 as a two-shot character, Kobayashi Yoshio/Rabbit Orphenoch. He isn't exactly a 'guest star' in Kabuto, so should he be added to that section? Thoughts? Jutari 12:18, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Well, over in the Den-O section, people who usualy appear throughout the series are called a series regular. I guess you can add that to the guest star area.(He he. Puns)White Coyote 14:39, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Ok, thanks! Jutari 11:52, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Shin Kagami?
Shouldn't it say Arata Kagami in the Cast list? 189.154.72.196 (talk) 19:38, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

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