Talk:Ketamine/Archive 3

Depression
User:A Real Journalist, about this (which had edit note "updated scientific data") and then this which had edit note "correct citation".

Over the last 15 years, ketamine has been found to be very effective as an antidepressant when administered intravenously in sub-anaesthetic doses. Over 100 independent clinical trials at leading institutions such as The National Institute of Mental Health, The Cleveland Clinic, Mt. Sinai Hospital, Yale University, Stanford University, UCLA, USC, and NYU, have been conducted. Average response rate to Ketamine Infusion Therapy among participants across all the studies is about 70%. In the last 5 years, there has been a significant increase in the number of ketamine clinics in the United States offering the treatment to the general public.
 * first version

However advancements over the last 15 years show that ketamine has been found to be very effective as an antidepressant when administered intravenously in sub-anaesthetic doses. Over 100 independent clinical trials at leading institutions such as The National Institute of Mental Health, The Cleveland Clinic, Mt. Sinai Hospital, Yale University, Stanford University, UCLA, USC, and NYU, have been conducted. Average response rate to Ketamine Infusion Therapy among participants across all the studies is about 70%. In the last 5 years, there has been a significant increase in the number of ketamine clinics in the United States offering the treatment to the general public.
 * second version

The section of the article where you put this content is "medical use". Content that goes into this section needs to describe medical use, and be sourced per WP:MEDRS, which briefly means a fairly recent literature review published in the biomedical literature, or a statement by a major medical medical or scientific body. The content in that section already describes medical use and the evidence for it, and is sourced to a fairly recent review.

The first source is an interview in NY Magazine and is not MEDRS. The second source is a news piece by the NIH, which is also not a MEDRS source.

The content is also very promotional, and obviously so, and really importantly, not supported by either source. Jytdog (talk) 00:14, 25 March 2017 (UTC)

External links modified
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Changes to lead
User:Irapliss, you are making changes only to the WP:LEAD and are using poor refs. Please see the note on your talk page at User_talk:Irapliss and the other messages there as well. Jytdog (talk) 19:50, 4 March 2018 (UTC)

Rapid acting antidepressant
Ketamine is not approved for this. Wired is not a good source to support

We have a whole section in the body Ketamine Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) 20:50, 3 April 2019 (UTC)
 * Okay added to the lead with a better source. Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) 20:57, 3 April 2019 (UTC)

Cleanup
This article is a little messy and could do with some rearranging. The medicinal uses part needs some subsections, and some thought might be given to partial merge with the medical research section. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Testem (talk • contribs) 10:28, 15 January 2014

In the structure subsection of the chemistry section, there is a table which includes axial and equatorial forms of ketamine, equating them to the salt and the free base forms. While chemically this may be true, the ball and stick structures do not show the nitrogen atom with the correct number of hydrogen atoms in covalent linkage. 24.12.7.29 (talk) 00:37, 9 May 2019 (UTC)
 * I have already pinged the editor who created that image to see about getting the ball-and-stick actual salt form for this context. DMacks (talk) 03:06, 9 May 2019 (UTC)

Immense profit potential means media bias and Government approval? Maybe. More information on ketamine please
The media (Washington Post, Cosmopolitan, et al) have delivered glowing reviews (repeatedly in the case of the Washington Post) of this drug for depression. These are anecdotal stories of one or more individuals who have a story of remarkable success apparently related to their use of the drug.

However, the following link shows flimsy evidence was used by the FDA to approve this drug for depression:

Moncrieff, J., & Horowitz, M. (2019). Esketamine for treatment-resistant depression. BMJ, 366. DOI: https://doi.org/10.1136/bmj.l5572 (Link)

Also Ketamine is known to be addictive. Here's this:

https://www.independent.co.uk/topic/ketamine

Side effects seem to include depression itself:

Short, B., Fong, J., Galvez, V., Shelker, W., & Loo, C. K. (2017). Side-effects associated with ketamine use in depression: A systematic review. Lancet Psychiatry. http://dx.doi.org/10.1016/ S2215-0366(17)30272-9 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.153.152.32 (talk) 23:40, 29 November 2019 (UTC)

Trace like versus dream like
Ref says "The resulting trancelike cataleptic state of “sensory isolation" not dream like. Propofol gives one the nice dreams. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 21:50, 11 April 2020 (UTC)

Table of biological targets
I suggest removing all targets with Ki > 10 mkM from the table. These targets are too weak to lead to any noticeable biological effect, and they make the Table confusing. The same goes about the text on the left from the Table: what is your opinion about removing all references to the targets inhibited with K more that 10 μM ?

The Sceptical Chymist (talk) 18:12, 26 November 2020 (UTC)

more cleanup
The "Recreational use" section is now duplicated in Ketamine in society and culture, so it should be just summarized here with a "main article" link. MB 01:37, 13 December 2020 (UTC)

Done. The Sceptical Chymist (talk) 12:58, 13 December 2020 (UTC)

"recreational use"
It is an incorrect term. It's not "use", it's recreational "abuse" as is misuse of all Rx medications, especially Scheduled ones. 2603:6000:D70A:BC00:1C69:20E9:6115:D11D (talk) 14:52, 19 July 2022 (UTC)


 * This seems to be primarily a question of morality, rather than fact. The word "use" captures things quite accurately from what I can tell. 153.92.159.205 (talk) 22:05, 10 October 2022 (UTC)

Date Rape mention
More info on ketamine’s use as a date rape drug would be useful, and it likely shouldn’t be included under Recreational Use? 69.42.137.164 (talk) 00:24, 19 November 2021 (UTC)


 * @69.42.137.164

A novel trimodal system on a paper-based microfluidic device for on-site detection of the date rape drug “ketamine” https://doi.org/10.1016/J.ACA.2020.01.002 2603:6000:D70A:BC00:1C69:20E9:6115:D11D (talk) 16:15, 19 July 2022 (UTC)


 * What kind of information do you feel is missing? The article already mentions that it has (sadly) been used in that way. Any drug which induces loss of consciousness or inhibition can and likely has been abused in such a way, by far the most common being alcohol. 153.92.159.205 (talk) 22:10, 10 October 2022 (UTC)