Talk:Lance Dodes

I have made Lance Dodes a redirect
I see that this draft, after being declined once, has been resubmitted. While waiting to see if this article can make it to the main article space of Wikipedia, I have made Lance Dodes a redirect to Effectiveness of Alcoholics Anonymous, mainly because it appears he is best known for “The Sober Truth”. SkylabField (talk) 07:16, 26 March 2020 (UTC)


 * How do I undo this? His extensive work on addiction (both for academic and lay audiences alike) is what he is by far best known for, not his debunking of AA's efficacy. Thanks. Philatherapist (talk) 18:04, 26 March 2020 (UTC)

If this draft article gets approved, it will replace the redirect. As an aside, another editor has pointed out this draft will probably not get approved because it’s not neutral. As just one example: Calling Lance Dodes’s work “The Sober Truth” a “debunking” is bias and slanted, because it falsely implies his views reflect scientific consensus on addiction treatment when, in fact they are not. SkylabField (talk) 21:03, 26 March 2020 (UTC)
 * I have done some work to make the article more neutral sounding and less biased, including having the entire section on “The Sober Truth” from Effectiveness of Alcoholics Anonymous here. SkylabField (talk) 21:23, 26 March 2020 (UTC)

Follow-Up
User:SkylabField, User:Philatherapist - In my opinion, Lance Dodes satisfies academic notability and general notability, and the draft should be accepted. It still has tone issues. I will be tagging it, but the tone issues can be addressed in article space, because it is not likely to be deleted in an AFD. The redirect will be displaced. Robert McClenon (talk) 14:46, 16 April 2020 (UTC)


 * I have condensed the section “Work on Addiction” and have expanded “Criticism of Trump's mental state” to make the article better reflect what reliable third party sources have to say about Dodes. Hopefully, this makes the article neutral enough that another editor can remove the NPOV tag.  SkylabField (talk) 17:50, 16 April 2020 (UTC)

Comments Moved from Front

 * I am reworking the article to try and make it more neutral. For the record, I feel that Dodes’s treatment of Alcoholics Anonymous in “The Sober Truth” is one of the most inaccurate and poorly done reviews out there, using distorted and downright inaccurate figures.  Hopefully my point of view can help this article be neutral enough to leave draft space. SkylabField (talk) 21:15, 26 March 2020 (UTC)

Re-submitting
I have gone to some effort to make this article neutral and to not have unreferenced allegations in it. While I very strongly disagree with Dodes’s assertion that Alcoholics Anonymous has success rate so low it may not be helpful, I also feel he deserves a Wikipedia article. SkylabField (talk) 10:57, 14 April 2020 (UTC)