Talk:Lexus ES

Merge
I think that Toyota Windom should redirect to Lexus ES, much like Toyota Aristo redirects to Lexus GS. I will be happy to merge the non-redundant information from the Toyota article, provided there is consensus to go ahead with the merge. DonIncognito 03:34, 4 May 2006 (UTC)

I agree. The Toyota Windom and the Lexus ES are the Exact same cars, albeit sold on a different market. Isn't Toyota Windom gonna be replaced by the Lexus ES soon because I heard that Toyota is starting to sell cars under the Lexus nameplate in Japan. Footballrocks41237 03:26, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

Toyota Window is yet another name for the Lexus ES, however, Toyota Camry is a less luxurious version of the same car. They have the same base. --Duncan21fan (talk) 09:35, 20 March 2012 (UTC)

EPA & Lexus
The Camry was a compact car platform until 2002. The EPA considered the Lexus ES as a compact until 2001. The LS used to be mid-size until 2000. -- Bull-Doser 01:01, 15 September 2006 (UTC)
 * What the EPA thinks is irrelevant to Wikipedia. IFCAR 01:40, 15 September 2006 (UTC)

The EPA is relevant to Wikipedia because they are what people go according to when it comes to classifying cars' size, mpg, etc.--Duncan21fan (talk) 09:55, 20 March 2012 (UTC)

Manual Transmission
Removed "The 1993 ES 300 was the last Lexus sedan to offer a 5-speed manual transmission until the introduction of the IS 300." because the SC300 was available with a 5-speed manual until 1997.


 * But the SC is a coupe, not a sedan. The statement was in fact correct. 142.31.10.90 (talk) 22:10, 6 May 2008 (UTC)

Regarding Lexus ES vs. Windom
The 1st generation ES had NO exact JDM sibling. Yes, it was really based on Vista (BTW, the main difference between Vista V2x and Camry V2x were doors -- Vista had frameless doors, while Camry had frames). BUT: in Japan, only 2.0 V6 (1VZ-FE?) was offered, while ES250 had 2.5 2VZ-FE. And, by the way, JDM version of what could be "ES200" was named Camry Prominent (neither Vista nor Windom, unlike stated in the article!).

 

they both look like the es250, so is the es250 based on both? if i rebadge my es250, what should i call it? above it says there is no exact JDM sibling but in those pix it looks like there is. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.90.179.120 (talk) 10:31, 28 December 2007 (UTC)


 * And relationship between 1st gen US Camry (VZV10) and 1st gen Windom exactly mirrored relationship between JDM Camry and Vista (SV30) -- they differed mainly in door frames, with Windom looking just as an enlarged Vista. Bolkhov 06:41, 27 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Thx for the information, I have added the 'partly' based on Toyota Vista for the 1st generation ES 250 section, and adjusted the reference to a 2.5L version related to the second gen ES 300 to say "including the VCV-11 Windom". Is this okay? Googling the Windom and Camry Prominent finds both with 2.5L V6s... and . The article states that the second generation ES 300 onwards until the fifth generation ES 350 shared similarities with the Windom, I was not aware of the Camry Prominent until you pointed it out. If there is any additional detail or correction to add to the article, any suggestions on how to do so would be great.  Thanks! Enigma3542002 08:50, 28 June 2007 (UTC)


 * The 1991-1995 Toyota Windom had also a 4VZ-FE 2.5 V6 engine which replaced the older 2VZ-FE engine. The Windom never got a 3VZ-FE, but did get the 1MZ-FE in 1994 with the 4VZ-FE following suit in most models , especially export asian markets as Thailand til 1995, when the new 1996 model debuted with the 2MZ-FE a 2.5 V6 which replaced the 4VZ-FE 2.5. The 1MZ-FE did not return to the lineup to the lineup until the 99-2000 model. 2000 up model Windoms never got the 3MZ-FE 3.3 liter V6, and Windoms had a manual transmission option til 1999. Also the Windom did have the 2AZ-FE for the last year and half of its asian market production until the Windom was dropped for the global ES name badge on the Lexus marque .Kongkit (talk) 19:21, 25 January 2009 (UTC)KongkitKongkit (talk) 19:21, 25 January 2009 (UTC)

Platform name
The ES350 is an GCV, not GSV platform Kongkit (talk) 19:18, 27 July 2009 (UTC)KongkitKongkit (talk) 19:18, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
 * According to these two sites: and  you get the platform designation by combining motor name and model range name. When it gets more than four letters the letter adding system for gasoline engine cars gives Z+X=C and R+X=S. Since this car is in the XV model range since the 2nd generation (1st generation V model range), the designated names would be:


 * {| class="wikitable"

! engine !! model range !! model range generation !! platform name
 * VZ || V || 2 || VZV21
 * VZ || XV || 1 || VCV10
 * MZ || XV || 2 || MCV20
 * MZ || XV || 3 || MCV30
 * GR || XV || 4 || GSV40
 * AZ || XV || 4 || ACV40
 * }
 * When googling I find very few non-Wikipedia-related pages that use the GCV40 designation. --Boivie (talk) 14:58, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
 * GR || XV || 4 || GSV40
 * AZ || XV || 4 || ACV40
 * }
 * When googling I find very few non-Wikipedia-related pages that use the GCV40 designation. --Boivie (talk) 14:58, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
 * }
 * When googling I find very few non-Wikipedia-related pages that use the GCV40 designation. --Boivie (talk) 14:58, 3 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Found official mfr document with GSV40 listed:, so I changed it back to GSV40. MTan355 (talk) 21:23, 3 December 2009 (UTC)

Gas pedal issue
That section needs a rewrite, one of the editors seems to have a bias against Toyota and has added false information. This investigation is not over also the NHTSA has yet to order Toyota to issue any recalls. Also section should use official sources from Toyota and the NHTSA, not outside sources. Flagolus (talk) 07:51, 15 November 2009 (UTC) When I get some time I'm going to replace the ABC News and LA Times sources with original source material from the NHTSA. Flagolus (talk) 08:14, 15 November 2009 (UTC)


 * There is nothing wrong with using newspaper articles. They are reliable sources under Wikipedia policy.  Please do not remove them as sources. Cla68 (talk) 11:27, 15 November 2009 (UTC)


 * I'm not sure if I was the one you accused as biased against Toyota. I currently possess and operate two Toyota automobiles and both work fine. Cla68 (talk) 11:31, 15 November 2009 (UTC)


 * There is a reason why Wikipedia isn't a news source. 60_Minutes.  The NHTSA investigation is ongoing, with six other similar NHTSA investigations on Toyota vehicles closed with Toyota being cleared of any wrongdoing.  Rehashing them again as ABC News is doing isn't useful to anyone beyond spreading misinformation. Exactly why real automotive news outlets are barely reporting this.

The sole reason this made ABC News a sensationalism TV "news" network and consequently wound up in this article through single purpose editors is because of the widely publicized deaths of the CHP officer and his family. People familiar with automobiles know the NHTSA runs numerous and endless investigations on car companies none of which are mentioned in their respective articles.

Details like:
 * floor mats in that accident were from the RX 400h
 * floor mats were not secured
 * the ES350 was a loaner
 * Toyota has been cleared repeatedly of these same allegations in the past.
 * The NHTSA investigation is ongoing

However apparently since ABC News wants to total up all the prior complaints which the NHTSA has cleared Toyota of that somehow belongs in the article.Flagolus (talk) 12:51, 15 November 2009 (UTC)

Sales and production
Whilst downsizing and consolidating the sales and production tables, I removed the dubious US-only production data from 1990 through to 2005. The references used (see this example for 2005) seem to relate to the model year only, despite the table claiming calendar years. The numbers also do not seem to correlate with the sales per year so I have removed them, but retained the 2006 through to 2009 figures as these are global and are reported based on the calendar year. The removed figures should be re-added when global figures can be found which are based on the calendar year.

Also, I am not sure why it is necessary to place misleading generation separations which indicate that each new generation commenced sales on January 1, and ended on December 31 (even with a disclaimer). For example, the 2001 calendar year includes sales of both the XV20 and XV30 models. It comes across as trying to force on information, that would work if reported by model years, into a calendar year format. Readers only have to scroll up to roughly find out the corresponding model available at the time. OSX (talk • contributions) 00:01, 24 December 2010 (UTC)

Official Competitors in Australia and New Zealand
In Australia and New Zealand, the Lexus ES 350 is comparable with the Holden Commodore and Ford Falcon. --198.228.216.26 (talk) 01:39, 27 November 2013 (UTC)


 * Not really. The Commodore and Falcon are slightly bigger, RWD, have optional V8 engines and are aimed at the average buyer. The ES is slightly smaller, FWD, no V8 and aimed at the luxury market.  Stepho  talk 02:27, 27 November 2013 (UTC)


 * It don't matter. There in $30,000-$45,000 range. :) 198.228.216.24 (talk) 03:48, 27 November 2013 (UTC)


 * Then we'd better list the HiAce as a competitor then. Which market are we going for again? And how does the ES stack up when towing a large caravan or boat?  Stepho  talk 04:32, 27 November 2013 (UTC)


 * Well, then why would a FWD Audi compare with a RWD BMW or Mercedes-Benz? --198.228.216.34 (talk) 04:54, 27 November 2013 (UTC)


 * Don't feed the troll, Stepho.  Mr.choppers &#124;   ✎  09:30, 27 November 2013 (UTC)


 * WHO is the troll? --198.228.216.27 (talk) 04:10, 28 November 2013 (UTC)


 * The Falcon and Commodore are not competitors to the ES 350. Are you making stuff up? 166.137.208.19 (talk) 00:13, 7 February 2014 (UTC)

Class of the car
Who writes that ES is a mid-size car? Mid-size is a D-segment, but ES is the E-class car, just as GS — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.237.6.202 (talk) 17:46, 25 May 2016 (UTC)


 * The Camry is mid-size, and the ES is very much based on the Camry, but with a unique body/interior. The current XV60 series does share more with the full-size Avalon though. OSX (talk • contributions) 17:49, 25 May 2016 (UTC)


 * Is based on camry but it's larger, it equals the e-segment — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.237.3.198 (talk) 13:18, 26 May 2016 (UTC)


 * Only the current model is larger. Given the ES is targeted at the US market and the US uses mid-size, full-size, etc, we should respect that. D- and E-segment are quite obscure terms. OSX (talk • contributions) 13:59, 26 May 2016 (UTC)


 * I do not mean to revive an old thread but I second this☝🏻 the ES is not Euro-centric, it's sized like E-segment European cars but if you're gonna compare it with them then you might as well compare a 1990s/2000s Mercury Sable or Buick Century/Regal with the German cars. Sorry but wearing a nice badge alone does not make for a luxury car. An ES does not offer driving experience similar to an A6, 5 Series, or E-Class. Nor is it a sporty car. On a side note, my stepdad drives a Lexus ES and it is nowhere as pleasant as the German cars. 2600:6C50:4000:27D0:3832:F32F:B0D4:1431 (talk) 09:47, 2 February 2023 (UTC)

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Model code
Prompted by an anon-ip change, I looked for what the new model code is. Found https://www.lexus-tech.eu/whatsNew.aspx Having registered (free) and poked around a bit, I found the model codes for the new ES are GSZ10L (for 2GR engine), ASZ10L (for A25A engine), AXZA10* (for A25A engine), AXZH10* (for A25A engine) * is L or R for LHD or RHD. Unfortunately, since Toyota/Lexus have started using a new variation of their model code scheme, I don't know yet what the shortened version is that covers all engines except that it will have 'Z' and '10' in it. But I can confidently say that it is not 'XV70'.  Stepho  talk 10:54, 26 October 2018 (UTC)


 * My guess it would be the XZ10, as the XF50 LS with a V35A engine has a VXFA50 designation. Here's my breakdown (it could be wrong though):
 * The letter V is taken from the first letter of V35A engine.
 * The letters XF is taken from LS's model designation (XF).
 * The letter A is taken from the "A" of "V35A".
 * The number 50 is taken from current LS's model code (XF50)
 * From the breakdown above, I took the AXZA10 code. By using the method above, the closest model designation I could get is XZ10. But after some further research, this particular code has actually already been used for the Toyota Raum MPV from the 1990s to 2000s. This made the actual designation more confusing. Could it be Toyota recycled the designation? Or is there another code for it? Hyperman001 (talk) 03:07, 17 January 2019 (UTC)


 * Sounds plausible. I guess we'll just have to keep watching to see the new pattern - just like we did in the 1990's when they added the X in front of most new models.  Stepho  talk 09:01, 17 January 2019 (UTC)

Local production in India
ES 300h local assembly in India. Is India became the fourth country that assembled Lexus vehicles other than Japan, USA and Canada? 182.30.204.161 (talk) 12:33, 31 January 2020 (UTC)


 * Does it make its own parts or just assemble them from kits and a few local bits? For me, stamping the body panels is the big one. Other people might have a different opinion.  Stepho  talk 04:44, 1 February 2020 (UTC)


 * From what I've read, it might be just assembling the complete body parts (or CKD) from Japan. I might be wrong though. 182.30.204.161 (talk) 04:58, 1 February 2020 (UTC)

Yes they do make mentions of mid-size
From Car & Driver: https://www.caranddriver.com/lexus/es "The Lexus ES mid-size luxury sedan excels in comfort and offers buyers a much lower starting price than ostensible competitors like the Audi A6 and Mercedes-Benz E-class. That’s because it’s a Toyota Camry underneath, with sleeker styling and posh interior furnishings." From Lexus themself: "2019 LEXUS ES 350 F SPORT WINS BEST MID-SIZE LUXURY CAR AWARD AT THE 2019 TEXAS AUTO WRITERS ASSOCIATION AUTO ROUNDUP" https://pressroom.lexus.com/2019-lexus-es-350-f-sport-wins-best-midsize-luxury-car-award-texas-auto-writers-association-roundup/

How is this not enough? Do moderators not have time to scroll down or even check the title within the link? I'm suing Wikipedia if all you guys do is suppress your editors with your own agenda. Do you even get paid to rebuke your agenda? 2600:6C50:4000:27D0:247B:9E0F:4D54:239A (talk) 21:12, 2 February 2023 (UTC)


 * Funny thing is they left the Daewoo Leganza (a garbage POS that started at a lower price than a Honda Civic of its time) as an "executive car" (that supposedly competed with an Audi A6) for months before I removed that term. 2600:6C50:4000:27D0:247B:9E0F:4D54:239A (talk) 21:16, 2 February 2023 (UTC)


 * Apologies. Self-reverted. Bahooka (talk) 21:42, 2 February 2023 (UTC)
 * I forgive you 2600:6C50:4000:27D0:9656:90D:BEE3:AAEA (talk) 21:51, 2 February 2023 (UTC)
 * I find this constant wrangling about size categories completely incomprehensible and nothing but a way for IPs to waste everyone's time, but in this case mid-size seems correct (and compact feels off). Best  Mr.choppers &#124;   ✎  21:56, 2 February 2023 (UTC)