Talk:List of Catholic dioceses in the United States

earlier conversation
Just want to say that I'm very proud of the map I made for this page. It took me all day, and led my roommate to think that I'm completely insane, but there it is, and it's very pretty. john k 04:51, 13 Mar 2005 (UTC)


 * Your roommate may or may not be wrong , but it is a very nice map. - Nunh-huh 04:53, 13 Mar 2005 (UTC)

He's probably right, sadly. Glad you like it. john k 05:00, 13 Mar 2005 (UTC)


 * Insane would be a map of Anglican dioceses of the United States in an animated gif that shows them morphing into the Roman Catholic dioceses. Or an animated gif showing the growth and spread of Catholicism from 1776 to 2005. You still haven't crossed the line!- Nunh-huh 05:06, 13 Mar 2005 (UTC)

This is an excellent map. I wish I had half your talent. T-Bone

Merge?
I oppose merging this article with the theoretically worldwide list of dioceses. That article is not nearly so well put together as this one. There perhaps should be more national lists, and then the world list can list the national list articles. Argyriou 00:32, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

I oppose too. Rwflammang 20:47, 6 September 2006 (UTC)


 * I'm working on the national lists. All of North America has been done. Here is my plan.

1. master list of worldwide list of dioceses. 2. 6 continental lists: North America, South America, Africa, Europe, Asia, and Australia/Oceanea. North America is done. 3. National lists. All the ones in North America are done, with Bolivia, Brazil and Argentina also done. Benkenobi18 03:30, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Multi-state dioceses
This article is very well put together and the map is first-rate.

The diocese of Gallup is described as comprising portions of New Mexico and Arizona and being the only multi-state diocese in the U.S. Isn't the Wilmington diocese a multi-state one, as well? I understand it comprises the state of Delaware and some counties of the state of Maryland. - 200.104.58.205 22:16, 31 March 2007 (UTC)


 * There are several other multi-state dioceses in the US. I believe all of the Eastern eparchies are multi-state. The text as of this time stamp is correct, saying that it is only one of a few dioceses that are multi-state. TMLutas 03:49, 20 October 2007 (UTC)

I live in the diocese of Wilmington and it does indeed cross state line as a user mentioned here in 2007. (It used to go all the way down the Delmarva Peninsula, but the Virginia part was returned to the Richmond diocese in 1974.) The diocese of Norwich, Connecticut also has Fishers Island, NY; thus, the New York province doesn't quite have all of New York state. The Washington Archdiocese has DC and 5 Maryland counties; it is not multi-state, because DC is not part of any state. Other US dioceses crossing state lines are not Roman-rite. Carlm0404 (talk) 04:53, 3 October 2020 (UTC)

Mother v. Head Church
The term Mother Church usually refers to the first church in a particular area, whereas Head Church refers to the cathedral (as in the German Domkirche or 'head church'). Thus the Archbasilica of Our Most Holy Saviour in Rome (also called St. John Lateran) is the "Mother & Head of all the churches in Rome and the world" since it was the first church (Constantine donated his palace) and is the cathedral of Rome. The Loreto Mission in Baja California is likewise stylized the "Mother & Head of All Churches in the Californias" since it is the first church and the cathedral for Lower (Baja) California. In Philadelphia our mother church is Old St. Joseph's and it is refered to as such. Our head church is the Cathedral Basilica of SS. Peter & Paul. I have fixed this on the page. Miguel 16:43, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

Catholic v Roman Catholic
There are 9 eparchies that are not Roman on this list. They are sister Churches within Catholicism. When listing bishops, the equivalent list is the list of Catholic bishops. Is there any reason not to move this list to "List of Catholic dioceses of the United States"? TMLutas 03:40, 20 October 2007 (UTC)


 * There is no reason not to move this list to "List of Catholic dioceses of the United States" so I did.--Antiedman (talk) 16:23, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

move article
It is now going to move this page to the title List of the Catholic dioceses of the United States since this page contains information on all catholic dioceses of the united states.--Antiedman (talk) 06:02, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Merge non-duplicated info
The List of the Catholic cathedrals of the United States contains a great deal of overlap with this article. I propose merging the pages. Goldnpuppy (talk) 02:37, 17 March 2016 (UTC)


 * Oppose Both the diocesan list and the cathedral list are part of a series of lists of these two topics in their respective country. Note the category at the bottom: "Lists of Roman Catholic dioceses by country."  There are 123 such lists.  (It should be noted that the United States is unique in that it has so many dioceses from the Latin/Roman Church and eparchies from the East.  That is why the US title does not have "Roman" in it.)  The cathedrals should be removed from this list, and to be honest they never should have been added in the first place.  At least they were initially in separate galleries, and now this list has become cumbersome.  In addition the placement of the cathedrals of the Eastern Catholic Churches in galleries for "Additional Archdioceses" and "Additional Dioceses" is offensive.  These are constituent parts of the Catholic Church, not "additional," and they should be respected as such.  I suggest the lists remain separate and the cathedrals removed from this list.  Farragutful (talk) 01:13, 9 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Oppose I agree with Farragutful. When I created the format for the tables for the cathedral and diocese wiki pages, the diocese page did not have the cathedrals or pictures of the cathedrals until somebody decided to add them in.  It was meant to be a list of dioceses, not dioceses and cathedrals.  When I have time, I'll cleanup the diocese page to remove the cathedrals. Roberto221 (talk) 05:29, 9 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Oppose There's a big difference between a list of structures and a list of organizations. Cross-referencing would be helpful.-- Jim in Georgia  Contribs  Talk  16:15, 12 May 2016 (UTC)


 * Oppose - Cathedrals are buildings. Dioceses are organizations. Gerry D (talk) 22:33, 2 October 2016 (UTC)


 * Because this has been open for about 1 year with no one but the original proposer in support. I am going to close out the merger by removing the merge tag, and condence this list as stated at Merging.  Etineskid  (talk)  02:39, 19 February 2017 (UTC)

Region?
In the table for each of the provinces, in square brackets, a notice is given with the word region followed by a cryptic roman numeral, e.g., Region XVIII. Nowhere is the word region explained. I will delete these this worthless information unless given a reason not to. Thanks! Rwflammang (talk) 00:04, 26 August 2016 (UTC)

Table mania
This article used to be a bunch of subsections, one subsection per province, with a bulleted list of dioceses given for each province. It has been converted to a table. In the conversion process, the existence of a table of contents of dioceses was lost. This is a major loss in an article as long as tedious as this one is. Unless given a reason, I will delete the table and restore what preceded it. Thanks! Rwflammang (talk) 00:07, 26 August 2016 (UTC)


 * Oppose The reason it was converted to a table is because it is easily sortable by Province and Diocese. As the name of the article states, it is a "List"

Roberto221 (talk) 00:19, 26 August 2016 (UTC)


 * A list with a table of contents would be a big improvement over a list without one. That is especially true since the rows in the list are so tall and take a long time to scroll through. Rwflammang (talk) 15:35, 27 August 2016 (UTC)


 * As I stated before, it makes it sortable. Also, when you are editing, make sure your edits actually work.  I just finished cleaning up so that it actually points to pages and files.

Roberto221 (talk) 23:44, 27 August 2016 (UTC)


 * Comment As I see it, there are a couple of problems with the table as it is presently configured.  First, it is cumbersome.  It does not sort the dioceses by their see city name, but by the the first word in their title.  Therefore, the first one listed in alphabetical order is the Apostolic Prefecture of the Marshall Islands, followed by all of the archdioceses and then all of the dioceses.  In my mind that doesn't make sense as it seems to me that most people would be looking for "Chicago," or whatever the city, and not "Archdiocese of Chicago."  Secondly, it's a very long list, and it needs to be broken up somehow.  Because it is so long it is difficult to edit, and not user friendly.  Yes, its sortable, but its not necessarily helpful.


 * I don't mind a table as such. In the List of cathedrals in the United States tables are used for each state.  They are not sortable, but they don't have to be sortable as most are short and provide pertinent and limited information.  A similar thing could be done here with a province division, and a "Contents" would be created at the beginning to aid navigation.


 * This is from the intervention above, but I'm including it here. I'm ambivalent about the inclusion of the bishop's conference regions for the dioceses in the 50 states and the Virgin Islands.  (The rest of the dioceses in the US territories are in other bishop's conferences.)  When I worked on the diocesan level many years ago these were important divisions and dioceses within them worked on a variety of programs and interests (liturgy, social justice, youth, etc.) accordingly, more so than on a province level.  (Although that may have been a reflection of the province I worked in.)  I have no idea if this is still true today.  Possibly something could be mentioned in the text above the list as to what the regions refer to.  To my knowledge only the San Francisco province is in two regions, and then it's only one diocese in the province (Salt Lake).


 * There is a another issue I have fought here and seemingly lost. The inclusion of the Diocese of the Caroline Islands and the Apostolic Prefecture of the Marshall Islands in the Agaña province.  They are not in the United States.  The Archdiocese of Agaña is in Guam, and the Diocese of Chalan Kanoa is in the Northern Mariana Islands, which are both US territories and should be included.  The Caroline and Marshall Islands are foreign territories and should not be included in a list of Catholic dioceses in the United States.  Their inclusion in the Agaña province does not make them US-based ecclesiastical territories. Farragutful (talk) 20:24, 29 August 2016 (UTC)


 * Personally, I agree with the user who started this section. The table destroyed the functionality of the table of contents in this article, which had allowed you to quickly click to a particular province rather than scrolling or searching for it. I liked that feature, which I have effectively restored by introducing subsections into the table. I hope that this will be a helpful compromise. The table is still sortable for those who like that feature, although I also agree that the diocese column should sort by the name of the see directly, intermixing the various archdioceses and dioceses as appropriate. LacrimosaDiesIlla (talk) 21:28, 13 May 2017 (UTC)


 * Well, even I have to admit it works as a compromise. You have the subsections and it still sorts the whole table. Can you work you magic on the Cathedrals and Bishops pages?  On another note, I did include Guam, Northern Mariana Islands and Samoa because the original title of this article was "List of Catholic dioceses of the United States" but got renamed and therefore their inclusion didn't make sense.  Same thing happened with the Cathedrals page. Roberto221 (talk) 00:08, 14 May 2017 (UTC)
 * I'll take a look and add them to my to do list. LacrimosaDiesIlla (talk) 16:10, 15 May 2017 (UTC)

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