Talk:List of people from Kingston upon Hull

Untitled
Jacob Bronowski, I never heard of him, but he is apparently important enough for the BBC to write about. (http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/humberside/hi/people_and_places/religion_and_ethics/newsid_8752000/8752434.stm) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.100.172.61 (talk) 11:54, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

Alfred Gelder
I cannot do cite/refs, I always seem to mess them up, can somebody add this one please. http://www.hullwebs.co.uk/content/k-victorian/people/alfred-gelder/alfred-gelder.pdf —Preceding unsigned comment added by MartinSpamer (talk • contribs) 14:31, 23 August 2010 (UTC)
 * I have added an entry, though we do not have an article as yet, looks good for an article though as he was knighted for his work. Keith D (talk) 16:03, 23 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Agreed. Thanks. MartinSpamer (talk) 11:36, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Guy Smith is reported as from Beverley not Hull on the profile on his Office Website. http://www.guysmith.com/profile —Preceding unsigned comment added by MartinSpamer (talk • contribs) 11:46, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Commander Harry Pursey was John Prescotts predecessor in Hull East. Here are a couple of links for sources citations. http://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/harry_pursey/kingston_upon_hull_east http://www.hull.ac.uk/arc/undergraduate/30039politics.html MartinSpamer (talk) 11:58, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

http://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/harry_pursey/kingston_upon_hull_east

http://www.thisishullandeastriding.co.uk/news/City-s-famous-sons-daughters-showcased-new-book-biographies/article-2632749-detail/article.html —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.249.223.220 (talk) 13:16, 12 September 2010 (UTC)

Ralph Thomas
Article include http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerald_Thomas but not his brother https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ralph_Thomas — Preceding unsigned comment added by MartinSpamer (talk • contribs) 11:48, 29 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Have you a reliable source for either of these that links them to Hull? The former is in the article but tagged for source so could be removed. Keith D (talk) 21:14, 29 April 2014 (UTC)

Chris Langton
Development of ultrasound to detect osteoporosis was also developed by Chris Langton at the University of Hull. About 12,000 detection machines have been sold worldwide. — Preceding unsigned comment added by MartinSpamer (talk • contribs) 11:56, 29 April 2014 (UTC)
 * The Chris Langton article is on an American - you would need to create an article on the person before adding them to the list. Keith D (talk) 21:16, 29 April 2014 (UTC)

Frederick Needler
Founder of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Needler%27s — Preceding unsigned comment added by MartinSpamer (talk • contribs) 11:59, 29 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Need some reliable sources, the article is under sourced and could do with some more. Keith D (talk) 21:19, 29 April 2014 (UTC)

Margaret Kissling ( nee Moxon )
Education pioneer from Hull to be honoured with commemorative plaque

A commemorative plaque will be unveiled today to pay tribute to a pioneering teacher from Hull.

Margaret Moxon travelled as a missionary to Sierra Leone and New Zealand, where she paved the way for girls' education during the 1800s.

http://www.itv.com/news/calendar/update/2015-11-23/education-pioneer-from-hull-to-be-honoured-with-commemorative-plaque/ http://www.teara.govt.nz/en/biographies/1k13/kissling-margaret http://hullvalley.blogspot.co.uk/2012/03/margaret-moxon-way.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.86.117.208 (talk) 22:15, 4 January 2017 (UTC)
 * Thanks, I have added an entry to the list and made a note on her article. Keith D (talk) 17:46, 12 January 2017 (UTC)

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Jonathan Dowsland
This is a list of notable people connected to Kingston upon Hull. Dowsland does not have an article to show his notability, Dowsland's YouTube videos do not show his notability, and he has no source to show his connection to the place. Meters (talk) 00:30, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
 * See WP:LISTPEOPLE Meters (talk) 00:36, 3 December 2021 (UTC)
 * And editing the text to claim that this list also includes non-notables is disruptive. Meters (talk) 03:25, 4 December 2021 (UTC)

"A person is typically included in a list of people only if both of the following requirements are met". Key word typically. This means that non notable people could, in theory, be added to a list of people. This issue is not necessary anything to do with Jonathan Dowsland.MarkRodge67 (talk) 03:47, 4 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Yes, and the full quote from Wikipedia:LISTPEOPLE  is Because the subject of many lists is broad, a person is typically included in a list of people only if both of the following requirements are met: The person meets the Wikipedia notability requirement. The person's membership in the list's group is established by reliable sources.
 * Neither of these conditions are met, let alone both of them, and WP:EXEMPT1E is not met. Meters (talk) 03:55, 4 December 2021 (UTC)

Doesn't matter [that both of these conditions aren't met]. The quote isn't "Only notable people are allowed on lists of people...", it says typically, because there are exceptions MarkRodge67 (talk) 03:58, 4 December 2021 (UTC)
 * We settle exceptions on Wikipedia by discussions like this. "Doesn't matter" isn't a particularly strong case... BusterD (talk) 04:11, 4 December 2021 (UTC)
 * I feel like it is a pefectly strong case given my argument before hand. The quote says "typically", this word is not 100%. MarkRodge67 (talk) 04:18, 4 December 2021 (UTC)

For the record, this isn't just one person trying to modify this page, we decided - as a group - that this person should be added to the list. This is one issue, the other issue is that i believe incorrect edits are being made to the introduction that don't follow the the rules/guidelines noted in this article. MarkRodge67 (talk) 04:55, 4 December 2021 (UTC)
 * we decided - as a group please see WP:SOCK and WP:MEAT. A group of people deciding something offline then all coming on here to argue it together is not okay. Joseph2302 (talk) 08:42, 4 December 2021 (UTC)
 * thats why we stopped trying to add him, but my other point still standsMarkRodge67 (talk) 15:18, 4 December 2021 (UTC)

If anyone has a counter argument then please make your argument here. This problem needs to be solved MarkRodge67 (talk) 18:08, 4 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Giving you're the one causing the problem, it could be solved by not you not editing it. Every list like this only includes notable people who have articles. The person you're trying to spam on here does not meet that definition, so should not be added. It needs no editing to "fix" anything, as it's fine as it is. We're not going to overrule the entire way we do things on Wikipedia for list like this, just because you and your sock/meatpuppets don't like it. Joseph2302 (talk) 18:33, 4 December 2021 (UTC)
 * To address MarkRodge67's insistence that WP:LISTPEOPLE's wording "typically included" means that anyone can be included, regardless of notability: yes, occasional exceptions can be made on some list articles, but Jonathan Dowsland does not meet the ones that are listed in LISTPEOPLE. We also sometimes allow the inclusion of entries where the subject is clearly notable and would qualify for an article if one were written, but Jonathan Dowsland cannot be presumed to be notable. He does not meet WP:NBIO or the more specific WP:NPROF or WP:NMUSIC. Note that WP:LISTPEOPLE also says "In other cases, editors choose even more stringent requirements, such as already having an article written (not just qualifying for one)" and it appears that lists of people from locales is one such case. WP:Settlement says "Names of notable people born or residing in the locality (not ancestry). Include only people with a Wikipedia article," I see nothing to suggest that there is even the slightest possibility that we should include Dowsland in this list.
 * The article is currently protected because of this issue. One user has been indef'ed because of this issue. There is an SPI open on the users attempting to add Jonathan Dowsland. The unsourced Draft:Jonathan Dowsland has been declined twice and is now up for deletion. I suggest that the users pushing this take the hint, read WP:IDHT, and drop this. Meters (talk) 21:07, 4 December 2021 (UTC)
 * And user:Bmcln1 added the usually unwritten and unneeded clarification that this is a list of notable people, presumably because of this issue. Meters (talk) 21:12, 4 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Stop bringing Jonathan Dowsland into it, I have made a separate point that has nothing to do with him. You've just proven my point - anyone can be added to lists so putting that only notable people can be put in this list is incorrect. I don't know why you are having trouble understanding that. We can discuss adding him later MarkRodge67 (talk) 23:50, 4 December 2021 (UTC) — MarkRodge67 (talk&#32;• contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
 * All of the named accounts attempting to include Dowsland or arguing that non-notables should be added have been indef'ed. Meters (talk) 20:37, 7 December 2021 (UTC)
 * They are not arguing that they should be added, they are arguing that they could be added. Ma rcu s MPQ (talk) 00:39, 8 December 2021 (UTC) — Ma rcu s MPQ (talk&#32;• contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
 * I heard about this fella back in my day, he's well known by the working class in Hull. He has done a great deal to benefit people less forunate for him in the areas of Computer Science and music. If you live in Gypsyville he's basically the most well known celebrity you could think of. Honestly, I think many people would truly appreciate it from the bottom of there hearts if he could be added to this page and it would mean a lot to a great many number of people. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dr Tobias Compton (talk • contribs) 21:20, 8 December 2021 (UTC) — Dr Tobias Compton (talk&#32;• contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
 * It's not about what locals think of him. It does not matter how many locals show up and ask to have him included. It's about whether or not he is notable by Wikipedia's standards. In my opinion, as I've already written: He does not meet WP:NBIO or the more specific WP:NPROF or WP:NMUSIC If you think he does meet notability requirements, then please add reliably sourced evidence of his notability to Draft:Jonathan Dowsland (if it has not already been deleted). See WP:RS on sourcing. Meters (talk) 21:35, 8 December 2021 (UTC)
 * They don’t always have to be notable by Wikipedia’s standards to be added and this page has been incorrectly edited to say that they need to be despite the countless amounts of evidence that has been provided by other users. FeetAndInches (talk) 22:27, 8 December 2021 (UTC) — FeetAndInches (talk&#32;• contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
 * As has already been pointed out, WP:LISTPEOPLE also says "In other cases, editors choose even more stringent requirements, such as already having an article written (not just qualifying for one)". And as has also already been pointed out, this article falls under WP:Settlement, which explicitly requires that all entries have Wikipedia articles. You either didn't read the thread, or this is a case of WP:IDHT. Either way, please don't waste our time. Meters (talk) 00:36, 9 December 2021 (UTC)

Notable people
This is not necessarily a list of notable people so it shouldn't say that in the introduction. User:MarkRodge67 Has made a compelling argument that should be taken into account. MickyMoo72 (talk) 09:32, 7 December 2021 (UTC) — MickyMoo72 (talk&#32;• contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
 * Already explained above. Meters (talk) 00:37, 9 December 2021 (UTC)

Robinson Crusoe
Arguably, Robinson Crusoe, albeit a fictional concoction, is the most famous person to be "from" Kingston-upon-Hull. The Daniel Defoe novel is cited as the first modern British novel. The Robinson Crusoe saga serves as a template of many imitators. "Robinson Crusoe" is a powerful metaphor for 3 centuries. And, finally, to be sure, Hull was the port that he began his Adventure from. So maybe a mention in the "transportation" section? The list of Famous? Both? Kurnkerner (talk) 18:41, 5 July 2023 (UTC)