Talk:Morrisite War

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Image in question[edit]

The image of Joseph Morris may be incorrect. Please see File_talk:Joseph_Morris.jpg--ARTEST4ECHO talk 20:08, 27 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified (February 2018)[edit]

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US involvement[edit]

This should be the United Stated and not the Utah Territory. As started invmy first edit "fix infobox. Added units(USMS and terrtoial milita), this was USA VS morrisite (this is because USMS where used)" I do not know why the edits where reverted, if @The Banner could clarify. LuxembourgLover (talk) 14:51, 5 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Do you have any sources for your claim? The Banner talk 15:21, 5 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
In addition to being referenced in the article, I have sources One and Two. LuxembourgLover (talk) 16:05, 5 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Nice, but both of these sources do not support your claims.
The first source states "Robert T. Burton, deputy marshal" but leaves it unclear if he was a local/state/US marshal.
The second source is even worse. It is a listing of autobiographies with a summery. The second one states: He participated in resisting the U.S. Army during the Utah War, mentions the Morrisite War, (...) No evidence he participated in the Morrisite War. Just mentioning that war does not prove that he participated. The Banner talk 20:17, 5 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
local/state marshals do not exist in the US. Also the article mentions he is a US Marshall. If you want to be sure, you should read all the references for the article. LuxembourgLover (talk) 02:01, 6 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Please read United States Marshals Service and especially: For over 100 years marshals were patronage jobs, typically controlled by the district judge.. You give zero evidence that they acted on behalf of the national US Government. The Banner talk 05:52, 6 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I just added info from the artical into the infobox, I do not need to sorce it if it says in the artical US marshals where sent to the battle. LuxembourgLover (talk) 19:37, 31 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
You are mistaken, as all other mention of the marshals are also unsourced. So it is necessary to get sources. The Banner talk 23:33, 31 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Now that the claim is sourced, should we have the United States or Union. LuxembourgLover (talk) 23:21, 25 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That "source" is just one passing mention of him being a "deputy marshal" acting on behalves of the territorial chief. Still n0o evidence of the central government being involved. And regarding your question about confederate or union: what do the sources say? The Banner talk 00:01, 26 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
You are right Robert Burton was not a Deputy U.S. Marshal, he was an Utah Marshal. However Judson was a Deputy United States Marshal, as found in the source “On May 24, 1862, Deputy United States Marshal Judson Stoddard obtained a writ of habeas corpus from Territorial Chief Justice John J. Kinney. He proceeded to Kingston Fort where he was allowed to read the writ to Morris, Banks, and Klemgard. These men were not willing to receive the document, however, and let it fall to the ground in their midst.”
Also my question was not confederate or union, it was Union or United States. As it was during the civil war I do not know what one to uses. LuxembourgLover (talk) 02:36, 26 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Picture[edit]

I found a picture that I think we can uses. It shows the Utah Territorial Militia attacking the fort. However the picture is called "massacre of the Morrisite" that did not happen, it also shows US forces attacking civilians, while civilians died they where not killed by US forces in a massacre. Should we still uses it? LuxembourgLover (talk) 15:02, 13 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Is it free of copyright? The Banner talk 18:05, 13 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, sorry I forgot to link it. I just don't know if we should use it because it is not the most historically accurate photo, but then there where 4 civilians to die in the conflict. LuxembourgLover (talk) 14:23, 15 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Morrisite massacre
As in this, free picture, already present on Wikimedia Commons with all the correct licenses? And free to use? The Banner talk 20:52, 15 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I asked the same question on Wikimedia Commons and they uploaded it. The question is should we uses it? I just don't know if we should use it because it is not the most historically accurate photo, but then there where 4 civilians to die in the conflict. LuxembourgLover (talk) 00:30, 16 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
This picture was uploaded in 2015, so definitely not after an earlier question of you. The Banner talk 01:41, 16 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Alright well nevermind, the question remains should we uses it? I just don't know if we should use it because it is not the most historically accurate photo, but then there where 4 civilians to die in the conflict. LuxembourgLover (talk) 05:35, 16 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]
I agree the picture is not the best choice for this article. As stated before it is not the most accurate picture for the war. I did want to ask why the description was “nonsense”@The Banner LuxembourgLover (talk) 13:15, 26 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
As above, this picture is about the massacre of the Morristes. Correct? Then why do you add a caption "Goverment focres entering the Kington Fort", what is another episode in this saga. The Banner talk 13:19, 26 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The only event was the siege, there is no evidence of the government “massacre” there was civilian deaths as with any war but no massacre. I understand it is not the most historically accurate, that’s why I opened this topic in the first place. LuxembourgLover (talk) 13:29, 26 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sometimes you give me the eerie feeling that you have no clue what you are talking about. Especially, as the Mountain Meadows Massacre belongs to the Utah War, not the Morrisite War. The Banner talk 13:36, 26 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The picture of from the Morristes war. What does this have to do with the Utah War? If the picture is the Mountain Meadows Massacre then my bad, the picture is called “massacre of the Morristes” a group that had nothing to do with the Utah war of the Mountain Meadows Massacre. LuxembourgLover (talk) 14:00, 26 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, but with this answer you confirm that you are just not accurate enough. The Banner talk 16:43, 26 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
What are you talking about? Morristes had nothing to do with the Utah war. LuxembourgLover (talk) 18:59, 26 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Then why are you putting a picture of the Utah War in the article about the Morrisite War? The Banner talk 20:07, 26 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Because the picture is of the Morrisite War? It is called “Morrisite Massecure”. If it is the Utah War then the name should be changed, sience the morsites had nothing to do with the Utah War.LuxembourgLover (talk) 02:09, 27 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]
No, the title is File:Grandest century in the world's history; containing a full and graphic account of the marvelous achievements of one hundred years, including great battles and conquests; the rise and fall of nations; (14778645701).jpg The files is not named Morrisite Massacre or Morrisite Massecure. When you look at the source (https://archive.org/details/grandestcenturyi00nort/page/49/mode/1up?view=theater) and scroll back to page 48, you can see that the picture belongs to the section "Mountain Meadows Massacre". And the Mountain Meadows Massacre (1857) is, as you can see in the article, part of the Utah War (1857-1858) and not of the Morrisite War (1862). The Banner talk 23:44, 25 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Yes I see this, all I’m saying is that the title is poor and should be improved along with the discretion. In the source you provided, the picture is called “massacre of the moriste” that’s the only part that confused me. LuxembourgLover (talk) 02:39, 26 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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