Talk:Mouride

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment
This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 28 August 2019 and 12 December 2019. Further details are available on the course page. Peer reviewers: PanupongSittipanya, Veroonikka99.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 04:32, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

Sections
I've created sections in this article, for readability and to encourage some expansion. Feer 17:01, 30 January 2007 (UTC)

I wonder if it wouldn't make sense to break the section Modern Following into some other sections. Why not, "Political and Economic Importance of Mouride Brotherhood" and "Followings within Mouridism"

Prof M Johnson (talk) 03:46, 20 September 2011 (UTC)

We would suggest to add a section on the Mouride's Brotherhoods influence in Senegalese Politics. It would be beneficial to expand on how the Mouride Brotherhoods influence was able to withstand any political changes placed by French Colonial powers or by current political parties. By WWII the French colonial powers formed a partnership with the Brotherhoods, which allowed for success in agricultural matters. One instance of the Brotherhood's influence in politics is that after the 1950's political parties needed the support of the Mouride Brotherhood for any type of political or electoral success.

Miriamao (talk) 06:24, 20 September 2011 (UTC) and Marauz (talk) 06:27, 20 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Hi Miraimao and Marauz
 * I did a little bit of rearranging in the Mouride entry. I was thinking, what if you altered it so that there was a section on "Mouride Influence in Senegal", then you had sub-sections "Political Influence" "Cultural Influence" "Economic Influence". I think you would find that you have information to add to both the political and economic sections. Also, some of what you are going to write about might fit better in the section near the top about Mouridism under French colonialism. Be sure to describe how the French and Mouride leaders worked together to spread groundnut cultivation in that part. Good start.Prof M Johnson (talk) 18:24, 21 September 2011 (UTC)

Hi, Miriamao (talk) 01:24, 30 September 2011 (UTC) and Marauz will be editing this article for our Politics of Developing Nations class throughout this semester (til Dec 2011), we will be mainly focusing on the part of the Mouride's influence in Senegalese politics.

Website
look at www.majalis.org to know more about Mouridiya — Preceding unsigned comment added by 196.207.198.113 (talk)

WikiProjects Politics
Here is our proposed Bibliography:


 * Beck, Linda. 2008. Brokering Democracy in Africa. New York: Palgrave Macmillan. 68-115
 * O'Brien, Donal. 1971. The Mourides of Senegal: The Political and Economic Organization of an Islamic Brotherhood. Oxford: Clarendon Press.
 * Villalón, Leonardo. 1995. Islamic Society and State Power in Senegal. New York: Cambridge University Press.
 * Gellar, Sheldon. 2005. Democracy in Senegal: Tocquevillian Analytics in Africa. New York: Palgrave Macmillan.
 * Boone, Catherine. 2003. Political Topographies of the African State. New York: Cambridge University Press. 46-67

Miriamao (talk) 01:47, 7 October 2011 (UTC) and Marauz (talk) 01:50, 7 October 2011 (UTC)


 * This bibliography looks great! When referencing individual sentences, the citation should specify the exact page number that contains the information referenced. You can read more about how to cite sources on Wikipedia here. Neelix (talk) 20:01, 14 October 2011 (UTC)

Feedback from Govt Class
This is looking very good. You should add to the introduction a one paragraph summary of your section on political, economic influence. Also, I think you need a discussion under the economic part about the Mouride's role in the informal economy which is huge today.

Also, doesn't Beck talk about the fact that Mouride leaders used to give Ndigels to vote for someone but don't really do it anymore because they didn't want to sacrifice religious authority when people started to wonder about their political advice?

If you want to get your article recognized for its quality, you might want to add the other parts of the article if you have time.

Prof M Johnson (talk) 00:58, 12 November 2011 (UTC)

Your sections on Mouride political, economic, and cultural influence on Senegal are very well written and thorough. The sentences flow well together and have great clarity. I saw no typos or grammatical errors, and I only have one suggestion for revision. The first sentence in the Cultural Influence section, "Islam is central to the political sociology of Senegal: the religious elite carry great weight in national politics; political discourse is replete with references and appeals to Islam." could be broken into two sentences to remove the need for colons and semicolons. I'd suggest rewriting it to say "Islam is central to the political sociology of Senegal. The religious elite carry great weight in national politics, and political discourse is replete with references and appeals to Islam." Aside from that, I haven't any other suggestions for improvement. Great work ladies! Annie.Lebo (talk) 02:56, 13 November 2011 (UTC)

Miriam and Michelle have done an excellent job in writing out their section on Mouride Influence Inside Senegal. The section is very well structured and the information is concise. I did not find any major edits that need to be made to the section however, I can suggest a couple of minor edits which they can choose to make or not - "In order to attain their support in elections, bribes and material incentives were given to marabouts from political parties and potential candidates"

This can be rewritten as "In order to attain their support in elections, political parties and potential candidates gave bribes and material incentives to marabouts."

The word dependant in the second line of paragraph reading as "While the political elite finds itself..." should be "dependent". Missing punctuation - "In exchange for political favors, these magicians give political leaders a powerful amulet which is thought to bring advancement for oneself or disaster for ones enemies." Should actually be one's. The shaikh (religious leaders) Should be singular i.e. leader. Try rephrasing this sentence: "The shaikh (religious leaders) can seek to buy the agreement through gifts and help to promote the career or threat to ruin the career of these local politicians and leaders." Maybe use threaten instead of threat; sounds a little odd the way it is. Remove 'the' before Senegalese politics - "Marabout very rarely themselves participate directly in the political process. What is more common is to see them exert their influence over their followers and use this in return to gain a larger presence in the Senegalese politics." Punctuation errors - "Although recently Mourides have become more involved in the highest level of politics. (Change to comma) Abdoulaye Wade who is the current president of Senegal is also a devout Mouride. The day after his election in 2000 (Put comma after 2000) Wade travelled to Touba to seek the blessing of the Grand Marabout, Serigne Saliou Mbacke."

Economic Influence "This partnership between the Brotherhood and the government, (remove comma) stems from the French colonial administrators, who had viewed the production of groundnuts by the Mourides as a means of economic advantage through the increasing production of crops for export."

Consider revising long sentence - "Economic involvement is in fact encouraged by the religious leaders to their disciples through the use of ideology that places great value on the production labor which is performed in the service of God."

"Because of their emphasis on work (insert comma after work) the Mouride brotherhood is economically well-established in parts of Africa, especially in Senegal and The Gambia. In Senegal (insert comma) the brotherhood controls significant sections of the nation's economy, for example (insert comma) the transportation sector and the peanut plantations. Ordinary followers donate part of their income to the Mouridiya."

"Islam is central to the political sociology of Senegal: the religious elite carry great weight in national politics; political discourse is replete with references and appeals to Islam. There is virtually no opposition to the principle of the secular state, socio-political cleavages based on religion, whether between Muslim and non-Muslim or between Sufi orders, are also virtually non-existent. [10] Within Muslim discourse (insert comma) we find constant reference to such concepts as Islamic government, Islamic economics, or Islamic social order."

"The Senegalese have a mystical aspect to Islam, much like the (omit the) Sufism. In Senegal, Islamic practice usually requires membership in religious brotherhoods that are (is) dedicated to the marabouts of these groups. Marabouts are believed to be the (omit the) mediators between Allah and the people. The (Omit the and begin with People) people seek the help of marabouts for protection from the evil spirits, to improve one’s status (in terms of career, love or relationship, finances etc), to obtain a cure or remedy for sickness, or even to curse an enemy. Marabouts are believed to have the ability to deal with the spirit world and seek the spirits’ help in things impossible for humans. The spirits’ help is sought since they are thought to be a source of much baraka, or divine grace."

"The marabouts of the Mouride Brotherhood devote less time to study and teaching (teach?!) than other brotherhoods."

Consider revising this sentence - "The maraboutic and taalibe (a disciple or a marabout or student in a Qur’anic school) relationship Senegal is essentially a relationship of personal dependence." "In a charismatic relationship demonstrations of devotion and abnegation towards the marabouts can only (insert be) explained because their taalibes see them as intercessors or even intermediaries with god. "The results (result) is that marabouts are expected to provide certain material benefits to their follower in addition to the spiritual ones."

Fix spellings of responsible and expansion "These collective farms were largely rsponsible for the expanision of peanut cultivation."

"In contrast to a vision of (insert the) masses blindly manipulated by a religious elite, the ties of taalibes to their marbabouts (marabouts) are frequently far more contingent and tenuous than assumed." Pfaheem (talk) 06:24, 13 November 2011 (UTC) Pernian Faheem

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Spelling of names
I would like to create articles for the different caliphs and Sufi figures. But I have noticed that the names of all the caliphs and are highly inconsistent. Is there any agreement on how to standardise these spellings? DjembeDrums (talk) 16:23, 28 October 2019 (UTC)

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Wikipedia Ambassador Program course assignment
This article is the subject of an educational assignment at Mills College supported by WikiProject Politics and the Wikipedia Ambassador Program&#32;during the 2011 Q3 term. Further details are available on the course page.

The above message was substituted from by PrimeBOT (talk) on 15:56, 2 January 2023 (UTC)

2024-04-24 Changes
Hi everyone,

I made various changes to this page as part of a university assignment and some additional personal interest and knowledge:

-Added some detail to the colonial history section

-Fixed, edited, and added to the political influence section. Here I also removed some paragraphs which, as far as I could tell, were misunderstandings of the provided sources. I also added some page numbers for the existing sources where I came across them during my own research. Where possible I retained the previously written article, but given how extensively it draws from one (albeit seminal) source, a further rewrite may be a worthwhile idea. Same for the other types of influence, which I did not look at in detail beyond fixing some sources.

-Added a section on the relationship with Salafist-inspired Reform movements. I wasn't entirely sure where to put this to maintain the structure so I added it under beliefs but another position may fit better. This includes some discussion of how the reform movement and the mourides have taken from one-another, which I hope is somewhat relevant to the article.

-Expanded the section on dahiras to elaborate on their role and history somewhat. More could be added here, but I did not have the time to do so.

-Cleaned up and edited existing citations. These were a bit of a mess and in order to write my own additions this had to be done. Where I could find the page number I also added it to all of them.

-Fixed a few typos throughout the article.

I believe that sums up the changes. If you have any questions or concerns about my changes and the process behind them please let me know, I'll gladly discuss them. Olopi (talk) 22:25, 25 April 2024 (UTC)