Talk:National Library of Peru



Untitled

 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the move request was: page moved. Felix Folio Secundus (talk) 09:10, 10 April 2010 (UTC)

Untitled
Shouldn't the title for this page be "National Library of Peru"?--Jersey Devil 05:14, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Probably. --Descendall 16:08, 1 February 2007 (UTC)

Biblioteca Nacional del Perú → National Library of Peru — The creator of this page started with English then later moved it to the Spanish name. I think it should use English, since "National Library of Peru" is a unambiguous, direct translation and exonym. - Ruodyssey (talk) 06:53, 6 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Oppose You need to give a reasoned argument for the move.  A direct translation amounts to original research and is not a good reason for a move.  Is it ever referred to as National Library of Peru in English prose?  Can we have some examples?  Skinsmoke (talk) 16:02, 7 April 2010 (UTC)
 * I'm not sure what policy or guideline says that translating an article name amounts to OR. If you know of one please let me know. (Translating within an article is not OR as long as it's RS-cited or interwiki.) You are right for asking for good examples of its usage, so I thought I'd test out a few alternatives, too. Rationale for move:
 * Google hit counts can be misleading, so you'll need to look carefully at the results to find the unique, quality, English RSes. (This article has no refs as is.) In doing so, I've found that "National Library of Peru" is not an uncommon name translated from the official Spanish name on English websites. Admittedly, Biblioteca... gets more hits than Library... when you specify English only pages simply because the official name is Spanish and a translation is not always explicitly provided. (Note: You will still get many Spanish pages in these results.)
 * {| class="wikitable" border="1"

! Search phrase !! Google !! Google News !! Google Scholar !! Google Books !! Google Groups !! Yahoo
 * "Biblioteca Nacional del Perú" || 30,400 || 3 || 2,850 || 1,443 || 5 || 1,600
 * "National Library of Peru" || 7,490 || 27 || 71 || 616 || 6 || 1,490
 * "Peruvian National Library" || 2,380 || 16 || 16 || 192 || 5 || 134
 * "Peru's National Library" || 1,390 || 37 || 10 || 79 || 8 || 258
 * }
 * Here are a few examples (some may be worth using as references): Organizations: UNESCO, NationalLibraries.org, ABINIA, Education: PUC del Peru, U. of Queensland, Commercial: Libidex, LibrarySites.info, PublicLibraries.com, Peru Links, News: BBC, WorldBank.org, LivingInPeru.com
 * Still, the results are relatively very low across the board. WP:UE states, "If there is no established English-language treatment for a name, translate it if this can be done without loss of accuracy and with greater understanding for the English-speaking reader." I hope you will agree "National Library of Peru" is the most faithful, accurate translation given. I believe this translation will lend the article better understanding.
 * To be clear, I am only arguing that the title be "National Library of Peru". Indeed, "Biblioteca..." should be prominently displayed as the official Spanish name. Per WP:Naming conventions (use English), "The native spelling of a name should generally be included in the first line of the article... Redirects from non-English names are encouraged." (Such a redirect is already in place.) However, and you may counter-argue, as it goes on to say, "Where there is an English exonym for the subject, but a native version is more common in English language usage, the exonym should be mentioned but should not be used as the article title." I am arguing that even though "National..." may appear to be less commonly used than the official Spanish name -- hit counts are no substitute for quality English RSes -- "National..." is a commonly used English exonym and would lend toward better understanding. - Ruodyssey (talk) 08:37, 10 April 2010 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.
 * Here are a few examples (some may be worth using as references): Organizations: UNESCO, NationalLibraries.org, ABINIA, Education: PUC del Peru, U. of Queensland, Commercial: Libidex, LibrarySites.info, PublicLibraries.com, Peru Links, News: BBC, WorldBank.org, LivingInPeru.com
 * Still, the results are relatively very low across the board. WP:UE states, "If there is no established English-language treatment for a name, translate it if this can be done without loss of accuracy and with greater understanding for the English-speaking reader." I hope you will agree "National Library of Peru" is the most faithful, accurate translation given. I believe this translation will lend the article better understanding.
 * To be clear, I am only arguing that the title be "National Library of Peru". Indeed, "Biblioteca..." should be prominently displayed as the official Spanish name. Per WP:Naming conventions (use English), "The native spelling of a name should generally be included in the first line of the article... Redirects from non-English names are encouraged." (Such a redirect is already in place.) However, and you may counter-argue, as it goes on to say, "Where there is an English exonym for the subject, but a native version is more common in English language usage, the exonym should be mentioned but should not be used as the article title." I am arguing that even though "National..." may appear to be less commonly used than the official Spanish name -- hit counts are no substitute for quality English RSes -- "National..." is a commonly used English exonym and would lend toward better understanding. - Ruodyssey (talk) 08:37, 10 April 2010 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The National Library System in Peru
The National Library (Biblioteca Nacional) is the head of the Sistema Nacional de Bibliotecas (SNB) del Perú. As a matter of fact, the SNB has not been developed for two main reasons: first, the lack of a proper and modern legislation; and second, a chronicle lack of resources. This has caused that Peru has traditionally reared neighboring countries like Colombia, Chile, and recently, Ecuador. Politicians and intellectuals have not helped to improve an obsolete system of service. A recent publication in "El Comercio," an influential newspaper, shows that only 60 % of cities (or districts in Peru) have a public library, and most of them do not have open shelves, Internet, magazines, computers, telephone, online catalogs, and copy machines. There is a sense of urgency about how to improve, first by using available resources applied to promote not only the infrastructure but also to encourage the people to find all the richness that only libraries can keep. Since August 2006 the BN director was Mr. Hugo Neira, an intellectual that was before teaching at a French university in Papeete, Tahiti. He has just resigned in November 2009, and for the first time in long time a professional librarian, Ms. Nancy Herrera C., is at the helm of the BN and the languid SNB. --Kharrub (talk) 04:39, 14 November 2009 (UTC)

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