Talk:Selah

Inconsistent
At the beginning we find the claim that "Selah" "...is a difficult concept to translate." Yet the rest of the article expresses uncertainty as to its actual meaning. I see a note below (in the "Untranslatable" section) that the meaning is completely obvious to people in the know, but the uncertainty expressed in the article, and the completely varying explanations given, suggest that the meaning is unknown to anybody.

Untranslatable
Can it be added that although the word "Selah" is untranslatable, its meaning is completely obvious in context to those who understand Biblical Hebrew. It is just that the multiple concepts are not easily explained in other languages. Similarly, the comma as it is used in English has various properties (e.g., the original Greek use as a breathing mark as opposed to the English grammatical use) and would require a lengthy article to explain it - academics may argue about definitions and so on, but speakers of the language know exactly what is meant even if they find it hard to verbalise. Words like Schadenfreude are what is more commonly meant by 'untranslatable' in that they do not have a direct English equivalent, but rather, require several words to explain what is meant. (And yes, I know that Schadenfreude does translate directly to epicaricacy, but that's hardly common usage.) But I digress; the point is that the page as it stands is a translation - just a rather wordy one. 212.134.179.30 (talk) 18:58, 17 June 2008 (UTC)Josh

Well, since no-one cared enough to answer, I have changed the article. 92.234.8.173 (talk) 03:24, 29 April 2009 (UTC)Josh

No, German has a different kind of word construction than English. You see extremely long words in German that are merely nouns and adjectives mashed together and whose meaning is immediately clear to anybody who knows German. And then there are idioms but those exist in any language. So the example of Schadenfreude doesn't demonstrate your point.

The 6th Beracha of the Amida is not Selah
The 6th beracha of the Amidah is not "selah" - rather "selicha". Some transliterate the Hebrew "selach" (imperative verb - forgive!) as selah; so in the Amidah we have "selach lanu avinu" - "forgive us our Father"


 * The article is refering to the second to last blessing right before the prayer for peace. "v'khol ha'chaim yedukha selah".  Jon513 20:55, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

holding Selah?
In the song Selah by the Ethiopians, the Ras Tafari is said to hold "Selah". I have difficulty interpreting the meaning of the lyric:

Want to leave out Babylon I am tired of Babylon Want to leave out Babylon Oh because the Saviour hold Selah

Is the Saviour "holding" the Selah? What is meant by this? Any thoughts?--Sonjaaa 17:42, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

No one is 'holding the Selah' is this song. The word is being used as a musical device, much as it is utilized in the Psalms. The lyric is stating the desire to leave Babylon, because the Saviour hold(s). Selah is used as a musical pause here.

gematria
I find the addition of the discussion on gematria a bit jarring in context. Implicitly it places study of "the mathematical underpinnings" of the Bible on par with scientifically established lexicography and historical critical research. I would suggest abbreviating this section and/or setting it apart somehow indicating that it represents minority opinion or that it is controversial in nature. Gematria is also a separate entry and a link might be in order.

70.48.153.199David


 * I agree. It needs a source, at least. I also find the use of English Gematria very strange. --agr 22:15, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Simple(6,74) English(7,74) Gematria(8,74) has been a tool of Kaballists, Freemasons, and Rosicrucians for many centuries and it's now all over the Internet and its use has been documented in many books. "'The mathematical underpinnings' of the Bible are on par with scientifically established lexicography and historical critical research". The Hebrew leaders and scribes were well aware of the GOD=7_4 Code (although it took awhile for The Holy Tongue and the Word 'God' to evolve/reappear). The Hebrew practioners of the ancient mysteries were/are also well aware that 'selah' appears 74x in the Bible. The Gematria reference should NOT have been deleted by an unenlightened destroyer of esoteric sacred knowledge. - Brad Watson, Miami (talk) 15:44, 25 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Once again, Brad, gematria is not considered a reliable source (reliable sources are discussed at this link). Gematria and other numerology is considered fringe, and not accepted as a neutral or reliable view on this site.  Wikipedia does not care about your "enlightenment," or whatever fantasies you have about Jews, Freemasons, or Rosicrucians.  Ian.thomson (talk) 16:04, 25 August 2012 (UTC)

Ian(24) Thomson(74), your fantasy of overseeing Wikipedia is just that. I AM just as BIG a part of this commnity as you think you are and have, in fact, been editing its articles much longer than you have. The difference between(74) you and I are striking! I AM a contributer and you are a deleter. You are WRONG about so many things, i.e. gematria is NOT numerology, although numerologists can use it. They can also use your low IQ number, but that doesn't make your low IQ numerology either. You've 'crossed the line' with me now numerous times and your judgment will be placed on http://7seals.yuku.com. - Brad Watson, Miami (talk) 16:32, 25 August 2012 (UTC)
 * What part of "no personal attacks" don't you get? While age doesn't matter here, you've been editing since this year, I've been editing since 2006.  And as I said, age here doesn't matter, but being able to edit within site policies and guidelines (like WP:RS, WP:NPOV, WP:FRINGE, WP:NPA, all of which you have demonstrated severe problems with).  You are contributing fringe materials against the guidelines, I am making sure the articles stay within the guidelines and policies while also contributing (as can be seen at the Debtera article, which, except for two minor edits, was worked on by me).  Ian.thomson (talk) 16:45, 25 August 2012 (UTC)

"calah"
In calah, cited as a possible etymon, what letter does the 'c' represent? —Tamfang (talk) 01:07, 9 June 2010 (UTC)
 * According to the citation from the Book of Job in the referenced article, it is samekh. I will add this info in. Vilĉjo (talk) 10:37, 17 September 2011 (UTC)

E.W. Bullinger regarding "Selah"
The article about E.W. Bullinger on Selah is incorrect. I have the complete library of Bullinger and nowhere does it speak of such confusion. One can read of this in the Companion Bible Appendix 66 II, The Works of Bullinger. Bbwjenkins (talk) 15:45, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

Urbandictionary?
Is Urban dictionary really considered a source? (footnote 6) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.73.83.113 (talk) 14:29, 25 June 2011 (UTC)

Selah is found 74x in the Bible
We should always strive to be as accurate as possible. Therefore... Selah (Hebrew: סֶלָה‎, also transliterated as selāh) is a word used 74 times in the Hebrew Bible - 71 times in the Psalms and 3 times in Habakkuh - and is a difficult concept to translate. - Brad Watson, Miami (talk) 16:41, 25 August 2012 (UTC)

'Book of Habakkuh' should have its own article
Apparently, there is no article on Habakkuh. How do we create one? - Brad Watson, Miami (talk) 16:43, 25 August 2012 (UTC)
 * We have the article Book of Habakkuk, and I've created a redirect to that. Ian.thomson (talk) 16:47, 25 August 2012 (UTC)

Selah does not mean "prayer" in Arabic
"Additionally, this word also means prayer in modern Arabic.[citation needed]". I erased this false (and unsourced) claim. Salah or Salat (prayer) in Arabic is written with a Ṣād, which is cognate to Hebrew Tsadi, while Selah is written with a Samekh. Yabti (talk) 10:23, 27 May 2013 (UTC)

Selah is a man
'''David and Habakkuk addressed the man who would arrive in futur: Selah '''

'''Habakkuk 3:3 ''' God comes from Teman, And the Holy One from Mount Paran. Selah. His splendor covers the heavens, And the earth is full of His praise./ New American Standard Version (1995)

'''Habakkuk 3:9 ''' Thy bow was made quite bare; The oaths to the tribes were a `sure' word: Selah. Thou didst cleave the earth with rivers./ American Standard Version (1901)

'''Habakkuk 3:13 ''' You went forth for the salvation of your people, for the salvation of your anointed. You crushed the head of the land of wickedness. You stripped them head to foot. Selah./ World English Bible

'''Psalms 24:10 ''' Who is this King of glory? The LORD of hosts, he is the King of glory: Selah.

'''Psalms 44:8 ''' In God we boast all the day long, and praise thy name for ever Selah.

'''Psalms 47:4 ''' He shall choose our inheritance for us, the excellency of Jacob whom he loved Selah.

'''Psalms 50:6 ''' And the heavens shall declare his righteousness: for God is judge himself Selah.

'''Psalms 59:13 ''' Consume them in wrath; consume them that they may not be: and let them know that God ruleth in Jacob unto the ends of the earth Selah.

'''Psalms 61:4 ''' I will abide in thy tabernacle for ever: I will trust in the covert of thy wings Selah.

'''Psalms 66:4 ''' All the earth shall worship thee, and shall sing unto thee; they shall sing to thy name Selah.

'''Psalms 68:19 ''' Blessed be the Lord, who daily loadeth us with benefits, even the God of our salvation: Selah.

'''Psalms 75:3 ''' The earth and all the inhabitants thereof are dissolved: I bear up the pillars of it: Selah.

'''Psalms 89:4 ''' Thy seed will I establish for ever, and build up thy throne to all generations Selah.

'''Be informed, the word has been changed alittle through the history coz of different pronunciation of hebrow, Greek and English. If you can read the bible in Hebrow, the result will be shoking.'''--37.63.222.46 (talk) 16:17, 21 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I can read the Bible in Hebrew, and I'm not shocked at all. This is wp:or and can't be included.
 * What a shame the last comment here-above isn't signed. It deserves the SMILEY OF THE YEAR :))) Arminden (talk) 14:22, 28 November 2021 (UTC)

I've removed a bit of text
The following text was recently added to the very beginning of this article:

[begin quote]Selah means to "pause". Though David wrote musical Psalms, this is no reference to a musical dynamic, but rather to how one should "pause", to enable oneself in reflecting and stopping to think about what was just said, with the purpose to make it part of your life, before moving on to the next declaration.

March 2017 Astrid Claasen[end quote]'

Because it is unsourced, and at odds with the rest of the article, I've removed it, at least till someone can tell us where it came from. Alephb (talk) 02:31, 11 March 2017 (UTC)

Add to "Literary Instances" Section
“Selah” is the first song of Emeli Sande’s 2016 album titled “Long Live the Angels.”

Jewish Encyclopedia text needs massive pruning
has done the fledgling article a lot of good on 4 March 2005 by adding a pile of material from the 1906 Jewish Encyclopedia. Mostly copied-and-pasted, down to the structure and much of the wording, even if he claimed it was edited ;) After 16 years though, and in accordance to what he wrote back then (good for now, but needs to be replaced with newer research), most of it should be removed. The weird "Attribution" paragraph at the bottom of the page (was it a common formula back then?), actually informing that the Jewish Encyclopedia has been used as a source, is easily overlooked and has misled some, me included, to put "citation needed" tags all over the place. The JE article is full of references to further authors and sources from around 1900, who/which are of interest for historians of science rather than modern researchers, maybe with the exception of H. Grätz. It's not the only article stuck with such massive transplants from public domain dinosaurs, but one of the worst afflicted ones I've come across. Ora et labora! Arminden (talk) 14:35, 28 November 2021 (UTC)

Pronounciation
Why should the word be pronounced /ˈsiːlə(h)/? The Hebrew vowel signs make it pretty clear that the first vowel is /e/ or perhaps /ɛ/, similar to "e" in "sell", certainly not the vowel from "seal".

--194.166.11.234 (talk) 07:28, 16 May 2022 (UTC)

Usage in the Talmud
Mention should probably be made of this word's usage in the Talmud. I personally don't know enough about the Talmud to write a section, but I can give an example: Tractate Berachot Chapter 1, towards the beginning of pg. 5a, at the end of R. Levi bar Chama / R. Shimon ben Lakish's opinion on fighting against one's "Evil Inclination." Zlvaughan (talk) 21:19, 8 February 2023 (UTC)