Talk:Victoria Institute

Disputed claims
The claim that "Its library and study center were destroyed in World War II by bombs" is clearly supported by a reliable source:



This piece also seems to support the claim (cited to a source not available online) that "Faith and Thought was merged" into Science and Christian Belief. Therefore, lacking a countervailing source, I am reversing these changes. I would also bring WP:COI to Ackworth's attention. HrafnTalkStalk(P) 18:07, 19 January 2012 (UTC)


 * Dear Hrafn
 * It’s a fair cop! I’m a complete newbie and though I am responsible for maintaining half a dozen websites I’ve always been frightened of dipping into Wikipedia editing – it seems my fears are justified!


 * I have read through the links you kindly sent about becoming a Wikipedian and I now feel even less confident! I would add that I completely agree and support the aims of Wikipedia and recognise and utterly respect the need to avoid conflict of interest and to adopt a neutral point of view.


 * My problem is that this page DOES HAVE factual errors about The Victoria Institute which I want to correct. These errors were pointed out to me by the current Council after I became administrator last year.  I understand that this means I am close to the organisation and must take extra effort to avoid a conflict of interest, but equally I’m sure you appreciate that those involved in an organisation today may have a better idea about what is happening in 2012 than an article published in 1990 (though it is easier to cite the latter than the former).  However, to respect your wishes and to avoid an accusation of conflict of interest I will confine my comments to this talk page rather than trying to edit the actual article.


 * So the errors…


 * Firstly and most importantly, the institute is not dead! The article is correct that The Victoria Institute (or Philosophical Society of Great Britain) now uses the working name ‘Faith and Thought’ and this name is shared with our journal (strictly ‘Faith&Thought’).  I regret this confusing nomenclature and council agree that wherever possible we will stick to ‘Faith and Thought’.  If it didn’t amount to self promotion I might be tempted to create a separate page for ‘Faith and Thought' to describe the current organisation's aims and activities better.  As it stands, a Wiki search returns [| Faith and Thought] which erroneously suggests equivalence with Science and Christian Belief.


 * This is error 2 on The Victoria Institute page, Faith&Thought (the journal) has NOT merged into Science and Christian Belief. We DO jointly publish S&CB with Christians in Science but Faith&Thought remains an independent journal, with a greater emphasis on appealing to the generalist rather than specialist.  It has been published continually (as far as I can tell from the boxes that now occupy my loft!) since 1957.  For the record then the history is:
 * •	1865 – The Victoria Institute (or Philosophical Society of Great Britain) founded,
 * •	1867 - Publishes Journal of the Transactions of the Victoria Institute
 * •	1958 – Journal renamed ‘Faith and Thought’, continues to present day, twice a year, latest issue October 2011 No. 51 with articles on The Date of the Last Supper, Stephen Hawking and the Multiverse and others.


 * The third ‘error’ is the claim that ‘its library and study center were destroyed in World War II by bombs’ for which you cite an article by Haas published in 1990 but this is an article of broad scope that does not reference this claim and it seems likely he was simply mistaken. Certainly his claim that the 114th volume in 1988 was the last is demonstrably wrong (they are on my bookcase). He may have got this idea from the list of back copies held on ‘Biblical Studies.org’ which also reveals that he wrote an article for the journal in 1998 (conflict of interest?!).  In the next few months I intend to update the website with a list of back copies from 1988 to the present day but you will already see that there is access to the text of selected articles from 1954 to 2007.  The current council assure me there never has been a ‘library and study centre’, this may have been someone’s private home but we cannot verify this and to assert that "therefore it had little recent influence…" is false.  We need to find other reasons for our lack of influence, not blame Hitler!


 * I wonder if you would be so kind as to consider correcting these errors for me. I’m sorry I can’t cite independently peer-reviewed journals of international renown to verify these claims but I assure you we do exist!  I might try editing articles myself when I feel more confident, but perhaps I should start with an unrelated sphere of interest.  I’ve found a website that claims Elvis works in a fast food outlet and as I can find no websites that incontrovertibly disprove this assertion I thought I might claim verifiability rights!  If I believed in smilies there would be lots, but if I have offended then I claim Puck's defence.  Sincere thanks.

Ackworth (talk) 16:51, 22 January 2012 (UTC)


 * Ackworth: We actually have two sources for F&T (journal) ceasing publication -- World Evangelical Fellowship, Evangelical review of theology, Volume 15, p. 191 (stating that it merged) and Haas (giving no details other than the date). Against this we have the evidence from your website that the journal currently exists. This leaves us in a rather messy situation, particularly as they are the only third party sourcing on VI/F&T in the modern era. If they are removed as unreliable, the article simply stops at 1927. I think I'll take this issue up with WP:RSN. HrafnTalkStalk(P) 17:21, 22 January 2012 (UTC)

Copyright problem removed
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