Talk:Volkswagen Phaeton

End of the Road for Phaeton?
A blog is reporting that the Phaeton will not be making a return for 2007. . Also, VW doesn't list the car as an available model. Perhaps the article needs to be updated? (I would do this, but I'm short for time right now sorry!) Raj Fra 02:58, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

I added this in the American Market section of the article, but I didn't add the reference link you provided. I'm short on time as well so I'm not able to do it. Leofan7, January 11, 2007

Shame this car wasn't well received in the U.S.
I love this car. I also love my Phaeton. My lease is up in Dec 06 and I can't find a comparable car:~(

I forgot that I posted this last year. Turns out that I did find the perfect replacement, another Phaeton. On November of 06 I had a new white Phaeton delivered from Chicago to California. At that time there were only 13 new Phaetons left in the US. The 06 is much nicer than my 04 because of the upgraded audio and seating etc.

This is by far one of the best cars flying under the radar. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.130.20.245 (talk) 05:50, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
 * I love the Phaeton, but VW also makes the Audi A8 which is even better. --Aizuku (talk) 12:00, 22 December 2009 (UTC)

Internal Competition
I've often wondered what the point of this car was. Didn't anyone at VW point out that Audi make the A8? It's not even as if the Phaeton could have used A8 tooling as the Audi is aluminium. VAG already had a car in the 7-series/ S-Class Merc segment so why bother with the expense of another one? Or, why didn't VW just restyle an A8 and preserve most of the pressings (a la Golf/A3 etc)?

LewisR 18:03, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

Other crap
I doubt the numbers:~( for the electronically limited maximum speed. How would you sell such an expensive car if it only makes a lousy 208 km/h (130 mph). That needs to be clarified.


 * All VW products sold in North America are limited to 210 km/h (130 MPH) - the Phaeton is no exception. I added a note to the body text of the main article mentioning the lower speed governor setting for NAR.  PanEuropean, Sept 2006


 * I just checked the Volkswagen Website it states 250 kph (156 mph) for the V8 and W12 version. Even the budget Diesel engine accelerates this car to 230 kph.

This article is written from a UK standpoint.

It says "by way of the phaeton auto body style" -- The phaeton auto body style is a convertable, and this is not a convertable. So this statement is wrong. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.23.40.194 (talk) 21:34, 7 January 2011 (UTC)

pronunciation
the typical german pronunciation of the word phaeton usually is ['fæ:ton]; so two syllables

Reliability
The newly added US Market section says Customers have been slow to accept a luxury Volkswagen, due to their historical perception of the brand as well as a reputation for poor reliability and unfriendly dealerships. Does the reputation for poor reliability refer to the VW brand, or the Phaeton specifically? I'm not aware of a reputation of poor reliability for the VW brand, but of course this doesn't mean it does not exist. Friday (talk) 15:52, 14 November 2005 (UTC)
 * There have been some major reliablity issues with VWs of late. Most notable is the "sludge" issue on the 1.8T version of the Passat.  This has not been the only one.  The New Beetle also has a bad reputation. Consumer Reports has them ranked pretty low.  Nmpls 10:50, 6 January 2006 (UTC)
 * This survey refers to the VW brand I am concerned however about the biased sounding nature of the "US Market" section. Also, it doesn't sound professional with words like "flop" and "gas guzzler" used. I think this section should be amended to sound more professional and less biased. vw12 - 08:22 15 November 2005 (UTC)

In the US, "gas-guzzler" tax is an accepted term. It is used rather frequently by the media and individuals. It applies to vehicles with very poor gas mileage for their class (usually supercars or large SUVs). Also, VW has developed a repution in the last 10 years or so for poor reliability and over-pricing in such core models as the Jetta and Passat. I am sure these factors have contributed to the failure of the Phaeton in the USDM Chris
 * Agreed. "Gas-guzzler" is a legal term in the US.  Much like "lemon." Nmpls 10:50, 6 January 2006 (UTC)


 * I think the first section is...leading the reader a bit, I mean, Wikipedia is not the place for conjecture about why a car has such a dismal sales record. Simply state the sales, potential comparisons to other factual sales numbers, and let the reader decide what is or is not self-evident. Also, the language does seem a bit "colored" by automotive press...  I suspect it will be easier to clean this article up (in a few years?) when the Phaeton is no longer sold anywhere and everyone has written her obituary, but for the time being, we should just stick with the simple facts, in a neutral, straightforward way.  By they way, I'd love to drive one of these, they sound fantastic. --Sirimiri 04:46, 3 December 2005 (UTC)

The language is somewhat inflammatory, but the problems are pretty much as laid out.

VW's reputation for reliability took a severe hit when they had problems with their coil packs which led to predictable failure between 25,000 and 50,000 miles. The same coil packs were used in more upscale Audi vehicles and Audi did a voluntary recall to replace all the defective parts. VW chose to replace the parts as they failed, leaving many VW drivers stranded on the road, and those drivers "lucky" enough to have their coils outlast the vehicle's warranty left holding the bag for expensive repairs.

Since then, VW has been well down on all objective measures of reliability.

Dealerships vary widely, but one common thread with the Phaeton is that luxury car buyers are used to being treated with deference and offered perks, and the VW dealerships don't generally do this.
 * VW only allowed the Phaeton to be sold in certain-- Termed "Class A" dealers. Some dealers were required to build new buildings for the Phaeton (Example, WestSide VW in the greater MSP area) Nmpls 10:50, 6 January 2006 (UTC)


 * The only statement I take issue with is this "Customers have been slow to accept a luxury Volkswagen, perhaps due to their historical perception of VW as being an "economy" marque." This is conjecture, not fact. I don't think it should be placed there. I agree with Sirimiri, just state the facts and let the reader decide what is obvious or not. I won't touch it until we reach a consensus about it.--vw12 10:05, 10 December 2005 (UTC)

I think that the word "perhaps" makes it clear that this is conjecture, not absolute fact. If we only wrote facts that could be absolutely proven we wouldn't write much worth reading. Reading other automotive entries, it doesn't seem to be a problem to use conjecture to illustrate why various cars are popular. Why is it such a concern when discussing a rather obvious negative?

Honestly, if you were a wealthy auto buyer, would you rather buy this car with a big VW emblem on the front, or a Bentley emblem?
 * Heck, I know people who this was an issue for. I know someone who owns a variety of dealerships and he says this is exactly why.  Numerous magazines/newspapers have said it too.Nmpls 10:50, 6 January 2006 (UTC)


 * I completely agree with your reasoning, but the problem here is that the WikiPedia isn't an outlet for original research or conjecture. If the other auto articles have such things, then they are wrong, and will eventually be sussed out. As it is, the statement:
 * "Customers have been slow to accept a luxury Volkswagen, perhaps due to their historical perception of Volkswagen as being an "economy" marque."
 * Should be thus:
 * "Customers have been slow to accept the luxury Volkswagen."
 * Since the second is a statement of fact, not conjecture. However, if you find information on the 'net which states that customer hesitation is the leading factor in the failure of the Phaeton, then add it, and cite the source. --DarrenBaker 16:24, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

moved article to US section
Moved Car and Driver statement to the US part.--VWphaetonfan 11:12, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

Name Origin
I highly doubt that its name comes from mythology, as a phaeton can mean:

1. A light, four-wheeled open carriage, usually drawn by a pair of horses. 2. A touring car.

81.86.76.6 17:24, 29 October 2006 (UTC)


 * More specifically, a phaeton was a 1930's four-door car with convertible roof that did NOT have a solid bulkhead between the front and rear seats. As the solid roof designs gained popularity, the phaeton style faded from production, leaving the 'drop top' mainly to two seat roadsters. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Bizzybody (talk • contribs) 03:22, 13 April 2007 (UTC).

Am I the only person who thinks it's pretty retarded to name a car after a guy who hijacked a chariot and crashed it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.72.21.221 (talk) 00:23, 30 September 2007 (UTC)

I think the name quite definately came from mythology since it's mentioned in the UK brochure for the car (along with the carriage body) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bewibble (talk • contribs) 15:48, 19 October 2007 (UTC)

Phaeton in past sense
The first article seems to depict the car in the past sense as in: ... was a large luxury sedan ... ... It served as the flagship ... This is not the case since the car is still being manufactured, and the next generation model is being developed.

Also, to go some way to establish the origins of the name, the UK Phaeton Universe website (point 990) quotes "Helios, the Sun god". http://www.thephaeton.co.uk/universe/index.php

Diesel engine size
The article says 4.9L V10 diesel on the right pane, and then 5.0L at the bottom table. Whichever one is wrong should be fixed... Craigblock (talk) 16:11, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

The V10 diesel engine is, without question, a 5.0L engine. PanEuropean (talk) 06:33, 28 September 2009 (UTC)

Original work?
The article is well-written but highly under-sourced and essentially of a tone more fitting an advertisment than a reference article. The big statements in the article, one after the other, are un-sourced. Anyone? 842U (talk) 01:52, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

It's awfully difficult to provide web-link, clickable citations for many of the facts given in this article. I have a whole collection of Volkswagen technical specifications for this vehicle, maintenance manuals, automobile magazine reviews, etc., but how do I go about using an official document (technical specification) published by Volkswagen as a citation? There's no facility within Wikipedia for me to scan the document and attach it for others to examine. PanEuropean (talk) 06:33, 28 September 2009 (UTC)


 * It's quite acceptable to cite non-web sources in WP. See the documentation for the details on how to do this. Letdorf (talk) 22:07, 14 October 2009 (UTC).

Sales section
Something needs to be done about it as it deals entirely with the US.(86.31.187.246 (talk) 01:38, 7 September 2008 (UTC))

I do strongly suspect that the sales figure given for the United States market in MY 2004 (1,433 vehicles) is incorrect, and the actual sales in Canada and the USA of MY 2004 vehicles is closer to about 3,000. But - I don't have any way of substantiating this. PanEuropean (talk) 06:33, 28 September 2009 (UTC)

Haiders accident car
Wouldn't be nice to add the exact type of car "v6, v8..." "The far right Austrian politician Jörg Haider drove a Phaeton and famously crashed it and was killed on October 11th 2008." without the car version its boring, if we add he is far right I think we should also mention which version he drove.

N00bh4ck3r (talk) —Preceding undated comment was added at 20:11, 13 October 2008 (UTC).

English Language Phaeton Owner Forum
I added an external link at the bottom of the article to the English language Phaeton Owner forum that is hosted at the VW Vortex discussion forum. Although VW Vortex is a commercial venture(there is advertising present at the top of forum pages), all of the content within the Phaeton forum is non-commercial, and all of the participants and moderators (of which I am one) are volunteers. I added this same link a few years ago and it was deleted, perhaps because someone was concerned that VW Vortex is a commercial venture. I think, though, that it is in the best interests of "knowledge dissemination" that this link to the Phaeton owner forum remain, simply because it is the single largest source of documented and substantiated factual information about this rather uncommon car. For example, have a look at the Table of Contents (list of frequently asked questions) on the Phaeton owner forum - it is at this link: http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=1652232 and note the substantiation (by way of photos, scanned technical documents, etc.) of the factual information that is presented there. PanEuropean (talk) 06:51, 28 September 2009 (UTC)


 * The WP guidelines on external links can be found at WP:EL. If you think your VW Vortex link complies, feel free to add it again. Letdorf (talk) 22:11, 14 October 2009 (UTC).

Recent edits
With regard to this series of edits, I would invite the IP editor to justify their actions. And to be fair, let Mr Choppers have a say as well - I note from his editing history that he does shy away from edit summaries sometimes.

The page has become awash with images - far too many for the accompanying text and it looks excessively cluttered. I also ask for clarification on their edit summary - I am not Mr Choppers, and I provided a valid edit summary for my actions.

As per discussion protocol - please leave the page in its current state while the discussion is carried out. Further reversion may well be seen as both disruptive, and as hitting the 3RR wall. Chaheel Riens (talk) 15:31, 13 April 2014 (UTC)


 * Yes, sorry, having spent something like sixty percent of my recent editing time on reverting the additions of this particular ip I have given up on adding editing summaries. They swap ip's with an alarming regularity and so after a few weeks I have simply stopped attempting to explain to them what is going on. See here for instance, where I have been reverting the same editor (from various IPs) numerous times. On five occasions I added a comment but it obviously has no effect and I am getting a little bit tired of having to behave better than people who obviously do not care at all. I believe that ip's should no longer be able to edit freely on wp, as the current stream of confused and vandalistic edits is stealing all of my available time on here, meaning that I now rarely add content but instead spend most of my time reverting ip nonsense. Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.  Mr.choppers &#124;   ✎  21:20, 13 April 2014 (UTC)


 * I also did add a (perhaps rude, I admit to getting a bit tired of this editor) message at Pham's talk page, suggesting they read WP:CARPIX. They also edit as Myuser89 and as myriad ip addresses, with a steady habit of adding dozens of pictures, often chosen seemingly at random. See Maserati Ghibli for another example, where he was using - I contacted him on that talk page as well and never got a response.   Mr.choppers &#124;   ✎  21:29, 13 April 2014 (UTC)

The replacemt in north america is the VW CC
i work at a vw dealer and the VW CC replaced the Phaeton A8v (talk) 11:52, 20 August 2015 (UTC)

Don't believe everything your "vw dealer" tells you 2600:1012:B028:202E:4C02:37B0:C66E:A366 (talk) 21:28, 28 January 2023 (UTC)