Talk:Xbox 360/Archive 2

Pictures
Perhaps the pic of the actual unit should be moved further down the article and the logo kept there? Or vice versa? &mdash; Ilγαηερ   (Tαlκ) '' 28 June 2005 04:59 (UTC)
 * I disagree. This is kind of a standard thing across all video game console articles including the original Xbox. K1Bond007 June 28, 2005 05:16 (UTC)
 * I am with K1 on this one, I like the logo and the unit at the top.--Thax 28 June 2005 06:22 (UTC)

Mib v. MB
An anon changed all the specs from MB/GB to MiB/GiB. While technically it's more correct, the specs provided by MS are in MB and GB. Shall I change it or not? &mdash; Ilγαηερ   (Tαlκ) '' 5 July 2005 00:37 (UTC)
 * Yes. Microsoft released them as MB and GB. That's probably how it should be. K1Bond007 July 5, 2005 03:38 (UTC)
 * One thing to note is that the HD should remain in GB because that is the method they use to specify capacity. The PS3 pages have been using MiB/KiB. At some point we will need to switch all of the content in the encylopia to be consistant, it isn't helpful if related pages are mixing measuring units. Does anyone know if there is some place were this decision could be made on a global basis for the encyclopia? --Thax 5 July 2005 17:44 (UTC)
 * I brought this forward at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:Technical_terms_and_definitions#Unit_Disagreement.2C_MiB_vs_MB --Thax 5 July 2005 18:27 (UTC)
 * Okay, I moved this to the village pump as I was not getting any activity in it's current location. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_%28policy%29#Unit_Disagreement.2C_MiB_vs._MB --Thax 8 July 2005 02:54 (UTC)
 * I still maintain that we should only use what Microsoft released. They released it in MB not MiB. K1Bond007 July 8, 2005 03:30 (UTC)
 * There is a link at the beginning of the article to the official Microsoft specifications. The specifications in the article go beyond the Microsoft specifications in terms of accuracy and the use of the term MiB doesn't conflict with Microsofts meaning of the use of MB. Microsoft needs to worry about marketing issues where as an encyclopedia doesn't face this same constraint.--Thax 8 July 2005 18:09 (UTC)

A vote has been started on whether Wikipedia should use these prefixes all the time, only in highly technical contexts, or never. - Omegatron 14:48, July 12, 2005 (UTC)

Procedural Synth
I added a section on the software side of things, but I mostly focused on the procedural synthesis part. ProcSynth looks absolutely neato... my only concern is recociling things in a multiplayer game... for example, one player could be advantaged by a less sparse or differently shaped tree or bushes. DoomBringer 03:49, 12 July 2005 (UTC)

Computers don't really do randomness - they use algorithms to generate pseudo-random number sequences driven from a seed value. A given seed value and algorithm returns a predictable result (the same stream of numbers each time). A tree-generation algorithm based on pseudo-random numbers would produce an identical tree given the same seed, so as long as the seed value is stored with each tree in the map data then each tree in the map would look different, but would still be identical on different machines, so shouldn't be a problem for multi-player. Robaker 10:17, 20 August 2005 (UTC)


 * Kinda shady making it seem like only the Xbox 360 and random obscure freeware are the only games/programs capable of such feats so we will just keep you honest there.

Add another Link?
http://www.360on360.com a pretty detailed Xbox360 Blog, should this be added to external links?


 * There is nothing useful on this site. It is a link to a link page with no orginal content. --Thax 16:06, 9 August 2005 (UTC)

Microsoft chooses Celestica for Xbox 360
http://www.cbc.ca/story/business/national/2005/08/16/Microsoft_Celestica20050816.html SD6-Agent 21:04, 16 August 2005 (UTC)

IGN interview with Peter Moore
Just another link...or is it? IGN had an interview with Microsoft Vice President Peter Moore yesterday, August 17, 2005. Read all about it here. In it Moore discusses why he chose to have two Xbox 360 prices - $299 and $399 - and he talks about the progress of the Xbox 360. -Hyad 04:49, August 18, 2005 (UTC)

IGN interview exploting the truth on DVD Compression
James Allard says developers have gotten sloppy with compression and not using all their talents.

Q: I've spoken to several developers and they're all telling me they're filling up their DVD pretty quickly, that the media isn't big enough. What's going to be done about that?

Allard: Well, we've got to do better on compression. We're not totally where we want to be with compression. Honestly, to be frank, stuff comes in hot. We're trying to do a worldwide launch of this very ambitious program, and developers will tell you that they're not very satisfied with the DVD emulator or compression. And therefore they are layouts with DVD, they're struggling with that; they're cutting corners. Basically what happens when you get final hardware late, you're sloppy. With all deference to the developers, you've got to take every out you can and so they're not applying all their talents, as they will next year and the year after to get every little bit they can out of it. They're being a little sloppy with the CPU, they're being a little sloppy with the discs, they're being a little sloppy with their formats and compression to make launch. And next year, you'll see that they tighten that up so they can get more out of the system using the same disc capacity, using the same compression, and the same art tools, and so they'll get a lot more out of the system next year. That's why games look better year over year. It's primarily because hardware comes in hot, and developers use the deficiency of the schedule not to just learn the hardware but to cut a couple of corners.

Is this problem serious as he says or will two DVDs be no big deal? If it can't fit on one DVD than it must fit on two. Straight forward I think. There is probably more too this than I think, but whatever. Renegade Viking


 * I found this unlikely video game devs tend to be very talented. He is just doing damage control on the fact that DVD wont contain every game next gen.  Compression cant fix everything and it lowers your audio and video quality.  Storage space will be a concern among developers with DVD-9 and high definition. Taladar 01:26, 23 October 2005 (UTC)


 * I think it's straight foward. Either developers lower video quality to non-HD or they use two DVD9s! And what's wrong with current PAL and NTSC resolutions? You won't see the difference in video quality between HD and non-HD on any composite TV and older LCD TV! So based on my theory, do you think Xbox 360 developers will use 1 DVD9? Renegade Viking 01:54, 03 November 2005 (CST)

Ridiculous Price
$400!?!?!?!? Sure, that's for the "Premium Edition," but still. C'mon! Looks like I won't be getting it any time soon...By the way, should we include consumer reactions in the article?

Something must be done about this ever axpanding list of prices that follow each price. Dollars, Euro, Pounds, Canadian Dollars and soon to be Yen etc etc Maybe start up a Xbox 360 pricing page? Ablaze 14:58, 18 August 2005 (UTC)
 * I think we should keep it in the main article. Havok  (T/C) 15:15, 18 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Even tho it could end up like (for example)$299.99/€299.99/£209.99/C$399.99/A$489.99/¥3,999.99/Sfr459.99? Ablaze 15:47, 18 August 2005 (UTC)
 * That still doesn't warrant it's own page in my eyes. Havok  (T/C) 16:02, 18 August 2005 (UTC)


 * I noticed that when I added the pricing was was disrupting the flow a bit. I was thinking of adding a pricing section. A seperate page that has pricing information for all of the consoles, as well as when the prices have changed or dropped in the past, would be interesting to see.--Thax 16:34, 18 August 2005 (UTC)


 * I say Dollars (US), Euros (Europe, we'd do it for britain), Pounds (Britain), and Maybe Yen. Also the premium edition is the one with all the good features, the basic one has nothing and costs $300 too &mdash; Ilγαηερ   (Tαlκ) '' 16:05, 18 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Yeah another page isn't needed, but the section is a good idea.Ablaze 07:48, 19 August 2005 (UTC)

The price is actually pretty reasonable, if you take a few seconds use think about it. Buying all the accessories separately would be much more steeply priced. Figure $50-60 for the HD, $20-30 for the cables, the remote for about $20, other bits and parts another $20-30. You're more than likely saving a bit of money. Also, game systems have launched for more in the past (relatively speaking, including inflation). Most people just mentally think "OMGWTFBBQLOL $100 for a HD!!!111oneoneleven," and they are dead wrong. DoomBringer 20:48, 6 September 2005 (UTC)

Xbox Live and Storage Requirements
From what I understand you require some sort of local storage to connect to xbox live silver, either a memory card or a HDD. Does anyone have the information about xbox live gold? I would imagine that you would need a HDD to patch games that have been exploited, and a memory card could introduce problems. It certainly isn't feasible to not patch the games, as people are able to exploit games in ways developers cannot reasonably predict or test for. Any information or links to sources would be appreciated.--Thax 16:39, 18 August 2005 (UTC)
 * I'm assuming they'd use the HDD in the premium version, and I don't know if they have internet support in the stripped down one. &mdash; Ilγαηερ   (Tαlκ) '' 16:48, 18 August 2005 (UTC)

no internet access on xbox, so dont be expecting it, i think ps3 has internet access.Tik 13:37, 27 August 2005 (UTC)

There is internet access on xbox, where have you been the past 4 years?

there is not internet access on xbox, where have U been the past 4 years? show me the official xbox keyboard and mouse, not to mention xbox talking or bragging about there internet access. And if they have internet access then y is it not in the xbox article, also why xbox 360 has not had internet access announced. The only "access" it has is connecting online to play online games, >< and that doesnt count as browsing capability. Online support is different from internet access. Ps3 has internet access, however it is not a game system anymore, just a computer. Next time sign your post. Tik


 * The Internet is not just the World Wide Web. Using an IP address and connecting to the Internet is considered 'Internet Access.'  'Online support' is a term you've just made up.  141.190.32.69 22:29, 26 October 2005 (UTC)

Yeah i guess your right, i didnt make the term up though, online support is used all the time by companies. anyways i was heated up around that time so i guess i lashed out, my bad Tik 15:10, 5 November 2005 (UTC)

Connectivity
Just how connectable(bad word, I know) will Xbox 360 be to Windows PCs. Cause I seem to get the impression that it will be connectable to any Windows PC (or XP at least) from some sites (like amazon.co.uk), BUT then I get the impression that it will only be connectable to XP Media Centre 2005 from xbox360.com. I hope its to any PC (or at least XP) since I don't have Media Centre and am not planning on buying a brand new PC just for that. - Gerbon689 18:31, 18 August 2005 (UTC)

---You don't need a Media Center PC to connect your Xbox to your network. However, a Media Center PC would make things easier, because of the Xbox Media Center Extender that's built into the system itself. Without a Media Center PC, your Xbox 360 is a ghost on your network, not really able to do anything (possibly transfer files).---


 * Wireless and Wired controller will be comptible with Windows Vista. In the Wireless piece, the connection will be make with USB charge cable.


 * What else could it do other than transfer files (that's all I really want anyway) - Gerbon689 18:08, 21 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Actually never mind this (below) answered all my questions (and should answer everyone else's) It's from www.xbox.com so is reliable.


 * Finally, Xbox 360 lets you control a new world of digital entertainment. So you can listen to your own play lists while you play all your games, and jack in your MP3 player, digital camera, and Windows XP PC to play your music, photos, and TV shows through your home entertainment system. Plus it lets you stream high definition TV and movies stored on Windows Media Center Edition PCs starting this Christmas.- Gerbon689 11:33, 28 August 2005 (UTC)

Remote
The article says that the deluxe edition comes with the remote, but the picture that shows what is in the box doesn't have the remote in it. It also isn't on the side of the box. Can we get a confirmation on this? Well someone went and did it. They wiped out the article. Any way to bring it back? Nevermind its back, thanks to whoever fixed it.


 * The remote control is an bonus on the premium edition for limited time.


 * No, I'm pretty sure it comes with the deluxe edition, why would they make it a "bonus" for a limited time? Amren (talk) 21:22, 17 September 2005 (UTC)


 * Umm, because they did. Where did you get the idea that it's not limited? I assume you did at least a little research before posting, but read here, specifically the eighth paragraph, to see the real deal. --Kamasutra 22:20, 17 September 2005 (UTC)

Ah I see, so they have two different remotes, and the media remote is the limited one while the universal is separate... thanks for the clarification.Amren (talk) 23:24, 17 September 2005 (UTC)

Premium 360
I have to admit, the Xbox 360 premium package is a good deal. Controller, hard drive, HD cable, ethernet cord, headset, etc...very nice. If I had the $x400, I'd get it. Too bad I don't.


 * The ethernet cord is what sold me. --Thax 17:46, 19 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Really? Ethernet cables can be pretty cheap depending on the length, but unfortunately they don't reveal the length in the specs. I was assuming most people would want to use the Wi-Fi anyway until I saw the adapter was $100 sold separately. The premium version is definitely worth it if the person would have bought all those extras separately, which seems to be Microsoft's plan to overprice them separately. I mean, just the hard drive makes up for the $100 different, but come on. 20GB for $100? I understand it's probably different than PC hard drives, but I saw a 250GB SATA drive earlier this week for $112 (no rebates), so how different are we talking? It'll be nice when third-party accessories start being released so we don't have to deal with Microsoft's overpricing. --Kamasutra 18:46, August 19, 2005 (UTC)


 * Microsoft's cost on the HDD is about 50 dollars. The drive is the Seagate LD25 I believe, it is a 2.5" durable, low power, low acquisitic properties while still achieving high performance. The problem with HDD's is that the base cost to manufacture them is quite high, so larger capacity drives are much cheaper per meg than smaller ones.--Thax 21:11, 19 August 2005 (UTC)
 * I looked up information on the Seagate LD25 and it seems you're right about the Xbox 360 using it. I couldn't find anything on the pricing, but $50 sounds about right. However, they're still selling it for double the price which is a bit much. Your explanation of base cost and pricing per meg doesn't explain their $100 price though. Do you agree or not? Also, I'm unsure what you mean by acquisitic properties, but I'll assume you mean acoustic since it's supposed to only output 2.7 bels. --Kamasutra 06:05, August 20, 2005 (UTC)


 * I agree, the only justification for the 100 dollar price tag is that Microsoft does't want people to buy the core edition. You are right about acoustic, I should get a spell checker. :)--Thax 22:22, 20 August 2005 (UTC)

Remember, good ole J allard is pretty good at laying things out, he said that its all about making money (dont have a link sry). anyways, it wouldnt make since for microsoft to release a product without trying to turn a profit, i know most game console makers dont make a profit there first couple quarters for a new console (as playstation routinely loses a lot of money upon release). If it costs them 50$ it totally makes since for them to charge 99$ for the HDD if they want to make money.Tik 13:58, 27 August 2005 (UTC)

Sexual Entertainment Devices
A few pornography companies, including Vivid Entertainment, have expressed intent to develop sexual accessories to accompany their future HD interactive pornography releases for the 360.


 * This is serious? I think the page need to be protected until new information as the official date of the launching are disclosed. --Mateusc 04:57, 25 August 2005 (UTC)

J Allard
I added an image of J Allard to the article in marketing because he helped market it at E3. View section.  Thorpe  talk 17:42, 26 August 2005 (UTC)

Picture of the back of the 360
I think what we could really use is a picture of the rear of the console. That way anyone that is wondering what kind of ports it has can see them. Does anyone have a picture they could post of this? I don't have one so I'm hoping that one of you guys do.


 * You can get one off www.xbox360.com. I'd get it but for some reasons it keeps refusing to recognise that I have Flash, even though I do. - Gerbon689 20:41, 27 August 2005 (UTC)


 * I'm at work and I can't access www.xbox360.com. Can someone snag this picture and post it?


 * I just got the pic. There's nothing really too amazing about the back of the 360, but I'll add it anyways. Amren (talk)  14:55, 2 September 2005 (UTC)

Games
Does anyone know the RRPs for games, outside the US. I hope Microsoft continue with their current trend of making the euro price the same number, or smaller number than US (i.e. $49.99=€49.99 or less). - Gerbon689 20:44, 27 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Play are selling them for £39.99 or €63.99 delivered. Microsoft also has notified retailers in Ireland that the selling price for the basic and premium packs will be €309.99 and €409.99 respectively. (Lets call it Irish Xbox Tax) Ablaze 19:09, 29 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Well if the price for Ireland is €409.99/309.99, then it's funny that GAME are calling €299/399 the SRPs, and that HMV have also reduced their prices to €399/299. Well I'm assuming about the €299 for HMV, since they dropped the premium to €399, and for competetion I'd bet GameStop and other shops have done the same. - Gerbon689 15:31, 9 September 2005 (UTC)
 * I hope your right... the guy in the game shop i was talking to was pretty stuck up about him being right about the price and me being wrong. This was a few days after the prices went public Ablaze 16:02, 9 September 2005 (UTC)
 * I personally wasn't told €399.99 (in HMV anyway) but my friend who ordered it in the same HMV as I was in was told €399.99, which makes sense cause the guy said the price wasn't confirmed when I ordered mine. (And btw, when I said "then it's funny that GAME are calling..., I didn't mean that sarcastically) - Gerbon689 16:19, 12 September 2005 (UTC)

Hardware headings
Having generic headings for the hardware section (CPU, GPU) seems to be a good way to simplify the article, hopefully this will allow for easier navigation for those not well versed in tech-jargon. Anetode 08:36, 20 September 2005 (UTC)

Release Dates
I looked through the article quickly, and I looked like release dates aren't included. I think it will be available by November 22nd in North America... Just check for them @ xbox.com.
 * It's in the intro. K1Bond007 04:34, 25 September 2005 (UTC)

Live
Maybe I should've put this on Xbox Live but I thought I'd get a faster/more reliable response here. Could someone confirm the thing on the Xbox Live page about it being free on weekends (free for gameplay) cause if it is, I think it really needs to be put here. Actually, there's a few things about Live 360 (as its called over there) that should be checked, cause I haven't seen them on any Microsoft sites. - RedHotHeat 11:58, 25 September 2005 (UTC)

--I added the fact that MMORPGs could be played if you only have a silver account.

Xbox live silver is already built in and ready to go once you turn your system and connect it to your broadband service,and yes it's free. Xbox live silver is free all around. Xbox live Gold is $49.99 which requires no credit card at all. You buy a subscription card for $49.99 that lasts one year. When that year is up you purchase a new one and so on. Gold will feature the market place where you can download new content,levels,new weapons,skins,characters,etc. with either points for market place that you've acquired from other games online or use a very small amount of real-time money(1cent-50cents max) from your bank account(Optional). Also you'll be able to video chat,video conference,leave video messages, have advance multi-player online gaming,etc. on xbox live gold edition. Its the very best online service ever with a record breaking 1biilion people on xbox live now. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 4.157.62.199 (talk • contribs) 16:52, 24 October 2005

I think that they will run event thingies where customers get Gold free on weekends every now and then, but they wouldnt do it every weekend. that would be unreasonable, but your right in that they will offer it for everyone free at some point be it temporary or not. (p.s. who wants to bet this post above is an advertisement ^)68.153.29.23 20:07, 30 October 2005 (UTC)

Microsoft has confirmed that they will be hosting periodic weekends offree Gold membership for Silver members, to let them try out the online gaming aspect. (XBOX Website Source) They won't specify how often they're having these weekends, other than to say that they "won't come often. "--KoopaTroopa211 21:54, 4 November 2005 (UTC)