Wikipedia:Peer review/Nelson Mandela/archive3

Nelson Mandela
I've listed this article for peer review because it reached GA status several years ago, and has recently undergone further edits to improve the coverage and scope of the article. A Peer Review to bring up potential prose improvements would be gratefully received, with the hope that the article could be taken to FAC in the near future.
 * Previous peer review

Thanks, Midnightblueowl (talk) 18:09, 13 June 2016 (UTC)


 * I have not had time to check the whole article, but there are a number of claims in the lead section which do not appear to be in the main body of the article (I searched for keywords; I may be mistaken). The lead text should not contain unsourced statements.
 * "the first elected in a fully representative democratic election"
 * "through tackling institutionalised racism"
 * "he became involved in anti-colonial politics"
 * I think this a fair summary of the first paragraph of "Law studies and the ANC Youth League: 1943–49". Midnightblueowl (talk) 12:48, 21 July 2016 (UTC)
 * "was appointed superintendent of the organisation's Transvaal branch"
 * This is covered in the third paragraph of "Defiance Campaign and Transvaal ANC Presidency: 1950–54", although the term "President" is used there over "superintendent", so I will change the latter term in the lede. Midnightblueowl (talk) 12:48, 21 July 2016 (UTC)
 * "presided over the 1955 Congress of the People"
 * "co-organised" better fits the evidence than "presided over". Changed. Midnightblueowl (talk) 12:53, 21 July 2016 (UTC)
 * "he was repeatedly arrested for seditious activities" – I can find mentions of "treason" but not "sedition".
 * The third and fourth paragraphs of the "Defiance Campaign and Transvaal ANC Presidency: 1950–54" section deal with these particular arrests; in at least one instance he was arrested under the Suppression of Communism Act, with "sedition" being the most appropriate word I can think of in this instance. Midnightblueowl (talk) 12:58, 21 July 2016 (UTC)
 * "continuing with the former government's economic liberalism"
 * I see this as a summary of the first paragraph of "Domestic programmes". Midnightblueowl (talk) 12:53, 21 July 2016 (UTC)
 * "became an elder statesman" – It says later that he founded The Elders. Does this constitute sufficient support of this statement?
 * "the radical left deemed him too eager to negotiate and reconcile with apartheid's supporters"
 * See the second paragraph of "Presidency of South Africa: 1994–99", the third paragraph of "CODESA talks: 1991–92", the second paragraph of "National reconciliation", and the third paragraph of "Reception and legacy". Midnightblueowl (talk) 13:14, 21 July 2016 (UTC)
 * "He is held in deep respect within South Africa, where he is often referred to by his Xhosa clan name, Madiba, or as Tata ("Father"), and described as the "Father of the Nation"." – Does this need a bit more citation?


 * Other issues I noticed are (crossed out issues I addressed below):
 * It should be the "University of the Witwatersrand", not "University of Witwatersrand" or "Witwatersrand University".
 * It should be the "University of Fort Hare" not "Fort Hare University".
 * "Secretary-General" should be hyphenated consistently.
 * "Nelson Mandela Foundation" is not linked.
 * This article suggests that Mandela received over 260 honours, not just over 250.
 * "Father of the Nation" is inconsistently capitalized.


 * Hpesoj00 (talk) 14:25, 19 July 2016 (UTC)


 * Additional comments after running through more of the article:
 * "Students Christian Association" – Should this be "Students'", with an apostrophe?
 * I've consulted Meredith's biography, and that refers to "Student" as opposed to "Student", so I have changed it to that. Midnightblueowl (talk) 12:29, 21 July 2016 (UTC)
 * "affiliated with the Africanist wing of African nationalism" – This sounds wrong. African nationalism seems like a movement, rather than an organization which could have a "wing".
 * I've switched "wing" with "branch". Midnightblueowl (talk) 23:39, 20 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Where is "Eloff Street"? Should this be specified?
 * In hindsight, the street name probably isn't worth mentioning at all, so I'm removing this from the article. Midnightblueowl (talk) 23:39, 20 July 2016 (UTC)
 * "stood trial as a part of the 21 accused" – Does this make grammatical sense? I may do, but it seems weird to me. "stood trial as one of the 21 accused" maybe?
 * A good alternative. Changed. Midnightblueowl (talk) 12:34, 21 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Also, I just made my own edits up until just before the "Imprisonment" section. Hpesoj00 (talk) 16:56, 19 July 2016 (UTC)


 * What is a "High Organ"?
 * It was the term that the prisoners used for their leadership; I was hoping that that might be evident from the context in which the term is beign used, but if you think that it isn't clear enough, I can perhaps replace it? Midnightblueowl (talk) 12:42, 21 July 2016 (UTC)
 * It's probably okay. I guessed that it was a leadership. I'm just not familiar with the use of word "organ" in this sense. Hpesoj00 (talk) 15:18, 21 July 2016 (UTC)
 * "abandoned after being infiltrated by an agent" – He infiltrated the escape plan? Doesn't make sense grammatically.
 * I've changed it to "after the conspiracy was infiltrated" Midnightblueowl (talk) 12:38, 21 July 2016 (UTC)
 * "a further 11 meetings over three years" – Over "the next" three years?
 * Changed. Midnightblueowl (talk) 12:38, 21 July 2016 (UTC)
 * "Both parties campaigned for an anti-pass campaign" – Is there a way to say this without repeating the word "campaign"?
 * I've gone with "Both parties took part in". Midnightblueowl (talk) 21:59, 20 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Hpesoj00 (talk) 18:38, 19 July 2016 (UTC)


 * "Changing clothes several times a day, after assuming the presidency, one of Mandela's trademarks was his use of Batik shirts, known as "Madiba shirts", even on formal occasions." – What is the emphasis meant to be in this sentence? As it is written, it sounds like, "While he changed clothes several times a day, Mandela then assumed presidency, and was thereafter known for his use of Batik shirts." Obviously, this sounds a bit odd. I assume that you mean to say something like, "After assuming presidency, Mandela was known for his use of Batik shirts, which he changed several times a day." However, since I cannot access the cited reference, I will leave you to amend this.
 * I've changed this to "Mandela was known to change his clothes several times a day and after assuming the presidency he became so associated with Batik shirts that the latter came to be known as "Madiba shirts"." Midnightblueowl (talk) 13:09, 21 July 2016 (UTC)
 * "National Executive" is inconsistently capitalized.
 * I've standardised all instances of this in the prose. Midnightblueowl (talk) 21:46, 20 July 2016 (UTC)
 * "by appointing de Klerk as first Deputy President" and "de Klerk and Thabo Mbeki became first and second Deputy President, respectively" – The BBC source names de Klerk as second and Mbeki as first. Is this significant, or are the labels "first" and "second" not significant?
 * Looking back at the sources, I don't believe that the terms are significant, so I am removing them from the article lest they cause confusion. Midnightblueowl (talk) 13:09, 21 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Reference 21, "Faculty of Commerce at the University of Cape Town", is broken.
 * I've removed it and the information that relies upon it. Midnightblueowl (talk) 21:56, 20 July 2016 (UTC)
 * "US" and "U.S." are used inconsistently. Pick one!
 * I've gone with "U.S." Midnightblueowl (talk) 21:46, 20 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Hpesoj00 (talk) 18:38, 19 July 2016 (UTC)


 * "media politicians... embodying" – Should the ... be [...]? See WP:ELLIPSIS.
 * A fair point. Changed. Midnightblueowl (talk) 21:41, 20 July 2016 (UTC)
 * "Two 'authorised' biographies" – Why is 'authorised' in quotes? Also, this is the first instance I have seen of single quotes. Is there reason not to use double quotes?
 * I think that I was following the source material here, but you make a fair point that this isn't necessary. Removed. Midnightblueowl (talk) 21:41, 20 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Finished my proof-reading of the article. Please check my edits to make sure they are sensible. Hpesoj00 (talk) 16:33, 20 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Many thanks for taking the time to produce this review, Hpesoj00. I'll make my way through the points that you raise over the coming few days. Midnightblueowl (talk) 21:31, 20 July 2016 (UTC)
 * No problem. Your edits so far look good. Hpesoj00 (talk) 15:18, 21 July 2016 (UTC)

Comments from Brianboulton
This is a very important article, and I appreciate the time and effort you have given to it. I won't have time for a full review, but I do hope that you will be able to bring it successfully to FA standard. I have a few comments, mainly from the early parts of the article, and I will try to add to the list if I can.
 * General prose point: while speedreading the first few sections, I noted a particular proliferation of "-ing" words, often at the starts of sentences. Thus we have "Living in Johannesburg,...", "Working as a lawyer,...", "Leading a broad coalition government,...", "Declining a second presidential term,..." – these are all in the lead, among lots of subsidiary -ings. This form of costruction continues into the main text, and becomes a little irksome to the reader after a while. I recommend some attention to this aspect of the prose.
 * Good point; I'd not really noticed that but looking back I see what you mean. I am going through the article and trying to cut down the "ing"s somewhat. Midnightblueowl (talk) 08:40, 3 August 2016 (UTC)
 * I thought I'd mention that the presence of "-ing" doesn't make the construction, but the presence of a verb. For example, "Working as a lawyer, [...]" uses the same construction as "Employed as a lawyer, [...]". I removed this particular example because I felt is wasn't an important enough detail to be in the lead section, but my point is that simply replacing the word doesn't change the construction. Hpesoj00 (talk) 14:06, 3 August 2016 (UTC)
 * In the lead, I'd describe Mandela as the country's first black "head of state", the higher office, rather than chief executive.
 * Good point. Changed. Midnightblueowl (talk) 14:16, 2 August 2016 (UTC)
 * I notice a paucity of dates in the early sections. After noting Mandela's birth in July 1918, we have no specific dates apart from "in 1937" until his return to Mqhekezweni in December 1940. It would be good to have dates, or at least years, for when he started at the local Methodist school; when  the Thembu regent became his guardian; when he attended the Methodist mission school located next to the palace; when he began at Clarkebury and subsequently at Fort Hare University. A clear chronology, I find, helps me to maintain my attention, rather than losing concentration through wondering "Where are we now?" oe "When did that happen?"
 * An excellent suggestion. I have gone through the sources and added dates where possible. This does not appear possible for some of the earlier events, such as his adoption by the Thembu regent, but the years in which he started Clarkebury and Fort Hare are available and I have added them into the article. Midnightblueowl (talk) 13:58, 14 August 2016 (UTC)


 * You appear to be writing in British English, but there are lapses into occasional American forms such as "at law firm Witkin, Sidelsky and Eidelman". The BritEng equivaleny would be "at the law firm of Witkin, Sidelsky and Eidelman".
 * I'm not the best at distinguishing between British English and American English but I'll keep my eye out for instances of this in the article. Midnightblueowl (talk) 13:50, 14 August 2016 (UTC)


 * "In order to..." occurs more than once in the article. The first two words of this ponderous construction are entirely superfluous and should be dropped. Brianboulton (talk) 09:10, 27 July 2016 (UTC)
 * I've removed both instances of this in the article. Midnightblueowl (talk) 14:16, 2 August 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for your comments and words of support, Brian. I'll make some reforms to the article accordingly. Midnightblueowl (talk) 14:14, 2 August 2016 (UTC)

Comments. As always, feel free to revert my copyediting. - Dank (push to talk)
 * I've done a little copyediting ... not too much because I want to start fresh when this gets to FAC. It's an impressive article. Best of luck. - Dank (push to talk) 18:21, 21 August 2016 (UTC)