Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Crime and Criminal Biography/Archive 1

Confidence scams
I set up the template Confidence Tricks for confidence scam related webpages. I figure we should probably do the same for other related crimes like Serial Killers, Bank robbers, Hackers, etc. Remember 21:13, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

Infobox title
I feel that the title "convicted criminal" should be inside the box instead of outside of it, but I do not know how to make this change. any code-savvy wikipedians can help? the box is at Template:Infobox Criminal. Wooyi 22:50, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

Task forces
Here is a suggestion as to the design (largely borrowed from WikiProject Military history) regarding adding related projects in the place of "task forces" as well as additional features for WP Crime. MadMax 08:51, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

Merge proposal

 * A proposal to merge the articles Street gangs and Gangster (which has been proposed to merge with Gang) has been suggested. MadMax 19:29, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
 * The proposal to merge the articles U.S. Mafia Families and Crime family has been made. MadMax 21:36, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

Emily Brogan
The article Emily Brogan, a member of the Provisional IRA, has been tagged as non-notible and may be in danger of being deleted in the near future. MadMax 21:33, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
 * I tried to find it in google but couldn't, dont know why. Wooyi 21:40, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
 * No luck finding it myself, although I left a note at WikiProject Irish Republican Army to see if can can dig anything up. MadMax 05:34, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Probably she is not a leader of IRA, but if she is notable the IRA project editors would come up with some printed reference. Wooyi 23:01, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

Martha Stewart
Martha Stewart's mug shot Image:Marthastewart.jpg is being accused as a hoax, can someone please verify it? Wooyi 22:35, 11 February 2007 (UTC)


 * My comments on Wooyi's talk page:
 * Yes, I did remove the Stewart mug shot and, yes, I do believe it is a hoax. First of all, the image was taken from a blog...bad practice. Second, The image clearly has been doctored...it looks to me like Stewart's head has been copied from another image and pasted into a mug shot image. Third, I believe Stewart's mug shot was taken in June of 2003...the date in this image looks to be 6-21-02. I find it very inappropriate to take a "mug shot" which is most likely a hoax from somebody's blog and than upload it to a Wikipedia article and act as though it is the real thing. --Matthew UND (talk) 22:51, 11 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Wooyi, I think the main problem seems to be the picture's source which is a known hoax journal which suggests the photo may have been altered with that purpose in mind. Hpwever, while I've found an additional website which uses the photo (see ), I'm unable to find any other photos related to her arrest including on major celebrity mugshot websites such as Mugshots.com. I have found an alternative photo of Martha Stewart in a prison jumpsuit, however, I'm unsure weither this is a legitimate photo or if it's in the public domain. MadMax 06:23, 12 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Personally, I don't feel Wooyi is entirtly at fault. It certainly is very convincing at first glance and there is no indication it was altered on the original website (such as a disclaimer or copyright notice). However, while I would obviously agree the photo's reliability in question, it should be importent to take in consideration that it was an honest mistake. MadMax 06:49, 12 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks MadMax. I will be careful about images in future. It was my careless mistake. Wooyi 05:01, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

Al Capone
The article Al Capone, which is within our project, was under persistent vandalism and an administrator has agreed to semi-protect it. Wooyi 22:08, 14 February 2007 (UTC)

Albert Fish
Albert Fish has been rated as "Good Article". It was created (or developed) by new member User:Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ). Thanks Mr. Norton! Wooyi 01:05, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

Merge proposals
A series of articles have been proposed to be merged at WikiProject British crime. MadMax 02:14, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

Novi Ligure Homicide
An article that is related to our project Novi Ligure Homicide is being proposed for deletion, you are welcomed to discuss it here. Thank you! Wooyi 02:01, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

Questions
Here are several questions from the unofficial WikiProject Organized crime which have not been answered.


 * for additional questions see the project talk page.


 * 1) I've reformatted the Los Angeles Mafia, however it still needs a lot of work from more knowledgeable editors. Would a more appropriate title be Los Angeles crime family or even the more specific Dragna crime family ? MadMax 11:47, 18 September 2006 (UTC)
 * 2) I've been working on some of the lesser known Jewish mobsters of the 1930s, mostly associates of Lansky and Buchalter, and I've come across a discrepancy between a claim in a published book "Murder Inc." by Burton B. Turkus and Sid Feir which claims Philip Kovolick was killed in 1949 after shaking down New York bookies in a protection racket and a New York Times article which reports his body was found sealed in a drum in Hallandale, Florida after fleeing from an indictment to appear before a Manhattan grand jury. Any thoughts ? MadMax 19:53, 4 December 2006 (UTC)
 * 3) I've been trying to add additional information to Vincenzo Aloi, another article created by User:TheChin, since it was previously redirected as a stub to the Colombo crime family. However, the article doesn't clarify weither this is Vincenzo "Buster" Aloi or his son. I'm assuming its his son, given the 1923 birthdate, however the article give a much higher position within the Colombo family as consigliere (when he is stated as a New Jersey capo in 1988 ) ? MadMax 14:06, 18 December 2006 (UTC)
 * 4) The date of death for Abraham Friedman differs between AmericanMafia.com and April 28 according to Albert Fried's The Rise and Fall of the Jewish Gangster in America (see ). MadMax 12:27, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
 * 5) I recently ran across the article Arthur Adler, however is this the same man who was killed by Sam DeStefano ? MadMax 14:58, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
 * 6) There doesn't seem to be any mention of Genovese mobsters Louis DeSorbo and John Matarazzo, online or otherwise. If anyone can provide sources, please do so. MadMax 21:18, 30 January 2007 (UTC)
 * 7) In trying to complete the somewhat inconsistant liniage of policy operators in New York, orgininaly begun by Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ), I'm unable to find who succeeded Anthony "Fat Tony" Salerno following his imprisonment in 1986. Assuming he retained control Harlem's number rackets after becoming head of the Genovese crime family during the 1970s, would it be logical to assume Vincent Gigante came into control following Salerno's downfall ? MadMax 21:36, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

Articles for deletion

 * The following articles have been proposed for deletion:
 * 1) Ebony Simpson (kept), an Australian murder victim nominated on the basis of being a non notable/memorial entry. Interestingly enough, it has been proposed by one editor to merge the victim to the crime, which has apparently been becoming common practice.
 * 2) CrimeLine (deleted) - proposed as a non notable/unverified organization.
 * 3) Dean Roberts (criminal) (deleted; currently under deletion review) - proposed as a non notible drug dealer
 * 4) Michael Tyrell (drug trafficker) (Kept) - proposed as a non notable criminal

—The preceding unsigned comment was added by MadMax (talk • contribs) 04:45, 12 March 2007 (UTC).

Flag question
An editor who edited Stanley Williams removed the flags in infobox and pointed out the problem here. Let's discuss here whether if we remove all flags from criminal biography infobox or keep them. Wooyi 20:45, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the pointer here, Wooyi. I think the most relevant issues from my perspective are that the flags are visually "busy" and distracting, and also, to borrow from WP:FLAGS, "Flags place unequal emphasis on location, especially in infoboxes. With a flag, Paul McCartney is English 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿. Without a flag, he is an English rock singer and songwriter who was in The Beatles." I don't think that removing flags from every infobox on Wikipedia is a good idea, but for criminal biographies, it may make sense. Most of these folks aren't politicians, and their notability has little or nothing to do with nationality. If most pictures are worth a thousand words, these flag icons are worth at least several dozen words ;-) and it seems like overemphasis on the trivial for criminal bios. — coe l acan — 01:02, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I've previously discussed this issue with Longhair and, while I do believe this is an issue which should be resolved, it could be useful for criminals who have died outside their native countries (as opposed to being a bit repetitive to keep for those who have died in their own respective countries). MadMax 02:09, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Well, the infoboxes should state the location of death. That info should be easily available for anyone who's looking for it, but I don't think it's exactly hidden in a flag-less infobox. Is location of death so important that there should be a colorful eye-catching icon there that demands a little piece of every reader's time? — coe l acan — 06:37, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I haven't really any opinion on the matter one way or the other, however if there is no real practical defined use outside of lists and such, I'm not sure I understand why the flag templates exist at all if their use is discouraged on biographies. MadMax 04:19, 16 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Well, keep in mind that while I endorse what WP:FLAGS has to say, it's just an essay, not policy. The use of the templates is discouraged by many but not by everyone. I can see how it's useful in Angela Merkel's biography. Her "Germanness" is a major component of her notability. Richard Müller's, less so. I wouldn't draw unwarrented attention to Müller's nationality with a flag icon, although I can see why Merkel's infobox has one. — coe l acan — 08:50, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

Discussion of notability guidelines
According to discussion regarding the deletion of drug trafficker Michael Tyrell, Smerdis of Tlön mentioned there has been some discussion at Notability (news) regarding the notability and sourcing policies of criminal biographies. Apparently there has been a growing opinion that articles deemed "non-notable" are to be deleted, however this is the first I've heard of it. Does anyone know anything more about this ? MadMax 02:22, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * It is very hard to draw a line, and the proposed Notability (news) was not adopted as a policy. WP:BIO's primary criteron says for a person to be notable it must be subject of secondary sources that are reliable, intellectually independent, and independent of the subject and it also says mentioning of the person in sources cannot be incidental. The following special criterion did not cover criminals, however. I guess that a notable criminal should be a primary subject of articles in at least two reliable newspapers. I also think that non-notable local newspapers probably don't count. For the case of Michael Tyrell (drug trafficker) it looks like it has been covered as main subject in articles on some national newspapers that have entries on wikipedia themselves, so I guess it should be kept. Wooyi 04:05, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Just to follow up a sec, we're currently looking at merging WP:N and WP:INCLUSION into a revised general guideline on notability. The main standard in WP:INCLUSION is that an article should include more than one independently published verifiable reference and the references should not all be published simultaneously (eg it shouldn't be three different papers reporting on the same wire story on the same day).  In the specific case of Michael Tyrell's article above, the references included appear to span a two year time frame, so my guess is it would pass both WP:INCLUSION and WP:N. Dugwiki 17:11, 20 March 2007 (UTC)
 * The problem, as I see it, is that it's a fairly trivial achievement for a criminal to meet WP:BIO. Just about any homicide or major robbery in a city with two media outlets would appear to make it; if it's covered in both, this criminal deserves an encyclopedia article under that standard.  This is why I tend to feel that criminals need to have some kind of evidence of lasting interest in order to be worthy of an article. What should those criteria be?  Idunno. - Smerdis of Tlön 15:35, 21 March 2007 (UTC)
 * To reply to Smerdis above, note that both WP:INCLUSION and WP:N recommend that the references be spread out a little over time. Multiple newspapers publishing the same story on the same day or two day period wouldn't count.  That's intended to weed out some of the "one shot" crime stories and such. It won't weed out every local crime story, but it does catch a number of them. Dugwiki 16:07, 21 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes, you are right, it does. It may, though, still make every criminal who goes to trial or  receives a sentence a potential encyclopedia subject.  This will happen some time after the crime and the arrest, and usually will be covered independently by the local media.  This, too, sets the bar too low, at least in my opinion.  - Smerdis of Tlön 16:34, 21 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I agree, the bar is intentionally low. It's set low since a low requirement is all that appears currently likely to receive strong consensus.  Articles about cases which minimally pass WP:N and WP:INCLUSION might still not be considered good articles for Wikipedia by all editors, and such controversial cases are going to require more detailed debate beyond the scope of the general guidelines. So yes, the guidelines err on the side of over-inclusion. Dugwiki 17:00, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Create Category:Crimes by year ?
While categorizing an article about a particular crime, I noticed that there doesn't seem to be a category for the year of the crime. Almost everything in Wikipedia has a category indicating the associated year of the event/birth/creation/etc, so it looks like an oversight that nobody has created Category:Crimes by year or something similar.

I was pointed to your project as the one that would likely have the most significant influence on maintaining such a category, so what do you guys think? Currently the only option for categorizing crimes by year is to put them under the "year by country" category, such as Category:1977 in the United States for a US crime that occured in 1977. It might be useful as a way to study crimes in a similar historical context, and would be a consistent category tag that basically any crime event article could include. Dugwiki 21:40, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Seems like a logical category to create. MadMax 04:22, 16 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I agree that creating a "crimes by year" category is reasonable and necessary, go for it. Wooyi 03:55, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the positive feedback. I'll probably start on it today or tomorrow using a template system similar to Category:Works by year.

Ok, I've set up the basic category templates for Category:Crimes by year. It should be fairly straightforward. Each yearly category uses Template:crimesyr for its format. Feel free to adjust the templates I set up as desired.

I also in the descriptions said that the categories should use the year of occurence of the crime, and for articles about a serial set of crimes use the year of the first crime in the series. (Otherwise you'll end up with a bunch of categories for crimes that span a number of years).

The next step is simply to start populating the categories and creating new categories using the templates as needed. I'll start doing some of that, but please feel free to add them as you find articles with missing crime years.

Finally, I also created Category:Year of crime missing to house articles which currently do not include the year the crime occured. This is similar to Category:Year of birth missing and is meant to be a temporary placeholder until the year can be included in the article. Dugwiki 19:01, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

FYI on alleged crimes
In the course of the above categorization of Category:Crimes by year I've noticed a few articles which allege that someone committed a crime, such as talking about the subject being sued or indicted, but for which no conviction resulted. I just wanted to make a general caution that unless an article has verifiable information that the subject was convicted of a crime they should not be labelled with "crime" categories. Otherwise you're basically calling that person or company "criminals" without providing actual verified information that they are officially criminals.

That's not to say there aren't alternatives. For example, Category:Scandals can be used for articles about people or companies who receive negative public attention for being accused of committing a crime, regardless of whether or not they receive a conviction. I would recommend using that category for public allegations, and reserving "criminal" categories for people and organizations who are legally considered criminals. Dugwiki 21:26, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Category:Crimes by year and Category:Criminals similarities
I noticed in the course of populating Category:Crimes by year that a lot of the articles involving specific crimes are actually biographical articles about the associated criminals. Thus many of the "crimes" articles appear instead under Category:Criminals. That's not a problem, per se, but it does point out that a good place to look for articles to populate Category:Crimes by year is Category:Criminals. Dugwiki 17:08, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Lewis Libby controversy
Some editors repeatedly tried to eliminate the "charge" and "penalty" row from the infobox in the article Lewis Libby, an article in the scope of the project. Please take a look at it and express your opinion here. Thanks! Wooyi 19:50, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

Template size
Can someone please take a look at this header? It's way too big. Thanks. Xiner (talk) 00:07, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I agree, but I don't know how to fix templates. If someone does please decrease the size of that row. Thanks! Wooyi 20:21, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Sasha Spesivtsev
I came across an article Sasha Spesivtsev, saying he was born in 1970, but some say it is 1969. Can someone check and clarify on this? Thanks! Wooyi 20:22, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

List of Italian-American mobsters
An ongoing discussion at the List of Italian-American mobsters is discussing how the list may be removed for supposed violations of European hate speach laws. MadMax 22:48, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Good article
The article on the Argentinian police officer who was a perpetrator during Dirty War, Miguel Etchecolatz has just passed the GA nomination and became a Good Article. WooyiTalk, Editor review 02:47, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

William Bennest
I have created this article: all we need to do now is to expand it, keeping it within WP:BLP policies. This one will be hard, because so far there is only one source on the article, and finding other sources is hard.

Please see the talk page of the article. --SunStar Net talk 15:53, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

Category deletions for Category:Gang members by affiliation and its subcategories
An editor has recently nominated Category:Gang members by affiliation and its subcategories Category:Vice Lords, Category:Gangster Disciples, Category:Crips and Category:Bloods. MadMax 03:56, 16 April 2007 (UTC)
 * They should not be deleted, as they are important to categorize organized crime articles. WooyiTalk, Editor review 03:58, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Smaller WikiProject banner
Hi all --- does WP Crime have an option (e.g. something similar to the standard as "small=yes") to make the box small and right-aligned? If not, could someone who's good with templates add one? Thanks! cab 23:22, 18 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes I noticed this too... is there a small banner for use? MrMacMan Talk  03:17, 19 April 2007 (UTC)

Virginia Tech Massacre
The motives section of the Virginia Tech Massacre was deleted probably because the article was too long. Stalking is a serious issue particularly on college campuses. The narrative in the section on Cho's motives alluded to his stalking female students and disturbing behavior in the classroom. The section was probably deleted to make the article shorter, but by making the article shorter it left out valuable information that may prevent further death. By minimizing the importance of stalking incidents, females do not report the incidents, do not go to court to get a protection order, no action is taken against the stalker (including serious psychiatric intervention) and sometimes this leads to deadly consequences. In fact, if only a single female were killed by a stalker or a domestic violence incident, there would not even be a reference in Wikipedia. In some jurisdictions, reports of stalking result in legal intervention and in others multiple reports accumulate and no action is taken. If more follow-up had been done in 2005 when the first complaints were made against Cho perhaps 33 more people would be alive today. Cherylyoung 10:42, 20 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I moved this to the talk page from the Project page. Quadzilla99 11:07, 20 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Well, I personally don't think stalking played a role in the massacre. There are tons of stalkers in our country, many of them are good people who are just obsessed with another person of the opposite sex. There are stalkers who intimidate the victims, it happens. But in general, most stalkers don't kill. When this massacre happened, some even blamed Asians, as an Asian myself I could not understand it. Hopefully it would not stir up a moral panic against stalkers, either. WooyiTalk, Editor review 20:17, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

Sometimes stalking does lead to murder. Sometimes after the stalker murders one person he goes on to murdering others. Cho photographed female students legs under the desk in Niki Giovanni's class. He looked up the email address of 2 female students and even found out personal information about their families. The second female student complained in 2005 because Cho showed up at her dorm room after having sent her the disturbing IM's. Andy Koch, Cho's roommate at the time said that he quit bringing females to the dorm because Cho would harass them. It is possible that Cho was actually stalking Heather Haugh, Emily Hilscher's roommate. If more attention in the investigation is focused on stalking, perhaps Virginia will re-examine their laws for personal protection orders. In Michigan 2 girls were being stalked and given death threats on the answering machine with a countdown of days until they would die. Ten days, nine days etc. A third girl was killed on the last day. Because of that I spent a lot of effort in 1994 to see that the laws for personal protection orders, truth in sentencing and sentencing guidelines were passed. Stalking is a serious issue. Cherylyoung 05:24, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

I will participate in the Criminal Biography section. Cherylyoung 05:29, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Recognized content
I'm starting a new section for recognized content such as GAs and FAs, feel free to comment/revert. I think the section should only list content that was improved or developed by the project. Rather than articles that just falls under the scope. I'm not wed to the idea so feel free to comment. Incidentally Matthew Cox is now a GA. Quadzilla99 13:07, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

Template sharing
Hi. I think if your scope is mostly made up of biographical articles, you ought to consider becoming an official workgroup of WikiProject Biography and sharing our wonderful template WPBiography. Please respond at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Biography or Template talk:WPBiography if you are interested. Thank you. --kingboyk 16:07, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
 * The project, at least in my own view, covers both criminal biographies as well as organizations, crimes and other topics related to true crime and criminology. However, I'd certainly be in favor of the project working with WPP:BIO. MadMax 16:23, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
 * That wouldn't preclude working with us. Either you can make use of our non-bio=yes parameter for articles which aren't biographical, or you could maybe set up a workgroup with us for just the biographies. (Although I do note that your project's title is specifically "Criminal Biography" :)) --kingboyk 16:37, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Can I second that proposal? Your project currently only has 42 articles that are bannered, so the change wouldn't be very difficult... -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs)  20:37, 14 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I'd rather maintain an independent project personally. Quadzilla99 22:25, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

Columbine High School massacre FAR
Columbine High School massacre has been nominated for a featured article review. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. Please leave your comments and help us to return the article to featured quality. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, articles are moved onto the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Remove" the article from featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Reviewers' concerns are here. Sandy Georgia (Talk) 17:25, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I think it should be kept since the reference thing can be gradually improved by adding them. Also only a minor portion of the article has alleged problems, the whole thing I think should not be delisted. WooyiTalk, Editor review 20:45, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Reference
A great resource was recently pointed out by Mikedash as the Library of Congress recently established a website for its newspaper digitisation project. This is especially helpful for those using the New York Times and Boston Herald from ProQuest, as the website itself currently features 25 major newspapers between 1900-1910. MadMax 20:08, 1 May 2007 (UTC)


 * The New York Times archive is also a handy reference. 72.74.208.247 07:59, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Harry Shapiro (American criminal) nominated for deletion
An AFD of a criminal's biography, Harry Shapiro (American criminal) has been proposed for deletion in this discussion: Articles for deletion/Harry Shapiro (American criminal). You are welcome to comment there. WooyiTalk, Editor review 02:54, 5 May 2007 (UTC)

Jewish-American organized crime
There is currently a debate to discuss moving the article title of Jewish-American organized crime to American Jews in organized crime. The reasoning for this move is to provide what has been refered to as a conspiritorial and almost accusatory title. Personally, I feel this is the same argument which has been brought up time and again for virtually every ethnic-related organized crime topic for more then two years now. The page move is based on POV, however I don't feel the title is anymore "offensive" then African-American organized crime or Greek-American organized crime nor do the articles serve to "decide the name of articles that effect entire ETHNIC GROUPS and RELIGIONS".

However, a point was brought up regarding Mafia and the Irish Mob and I think these articles should be broken up between there U.S. and international equivalants (ex. Irish-American organized crime and Italian-American organized crime). MadMax 05:36, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

Mass deletion/renaming of criminal and street gang related articles
Another editor has yet again nominated Category:Gangs by ethnicity as well as virtualy all ethnic and historically related street gang categorires on Wikipedia. I feel this is a fairly serious issue which is becoming more and more frequent in recent months. MadMax 19:34, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

Matthew Cox
I'm currently trying to get this article up to FA length, but I'm having trouble getting new sources. To clarify I've scoured pretty much everything that was released up to mid April, any help would be appreciated. Quadzilla99 22:29, 14 May 2007 (UTC)
 * To clarify more news should be coming out on him (he was recently captured) but I haven't found any yet. Quadzilla99 22:36, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

I'll see what I can dig up. MadMax 04:57, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

Buster from Chicago
An editor recently left me a message regarding Buster from Chicago and his suggestion, according to Jay Robert Nash, that his identity may have been Leo Vincent Brothers. I only had Carl Sifakis's "The Mafia Encyclopedia" to go by, however does anyone have any sources that can clarify this ? MadMax 05:53, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

Assessment
Should we be using the 1.0 bot (Version 1.0 Editorial Team/Using the bot) to start assessing the Criminal biography articles? Remember 18:02, 22 May 2007 (UTC)


 * That would probably be a good idea and, personally speaking, I do find it difficult to determine the importance of artices when entering a grade by hand. I wonder if it would be possible to use a bot to tag the on article in the crime categories as well ? MadMax 04:54, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

Polish Crime
I have an article which keeps being blocked which I would like to add to the Polish Crime section. It is referenced, notable, and verifiable and describes the life of Julian Dobrowolski. Right now though, it is blocked from being remade. I was advised to contact the Criminal WikiProject on the subject and would really like some help regarding this situation... Benek69 18:46, 18 June 2007 (UTC) Thanks

Error in Chris Benoit Article
There is an error in the Chris Benoit article and since its talk page is locked I'm putting this on your page. It says he killed himself late Saturday or early Sunday. That is WRONG! He killed his son at those times. He killed himself on Monday. How can a dead man send text messages?

Misuse of Infobox criminal
WikiProject Criminal Biography input at Misuse of Infobox criminal would be welcome. -- Jreferee  (Talk) 17:57, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

Charles Whitman
I was hoping to bring Charles Whitman to Good Article status soon, in the hopes of one day possibly reaching FA if I can only find a way to track down his relatives and get PD releases for the photos (because the FU photos are what's bogging us down right now). It's been a pet wiki article for me for ages, I have 315 edits that have made up most of what the page is Is thnow (and another 119 edits to the talk page, holy crap) - and I would very much appreciate constructive criticism on how to improve it. Sherurcij (Speaker for the Dead) 07:17, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Tyrone Noling AfD
I didn't see a Crime-related deletions list, so I'm posting here. Thought your group may be able to provide insight into the AfD for Tyrone Noling and whether the Ohio Supreme Court ruling of his death sentence is notable. Canuckle 22:26, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

Deletion sorting
Hi, a request for a crime related deletion sorting list was made at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Deletion sorting. It sounds like a good idea as there as there is a steady flow of these, so here it is: WikiProject Deletion sorting/Crime. It is empty at the moment. Please notify any other WikiProjects that will also be interested in this new list. John Vandenberg 15:13, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

American Serial Killers
I have been trying to enter the Serial Killer Infobox including a photo for all of the serial killers listed under the American serial killers category. This of course takes a lot of time. I was wondering if anyone would like to help out? I would like to do this for serial killers from all countries eventually. Jmm6f488 20:23, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

Serial Killer Task Force Up and Running
The Serial Killer Task Force is up and running though still a little under construction come and check it out and feel free to join. Jmm6f488 08:38, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

Mountain Meadows massacre
I have requested a peer review for the Mountain Meadows massacre article. I am placing this here in hopes editors can take a look at the article's treatment of the event. Any feedback is appreciated. --Robbie Giles 13:34, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

I put up a CFD
Here suggesting that Category:Parents who murdered their children be renamed Category:Parents who committed filicide. I really don't know how CFD works (I've never listed anything there before), so I could use some help, and of course input. Thanks. Nosleep1234 09:41, 27 July 2007 (UTC) Thank you for the input. Nosleep1234 19:52, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I won't get involved at the moment (it's probably over by now anyway) but I don't really think either name is suitable. You should find an appropriate word like 'filicidals'. Filicide can only be committed by parents anyway, so saying 'parents who committed' is an unnecessary pre-statement. It's like writing 'criminals who committed homicide'. Unfortunately it doesn't look very good and I'm not even sure if it's a word. People write 'murderers' or (I think) 'manslaughterers' (lol) rather than 'homicidals' for example. Homicide is either used as a noun for an act or an adjective ('he's homicidal') but not as a noun identifying a person so far as I'm aware. Whatever category that you come up with, don't include 'parents' in the name, but instead, put it inside the 'parents' category if there is one in existance, or something like 'child crimes' or 'criminal parents' or something like that. Whatever is appropriate, since I am no familiar with such categories. Tyciol 15:58, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Rock Springs massacre
Hello everyone. The article Rock Springs massacre, while not tagged by this project probably falls within its scope. It is a current Featured article candidate, if anyone here has the time comments would be appreciated after reviewing the featured article criteria and comparing those to the article. You can see its entry and participate in the discussion at Featured article candidates/Rock Springs massacre. This message is an attempt to jumpstart lagging discussion, talk page posts on WikiProject pages which have tagged the article went unnoticed as the three projects are less than active at this juncture. Thanks ahead of time. IvoShandor 09:50, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

Featured article review of Schabir Shaik trial
Schabir Shaik trial has been nominated for a featured article review. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. Please leave your comments and help us to return the article to featured quality. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, articles are moved onto the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Remove" the article from featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Reviewers' concerns are here. — Black Falcon (Talk) 05:46, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Where was info found
I was curious about the information given on a conviction in Indianapolis. In all my research including his brother Mikal's book there is never a mention of this and I'm wondering where the contributor obtained this particular information. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jarrodssis (talk • contribs) 18:10, 7 September 2007 (UTC)


 * Is this woman in prison now? She was a minor when she comitted the crime and obviously insane. This is a miscarriage of justice under US law.70.20.133.75 05:55, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

Move proposal

 * I'm not sure where to put this, however Talk:1871 in organized crime and Talk:1872 in organized crime should be moved to 1871 in organized crime and 1872 in organized crime respectivly. 71.184.36.216 03:28, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

Tables Galore
I've been adding crime stats tables to cities. I think they go great in the articles. Check them out: West Palm Beach, Florida Fort Myers, Florida Opa Locka, Florida etc...

I suggest you do the same in your hometowns! ReignMan 03:44, 5 October 2007 (UTC)

Mass deletion of criminals
I've updated the listing of crime-related articles on AFD. Members of the project and its related Wikiprojects that there seems to be a lot of criminal biographies being listed for deletion at present on the basis of being non-notable, despite many of these having cited references and sources. What is disturbing, at least from my perspective, is the comments which have been made by users in these debates who simply feel there are "too many" biographies on criminals, however well it meets Wikipedia's notability guidelines. 71.184.39.74 23:44, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

Assistance
Uh a vigilante editor has gone off and Wikified every bit of the "Craigslist Killing" including both the victim and the perp. I'm not really for Encyclopedifying peoples lives especially when the criminal act is isolated and no actual motive has been released. I would nominate both the individuals articles for deletion and simply combine their information into the "Craigslist Killing" article. I ask this Wikiproject to assist in overseeing these pages based on their knowledge of other similar Wikified crimes. 64.122.208.184 16:48, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Charles Manson
We have nominated this article for Good Article status. Anyone who hasn't spent a lot of time working on this article is asked to drop by Charles Manson, Good article nominations and Talk:Charles Manson to look it over and leave comments. Thanks. Wildhartlivie (talk) 21:59, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

1985 Rajneeshee assassination plot

 * New article, just created, 1985 Rajneeshee assassination plot - about the plot by at least seven high-ranking members of Rajneeshpuram to assassinate the United States Attorney for the District of Oregon. Let me know what you think of the article on its talk page.  Cheers, Curt Wilhelm VonSavage (talk) 14:09, 26 November 2007 (UTC).

Robert A. Hawkins
There is some debate over the correct use of infoboxes in relation to this subject. As it falls under your Wikiproject I thought you might be able to contribute to the debate on which is the best manner to proceed with the article. Parsival74 (talk) 21:23, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

Lo Piccolo images
The images Image:Lo_Piccolo_photofit.jpg and Image:Lo_Piccolo_arrest.jpg have been listed at Images and media for deletion. Please see the  (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry), if you are interested in it not being deleted. - Mafia Expert (talk) 13:41, 15 December 2007 (UTC)

the Black P Stone page
who wrote the page page on the Black P Stones? Whom ever did it, plagiarized and did not properly site the original author, Alex Alonso of StreetGangs.com. If you visit the page on the Black P Stones at http://www.streetgangs.com/bloods/bpsn.html you will see the information was taken word for word and four other sources are noted at the bottom of the page, omitting the true author, Alex Alonso.

What type of editors does wikipedia employ here? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.137.254.49 (talk) 08:44, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

Need to prove the Black Guerilla Family is a gang.
There is a difference between a revolutionary organization and a gang. The existence of an article on the Black Guerrilla Family, identifying them as a gang, is incredibly problematic, considering prison administrations identify political inmates as part of this group (as part of their prison gang validation strategy) and then confine them to segregation cells (SHU) indefinitely. The lack of citations, evidence, and scholarship in this article only continues this misidentification and contributes to the misery of such prisoners. What 'gang-related' activities do members of this 'gang' engage in? Where is the evidence?

Let's be a bit more responsible, no? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.234.15.167 (talk) 00:34, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

jones town
I have seen no mention of the us army sending in a company from Panama headed by a Capt. H.C.S. whose mission was to investigate an armed conflict within the town. they landed by air transport 3 miles from the settlement. capt. hcs deployed his men around the town then sent in a team to access the situation. the lieutenant name with held was so rattled at what he saw that he broke radio code and told the capt about the dead. the capt organized his company to complete a house by house search for combantants -- none were found. the located an 83 year old lady who was hidden under the bed. the cpt reported the crime scene, in two days was told to leave some soldiers for body detail and the rest of the company was ordered back to base in Panama. vv

Smuggling
Having been a observor of various cigarette smuggling events on a recent world tour - i note that the smuggling and cigarette smuggling and related articles could be considered part of this project rather than sociology say - any objections to adding these into the crime category tree? SatuSuro 15:53, 3 December 2009 (UTC)


 * That sounds like a common sense change. No objections from me. momo  ricks  23:46, 3 December 2009 (UTC)

Unfortuantely that might logically include drug smuggling as well - any problems with a rather rapid growing branch of the category tree? SatuSuro 09:23, 4 December 2009 (UTC)

OOps maybe this comment should be at the crime project talk page - it is confusing :( SatuSuro 11:37, 4 December 2009 (UTC)

I think I have sorted it out - the category is there - it just needs expanding by tagging appropriate articles and categories SatuSuro 12:03, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

Template merger proposal
See Template talk:Infobox mass murderer. Thanks! Plastikspork ―Œ (talk) 00:10, 8 December 2009 (UTC)

Eyes needed
An extra set of eyes are needed at Ted Bundy for opinions, etc. Wildhartlivie (talk) 01:44, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Portal:Biological warfare at peer review
A new portal Portal:Biological warfare is now up for portal peer review, the review page is at Portal peer review/Biological warfare/archive1. I put a bit of work into this and feedback would be appreciated prior to featured portal candidacy. Thank you for your time, Cirt (talk) 22:31, 24 December 2009 (UTC)

"Actively remove tangential "mentions" of article subjects from articles"
Hi. I've recently come to be aware of a conflict regarding a mention in a crime biography. I'm not familiar with this WikiProject, so I'm unable to say what you might precisely mean by the sentence I've cited in this section title. I've got a question about it. The article in question is Black Dahlia, the victim of a famous murder in California in 1947. There is a recent book by Lynda La Plante, and a television series, Above Suspicion (TV drama), which makes use of the murder as a plot device. Not having read the book or seen the series, it's not 100% clear to me the extent to which the actual murder was used in it. It seems to be more than a tangential mention, but less than some higher standard; i.e., it's not actually about the Black Dahlia murder, but its existence is based on a reference to that killing, and a copycat murder. I understand that the characters in La Plante's story discuss the Black Dahlia case and its possible relation to the case they're investigating. Anyway, the discussion at Talk:Black Dahlia is rather long and complicated, as well as a bit acrimonious. (There may be important points in that discussion that I've failed to mention here. That's because I'm only just getting to know the issues at hand.) This Project's goal of actively removing tangential mentions is cited in that discussion, and I think we could use input from more editors. Therefore, I request that anyone from this project who is interested take a look at this case and weigh in on whether the book and miniseries should be mentioned in our article. Thanks in advance. :) -GTBacchus(talk) 20:44, 10 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Actually, I think everyone at this project who is active has already weighed in at that discussion. I may be wrong, but I basically see those who ever reply here commenting at Talk:Black Dahlia. Just a point. Wildhartlivie (talk) 21:27, 10 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Huh. Maybe it would be helpful to ask over at WikiProject Biography? -GTBacchus(talk) 03:54, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Maybe, or at WP:FILM. They are usually willing to offer opinions. Wildhartlivie (talk) 04:21, 11 January 2010 (UTC)

Genre
Should articles related to crime fiction be part of this project? I first noticed that this project was added to the article on The Godfather.Andrzejbanas (talk) 03:43, 19 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the heads up, Andrzejbanas. No, this project handles true crime-related articles. momo  ricks  10:27, 19 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Got it. I'll remove it if I see it related to other fiction articles. Cheers. Andrzejbanas (talk) 19:16, 19 January 2010 (UTC)

WP 1.0 bot announcement
This message is being sent to each WikiProject that participates in the WP 1.0 assessment system. On Saturday, January 23, 2010, the WP 1.0 bot will be upgraded. Your project does not need to take any action, but the appearance of your project's summary table will change. The upgrade will make many new, optional features available to all WikiProjects. Additional information is available at the WP 1.0 project homepage. &mdash; Carl (CBM · talk) 03:11, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

Reassess Forced Prostitution article
Hey guys. A significant amount of work has been done to the Forced Prostitution article by me among others, is it possible for it to be re-assessed? Thanks. -- Eraserhead1 &lt;talk&gt; 10:19, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

Featured portal candidacy
I have nominated Portal:Biological warfare as a candidate for Featured portal status. Feel free to comment, at Wikipedia:Featured portal candidates/Portal:Biological warfare. Cirt (talk) 20:30, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

Sarah-Jane Hilliard
Please someone consider to write this article, they deleted this page without give me the possibility of arguing Di Natale Massimo (talk) 18:19, 16 February 2010 (UTC)

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1251201/Young-woman-cried-rape-sex-public-toilet-escapes-jail.html


 * Notability is disputed. Please join discussion, this is a very important case Di Natale Massimo (talk) 18:36, 16 February 2010 (UTC)
 * The page was deleted because an admin (and at least one other editor) considered it an attack page. However, it is likely that it cannot be recreated even if written neutrally.  See ONEEVENT to understand why.--otherlleft 19:01, 16 February 2010 (UTC)
 * It was considered an attack pages because first version containing the word "criminal". That's not an offence, it simply denotes a person convicted. Second version was "neutral" indeed, but they deleted the page without explanation Di Natale Massimo (talk) 19:41, 16 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Did you read the link I provided? Generally people who are in the news for a single event are not notable, so that overrides any questions of neutrality - unless she pulls the same stuff again with someone else I don't expect it will ever be appropriate to have an article about her here.--otherlleft 19:47, 16 February 2010 (UTC)
 * This is forum shopping, editor has raised this at ANI. The editor has also agreed the subject isn't notable. Dougweller (talk) 19:53, 16 February 2010 (UTC)
 * (EC) This has already been dealt with in your frivolous ANI report. Continuing to forum shop will not help. -- AnmaFinotera  (talk · contribs) 19:53, 16 February 2010 (UTC)

Murder of Jennifer Ertman and Elizabeth Peña
In regards to Murder of Jennifer Ertman and Elizabeth Peña - I found that two of the perpetrators, José Medellín and Derrick O'Brien, have their own articles. I think that Medellin and O'Brien should be merged into the murder article (there is a separate article about the Medellin court case in the U.S. Supreme Court) - What do you think? WhisperToMe (talk) 00:33, 7 March 2010 (UTC)

GA Review of Akmal Shaikh on hold
The GA review of the Akmal Shaikh article, which is tagged as being within the scope of this project, has been on hold for over 30 days. It is near to being passed, but the Akmal_Shaikh section needs editing to reduce the amount of direct quotation as per Quotations, and also to be trimmed in general to meet GA criteria 3(b): "stays focused on the topic without going into unnecessary detail". Any assistance in this matter would be appreciated. See Talk:Akmal Shaikh/GA1 for more detail. (If you feel that the article does not fall under the scope of this project, please remove the project tag from the article talkpage).  SilkTork  *YES! 10:35, 15 March 2010 (UTC)
 * The article has now passed.  SilkTork  *YES! 14:03, 19 March 2010 (UTC)

Missing crime topics
I've updated my list of missing topics related to crime - Skysmith (talk) 13:40, 8 April 2010 (UTC)

Request for copy editing
The article Murder of Marwa El-Sherbini is currently under review for FA. It has been suggested to copy edit it to 'fix grammar and punctuation problems'. If you are en experienced copy editor, please let me know if you would like to do this job. Many thanks! Mootros (talk) 08:31, 5 May 2010 (UTC)

Infobox
There's a proposal on Template talk:Infobox criminal to add a nationality field to the infobox. Any comments over there please. &mdash; Martin (MSGJ · talk) 11:58, 6 May 2010 (UTC)

2010 Times Square car bomb attempt
Hello. I was wondering if anyone might be interested in rating this article for importance to this wikiproject, as well as reviewing whether the rating (now C) is correct. Tx.--Epeefleche (talk) 14:43, 7 May 2010 (UTC)

Portal:Terrorism at peer review
A new portal Portal:Terrorism is now up for portal peer review, the review page is at Portal peer review/Terrorism/archive1. I put a bit of work into this and feedback would be appreciated prior to featured portal candidacy. Thank you for your time, -- Cirt (talk) 14:58, 17 May 2010 (UTC)

Recreational drug use
Google's private foundation is supporting expansions of the Swahili Wikipedia, Spanish Wikipedia, and Arabic Wikipedia. (See this announcement.) Forty medicine- or health-related articles, some of particular interest to developing countries, have been identified as targets. Basically, Google has offered to have these articles reviewed and professionally translated -- and we'd all rather that the translators were looking at a good, accurate, globally relevant article.

Recreational drug use, a topic that is within the scope of this project, has recently been reviewed by an outside expert, who suggested several freely accessible sources and some factual corrections. Please read the comments on the talk page and see whether you can help improve this article. Even small contributions are very much appreciated.

If you are interested in helping with the overall project, please consider adding WikiProject Medicine/Google Project to your watchlist, improving these articles, and/or contributing advice at the talk page. All editors are welcome. Thanks, WhatamIdoing (talk) 21:30, 17 May 2010 (UTC)

Featured portal candidate - Portal:Terrorism
This portal is currently being considered for Featured Portal status. Comments would be appreciated, at Wikipedia:Featured portal candidates/Portal:Terrorism. Thank you for your time, -- Cirt (talk) 01:10, 18 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Portal:Terrorism

Relevant AFD - Steve Eichel
Please see discussion, at Articles for deletion/Steve Eichel. Thank you for your time, -- Cirt (talk) 22:43, 18 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Steve Eichel

Fallen Officers
I've been pondering starting an article about fallen officers in the line of Duty, specifically, in Houston. During the creation of History of the Houston Police Department, I noticed there was a considerable amount of information of the various deaths, even the earliest ones. Before starting such a labor intensive project, I would like to seek some input and guidance as to the feasibility of such an article so it won't just get deleted because of WP:notable.--Hourick (talk) 14:10, 1 July 2010 (UTC)

Michael Brown Okinawa assault incident
nominated Michael Brown Okinawa assault incident for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Remove" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Ironholds (talk) 19:21, 1 July 2010 (UTC)

AFD for crime lord Necati Arabaci
Necati Arabaci crime lord in germany is under AFD Articles_for_deletion/Necati_Arabaci. Kasaalan (talk) 11:22, 10 July 2010 (UTC)

This project must define its scope more clearly
WikiProjects are supposed to have a section on the project page which details the project's scope, i.e. which articles belong and which do not belong to the project. With this project that is particularly important as being associated with this project is often considered controversial. Therefore I have added the scope section, however without any text. The definition of scope could also provide a few examples of borderline articles (biographies), on both sides (those who are included and those who are not). __meco (talk) 15:57, 25 July 2010 (UTC)

Assess?
If someone could assess Gerald Garson, a bio on a NY judge convicted of receiving bribes, that would be great. I've expanded it a great deal, and it is up for DYK as well. Tx.--Epeefleche (talk) 19:58, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

Category:Murderers of children
As I understand it, this category is for murderers who target children. But see, just one example of this IP adding it to articles on Muslim terrorists. He also changed the criteria for Mass murder, see. Am I wrong in my understanding of this category? Thanks. Dougweller (talk) 07:55, 28 July 2010 (UTC)
 * Mass murders might be murderers of children. --Luckymelon (talk) 21:30, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
 * But categories are intended as navigation aids. Our guidelines say "Categories should be useful for readers to find and navigate sets of related articles. They should be the categories under which readers would most likely look if they were not sure of where to find an article on a given subject. They should be based on essential, "defining" features of article subjects, such as nationality or notable profession (in the case of people), type of location or region (in the case of places), etc". If we broaden it to mean anyone whose victims incidentally included children, it becomes useless as a navigation aid. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dougweller (talk • contribs) 10:08, 9 September 2010 (UTC)

Sex offender laws in USA
An Austin Chronicle article discusses and takes a position on sex offender registries in the USA. WhisperToMe (talk) 08:11, 9 September 2010 (UTC)
 * Smith, Jordan. "Sex Offenders Exposed." Austin Chronicle. September 10, 2010. Retrieved on September 9, 2010.

Rodney King
Please see the section at Talk:Rodney_King about whether to include African American as King's ethnicity in the Person Infobox. --Steven J. Anderson (talk) 00:15, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

1886 in organized crime
FYI, 1886 in organized crime has been prodded for deletion. 76.66.200.95 (talk) 06:03, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

Lizzie Borden
Could someone or a bunch of someones please look at the Lizzie Borden article and some of the obstacles I've been running into at that article? I feel like I'm banging my head against the wall with a couple of others who have been working on the article and undoing changes that seem reasonable. One of the changes I've been making to the article is the use of first names rather than the standard set by the Manual of Style re: use of last names. If anyone could please take a look and do what they can as well as adding suggestions or changes it would be appreciated. Thank you. True Crime Reader (talk) 20:38, 16 October 2010 (UTC)


 * True Crime Reader, have you had any accounts prior to this one? Here, you say you've been here since July.  Are there any other accounts out there?  Any response would be greatly appreciated.  Thank you! Doc  talk  21:52, 16 October 2010 (UTC)


 * This is what I was getting at... Doc talk  22:06, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

RFC: Should there be a separate article called Targeted killing
Thank you for your time, -- Cirt (talk) 22:24, 23 October 2010 (UTC)
 * Ongoing Request for Comment, at Talk:Assassination.
 * New comments should go all the way to the bottom, below subsection, Discussion break.

Crime-related articles have been selected for the Wikipedia 0.8 release
Version 0.8 is a collection of Wikipedia articles selected by the Wikipedia 1.0 team for offline release on USB key, DVD and mobile phone. Articles were selected based on their assessed importance and quality, then article versions (revisionIDs) were chosen for trustworthiness (freedom from vandalism) using an adaptation of the WikiTrust algorithm.

We would like to ask you to review the Crime-related articles and revisionIDs we have chosen. Selected articles are marked with a diamond symbol (♦) to the right of each article, and this symbol links to the selected version of each article. If you believe we have included or excluded articles inappropriately, please contact us at Wikipedia talk:Version 0.8 with the details. You may wish to look at your WikiProject's articles with cleanup tags and try to improve any that need work; if you do, please give us the new revisionID at Wikipedia talk:Version 0.8. We would like to complete this consultation period by midnight UTC on Sunday, November 14th.

We have greatly streamlined the process since the Version 0.7 release, so we aim to have the collection ready for distribution by the end of November, 2010. As a result, we are planning to distribute the collection much more widely, while continuing to work with groups such as One Laptop per Child and Wikipedia for Schools to extend the reach of Wikipedia worldwide. Please help us, with your WikiProject's feedback!

If you have already provided feedback, we deeply appreciate it. For the Wikipedia 1.0 editorial team, SelectionBot 16:31, 6 November 2010 (UTC)

Nicolo Rizzuto
As Nick Rizzuto just died, I think it's a good time to improve his article, considering that alot more information in reliable sources should be showing up now, in the news. 76.66.203.138 (talk) 10:03, 11 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Rizzuto crime family could also due with some revision. 76.66.203.138 (talk) 10:42, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

Nomination of Werner Erhard vs. Columbia Broadcasting System for deletion
A discussion has begun about whether the article Werner Erhard vs. Columbia Broadcasting System, which is relevant to the subject of this WikiProject, should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Articles for deletion/Werner Erhard vs. Columbia Broadcasting System until a consensus is reached, and you are welcome to contribute to the discussion.

Thank you for your time, -- Cirt (talk) 18:34, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

Assassins
The usage of is up for discussion, see Talk:Hashshashin. 184.144.167.193 (talk) 05:12, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

Winston Moseley
I just swiped some hidden text on Kitty Genovese and added it to the Winston Moseley article. The article is currently a stub, but you can upgrade it with the text that was hidden. DanTD (talk) 21:22, 25 December 2010 (UTC)

Billy the Kid - top importance?
Is Billy the Kid really of top importance within the subject of crime ? //Blaxthos ( t / c ) 07:05, 29 December 2010 (UTC)


 * No I don't think so. -- Crohnie Gal  Talk  10:52, 29 December 2010 (UTC)

Essay about splitting and naming articles relating to crimes
I've done a userpage draft of an essay: User:FormerIP/Crime. Please take a look if you have time and feedback comments on the talkpage, good or bad.

I think the essay would be useful because it seems that any crime that is in the news gives rise to deletion discussions as editors create separate articles about victims, suspects etc.

Thanks! --FormerIP (talk) 19:44, 5 January 2011 (UTC)


 * Update: Following a comment received elsewhere, I've now posted an alternative proposal here: Wikipedia_talk:Notability_(people). Cheers. --FormerIP (talk) 20:01, 6 January 2011 (UTC)

Billy the Kid
There is discussion at Billy the Kid about merging and redirecting Ollie P. Roberts. Any input would be great.--Adam in MO Talk 08:50, 9 January 2011 (UTC)

New article: The Mystery of a Hansom Cab
New article, created, at The Mystery of a Hansom Cab. Additional assistance in research would be appreciated, feel free to help out at the article's talk page. Cheers, -- Cirt (talk) 13:43, 1 February 2011 (UTC)

John Gotti
There's another John Gotti biopic coming. It's still in preproduction, so if anyone's interested there's probably plenty of time to fix his article up in time for TFA on or around the film's release.

I couldn't find any collaboration suggestion section, so I figured I'd leave a message here. I've done a little work on it, but there's still a lot of information missing. --Lenin and McCarthy |  (Complain here) 21:57, 12 February 2011 (UTC)

New article: Firearms by assassination
I've noted online that there are plenty of questions on forums, answer websites, etc. as to specifically what firearms were used in various assassinations. A bit of a morbid topic, but seems a popular question and a valid issue to cover. Accordingly I've made Firearms by assassination. I'd appreciate any feedback on improving the format/layout, and any additions to the list. MatthewVanitas (talk) 03:30, 15 February 2011 (UTC)

Blog del Narco
It might help to see how to expand Blog del Narco, one of Mexico's most famous sites. It's now a big go to site for the Mexican Drug War. WhisperToMe (talk) 23:08, 19 February 2011 (UTC)

Wilbert Rideau content dispute
Please see Talk:Wilbert_Rideau - As there is a dispute over how much "weight" should be given to Billy Sinclair's role in Wilbert Rideau's life and career. WhisperToMe (talk) 14:33, 20 February 2011 (UTC)

CfD on fraud/fraudsters

 * Categories for discussion/Log/2011 February 20 -- of likely interest to people involved in this Wikiproject. Nomoskedasticity (talk) 08:46, 21 February 2011 (UTC)

New Article
Hey everyone. I started the article John F. Kennedy document hoax on a pretty interesting scandal from the late 90s, and would appreciate any help in improving it. There's quite a lot of sources available, so it shouldn't be too difficult to clean it up and improve it in general. Thanks so much!--Yaksar (let's chat) 08:48, 25 February 2011 (UTC)

A-Class reviews: commentators and volunteers
Dear project contributors,

I have been working on an A-Class review scheme for this project. Please see here: WikiProject Crime/Assessment/A-Class review. I would be delighted to hear your comments. It would be nice if in the end some olunteers could test the process and try to review some articles. Many thanks! I look forward to hearing from you. Mootros (talk) 22:19, 28 February 2011 (UTC)

PS: If you need some more background information about the project-intern A-Class quality review see here: Version 1.0 Editorial Team: A-Class Assessment. My own background in this project is, I have brought for example this article to GA status.

Why "Purple"?
I read that the reason why they were called the Purple Gang was because each of them always wore at least one purple accessory, so they could recognize one another. If this is true, it's important; if not, then there must be another explanation for the name of the gang. 4.154.249.66 (talk) 22:13, 8 March 2011 (UTC)

Talk:Chloroform
It was recommended I post here for input on the above discussion. Just wondering if anyone could come by and give us some thoughts and perhaps a suggestion or two on how to best cover this aspect and to what degree.--Crossmr (talk) 23:44, 31 March 2011 (UTC)

Murder vs homicide
I can't seem to find any discussion of this issue; if I've missed it, please direct me to the right place.

I've noticed that the word "murder" is used in categories (and in some articles) in a loose manner. Anyone who is killed by another person is categorized as a murder victim in some way. But the term "murder" has a specific legal meaning (at least in Canada, the U.S., the UK): it's the intentional killing of another person with malice aforethought (of different degrees). This definition presupposes that a perpetrator has been apprehended, charged, tried, and found guilty of murder (rather than, say, manslaughter).

In some instances the killer is never found (e.g. see Chuckie Mauk), or the killer cannot be brought to trial (e.g. see Phil Hartman). So these killings cannot properly be called "murder"; they should be called "homicide". I know Wikipedia is not a legal encyclopedia per se, but I do feel that this is a distinction that should be maintained. Characterizing a homicide as a "murder" seems also to carry a subjective weight that is discouraged by WP:NPOV.

I also realize that the "murder" categorization is used all over the place in thousands of articles. Perhaps one of the tasks within the Crime Project could be to scan through the articles categorized under "murder" and determine which ones don't belong. There could be new categories created for "homicide", and the "murder" categories would be subcategories. I've created Category:American homicide victims as a start. I'd be willing to work on it.

Any thoughts? ... disco spinster   talk  00:51, 6 April 2011 (UTC)

Grand Theft Auto
The usage of is under discussion, see Talk:Grand Theft Auto (series). 64.229.100.45 (talk) 06:19, 14 April 2011 (UTC)

Talk:Rape
Opinions are needed. A proper move/merge discussion would be best, though, to bring in the wider Wikipedia community on this. The discussion is about whether or not the articles should be merged/whether or not the Rape article should exist. Flyer22 (talk) 02:07, 17 April 2011 (UTC)

Purgatory Correctional Facility
Purgatory Correctional Facility was on this project's request list. I wrote an article and submitted it for DYK. It came back as being too short and also having some problems with the hook - about Warren Jeff's (which I'll correct). Now, one reason for its interest is obviously the name. I think ther could be a much better hook than I Purgatory Correctional Facility|wrote. I am asking members of this project to 1) try to find material to add to the article to make it longer, and 2) to make alternative suggestions on the DYK page for a better hook. Thanks in advance. Hope somemone reads this! Verne Equinox (talk) 22:18, 21 April 2011 (UTC)

Murder of Meredith Kercher
User:Wikid77 here (joined May 2006). Experienced editors are needed at article MoMK (Amanda Knox case; appeals re-trial underway November-July 2011) to expand details, explain convictions, and prepare for results of appeals trials, in a contentious editing environment where details have been suppressed for months. As you might know, WP founder Jimbo Wales (acting as an admin-editor) was asked in March 2011, by an outside forum with a 230-signature petition, to help investigate expansion of details and WP:NPOV neutral balance of text formerly based upon British tabloids and similar incorrect sources. Upon preliminary investigation, he discovered some editors had been blocked by admins for minor disputes, and 1 admin resigned and the other has backed away. Jimbo has consented to help, having read 3 or 4 books about the case, and to make suggestions for NPOV balance and WP:Reliable sources. Meanwhile, external forums have challenged that Jimbo's influence will fail to expand the article to explain convictions or reasons driving the appeals (or other details), based on the notion that "Wikipedia's structure is incapable" of allowing, even him, to overcome the censorship of the article and allow details. Currently, some 3 or 5 editors are still preventing expansion of the article (claiming WP:UNDUE details) to explain why the court(s) initially found 3 suspects guilty, and on what specific grounds the suspects filed appeals. There is a significant rejection of text based on WP:PRIMARY sources (2 trial summaries in Italian), even though most broad details have been mentioned in hundreds of news reports, as secondary sources supporting primary. However, much of the suppression of new text is based on claims of "needing to prove" that it is important (enough) to describe why the 3 suspects were judged guilty. Also, people are monthly taken to the WP:ANI noticeboard to seek indef topic bans against first-time editors of the article who become upset. Hence, this article needs experienced crime-article editors, who know the ropes of contentious battles, but would be willing to help Jimbo and others expand the article, perhaps starting 3 May 2011. If you wish to discuss privately, I can be emailed at Special:EmailUser/Wikid77. The MoMK article has become one of the Top 1000 most-read articles of 2011, so results will be read by over 1 million readers. It is the only crime article, so far, in the Top 1000. -Wikid77 (talk) 07:34, 27 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Caveat: This article has been somewhat of a contentious one: anyone who decides to participate there is advised to read the talk page rather than listen to the opinions of an amateur sleuth with a strong POV and a strange obsession with fruit juice, picking flowers and Harry Potter. pablo 12:13, 27 April 2011 (UTC)

Page move discussion
Please comment at Talk:Rod_Blagojevich_corruption_charges on moving Rod Blagojevich corruption charges → United States v. Blagojevich.--TonyTheTiger (T/C/BIO/WP:CHICAGO/WP:FOUR) 18:04, 27 April 2011 (UTC)

Kevin Foster (murderer)
Leader of Lords of Chaos has a Currently Active Appeal attempting to overturn his Death Sentence in favor of Life. I just put a bunch of stuff on his personal page (which has a number of flags up, btw) and would appreciate everyone's help in incorporating/expanding the info.

One of the flags is for Notability; numerous publications are listed on the LoC page, including novels and TV broadcasts. Another is citations, but all the stuff I put on Talk should cover that. Thanks in advance! VulpineLady (talk) 12:55, 16 May 2011 (UTC)

Jonathan King
There is currently a discussion about BLPs and Category:British people convicted of child sexual abuse. This discussion could have a far reaching impact on categorization of BLPs in the Category:Criminals cat. To weight in click here: Biographies of living persons/Noticeboard/Archive191.Lionel (talk) 21:39, 17 May 2011 (UTC)

Causes and correlates of crime
I'm not quite sure how to tackle the above-named article. I've expressed my concerns on the appropriate talk page but little discussion ensued and the issues weren't addressed. The topic is contentious but not, I think, in a way that would suffer in AfD. Anyway, all AfD can do is pronounce notability. And PRODding the article with my concerns may get little more reaction than a de-PROD. Tagging is an option, of course, but I believe the article needs to be dealt with more promptly than tagging would guarantee. The article's vagueness, its simplisticness and its predominant reliance on a single source make it far more contentious than it should be and thus a very poor representation of WP standards. Therefore, can others please have a look at the article and help decide how to tackle it. I'm no expert in crime so I have no idea how or whether the topic shuld be written. I've also placed this request at Talk:Crime. Thank you. LordVetinari (talk) 11:59, 19 May 2011 (UTC)

I have removed this request from Talk:Crime on grounds that it is in the wrong forum because that talk page is supposed to be about that article, and not a general noticeboard.James500 (talk) 21:53, 20 May 2011 (UTC)


 * Apologies. I only added it there too as aspects of the article seemed to be mergable to Crime and thus relevant. LordVetinari (talk) 08:32, 21 May 2011 (UTC)

Collaboration on US Supreme Court case article improvement
Wehwalt and myself will be collaborating together to improve the quality of this article. Others are welcome to help out with research, writing, and copyediting. :) -- Cirt (talk) 18:26, 15 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Nebraska Press Association v. Stuart

Proposed deletion of Status crime


The article Status crime has been proposed for deletion&#32; because of the following concern:
 * My research on Google did not show this expression being used this way, except for copies of this article. Instead it is used (in the USA) to refer to acts by a minor, such as running away from home, that would not be crimes for a person of adult status.

While all contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. The speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. BigJim707 (talk) 14:47, 17 June 2011 (UTC)

Talk:Casey Anthony: Own article or not?
A discussion is going on at the above linked talk page about whether or not Casey Anthony should get her own article outside of the case. Some of you may want to weigh in. Flyer22 (talk) 19:37, 7 July 2011 (UTC)

Created new article on US Supreme Court case = Time, Inc. v. Hill
I have created a new article on the U.S. Supreme Court case, Time, Inc. v. Hill. Feedback and especially help with additional research would be appreciated, at the new article's talk page. Cheers, &mdash; Cirt (talk) 00:17, 10 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Time, Inc. v. Hill

Asking for a FAR of the article Sharon Tate
I believe it no longer meets FA status and have nominated it for FAR. Per wiki rules, I am notifying all of the article's involved wiki projects. Crystal Clear x3 03:27, 22 July 2011 (UTC)

Criminal Hasan ali - Lots of clarification required
I am planning to write an article on Hasan Ali, a man convicted of a lot of crimes but found to be guilty of none. I will give a list later but for now i can only disclose that the man has been charged by Indian authorities for money laundering and allied charges. So please clarify the following

1. Can a person merely charged with many serious offenses on multiple occasions but found guilty of none be published on Wikipedia? 2. Should images be used on each info box?

Regards

Wikishagnik (talk) 01:10, 13 August 2011 (UTC)

Get tough on crime
, a redirect that currently points at Property is theft! has been nominated at Redirects for Discussion. It has been suggested that perhaps Wikipedia has/should have an article on either the phrase or underlying philosophy. As members of this project are likely more knoweldgeable about the subject area than most regular RfD participants, your comments are invited at Redirects for discussion/Log/2011 September 7. Thryduulf (talk) 23:08, 7 September 2011 (UTC)
 * As the person who nominated it for deletion, I'd greatly appreciate help; if you can write an article about it or redirect it to a good target, I'll be happy. Nyttend (talk) 01:10, 9 September 2011 (UTC)

Requested moves
I've requested the moves of Murder in English law and Homicide in Israeli law to Murder (English law) and Murder (Israeli law) or Homicide (Israeli law). Please contribute to the discussion at Talk:Murder in English law. Thryduulf (talk) 09:59, 18 October 2011 (UTC)

Proposal to Edit the 'Juvenile Delinquency in the US' Page
I propose to make edits to the current page titled ‘Juvenile Delinquency in the US’. Seeing as how important this issue is in America, I think the page is lacking a lot of important information. I plan to add the following sections: introduction to juvenile delinquency, recent statistics, the cradle to prison pipeline, and the juvenile justice debate, and preventing juvenile delinquency. It is very important to educate the Wikipedia world on this topic, and to show how much room there is for improvement. Showing the room for improvement, this page might have the ability of enacting social change and changing future generations of children for the better. I think that the editions I will make to the page are, clearly, largely related to crime and many issues associated with crime. I hope that these changes will make the content on crime that is out in Wikipedia more substantial and didactic. MariaNunez (talk) 04:01, 19 October 2011 (UTC)

Current event of importance
I created the stub article Philadelphia basement kidnapping event, which i think is evolving quickly into an important criminal event. I know my title is probably temporary. I have not written articles on current events before, and want to make sure this is well written.Mercurywoodrose (talk) 04:55, 20 October 2011 (UTC)

2007 Boston bomb scare is a GAN that needs work today
I'm the GA reviewer for this article. It's been on hold for over a week and I plan to fail it at the end of the day unless some editors take the initiative to implement the necessary improvements. Thus far, nobody has responded. AstroCog (talk) 15:25, 15 November 2011 (UTC)

Featured portal nominated for deletion
A Featured Portal related to this WikiProject, Portal:Biological warfare, has been nominated for deletion. Please see the discussion, at Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Biological warfare. Thank you for your time, &mdash; Cirt (talk) 04:12, 17 November 2011 (UTC)
 * Update: The discussion was closed as "Speedy Keep". &mdash; Cirt (talk) 05:06, 17 November 2011 (UTC)

Query
Hello. Does anyone of the full postal address of the prison in Russia where Mikhail Khodorkovsky is imprisoned ? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.154.229.117 (talk) 22:44, 10 December 2011 (UTC)

Query
Hello. Does anyone know of the full postal address of the prison in Russia where Mikhail Khodorkovsky is imprisoned ? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.154.229.117 (talk) 22:46, 10 December 2011 (UTC)

Notability of the protagonist in true small town crime stories
 This section was also posted at Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Law_Enforcement.

There is an AFD deletion discussion at Articles for deletion/Sean Hart. The discussion has wider implications. The more general quetion is if a small town cop who is so notable as to be the investigator in about 70 news stories is not considered notable, then how can information on such investigators be available to readers who might be interested in the information? A pre-trial crime story has three main human subjects, the criminal, the victim, and the investigator (who would be called "the protagonist" of the story if it were a detective novel or movie). These correspond to the three main actions reported on, the elements of the crime, the effects on the victim, and the investigation. Any criminal or victim in 70 news stories on 15 different topics would surely be notable. Why should articles about the protagonist investigator be treated at some impossibly higher notability standard? I propose that if the Sean Hart article is deleted for WP:NN, then the notability guideline be fixed so it does not happen again to the next notable small town cop. PPdd (talk) 18:26, 16 December 2011 (UTC) Detectives are not likely to be notable unless: Small town cops (speaking as a small town cop myself) are just not generally notable. -- Necrothesp (talk) 23:40, 18 December 2011 (UTC)
 * They held a reasonably high rank. Except in very exceptional circumstances, I would suggest that nobody of the rank of captain/chief inspector or below would be considered notable and even more senior officers would have to have a damn good reason to be notable. And;
 * They operated at a national level or in a very major sub-national jurisdiction (such as London or New York). And;
 * They were the lead investigator in major cases of national importance. And;
 * Their work was substantially covered in the national media.
 * and a few other reasons: a major book or film was made about them, they won a national-level award, they were president of a national organization.  DGG ( talk ) 05:30, 26 December 2011 (UTC)

Killing vs. "Honor killing" in six bio titles
There is a Requested move on Honor killing of Sadia Sheikh to change the title back to to Killing of Sadia Sheikh. Note the following articles also were changed recently to "honor" killing: Honor killing of Arash Ghorbani-Zarin, Honor killing of Hatun Sürücü, Honor killing of Fadime Sahindal, Honor killing of Samaira Nazir, Honor killing of Ghazala Khan. Various issues are raised, more diverse ones in subsection "Series of "Honor" killing moves. CarolMooreDC 17:08, 31 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Ok, just to clarify, Honor killing of Sadia Sheikh was the original title that was changed and reverted by the originator and there was a proper discussion on that talk page. However, the others were all changed to "Honor Killing" from some other title by User:Plot Spoiler and then contested and changed to "Killing of" by Kevin McE and reverted back by User:Plot Spoiler. I argue on those five remaining pages that since there is not consensus to move the titles to Honor Killing and there have been two dissenters, User:Plot Spoiler should return to the original name - whatever it was - until there is a proper Requested Move and consensus.
 * Note that responders were evenly divided on Honor killing of Sadia Sheikh, with about half thinking Killing or Murder was less problematic for a variety of reasons. So I don't think there would be a consensus to change to Honor Killing. Anyway, I really don't know how to move an article name that's been reverted a couple times already, so I'll leave it to those of you who do to do so if you think it is warranted. And those who deal with these issues more regularly to decide if it's worth proceeding. However, FYI, just doing a google search I found the kind of article that makes me feel there is an unnecessarily strong POV attached, here. CarolMooreDC 05:00, 3 January 2012 (UTC)

User page related to this project
The following user page may be of interest to this project: User:MadMax/Organized crime. Northamerica1000 (talk) 02:38, 2 February 2012 (UTC)

Jose Vargas
You are invited to join the discussion at Talk:Jose Antonio Vargas. RightCowLeftCoast (talk) 17:40, 1 March 2012 (UTC)

Trafficking of children
The central goal of WikiProject Crime is to improve the quality and quantity of Wikipedia articles related to crime. In the upcoming weeks, I plan to make significant edits and additions to the article Trafficking of children, subsequently adding it to this WikiProject. Trafficking of children has been internationally recognized as a severe violation of human rights and a criminal offense, and thus, its article is appropriately denoted as High Importance in WikiProject Human Rights. However, the current article is also listed as Start Class, and accordingly needs a significant amount of revision and expansion. Specifically, I plan to create several new sections concerning child trafficking mechanisms, prevalence, impacts, and solutions, while also focusing on several key international documents that address the criminality and legal consequences of this practice. As I move forward with my proposed editing plans, I would sincerely appreciate any feedback; I look forward to the continued opportunity to contribute to this project. Crr4 (talk) 23:10, 8 March 2012 (UTC)

Revision and Expansion of: Human trafficking in the United States
I plan on doing major edits to the page, Human trafficking in the United States. The page is currently written based primarily using newspapers as citations on trafficking that occurs in the United States. I plan replacing this information with scholarly research surrounding current and past debates about human trafficking in the United States. In discussing Human Trafficking, I hope to create a better definition of those being trafficked as they are presented in the scholarly works. In addition, I hope to elaborate on the different types of current legislation with regard to human trafficking and the debates surrounding the implementation of such legislation. I would appreciate any feedback about my proposed revisions. Specifically, please feel free to comment about any part of this topic you feel I might be missing, or comment on my user page if you would like hear about my revisions in more detail.

Cyoung530 (talk) 23:38, 8 March 2012 (UTC)

any information
is thier any information on charles sands? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.70.169.168 (talk) 19:14, 14 March 2012 (UTC)

Crime Classification Manual
Could members of the project help by giving some evidence for the notability of Crime Classification Manual and Index of criminology articles covered by the Crime Classification Manual please? Cusop Dingle (talk) 10:07, 18 March 2012 (UTC)

Organised Crime in the United States
Although there are articles that deal with organised crime in various U.S States, there isn't an article for the united states as a whole. Could anyone versed with the subject write such an article? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 117.219.145.231 (talk) 21:28, 27 March 2012 (UTC)
 * This surprised me as well. Indeed, organized crime is such a fertile field of interesting information, I was surprised that there was not a WikiProject devoted to it. TheRoyalMe (talk) 01:49, 21 May 2012 (UTC)

Please see here
Talk:Murder_of_Oksana_Makar Thanks! Mootros (talk) 13:10, 9 April 2012 (UTC)

Reevaluation of "Female homicides in Ciudad Juarez"
I recently edited the article Female homicides in Ciudad Juarez and would like to request a reevaluation of the article to be a part of WikiProject Crime. Thank you very much! Cnovoa17 (talk) 21:33, 21 April 2012 (UTC)

RfC at Correlates of crime
The input of members of this project is requested for and RfC about the title of the article Causes and correlates of crime/Correlates of crime. The question is whether that article should be called "Causes and Correlates of Crime" (and therefore treat statistical correlations and theories of causality together) or just be called "Correlates of Crime" (which better describes the current content of the article that does not provide any information at all about criminological theories of crime causation). Or should it have a different title all together?·ʍaunus·snunɐw· 21:20, 22 April 2012 (UTC)

Felon vs. Ex-Felon
Hi WikiProject Crime! I wanted to bring to your attention my discussion with User:LanternLight about the terms "felon" and "ex-felon." LanternLight has been replacing "ex-felon" with "felon," on the grounds that once convicted of a felony, one is always a felon. I feel that this term is unnecessarily negative and that ex-felon conveys more information. I feel as though these replacements should be undone, but I would like feedback from the community. See the discussion on LanternLight's page here. Thank you! groupuscule (talk) 16:46, 19 July 2012 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:Crimesincentury
Template:Crimesincentury has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. DH85868993 (talk) 06:26, 17 August 2012 (UTC)

Importance scale
I notice that this project has no importance scale. It would be helpful if somebody closely involved with the project would clarify what standards have been established for the importance of criminal biographies, articles on individual crimes, articles on crime novels, and other things. - Cal Engime (talk) 22:28, 24 August 2012 (UTC)

Good evening I am new to the project pages
Hi all, I have added my name and would like to participate in the crime biography projects but have no idea how to begin. I have recently began editing an article about an American murderer Michael Woodmansee who is still living, and have a question about an image. I would like to add an image of him and am wondering just how I go about that. There are a number of them on the web but of course I want to be sure I am not committing a copyright crime. How would I go about this? Is there a way to add requests to the tasks to be completed list? If so how does one do that as well? Any help would be appreciated. I am here to help so just point me in the right direction. I do enjoy mostly topics revolving around crime, prisons, history of, movies about etc. and have every intention on expanding the article about Woodmansee further. I am also wondering if the recent edits/expansions I have added to that article would step it up a notch above "stub" status so the template can be removed? Thanks so much and have a great week.  Ț ♥ ttØØd <font color="#10AD00">Ẅ ♥ itre§   04:24, 27 August 2012 (UTC)

Articles concerning criminal acts
Following a recent AFD debate and other concerns with "murder of" articles, I want to suggest establishing some clear guidelines on the issue of articles concerning murder and other criminal acts. Far too many "murder of" articles seem to appear here within a relatively short time of the event's occurrence, and the majority end up in the AFD pile where there is an endless debate about their notability. To this end, I've put together a draft essay on the subject based on current policy and comments made at the AFD, and would really appreciate some feedback. Please feel free to make any suggestions and/or changes to it you feel are appropriate. Cheers Paul MacDermott (talk) 11:48, 9 September 2012 (UTC)


 * To that topic, I'd appreciate some assistance in format/style/etc at Murder of Brandon Brown.--Paul McDonald (talk) 00:04, 13 October 2012 (UTC)

Merge involving Rolando Cruz case
Should Rolando Cruz case merge with Jeanine Nicarico murder case? Please comment at Talk:Rolando Cruz case. Ego White Tray (talk) 03:25, 16 October 2012 (UTC)

New article on novel Donkey Punch
I've created this new article. If you've got additional input for secondary sources, please feel free to suggest them at the article's talk page, I'd really appreciate it. :) Cheers, &mdash; Cirt (talk) 18:20, 22 October 2012 (UTC)
 * Donkey Punch (novel)

Missing persons cases cats
It might be useful to come up with a standard definition for usage of "missing persons" vs "murder victim" as an article cat. I have found several articles where the person in question was only "missing" until they were found dead a few days later (like Gemma McCluskie). Moreover, the definition in the article Missing person says A missing person is a person who has disappeared, and whose status as alive or dead cannot be confirmed as their location and fate is not believed known. Ergo, once they've been found, they're no longer missing. Now, I can see Etan Patz being in that category even though his murderer confessed decades later, but when only a few days have elapsed, "missing person" seems like an inappropriate category. MSJapan (talk) 19:39, 12 November 2012 (UTC)

Revisions to Walker Family Murders
As a result of new leads in the case, information and references have been added to the Walker family murders linking them to Perry and Hickock of "In Cold Blood" fame.

This addition may address the note on the page regarding general notability guidelines. Should this note now be removed?

Willjay (talk) 03:03, 6 December 2012 (UTC)

New Criminal Theory pages
Hey. So while patrolling the New Pages logs, I noticed that there were several new pages on criminal theory all from new accounts. I think this may have been a school assignment of some sort as they have some good content, just need to be touched up a little. Thought I should bring them to you all's attention. There may be more, these are the only ones I saw though. Deflagro (talk) 07:43, 6 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Serial Offender Hunting Patterns
 * Regulatory crime control
 * Crime Opportunity theory
 * Crime Concentration
 * Crime prevention theory

Murder committed by minors
I am not normally a wiki contributor, so am not sure what the protocol is for adding this information. I went to school with a kid who murdered one of our classmates when we were 16. Is there a standard for how notable a case must be to include it? Here is a link to some more information: http://www.teenkillers.org/index.php/juvenile-lifers/offenders-cases-state/individual-offender-profiles/colusa-county/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.193.188.131 (talk) 03:04, 17 December 2012 (UTC)

NRA article: Responses to mass shootings
To the National Rifle Association article, I've added a new subsection under Political activity titled Responses to mass shootings. Source is a New York Times article. Members of this Wikiproject may find this of interest; it could certainly be expanded upon (and had been, surprisingly, absent from the article). Discussion at Talk:National Rifle Association is here. --Middle 8 (talk) 07:39, 18 December 2012 (UTC)

Question regarding possible religious roots of Indecent exposure laws
Please see Talk:Indecent exposure and offer your responses. Thank you. John Carter (talk) 00:48, 28 January 2013 (UTC)

I just wanted to comment that the section on "Alternative Punishment" is mostly centered around the US and Canada (western world). It would be helpful if there were additions comparing the alternatives used world wide, such as Banishment, Flogging, other tortures, etc. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.5.183.23 (talk) 20:20, 31 January 2013 (UTC)

Issue with Racial hoax
A large block of text (76 kB)was deleted (citing WP:SYN and WP:INFO) which I reverted asking the IP to discuss it in Talk:Racial hoax first. I am not really up to the task of scrutinizing this. Would someone more knowledgeable take a look at it? It does seem likely that it should be removed. Thanks you Jim1138 (talk) 09:15, 3 February 2013 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Category:Property_damaged_by_arson
Category:Property damaged by arson and many of its subcats have been proposed for deletion at Categories_for_discussion/Log/2013_February_14. DexDor (talk) 07:33, 14 February 2013 (UTC)

Merge discussion for John Allen Muhammad
An article that you have been involved in editing, John Allen Muhammad, has been proposed for a merge with another article. If you are interested in the merge discussion, please participate by going, and adding your comments on the discussion page. Thank you. RightCowLeftCoast (talk) 14:49, 16 February 2013 (UTC)

Chandra Levy and Oscar Pistorius
I wonder if you can help improve these articles. Levy article has probably too many details and other issues, and Pistorius may qualify for this Project. --George Ho (talk) 18:23, 18 February 2013 (UTC)

AfD at Definitions of Pogrom
Hi everyone, we'd be grateful for your thoughts at Articles for deletion/Definitions of Pogrom. Oncenawhile (talk) 18:33, 4 March 2013 (UTC)

Acid throwing article revision
Hello everyone, I am a Rice University student who plans to revise the current Acid throwing article as part of a class assignment. As it now stands, the article is rated as C-class article that hasn't been evaluated for importance in WikiProject Crime. Acid throwing, though a recognized crime, severely lacks in legislative enforcement and persecution of perpetrators; amidst increasing rates of attacks, its relevance to WikiProject Crime is apparent. I hope to elevate both the importance and quality of this article by focusing on the various factors that perpetuate acid throwing through a nuanced, global perspective. In terms of the criminality aspect, I will expand upon the victims and perpetrators of such attacks, along with a more comprehensive coverage of laws, enforcement, and persecution relating to the act of acid throwing. Additionally, I will be discussing potential legislation and policies to combat this issue. I look forward to contributing to this WikiProject, and would greatly appreciate any comments/suggestions you have for my article revision. Thank you! Daniellam91 (talk) 02:53, 7 March 2013 (UTC)

Featured article candidate
The article about She Has a Name, a play about a criminal investigation, is a current featured article candidate. If you would be willing to review the article, your comments at the discussion would be greatly appreciated. Neelix (talk) 12:52, 10 March 2013 (UTC)

Swiss tourist rape in India
Do we have an article on the Swiss tourist rape in India? -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 23:47, 18 March 2013 (UTC)

St. Jerome helo escape?
Do we have an article on the Saint-Jerome helicopter prison escape? -- 65.92.180.137 (talk) 23:47, 18 March 2013 (UTC)

Move discussions
There are two current move discussions which might be of interest to this project: Talk:Brenda Ann Spencer and Talk:Cleveland School massacre. --MelanieN (talk) 01:24, 19 March 2013 (UTC)

Requesting an assessment
Could somebody from the project please assess the Murder of Sagar Sarowar and Meherun Runi? The Sagar-Runi murder case is said to have been one of the most "talked about" murders in Bangladesh in the last 25 years.Crtew (talk) 23:14, 7 April 2013 (UTC)

school stabbing?
Do we have an article on where a knife is used on a stabbing spree / mass stabbing instead of a gun (school shooting) ? should cover both, and bombings as well) -- 70.24.250.103 (talk) 06:13, 10 April 2013 (UTC)

Project template
Hi, I created a template for the project. WikiProject Organized Crime, but it is currently not working properly. Can you help me with it? Also, we will need a photo for this template, and the same for userbox. Thanks. :-) — <span style="font-family: monospace, monospace;">usernamekiran (talk)  21:13, 21 June 2017 (UTC)
 * I formatted the parameters for the template today. A photo may not be the way to go, because it may lend undue weight toward a particular topic. A project logo is the better way to go, in my opinion. North America1000 21:58, 23 June 2017 (UTC)
 * What kind of logo do you have in mind, and how would we create it? <b style="color:black">Vaseline</b><b style="color:lightgrey">eeeeeee</b>★★★ 22:52, 24 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Using an existent logo-type image would be easiest. Perhaps something from Category:Balanced scales of justice at Commons, such as the example below. I think this example would work out, as it's rather simple. North America1000 23:17, 24 June 2017 (UTC)


 * I don't know...I don't think it really fits. I like the abstract idea, but I still need to think. <b style="color:black">Vaseline</b><b style="color:lightgrey">eeeeeee</b>★★★ 02:16, 25 June 2017 (UTC)

We never agreed on the image for the userbox or the info box. <b style="color:black">Vaseline</b><b style="color:lightgrey">eeeeeee</b>★★★ 03:49, 26 June 2017 (UTC) — <span style="font-family: monospace, monospace;">usernamekiran (talk)  03:58, 26 June 2017 (UTC)
 * I saw it being used on the project and thought the image was decided through a consensus. I apologise. Please feel free to remove the image temporarily till another image is formally accepted. :-)
 * I really don't see how the scale relates. How about something like this? The image is free. I think it's a pretty cool silhouette, and the majority of organized crime involve weapons. <b style="color:black">Vaseline</b><b style="color:lightgrey">eeeeeee</b>★★★ 04:02, 26 June 2017 (UTC)
 * yup. I find it cool. But is wikipedia fine with using a firearm's photo? Also, I would prefer a tommy gun — <span style="font-family: monospace, monospace;">usernamekiran (talk)   04:25, 26 June 2017 (UTC)
 * i think the image is of tommy gun. But are you sure it is free for use? — <span style="font-family: monospace, monospace;">usernamekiran (talk)  04:32, 26 June 2017 (UTC)
 * I think so, on Google it's under "images for reuse and modification". <b style="color:black">Vaseline</b><b style="color:lightgrey">eeeeeee</b>★★★ 04:44, 26 June 2017 (UTC)
 * yup. It says "CC0 Public Domain, Free for commercial use, No attribution required". I will upload it to commons. — <span style="font-family: monospace, monospace;">usernamekiran (talk)  04:58, 26 June 2017 (UTC)


 * Done. — <span style="font-family: monospace, monospace;">usernamekiran (talk)  05:10, 26 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Organized crime includes terrorism and terrorist groups and organizations nowadays. As such, I'm uncomfortable using an image of a firearm as the project logo, particularly since a project image would be used on the project's banner that goes on article talk pages. North America1000 06:06, 26 June 2017 (UTC)

Categories for bot
erm... what does mean by recursive category? Can you give me an example please? I can start working on it then. — <span style="font-family: monospace, monospace;">usernamekiran (talk)  22:11, 29 June 2017 (UTC) I missed your ping. Sorry. — <span style="font-family: monospace, monospace;">usernamekiran (talk)  17:27, 1 July 2017 (UTC) — <span style="font-family: monospace, monospace;">usernamekiran (talk)  00:25, 5 July 2017 (UTC)
 * User:BU Rob13 meant that pages in subcategories and sub-subcategories of those will need to be listed separately, in one long list, and that the bot cannot go through the categories using a category tree. So, we have to list everything here manually. I'm trying to keep it in a sort of topical and/or alphabetical order. North America1000 22:16, 29 June 2017 (UTC)
 * I think I understood it now. I will start working on after 12 hours from now. :)
 * Yes, so basically, say Category A contains Category B which contains Category C. You want everything in the tree tagged. You would need to add each of Categories A, B, and C to your list of categories. This is to prevent mistakes. If you go deep enough down a category tree, there is almost always pages unrelated to the top category. ~ Rob 13 <sup style="margin-left:-1.0ex;">Talk 14:32, 4 July 2017 (UTC)
 * Understood. :)

Hi. I have started to work on Category:Organizations designated as terrorist in Asia‎, but I am going offline soon. I will be out of town for a few days (2-3 days I think, but the stay might increase). I will not have access to any computer during this period (but I might edit through phone). I will work on that particular category once I get back. Sorry for the inconvenience. Best, — <span style="font-family: monospace, monospace;">usernamekiran (talk)  21:04, 28 July 2017 (UTC)

A check is requested
Hi, I listed some categories for bot. special:diff/792166564. Would you please tell me if I did it correctly? If I did, then I continue the task in same manner. If there is something that needs to be changed/done differently, kindly let me know. — <span style="font-family: monospace, monospace;">usernamekiran (talk)  21:41, 24 July 2017 (UTC)
 * Looks good, and I noticed that you also included the relevant subcategories of initial subcategories. Yes, this is how to do it. North America1000 17:33, 27 July 2017 (UTC)

Talkpage banner addition using AWB
While the categories are being worked out I, [ <span style="font-family: monospace, monospace;">usernamekiran (talk)  ], am also adding the banner using AWB, in addition to sorting out the categories as originally discussed. So far, the banner has been added to the articles of following categories (excluding their subcategories):
 * Category:WikiProject Organized crime
 * Category:Mafia films

Entire categories
Following categories have been tagged with AWB's "recursive" option:


 * Category:Gangs: around 14,000 articles remaining. (tagging average:400 articles per day)