Talk:M.I.A. (rapper)/Archive 3

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Reputation?

Saturday Night Live routinely skewers her as a gun-toting psycho. I assumed that she had a long history of arrests, fights, and maybe alcohol/drugs, but I'm not getting that from reading this article. Does she or doesn't she?

If she is know for such an image -- deserved or undeserved -- shouldn't it feature prominently in the article? And shouldn't SNL be mentioned specifically?

Or am I totally confused here and they're satiring someone ELSE? 216.50.220.6 (talk) 11:03, 12 February 2012 (UTC)

/\/\/\Y/\

Can someone cr--Exander2009 (talk) 18:19, 20 August 2010 (UTC)eate an article page for the new album. I think there is enough information available to do so. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.55.67.188 (talk) 13:08, 12 May 2010 (UTC)

Someone has created the article at MAYA (M.I.A. album) - do people think this is the right title, or should it be at /\/\Y/\? Is the latter just a case of goofy typesetting........? -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 15:17, 21 May 2010 (UTC)
/\/\/\Y/\ already redirects to the article. As we don't use stylisations in article titles, this seems fine. 17:35, 8 August 2010 (UTC)
Hmm. The redirect does exist,[1] but I think the software can't deal with all those slashes in wikilinks. Fences&Windows 17:37, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

Maya Tour?.. can someone create an article for the new tour? thanks.. sources: http://pitchfork.com/news/39975-mia-announces-fall-tour/ http://www.rap-up.com/2010/09/08/mia-plots-north-american-fall-tour/ RainBell (talk) 04:43, 27 September 2010 (UTC)

Here are more sources:

http://dn.sapo.pt/inicio/artes/interior.aspx?content_id=1635264&seccao=M%FAsica, http://www.nme.com/news/mia/52398, http://www.contactmusic.com/news.nsf/story/mia-fears-new-york-shows-are-jinxed_1168416, http://www.demorgen.be/dm/nl/2590/Festivals/article/detail/1142549/2010/08/08/Meer-dan-120-000-bezoekers-op-Lokerse-Feesten.dhtml Possible suggestions for the article? Lifebonzza (talk) 11:28, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

Politics

For there not to be a Politics section is crazy. This revamping is cool enough, but dropping the Politics section is uncalled for since M.I.A. has been very political throughout her career. I am putting the section back up, minus anything that overplaps with these new sections. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Exander2009 (talk • contribs) 16:00, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

Your reason for having a politics section, because "she has been very political throughout her career" is insufficient. She has been alot of things throughout her career, to give WP:UNDUE weight to "Politics" by creating a massive section with random unconnected info in it i--Exander2009 (talk) 15:39, 23 August 2010 (UTC)s wrong, especially on an article of an individual who is NOT a politician. This fails WP:BLP. It, along with other themes are in their relevant general section. Lifebonzza (talk) 16:16, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

Also, I feel the Philanthropy, and even the Activism sections are too small, and should be included in the Politics section like before. --Exander2009 (talk) 18:32, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

It does not fail the BLP at all. I will get back to you on this later. Surely M.I.A.'s political happenings are as important or more important than her fashion. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Exander2009 (talk • contribs) 17:09, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

There are too many relevant quotes and there is too much politcs from M.I.A. to ignore. Lets work through this disagreement. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Exander2009 (talk • contribs) 17:19, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

I'm waiting for more opinions on this from other users. Where have her "politics" been ignored? We are not simply a collection of random irrelevant quotes, neither are we ultraspecific news aggregates of incidents you consider "political happenings." The article is encyclopaedic, and relevant info is included in the article under appropriate sections and described in a formal tone for a musician's article that do not fail WP:UNDUE and WP:BLP. Since you give no reason why info in these sections which you're happy with should just be repeated with random nonsense under "politics", ("Whatever you want to call it, this stuff should be up here. is not adequate) and why the policies are not being violated, this version suffices. [2]Lifebonzza (talk) 17:29, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

I fail to see how this section fails BLP. It looks well-sourced enough to me. It is, however, given undue weight. I would support a heavy trim of the section, particularly cutting out the extensive quoting. carl bunderson (talk) (contributions) 18:27, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

I am not against your personal work on this page either. I think a fashion page is relevant. THe picture is cool too. Without a doubt though, M.I.A. is one of the more political type people out there. Just take a look at the quotes, any article, or even the song, "I'm a Singer", by her. Denying her politics, and many of these quotes, would be a failure to her as an artist and person. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Exander2009 (talk • contribs) 20:02, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

You have put a lot of work into the page, and have been with it for quite a while, like me, so I am giving you respect on that. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Exander2009 (talk • contribs) 20:06, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

Wikipedia is not about personal contributions, but how together we can stick to policies to create articles that are fair and balanced. I agree with User:Carl.bunderson above that undue weight is given by the politics section and that it requires a heavy trimming. The extensive use of quotes, random and off topic failing WP:TONE among other policies would be a good place to start. Lifebonzza (talk) 22:33, 11 August 2010 (UTC)
How about I'll create a version based on what we have, put it in my sandbox, and you can see what you think? carl bunderson (talk) (contributions) 03:12, 12 August 2010 (UTC)
... ok , it's a start. I'll read your suggestion. :) Lifebonzza (talk) 07:52, 12 August 2010 (UTC)
Ok, I just tried making a version of the section. I cut out a lot, and it still wasn't very good. What's useful is already covered in Activism. I now support wholesale removal of the politics section. carl bunderson (talk) (contributions) 17:15, 18 August 2010 (UTC)
I've read your suggestion, thanks for trying. I agree with you that what is useful is already covered, and that for the reasons listed, the politics section should be removed wholesale. Lifebonzza (talk) 19:11, 18 August 2010 (UTC)
Done. carl bunderson (talk) (contributions) 19:31, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

I wholeheartedly disagree with the decision to remove a "Politics" section. You talked about policy, and it is Wikipedia biography policy to include quotes whenever possible. The section has stood for years. M.I.A. is one of the most political people out there. I am putting it back, it's just too much of her own words cut out.

There is no support for having the section in the article. It needs to be removed. Where does BLP say we should include quotes whenever possible? carl bunderson (talk) (contributions) 19:28, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

M.I.A.'s own words should be included with the Politics section. An activism section here, with just a few author's opinion's, not M.I.A's own, is not enough. The activism section branches off from activism into politics within the section itself. Sometimes, the best source of information on a person, is the actual person themself. It creates the an un-biased and uninterested tone to include the voice of the person being discussed. The reader makes their own conclusions this way, instead of the intereseted tone of someone else. I am not saying the secondary sources should be denied, but denying M.I.A.'s voice, especially in this situation, is denying the most reliable and pertinent source. There is ample support for having a Politics section. M.I.A. introduces her latest album discussing Government. What could be more political?--Exander2009 (talk) 18:20, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

"Sometimes, the best source of information on a person, is the actual person themself. It creates the an un-biased and uninterested tone to include the voice of the person being discussed. The reader makes their own conclusions this way, instead of the intereseted tone of someone else." This is completely off. The person themself has too much interest in how they are portrayed to be objective. This is why we have policies regarding conflict-of-interest. Quotations from a BLP should be limited and subordinated to secondary, reliable sources. Including the voice of the person being discussed actually introduces bias and a voice over-interested in the subject. There is not "ample support" for having a politics section. One relatively new user who edits only M.I.A. topics and an anon who completely disregards WP policy hardly constitutes "ample support". carl bunderson (talk) (contributions) 19:48, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

The quotations I include ARE from secondary sources, like Rolling Stone. The, "My approach to Politics is the I never said I'm smart" quote is included, in BOLD in the middle of an August article in Rolling Stone. MIA has started concerts with political speeches. Her 2008 concerts started with a political speech from aa Japanese politician, check it out on youtube. She started her Coachella concert from behind a podium for goodness sake. And take a look at this quote from Rolling Stone: "M.I.A. uses politics like Madonna uses sex, as part of her art, something that's supposed to make you move, not think." And you're saying there should not be a politics section? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Exander2009 (talk • contribs) 19:57, 19 August 2010 (UTC) In fact, I thnk I will put that up there. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Exander2009 (talk • contribs) 19:59, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

I don't doubt the truth of the quotes, but their usefulness to the article. Just because a RS quotes M.I.A. doesn't mean we need to include her own words in the article. Again, where does BLP say we should include quotes whenever possible? carl bunderson (talk) (contributions) 20:05, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

BLP says we should include reliable sources with an unbiased tone. Using quotes is not biased if its from the one being biographied and its not slanted. Politics is extremely relevant. How many examples do you need? She's practically political by birth, because of her father, and on top of it she has it in her music and quotes. Have you listened to the latest album? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Exander2009 (talk • contribs) 20:11, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

An expample for you is "The Message" off the new album. Listen to that. Case and point right there. I majored in political science, and it does not take a political scientist to know that she is political. She's political by definition. She's a walking, talking example of Global Politics in action. Getting the information from a few opinionated writers in the activism section is not enough, and is more against BLP than anything else. Its proper to hear what she has to say about the whole thing too. For God's sake if there is a fashion section there should be a Politics section. A few paragraphs in the activism section is just insufficient right now for how political she is.

Case and point, the activism uses it main source as a book from 2006! A lot of Maya material since then. That was before Kala even. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Exander2009 (talk • contribs) 20:26, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

Also, the first source in the activism section is from Rolling Stone itself. That bio source was written BEOFORE the new album came out, and even before Kala. The Politics section stays for sure.

I looked at this objectively, even agreeing with you at first. But the section is just not salvageable. What needs to be covered by it is already covered. carl bunderson (talk) (contributions) 23:07, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
This consensus has been reached, with only you Exander2009 insisting on returning this collection of quotes you've picked up, and your refusal to cooperate does neither you or this page any favours. WP:Good faith has been assumed repeatedly with you. Once again, I agree with User:Carl.bunderson and will support any further action that needs to be undertaken. Lifebonzza (talk) 00:07, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

I do have good faith, and I assume good faith in others. I do not agree that not having a politics section serves the biography well, and having just a few opinions in the activism section is not enough in my opinion. It seems no ammount of examples proves the need for it. It is a shame to not have enough quotes from the actual artist. Wikipedia also has the idea of including information above excluding it. I think excluding this ammount of information is a disservice. With an artist this political, having so liitle information from so few places in an activism section is not adequate. And on a side note, these pictures are really cool, but it looks like one of them messes up the format, any way to fix that? --Exander2009 (talk) 18:14, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

I am looking at the article, and really feeling something is missing. Why are you against the quotations. I'll continue to work on this. Not enough time has been given, not enough repsonders to make a consensus on whether ot not to have the section. For exerpimental sake, I will let the section be vacant for ahile to see what happens, I feel its absence will soon prove its need.

This is just not ideal, I really see the need for the section, or at least the information. Do you have any constructive input on where this information could actually be included? Or maybe where some of it be inncluded. That sure is a lot to delete. We are relying on just a few paragraphs for one of her biggest topics, her politics.

We definitely need more time and more users input. --Exander2009 (talk) 18:12, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

The "Born Free" bit in the activism is itself out of place, and should be in a politics section since that is not really activism in the truest sense. Again, I see the need for the section for this and the preceeding reasons.--Exander2009 (talk) 18:19, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

I will let the section go for a while and see what happens. Until then I see the need for her response to an interview qeustion regarding some censorship of her material. I will include it at the end of the lyrics section for now. --Exander2009 (talk) 18:27, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

Once again I repeat what carl bunderson has said. There is NO support for a politics section on this article. The section's presence is not your decision alone to make. Your edits on wikipedia revolve entirely around keeping this section of quotes on this article. All useful info is now covered in appropriate sections. By your logic, we should have a comedy section on her article because she has lyrics that are funny on all of her albums! Refrain from edit warring and adding sections that have been agreed to be removed, or further action may have to be taken against you.Lifebonzza (talk) 18:43, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
I reverted this edit because the URL provided as a source is no longer functioning. carl bunderson (talk) (contributions) 18:45, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
And I have requested that a few other editors, whose judgement I would trust and who have edited this page recently, comment on this thread. I agree that the input of additional users would be beneficial. carl bunderson (talk) (contributions) 18:45, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

Just becuase information does not have a source does not mean it should be pulled. Wikipedia talks about using information as opposed to not using it. That was an active link than became broken I believe. Who made Lifebonzza president of this article, that's what it feels like.?--Exander2009 (talk) 15:39, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

M.I.A. commented on the formula for the War on Terror through her art during the Bush administration. This article now fails to address that adequately. Exander2009 (talk) 15:44, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

Lifebonnza is really coming at me personally and it is undfounded, and makes me question his motives for editing. He accuses me of warring, questioning faith, and the type of editing I do. I don't deserve this, can other people watch this editor please? Carl, thanks for being a third eye on this at least. Exander2009 (talk) 15:50, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

Speaking as an editor unfamiliar with the content dispute or what the Politics section used to contain, I would say that MIA's political beliefs are a significant aspect of her notability, and deserve comparable coverage at least for example with her activism, art and film pursuits, and philanthropy (all of which get dedicated [sub-]sections). Given the controversy surrounding the topic (and around the coverage of it), it could be difficult to develop a neutral section, but that does not absolve us of the responsibility for doings so. The appropriate weight and tone given to the issue could be divined from recent profiles such as this from The Guardian. Another option would be to combine the "Activism" and "Philanthropy" sections with the politics material to create a more integrated/synthetic view of her stances and actions. Hope this is of some help, Skomorokh 11:12, 26 August 2010 (UTC)

I highly recommend reading what the politics section contained, you'll see there was nothing in it that isn't already contained in subsections like Activism and Philanthropy that you rightly state are notable and deserve their sections coverage. It would be helpful if you could list with reliable sources what outside of what's included you feel would be appropriate in a politics section, without failing WP:UNDUE and WP:Tone. I supported User:Carl.bunderson's attempts to do just this before he agreed it was pointless in creating such a section and decided to support its removal wholesale. Thank you for your input user:Skomorokh, look forward to you reply. :) Lifebonzza (talk) 12:43, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
I just want to reiterate, my points and questions in this discussion were not intended to question Exander's good faith edits and neither were they personal. They were made in good faith as I'm sure were his edits but the latter were not in line with policy and were affecting the article's structure. I think the right consensus was reached in the end, and hope he is successful in whatever he choses to do :) Lifebonzza (talk) 21:27, 15 January 2012 (UTC)

Sections

I'd be fine with putting the paragraph of philanthropy in the activism section. I can't discern a difference between them. carl bunderson (talk) (contributions) 16:11, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

Hmmm, usually Philanthropy is listed as a separate section in BLPs. I don't think her charity work should come under activism having read the article for it on wiki..... Lifebonzza (talk) 17:00, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

This is why I supported a Politics section, which would include both Activism and Philanthropy. I guess leave it until more people chime in. Exander2009 (talk) 18:08, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

Yes, surely M.I.A.'s continued political expression should be formerly acknowledged.

Tamil Name

Why does the Tamil name seem to get messed up every other edi?--Exander2009 (talk) 22:33, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

Internet

Well I looked into it and there is a whole article about whether or not Internet is capitalized. Internet capitalization conventions So, either way is fine with me. The dictionary has it capitalized though. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Exander2008 (talk • contribs) 20:36, 7 September 2010 (UTC) --Exander2008 (talk) 20:39, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

Piracy Funds Terrorism?

Current version of this article downplays the release of Piracy Funds Terrorism. The Piracy release was integral to the launching of her career, as was her relationship to co-producer Diplo. These details were more prominent in earlier versions of this article and I' wondering why. Morganfitzp (talk) 22:16, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

Good point. I also think Diplo should be mentioned more, as the producer of songs like "Paper Planes". --Exander2008 (talk) 16:04, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

There was a part in the article describing M.I.A. meeting Diplo. I may look for it and reinsert it in the article as long as there are references. I will put it in Earl Career. --Exander2008 (talk) 16:14, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

Its removal I gather was due to WP:UNDUE, but yes her mixtape Piracy, while popular in certain underground music circles, was mixed by Diplo and helped them both in their careers. His name could appear with that mixtape mention, however the other articles are there for such purposes - listing collaborators. I'm including their former personal relationship, since that appears to be in a few sources. The article is quite long already. As for their meeting, its merger into his article was discussed here.[3]. Although you've pointed this out here, the mixtape was mentioned. The launching of her music career and her international popularity with singles "Galang", "Sunshowers" and "Fire Fire," described in sources such as this and this is detailed accordingly. :) Lifebonzza (talk) 19:22, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

Why would people not want to mention Diplo, probably her biggest producer, who helped produce Paper Planes? --Headphones99 (talk) 15:22, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

Genre

Why is "avant-garde" listed? This is a little ridiculous, I think. Epigrammed (talk) 22:30, 9 March 2011 (UTC)

It looks like Lifebonzza added that. Since you (Epigrammed) raise this as questionable, I am deleting it for the time being. Lifebonzza is welcome to justify the statement here so that we can reach a consensus. Axl ¤ [Talk] 10:50, 10 March 2011 (UTC)
Here's a source [4]. I don't think the article loses out by stating the obvious here.... Lifebonzza (talk) 21:43, 11 March 2011 (UTC)
That reference states, "Akin to albums by the similarly avant-garde artist Björk, each track on /\/\/\Y/\, no matter how different, is unmistakably the work of M.I.A." I'll invite Epigrammed to comment. Axl ¤ [Talk] 09:50, 12 March 2011 (UTC)
The reference is already included in the article so I figured I'd just readd this description in. There has been no reply from Epigrammed for a week.Lifebonzza (talk) 20:25, 18 March 2011 (UTC)
Hmm, this seems to be an ongoing issue. I have invited the most recent IP editor to comment here. Axl ¤ [Talk] 09:47, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
In view of the absence of comment from Epigrammed and the IP editor, I am adding "avant-garde" back to the list. Axl ¤ [Talk] 08:22, 1 April 2011 (UTC)
Avant-garde is not a genre, it is a description of the artist not the artwork. An avant-garde artist is experimental and pushes boundaries. I'm removing it.--Khajidha (talk) 18:48, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

NYT article

The NYT profile, despite its controversy, shed some interesting light on the subject here. You could question its neutrality, but I do not see how it could be interpreted as "original research". Besides, it seems weird that you mention the controversy of the article without citing the actual source. I would appreciate a discussion before you remove the reference. - Artoasis (talk) 06:28, 18 March 2011 (UTC)

Hi. It's precisely because, as you note, its neutrality can be questioned that it cannot be used to cite any information on our article which is why it was removed. I understand you're inclusion of it here was in good faith, you felt that because the wiki article mentions the controversy, it would help to include the magazine article, but our article here isn't a collection of sources. I agree that one read of the nyt mag article demonstrates its controversial nature, and on the outset, it would appear reasonable to cite information on its controversial nature here with the actual source. Since the cite's content doesn't address the controversy (the way the other sources [5], [6] do, even if it has a correction), it would rather just stand as the offending piece and so its inclusion would constitute original research when used in this way as well as violate policy that state questionable sources should not be included at all on WP:BLP biography pages.Lifebonzza (talk) 20:23, 18 March 2011 (UTC)
Well, my argument would be something like this. If you mention the controversy at all, the readers' first reaction would be to look up that piece. Actually that's exactly what I did when I read that part. As long as this wikipedia article is not based on that NYT piece, its neutrality should not be a problem here, especially as a reference to assist the readers. I don't want to start some kind of edit war by re-adding it. But I changed the order of the references to make it easier for readers. - Artoasis (talk) 13:32, 19 March 2011 (UTC)
Thank you for reordering the references. I agree that the neutrality of the wiki article won't be a problem so long as it isn't based on that piece. But seeing as policy states its better not to use such a source at all in a wiki bio, I agree it's better without it here altogether.Lifebonzza (talk) 21:11, 19 March 2011 (UTC)

M.I.A.'s parents' religion

There seems to be a minor edit war rergarding M.I.A.'s parents' religion. Is it Hindu or Christian? Axl ¤ [Talk] 08:26, 1 April 2011 (UTC)

Hi, I'm pretty sure M.I.A.'s mother is Catholic and her maternal grandmother was Hindu [7]. Not sure about her father. Lifebonzza (talk) 00:06, 10 April 2011 (UTC)

123.231.81.65 (talk) 23:29, 24 April 2011 (UTC) Namaste. I know for a fact that both of M.I.A's parents are Hindu Tamils.

Can you point out a reliable source please? Axl ¤ [Talk] 12:41, 25 April 2011 (UTC)
And also, just because her parents are doesn't mean she is. It's highly doubtful she's a practicing Hindu anyway. The Blue Elephant God probably doesn't appreciate rap. >D --Nutthida (talk) 01:18, 6 February 2012 (UTC)

Disambig Line Added to Opening Because M.I.A. (with periods added after each initial) Does Not Redirect

Hence the disambiguation line added at the top, as per Wikipedia policy.

75.71.193.232 (talk) 21:41, 13 April 2011 (UTC)

Mia, M.I.A, Mia (disambiguation), M.I.A., etc, not of them redirect here, none, addding that line is unneeded, useless, absurd and a waste of space. Tbhotch* ۩ ۞ 23:02, 13 April 2011 (UTC)

m.i.a. (lower case) only redirects here.

And many people search lower-case. Therefore the redirect belongs at the top of the article.

75.71.193.232 (talk) 06:50, 14 April 2011 (UTC)

I agree with User:Tbhotch. The line is redundant and has been removed for good reason. If readers are here, it's because they wish to read about this subject. Lifebonzza (talk) 14:57, 14 April 2011 (UTC)

If anyone searches on Wikipedia for "m.i.a." lower case (not upper case, lower-case search) it only comes here.

This cuts out "Missing in action" (m.i.a.) searches (soldiers missing in wartime). This hurts the families of these soldiers.

Many people search lower-case only and if they do m.i.a. (with periods) it ONLY comes here.

Therefore the disambig line does belong on this article. The artist (subject of this article) had to deal with War and I'm sure she would not want families of Missing in Action soldiers to have their article unsearchable (lower case, which many people do). Fortunately Wikipedia has a solution-- the disambiguation line added at the top of articles is standard Wikipedia practice to solve this problem.

A little sensitivity and flexibility are in order here. There is no hardship on this article by having a disambig link at the top so that military families with missing loved ones can have their article searchable too.

Telemachus.forward (talk) 17:07, 14 April 2011 (UTC)

Someone fixed it, the (lowercase) "m.i.a." no longer redirects here (although it did as recently as last night).

However my solution would have been better, as it allowed this (artist) article to search more easily (with lower case "m.i.a." searches).

Out of consideration for the article on the artist (this one) I rearranged the disambig page so that "Musicians" (and this article) under "MIA" are more visible.

This is also in line with Wikipedia policy as I moved the MIA "musicians" list (which is all real people) above the list for "Fictional" uses of the name.

Wikipedia prioritizes real people over fictitious film and literature characters in that regard.

Best,

Telemachus.forward (talk) 18:17, 14 April 2011 (UTC)

What is this even supposed to mean?

M.I.A.'s attempts to provoke are both lauded and questioned, with her complete control of her output noted by Harpers & Queen in 2005 as the primary reason for her success.

This sentence is as clear as mud to me. I'd edit it but I have no idea what the intent even is. "her complete control of her output...[is] the primary reason for her success". What? The reason for her success is she determines what her output is? What does that mean? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.201.111.155 (talk) 04:49, 1 May 2011 (UTC)

I've read this again, and it does appear confusing in the context of the text overall. Until it can be better phrased, I've edited it out....Lifebonzza (talk) 21:36, 15 January 2012 (UTC)

TERRORIST

There is facts supporting that she`s father is a well known terrorist, i think this should be addressed in this article--85.228.166.25 (talk) 19:24, 2 May 2011 (UTC)

Can you point out a reliable source please? Axl ¤ [Talk] 09:43, 4 May 2011 (UTC)
Most certainly can. I am adding a separate section titles terror links as there are lots of accusations from reliable sources. --203.167.243.169 (talk) 02:43, 5 May 2011 (UTC)

Request

To add her in The Rock's homecoming on his birthday a few days ago.66.108.211.43 (talk) 03:20, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

Is there a reliable source for this? If you can find one, cool, but I don't think it fits in overall on a summary bio article... Lifebonzza (talk) 21:27, 15 January 2012 (UTC)

Genocide of Tamils by Sri Lanka

Ive added more info on her condemnation of genocide of Tamils in Sri Lanka to the article, feel free to add more if you find more sources on this..... Lifebonzza (talk) 19:46, 17 January 2012 (UTC)

(artist) --> (singer) please

the article title M.I.A. (artist) is confusing. it seems like there is a visual artist named M.I.A. Could the explainer please be changed to (singer) or (rapper) or something less confusing. Thanks. Cramyourspam (talk) 04:23, 6 February 2012 (UTC)

Unless there is another visual artist who goes by M.I.A. that I'm unaware of, they are one and the same person. The M.I.A. who this article is about was first known as a visual artist, and was nominated for the alternative turner in 2001. She started making music afterwards. This article goes into quite a bit of depth on this if you're confused. 92.236.117.111 (talk) 20:33, 7 February 2012 (UTC)

Superbowl, 2012

Arulpragasam generated controversy during the 2012 Super Bowl. She raised her middle finger while mouthing “I don’t give a shit." (1) The gesture occurred during the performance of Madonna's "Give Me All Your Luvin". (2)

NBC commented on the gesture noting, "Our system was late to obscure the inappropriate gesture and we apologize to our viewers." (3)

Some have compared the gesture to the Janet Jackson wardrobe malfunction during Super Bowl XXXVIII. (4) The Parents Television Council noted, "“NBC fumbled and the NFL lied because a performer known as M.I.A. felt it necessary to flip off millions of families. It is unfortunate that a spectacular sporting event was overshadowed once again by broadcasting the selfish acts of a desperate performer."

(1) Source: http://www.suntimes.com/entertainment/music/10468101-421/apologies-from-nfl-nba-after-mia-flips-bird.html (2) Source: http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/story?id=15521243#.TzAHNMhPaSo (3) Source: http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/mia-middle-finger-super-bowl-nbc-287200 (4) Source: http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/nationnow/2012/02/super-bowl-fallout-will-mia-middle-finger-draw-fcc-fine-.html (5) http://www.parentstv.org/PTC/news/release/2012/0206.asp

It's already in the article. --Nutthida (talk) 17:36, 6 February 2012 (UTC)

MIA made an obscene gesture during her performance at the Super Bowl,2012. Was this an attempt to upstage Madonna? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.166.152.254 (talk) 09:26, 6 February 2012 (UTC)

Probably. Maybe. It's in the article now anyway --Nutthida (talk) 15:14, 6 February 2012 (UTC)
A mention of the performance is in the article. Heres another source "You'd be forgiven for not having a coronary over the fact MIA gave Super Bowl viewers the finger during her half-time guest spot with Madonna. For most fans, it was probably more shocking to see MIA performing a rehearsed dance routine than flipping the bird. And besides, it was more than 35 years ago that Sex Pistols went on British television and called host Bill Grundy a "fucking rotter"...America secretly loves whipping itself up into a frenzy over this sort of thing, but it wasn't just the rightwing press expressing outrage – even Pitchfork was in on the act. "In the few bars Madonna was kind enough to grant her during the biggest television event of the year, MIA's message to America was simply, 'Fuck you'" it complained, somewhat innacurately (surely the message was "I don't give a shit", otherwise she'd have just said "fuck you"). It went on to conclude that: "It wouldn't be the worst idea [for MIA] to draw as much focus as possible back on to her music." Yes, because the Super Bowl half-time show has always been about the music.''[8]
and this:
"British singer/rapper/activist/what-have-you MIA has caused a bit of a kerfuffle with her appearance at the Super Bowl. Performing alongside Madonna during the half-time show, the star ended her brief verse of the song Give Me All Your Luvin' by flashing her middle finger at the camera, and thus at an estimated 111 million viewers. The gesture prompted the NFL and broadcaster NBC to issue swift apologies, although early signs are that the forbidden finger won't cause quite as much hilariously disproportionate opprobrium as Janet Jackson's wardrobe malfunction did at the 2004 Super Bowl.

In this Olympic year, it's a shame that MIA didn't do her bit for traditional British culture by opting for the V-sign instead of the finger, but her choice of gesture isn't surprising."[9]

Source [10] - The sight of Nicki Minaj and M.I.A. side by side, pom-poms in hand is one thing; M.I.A. so briefly, so slyly raising up her middle finger to the camera is something we might cherish forever. She shimmied convincingly, better than we'd ever imagined (we're more used to her making the two-finger gun than powering down yardage with pom-poms), so during the halftime show, we were torn between amusement and confusion. This is M.I.A., she whose name brings to mind the sound of change and gunshots. And she who rapped alongside Jay-Z and Kanye onstage nine-months pregnant, as the most swaggery pregnant woman there might ever exist. And now she’s on stage with Madonna, rah-rah-ing. And then she slipped us that beautiful middle finger and everything in the world was right again. It was so brief, so quick, a wink — and exactly what we needed during a show where the only competition for our attention was that tight-rope performer" [11]
adrenaline and nerves?
The most important artist of the aughts played the Super Bowl last night. Maybe you saw it. In the middle of Madonna’s set, Maya Arulpragasam—professionally known as M.I.A.—performed her part in the new Madonna song, “Give Me All You Luvin’.” In the original video, she ends her kind of meh verse by saying “I’ma say this once—yeah, I don’t give a shit.” Also in the video, she makes the “finger gun” hand signal, synced to a gunshot that references her biggest hit, “Paper Planes.” Last night, she flipped America the bird, rather than a gun. Cue apologies and hand wringing.As reported by Todd Martens and Patrick Kevin Day on the Los Angeles Times Web site, the NFL, NBC, and M.I.A. have all apologized. Tim Winter of the Parents Television Council, whose job is to get mad, got mad about this “offensive material.” So we have two subjects: the incident and the artist. The outrage is tiresome and deeply hypocritical, in all the tiresome ways you’ve been tired out by before. M.I.A. was illustrating her line, acting out the attitude of the words: performing. Fine, it may not be legal to flip the bird on television, but that’s simply a remnant of the fifties we haven’t shaken. Unless somebody was handing out Xanax with the foam fingers, Lucas Oil Stadium was ringing with the music of profanities last night. More to the point, television viewers were submitted to ad after ad that likened women—negatively—to sofas, cars, and candy. Mr. Winter didn’t have anything to say about that, so I’d like to raise both of my middle fingers to him and anyone who thinks profanity is somehow more harmful to our children than images of violence and misogyny. (My two sons, fourteen and eleven, thought the Fiat ad was corny, so I guess they will be safe without Mr. Winter’s intervention.) I say we get out of The Pretending To Be Moral game altogether and use the Internet for important things like posting pictures of cats looking at croissants and PDFs of sensitive government documents. [12]
another source on the performance, [13] however I agree with Nutthida, the current mention of this performance in the article appears more than enough.Lifebonzza (talk) 20:06, 6 February 2012 (UTC)

Designation as a "Desi" Artist

Are those who identify as Tamil (and, therefore, indigenous) really Desi? If she self-identifies as Desi, that would be sufficient. Does M.I.A. identify as Desi? Or is this a bit like calling Aboriginal Australians "African-Americans"?

184.187.164.52 (talk) 17:33, 8 February 2012 (UTC)

her parents are Hindu and of Sri Lankan Tamil descent

Hindu= religion Hindi= language and ethnic group Isn't it??? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 61.215.194.29 (talk) 04:14, 9 February 2012 (UTC)

Encyclopedia style for names

Hello. The subject of this article is named Mathangi Arulpragasam, but the article calls her 'M.I.A.' in several places. 'M.I.A.' is her chosen stage name, but proper encyclopedic style should be to use her last name to refer to her in the text. Compare articles about Mixed Martial Arts fighters -- they are properly described by their last names rather than by their chosen nick-names. Or compare the article on 50 cent, which correctly refers to him by his last name 'Jackson'. Accordingly I think that general references to the subject in the text should be changed from 'M.I.A.' to 'Arulpragasam'. 174.91.146.116 (talk) 03:06, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

Not done: Please establish a consensus before making a request with that broad of a scope. Thanks, Celestra (talk) 17:18, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

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Hip Hop with no hyphen or hip-hop with hyphen?

Webster's online dictionary spells hip-hop with a hyphen while the Wikipedia article does not have a hyphen. The Vibe History of hip hop does not use a hyphen in it's writing. I prefer to use the hyphen. Though I will leave it out here. Honestly, I think it should have a hyphen though. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Headphones99 (talk • contribs) 06:09, 7 April 2012 (UTC)

new rave and grindie

I'd like to add both these genres as I say they both reflect her style --84.13.85.148 (talk) 15:36, 7 January 2013 (UTC)

Problem with archiving

How come the first talk page goes to the third archive? and how come the third archive isnt listed above? have the pages been moved to the wrong place or something? Can someone check how the talk pages have been archived and if its correct because its quite confusing? 83.157.3.32 (talk) 13:11, 27 January 2013 (UTC)

Removing the Mangino's "To Congo, To Colombo, can’t stereotype my thing yo:” M.I.A.’s Politics of Difference

Because it is an undergraduate thesis, and the majority of the claims put forward are not supported by any historical investigation or discussion into MIA career and whatever quoted by it are supported by articles already cited, would it be not be wise to remove this source and substitute citations to links of the articles and replace references with quotes from the articles themselves? 198.84.235.35 (talk) 20:52, 27 March 2013 (UTC)

Media section

Balance can be tricky. Lynn Hirschberg has been characterized as writing a hit-piece on MIA, but the section, with extended, over-defensive quote by Rob Horning reads like a hit-piece on Lynn Hirschberg. Her article is described as "attempting to portray the musician as politically naive and hypocritical through implication" without giving any quotes or inkling of what was said. The quotes "Hirschberg "has been a sell-out all along" and accusation of "character assassination and ad hominem attacks" indicate a bias rather than a neutral point of view. Please improve this section. Tehw1k1 (talk) 04:08, 30 April 2013 (UTC)

Article title (artist)

Per WP:CRITERIA shouldn't this be either (musician) or (recording artist)? In ictu oculi (talk) 02:33, 7 September 2013 (UTC)

Roland Sintos Coloma Postcolonial Challenges in Education 2009 Page 178 "CHAPTER 11 Border Crossing with M.I A. and Transnational Girlhood Studies - Lisa Weems Rolling Stone magazine named Kala, the sophomore production of Sri Lankan British hip-hop artist M.I.A., its 2007 Album of the Year."

As above (hip hop artist) would be better per WP:CRITERIA since "(artist)" is generally used for visual artists in en.wp. In ictu oculi (talk) 06:41, 8 September 2013 (UTC)

MIA's Ethnicity & Notability (@ User: Kww)

Hi Kww. I'm very convinced that the edit I proposed is more suitable. You bring up that her ethnicity holds no weight to her notability, citing MOS:BIO like myself. Almost everything about her as an artist, from her name MIA, to all of her work, in music and in visual arts, have to deal with her ethnic background. Her creativity, her struggles, her appearance!, all stems from her ethnic background. Retrospector87 (talk) 23:18, 10 September 2013 (UTC)

Is there a suitable source that states that? Axl ¤ [Talk] 11:19, 12 September 2013 (UTC)
Sure. To start with, her artist name is a play of her real Sri-Lankan/Tamil name, Maya Arulpragasam, as introduced in the article intro paragraph and treated as common knowledge (that is, it's not cited). And just to give one example, her debut album's title, Arular, is an explicit reference to her father's rebel code name as a founding member of the EROS, the Ealem Revolutionary Organization of Students, a sort of junior version of Sri Lanka's infamous Liberation Tigers of Tamil Ealem. The album's content itself touches directly to this reference, with much controversy (http://web.archive.org/web/20090416192026/http://www.cbc.ca/arts/music/mia.html: "Tigress Beat"). There's countless more sources that state her ethnic background's important to her work and notability, past and present, but that would just be me spoon-feeding material that may otherwise be independently researched. Retrospector87 (talk) 18:32, 12 September 2013 (UTC)

Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the proposal was moved. --BDD (talk) 23:42, 27 September 2013 (UTC)

M.I.A. (artist) → M.I.A. (rapper) – or M.I.A. (singer) per WP:CRITERIA (singer) (rapper) (musician) but not (artist). "The rapper M.I.A." seems to be ahead of (singer) per both Google Books "rapper M.I.A." vs Google Books "singer M.I.A" and plain Google "rapper M.I.A." per newspapers Huffington Post, Daily Mail etc. In ictu oculi (talk) 11:46, 19 September 2013 (UTC)

  • Support. "Artist" alone as a disambiguator generally suggests a visual artist, and while M.I.A. is one, it's not what she's primarily known for. Our article on Jerry Garcia, for example, calls him a "musician" in the lead even though the article also discusses his career as a visual artist. 168.12.253.66 (talk) 16:31, 19 September 2013 (UTC)
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the proposal. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

contact with her father prior to release of Arular

Regarding this bit: Prior to the release of the first album, which Arulpragasam had named after her father, Arular emailed her: "I am proud of you but you must change the title. Love, Dad. [citation needed] Maya chose not to change the album title." My understanding was that her father contacted her only after the release of the album, as a direct result of its publicity, and thats the way I've seen in presented in a recent article (sorry no time to find it). Certainly, the above can still be true, given pre-release exposure of the album (which might also explain why she couldn't change the album name). 00:33, 22 November 2013 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Yugyug (talk • contribs)

List of Nominations

I notice that among her list of 'unprecedented' nominations is one for the "Alternative Turner Prize". This is a spoof event and not really a proper prize as such.... Should be edited out really.... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.191.68.161 (talk) 10:11, 18 December 2012 (UTC)

I agree. There is, as such, no official Alternative Turner Prize. And it's rather a goof prize, even though the people it nominates are generally serious artists. Accordingly, the sentence:

She is the only artist in history to be nominated for an Academy Award, Grammy Award, Brit Award, Mercury Prize and Alternative Turner Prize

is rather dubious. She is "the first to win A, B, C, D, X" prizes, where X is an obscure joke prize. It's like the claim "Buzz Aldrin is the first person to: walk on the moon, and do so with a size EEEE shoe." I'm removing it. For similar reasons, it seems strained to say:

first artist of Asian descent to be nominated for an Academy and Grammy Award in the same year

If we narrow our specifications finely enough we can find "firsts" in a lot of places; I don't think this "first" warrants inclusion.--Petzl (talk) 08:59, 22 November 2013 (UTC)

M.I.A. Birthday

Birthday needs to be changed to July 18, 1975. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.36.199.224 (talk) 03:51, 25 April 2014 (UTC)

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Mauritius

That is where Mauritius is. They are all full-fat, monoracial, pure, whole, and/or 100% Afro-Asian! --174.109.221.236 (talk) 23:06, 24 September 2016 (UTC)

genres

is it too much to add worldbeat to her genres? its a pretty integral description of her sound, more than indietronica for sureà — Preceding unsigned comment added by 150.108.238.41 (talk) 18:48, 1 November 2013 (UTC)

should rap also be a genre to consider adding her to ? — Preceding unsigned comment added by G erika (talk • contribs) 03:56, 25 February 2017 (UTC)

ethnic background in the lead

This isn't standard for musicians. She's not the only musician with a political agenda related to their ethnic background. Unless there is some reason for her ethnic background being so much more notable than all the other musicians who sing about political issues, there is no reason for it to be in the lead. Spacecowboy420 (talk) 09:01, 16 November 2015 (UTC)

Wikipedia doesn't have a one-size fits all policy. The fact that other musicians' ethnicities aren't included in the lead does not prevent it from being included in this article. The lead is meant to summarise the article. The article contains a very large section on MIA's activism but none of this is mentioned in the lead.--obi2canibetalk contr 16:08, 21 November 2015 (UTC)
Then perhaps we can also mention the claims of her being a terrorist sympathizer in the lead as well? I personally don't think the lead is the place for a musician's political agenda, but if it's going to be there, it should be balanced. Spacecowboy420 (talk) 07:51, 23 November 2015 (UTC)
Ethnicity should not be in the lead unless it is relevant to the subject's notability. In this case most sources that you will find refer to her Sri Lankan origin. In this case I would deem it relevant. Karst (talk) 07:39, 20 May 2017 (UTC)

Length of this entry

This entry seems to be absurdly long and over-detailed. It reads more like the product of an obsessed fan (or egomaniac artist) than a pop singer. For context, it's just slightly shorter than the entry for Nelson Mandela. 62.253.71.89 (talk) 16:03, 26 January 2016 (UTC)

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M.I.A. explicitly countering claims made on Wikipedia

In a recent interview she counters the claim that appeared on her Wikipedia page about the estate where she grew up. I checked the sources and there was an article where one official claimed the estate wasn't racist followed by a resident who stated that it was. There was nothing from M.I.A. herself. However, M.I.A. in a recent interview countered the claim. It seemed appropriate to revise that section and use YouTube of her interview as a reference. Another Wikipedian seemed to disagree so I will leave it to this talk page. Cheers. — Preceding unsigned comment added by IoniCkWar (talk • contribs) 22:02, 21 June 2017 (UTC)

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Pronounced as distinct initials

This needs stating in lead https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c7v5ZReiqZI In ictu oculi (talk) 12:54, 12 January 2018 (UTC)

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