Talk:Biangbiang noodles

Number of stokes
I make it 45 strokes- is that right? Whatever the right number is, it would be nice to mention it. HenryFlower 12:08, 20 July 2006 (UTC)
 * I thought it was 57! Discuss it at Commons:Image talk:Biáng-order.gif.  Silversmith  Hewwo 12:18, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

That 45 should have been 54- still not the same, but closer. I dropped some on the ma and the changs. ;( HenryFlower 12:31, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

Biang didn't make it into Unicode 5. :-( 81.236.185.9 16:03, 12 August 2006 (UTC)

It didn't make it?! I'm so disappointed...but is this really the most complicated character? What about "Dragons moving?" (In Japanese thats pretty complicated...) Anyway, maybe I'll learn bing2 just for fun.. --Charizardpal 23:27, 17 April 2007 (UTC)


 * It has been submitted (not yet accepted) to the IRG for Extension D. Extension C is next, which will be post Unicode 5.1. Bendono 08:12, 11 June 2007 (UTC)


 * I think you are referring to U+9F98 龘 . However, there is the more complicated U+2A6A5 𪚥 as well. While does have more strokes (64), it is much simpler to write due to the repetition than biáng. It means "many words" (due to the many strokes). Bendono 13:05, 11 June 2007 (UTC)


 * How about taito/daito? 84 strokes.  — Ecw.Technoid.Dweeb  | contributions | talk | ☮✌☮ 18:26, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

Mnemonic
The Mnemonic seems to missing the knife (刀) radical on the right, no? Jbradfor 01:37, 30 July 2007 (UTC)


 * No. At least, the current version mentions "a hook at the right to hang sesame candies".--Emma li mk (talk) 13:13, 26 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Good, it was added. If you look at the earlier version (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Biang_biang_noodles&oldid=142580053), it was missing.  Although I'm not sure why the Mnemonic uses hook (釣) rather than knife (刀), but at least it's close. Jbradfor (talk) 18:32, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

Unicode
Did this character get added into Unicode? --Voidvector (talk) 21:52, 25 November 2007 (UTC)


 * No, not yet. As I wrote above, it is part of Extension D which is still being finalized by the IRG. Expected completion is sometime in 2008, but then it needs to go through formal balloting etc. which will delay it even longer. Expect Extension C first. Bendono (talk) 01:03, 26 November 2007 (UTC)


 * It is in this report. Marked as UTC00791, noted as "Submitted for Extension E". It doesn't have a codepoint assignment yet. --Voidvector (talk) 23:32, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

Image?
Erm, why are there two identical images? One says stroke order, are there supposed to be numbers? Kleptosquirrel (talk) 00:54, 18 October 2010 (UTC)


 * File:Biáng-order complete.gif is an animated GIF, but it contains 608×538×58 = 18,972,032 total pixels, and with the current Wikimedia parameters, images with more than 12,500,000 will not be displayed as animated when resized as thumbnails... AnonMoos (talk) 10:59, 9 November 2011 (UTC)

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Wrong stroke order in animation
According to this post 穴 → 言 → 幺（L） → 幺（R） → 長（L） → 長（R） → 馬 → 心 → 月 → 刂 → 辶 --Backinstadiums (talk) 09:24, 31 October 2018 (UTC)

Removed text
CC-BY-SA declaration; text in this section removed from the article by me because it is miles off-topic; in an article about a food item, a short section about the etymology of the name is acceptable but we don't need an extended section about it. Per WP:WEIGHT and WP:COATRACK essays (yes, I know essays are not policy but they do make sense). If the subject is notable, it should be spun off into its own article, say Etymology of biangbiang noodles. I'm leaving it here in case its removal breaks any references.  Baffle☿gab  00:43, 3 September 2020 (UTC)

Chinese character for biáng


There are many variations of the character for biáng, but the most widely accepted version is made up of 58 strokes in its traditional form (42 in simplified Chinese), and the Chinese character for biáng is one of the most complex Chinese characters in modern usage, although the character is not found in modern dictionaries or even in the Kangxi dictionary.

The character is composed of 言 (speak; 7 strokes) in the middle flanked by 幺 (tiny; 2×3 strokes) on both sides. Below it, 馬 (horse; 10 strokes) is similarly flanked by 長 (grow; 2×8 strokes). This central block itself is surrounded by 月 (moon; 4 strokes) to the left, 心 (heart; 4 strokes) below, and刂 (knife; 2 strokes) to the right. These in turn are surrounded by a second layer of characters, namely 穴 (cave; 5 strokes) on the top and 辶 (walk; 4 strokes ) curving around the left and bottom.

Computer entry and phonetic substitution
Both the traditional and simplified Chinese characters for biáng were encoded in Unicode, on March 20, 2020, for Unicode 13.0.0. The code point is U+30EDE for the traditional form (𰻞) and U+30EDD for the simplified form (𰻝).

Until that point, there were no standardized ways of entering or representing them on computers. Both traditional and simplified forms had been submitted to the Ideographic Rapporteur Group for inclusion in CJK Unified Ideographs Extension G. As the characters are not widely available on computers (and not supported by many fonts), images of the characters, phonetic substitutes like  or , as well as the pinyin, are often used instead.

The character is described by the following ideographic description sequences (IDSs):

⿺辶⿳穴⿰月⿰⿲⿱幺長⿱言馬⿱幺長刂心 (traditional)

⿺辶⿳穴⿰月⿰⿲⿱幺长⿱言马⿱幺长刂心 (simplified)

In Adobe's Source Han Sans and Source Han Serif font these IDS sequences do not display as IDS sequences, but display the actual glyphs for the character.

Unicode
After the discussion with Lee Collins through emails, John Jenkins has submitted an application of "" since 2006. However, its IDS is too long at that time and "radical 心 (heart)" is missed in this character shape. It can be moved into the meeting WS 2015 lastly.

At this time, Ming Fan submitted an application to Unicode Consortium. After that, in the meeting WS 2015, the traditional character has a code "UTC-00791" while the code of its simplified character is "UTC-01312".

However, the evidence for this character does not fully match the character shape. For UTC-00791, "radical 刂 (knife)" has disappeared from the dictionary which is used as evidence. For UTC-01312, "radical 刂 (knife)" has swapped into "radical 戈 (dagger-axe)" in the academic paper which is used as evidence. Members of the Unicode Consortium argued for the character shape. Moreover, Toshiya Suzuki suggested for adding a new block "CJK Complex Ideographic Symbols", set "" as a basic shape, unify the variation and even admit "" as a variant form of this character.

At last, the traditional and simplified forms of the character were added to Unicode version 13.0 in March 2020. The characters are located in the CJK Unified Ideographs Extension G block in the newly-allocated Tertiary Ideographic Plane. The corresponding Unicode characters are:
 * Traditional: U+30EDE 𰻞
 * Simplified: U+30EDD 𰻝

Mnemonics
There are a number of mnemonics used by Shaanxi residents to aid recall of how the character is written.

One version runs as follows:

Note that the first two lines probably refer to the character 宀 (roof), building it up systematically as a point and a line (river) with two bends.

Origin of the character
The origins of the biangbiang noodles and the character biáng are unclear. In one version of the story, the character biáng was invented by the Qin Dynasty Premier Li Si. However, since the character is not found in the Kangxi Dictionary, it may have been created much later than the time of Li Si. Similar characters were found used by Tiandihui.

In the 2007 season of the TVB show The Web, the show's producers tried to find the origin of the character by contacting university professors, but they could not verify the Li Si story or the origin of the character. It was concluded that the character was invented by a noodle shop.

One hypothesis is that there was no such character or meaning for this word in the beginning, and the word actually came from the sound people make from chewing the noodles, "biang biang biang".

A legend about a student fabricating a character for the noodle to get out of a biangbiang noodle bill also is a commonly-believed hypothesis about the origin of the character.

According to an article on China Daily, the word "biang" actually refers to the sound made by the chef when he creates the noodles by pulling the dough and slapping it on the table.

Variants
Seventeen variants of the Traditional character for biáng, having between 56 and 70 strokes:



Is this an article about the Chinese character of about the noodles?
The text about the Chinese character is by far longer than the information about the dish itself, which is restricted merely to the introduction. It does not make any sense. If the character is so fascinating I suggest moving all this info to a proper article referenced in this article. Lironcareto (talk) 15:44, 24 April 2021 (UTC)


 * The character is a gimmick which has brought the noodles much more publicity than they probably otherwise would have had. I don't see any real reason to separate the two... AnonMoos (talk) 16:05, 24 April 2021 (UTC)

Nothing

 * ) 60.50.195.112 (talk) 09:52, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the. —Community Tech bot (talk) 05:07, 3 April 2022 (UTC)
 * Biáng-order(complete).gif

Biáng-suzuki2.svg [Biang character with monkey inside]
Is everyone just ignoring the document's April 1 submission date or? Fish bowl (talk) 21:42, 4 April 2022 (UTC)


 * Lol, that does look like an April fools'. It also references this Wikipedia article, so even if it isn't, we possibly can't use it because of WP:CIRCULAR. — Jthistle38 (talk) 22:14, 7 April 2022 (UTC)

Description
The article mentions the noodles are ‘long and belt-like’, but not such basic properties as their average dimensions or even what they are made of. At least according to Japanese Wikipedia, they’re made of wheat flour with added water and salt, and can reach as long as 1 metre. Are there English-language sources that can verify this? שונרא (talk) 20:36, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

Link to “nonce word”?
Since the biáng character (or in fact syllable) is not used anywhere else in Chinese, I think it’s a hanzi equivalent of a nonce word and a link to that article should be added in “See also”. 122.213.236.124 (talk) 09:44, 4 January 2024 (UTC)