Talk:Jaundice

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment
This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 11 May 2020 and 5 June 2020. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Taglel.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 01:08, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

Modifying Organization
Hi! I am a new wiki editor and would love to get advice from more experienced editors. I felt like this article is really hard to understand due to a general lack of logical flow, poor organization, excess medical jargon, superfluous/repetitive information. Thus, I would love to know your thoughts on some changes I plan to make on this article.

Firstly, I would like to improve the flow and organization as follows: Definition (including summary of article), Etiology (including risk factors, triggers, genetics, virology, etc.), Pathophysiology, Clinical Signs & Symptoms, Diagnostics (subheadings: imaging, labs), Treatment, Prevention, Prognosis, Complications, Epidemiology (Incidence, prevalence, etc.), Special Populations (Neonates), Historical Significance (early discoveries, historical figures, etc.), References.

Secondly, I would like to add more current literature/references.

I plan to work on this article for the next few weeks, so it will definitely be a work in progress. Thanks in advance for your input.Taglel (talk) 19:18, 15 May 2020 (UTC)

This article
Does not explain very well what the actual cause of jaundice is. It starts trailing off like my biology teacher and doesn't conclude or simplify the information. I went to another website and I understand instantly the cause of jaundice. IMPROOOOVEE!!! Also, under symptoms it doesn't actually give a symptom. It just rambles on about jaundice eye's in poetry. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.13.65.217 (talk) 17:42, 1 December 2009 (UTC)

Jaundice
Is there any information available on jaundice treatment? 68.55.216.197 02:14, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

I wonder if the article should explain what happens if jaundice is not treated. Is a baby's life in danger if it is not treated for jaundice (assuming the jaundice does not go away by itself)? Saleem ready discussed: "With high doses of bilirubin (severe hyperbilirubinemia) there can be a complication known as kernicterus. This is the chief reason for neonatal jaundice to be treated. The effects of kernicterus range from fever, seizures, and a high-pitched crying to mental retardation." David Ruben Talk 00:57, 1 March 2006 (UTC)


 * That section appears to have disappeared. Could we have it back? --Puellanivis 22:01, 2 October 2006 (UTC)


 * I believe it moved to Neonatal jaundice, no?--Steven Fruitsmaak (Reply) 12:22, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Who is the idiot that keeps changing Pre-hepatic urine color to light? Lets do an experiement. Go to Africa, get malaria, and go to the bathroom and tell me if your urine is light. It's not. Any hemolytic anemia is going to increase your unconjugated bilirubin and your liver will conjugate the bilirubin to increase the conjugated bilirubin which will go into your intestines, be broken down by bacteria to urobilinogen and oxidized to urobilin and then reabsorbed and put into the urine. If you have more, you will reabsorb more and your urine will be darker. I even put a reference. You guys at wiki. Sometimes. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mastac741 (talk • contribs) 15:37, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

Popular reference
The pop culture reference was not helpful. I removed it to give the aritcle a boost of credibililty. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.62.130.213 (talk • contribs) 05:44, 17 April 2006

There really should be the symptoms and treatments available.82.128.11.179 16:16, 1 February 2007 (UTC) Tolulope Ogunbiyi

The article is referenced to a "dictionary of cliches." That can't be right!!70.116.136.85 22:57, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

Bryanton's Triangle
"Patients often complain of severe itching or "pruritus". Often, only Bryanton's triangle will remain unscratched. Bryanton's triangle is a single triangle of skin on the patient's back that the patient is unable to reach, and therefore scratch. It varies in size depending on the flexibility of the patient, and occasionally presents as a diamond in lower BMI patients."

I looked this up on Google, and while it appears that there is no such thing as a "Bryanton's Triangle" there is something called "Bryant's Triangle" which isn't located anywhere on the back. Although the description they give sounds reasonable, whatever it is, it is not "Bryanton's Triangle". 75.120.169.120 (talk) 18:38, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

what is hepatitis A,B and C? --202.164.149.30 (talk) 06:44, 21 December 2007 (UTC)
 * If only there were such a thing as an instantly searchable online encyclopaedia, eh? 87.114.25.228 (talk) 14:31, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Include information on how hyperbilirubinemia causes intrinsic staining of the teeth —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.6.224.2 (talk) 20:25, 8 January 2008 (UTC)

Lab tests
The table is good, but do you think we should add other tests in to determine if it is pre/intra or post hepatic? For example alkaline phosphatase raised in post hepatic, and Gamma glutamyl transpeptidase raised in intra hepatic. Or break down products of bilirubin, for example urobilinogen being decreased in the urine of patients with posthepatic jaundice.82.10.78.130 (talk) 09:04, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

Is there such a thing as urobilirubin - is it supposed to be urobilin (see hepatic jaundice) I searched guyton 11th ed 2005 couldn't find that word anywhere  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.167.100.198 (talk) 09:17, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

That's because they changed the name. A lot happens in medicine in a few years. Urobilinogen is formerly known as Stercobilinogen. I bet that's the term they use in your old textbook. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mastac741 (talk • contribs) 20:12, 7 April 2009 (UTC)

When urobilinogen is oxydized it becomes urobilin. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.7.204.33 (talk) 10:46, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

Picture
Jaundice can also cause pixelation of the eyelids--TheBladeRoden (talk) 19:01, 4 August 2010 (UTC)


 * Wikipedia is not censored and we have lots of scary pictures, but this one is unintentionally terrifying. 80.221.34.183 (talk) 20:18, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

Yeah...I would kinda like a text only version of this page...yuck... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.29.195.191 (talk) 01:11, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

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The article says this:

"It was once believed persons suffering from the medical condition jaundice saw everything as yellow."

However, it neglects to tell us whether or not this is true.

Rosa Lichtenstein (talk) 17:08, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

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You know, if the pictures are scary you can right-click, click on block content, and click on the picture you don't want to see. When you do this it will not show them. You can unblock them, as well.

User:Hiediarobalx 05:38 27 September 2012 (UTC)

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In this picture https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jaundice#/media/File:Jaundice08.jpg the pillow appears to also suffer from Jaundice. In other words -- the picture has been yellowed, it has been enhanced and inforced. Is this symptomatic to WP in general? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:980:42B2:1:105F:1852:6D10:3E30 (talk) 18:01, 5 January 2020 (UTC)

Invitation to edit
It is proposed that Jaundice be part of the trial of a new template; see the green strip at the top of Pain where it has been in place for a couple of months. The purpose of this project is to encourage readers to edit, while equipping them with the basic tools. If you perceive a problem with this, or have any suggestions for improvement, please discuss at the project talk page. --Anthonyhcole (talk) 10:07, 10 January 2011 (UTC)

Is this picture appropriate?
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File%3AJaundice08.jpg

I know Wikipedia is not censored, but at the same time, its not uncommon in many medical textbook images for the facial features of a patient to be hidden/blurred for privacy reasons. In this case, the patient's entire face is shown - Should we at least aim to avoid revealing the patient's identity, even if this picture does a good job in showing the actual condition in a hospital setting? Would covering up the patient's eyes impair the reader's understanding of the appearance of jaundice? -A1candidate (talk) 11:24, 28 February 2013 (UTC)

[August 30, 2013] I agree. The pictures used on this article are not appropriate, and I believe may violate copyright law. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.141.55.198 (talk) 03:19, 31 August 2013 (UTC)

[August 30, 2013: Part 2] Due to a lack of evidence showing the patients agreed to have their pictures posted online, they have been removed from the Wiki article. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.141.55.198 (talk) 03:23, 31 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Patient has given consent for release under a CC BY SA license. Maybe you could try asking the uploader next time. Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) (if I write on your page reply on mine) 05:45, 31 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Please provide a link. Maybe you could try being less passive aggressive next time. Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.141.55.198 (talk) 03:29, 2 September 2013 (UTC)
 * A link to what? Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) (if I write on your page reply on mine) 08:35, 2 September 2013 (UTC)

VERY heteronormative, just putting it out there — Preceding unsigned comment added by 144.173.149.117 (talk) 10:37, 12 May 2016 (UTC)

Where should we mention cholestatic jaundice
Other articles refer to cholestatic jaundice but it's not mentioned here. - Rod57 (talk) 05:43, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Thank you, I have redirected to obstructive jaundice. LT90001 (talk) 09:45, 2 September 2013 (UTC)

The Simpsons?
Should we include something about The Simpsons on here?

Whites of the eyes
Are the sclera. And yes jaundice makes them often appear yellow. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 20:20, 3 May 2017 (UTC)

WP:LEAD
Lead is supposed to be a summary of the condition in question. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 11:08, 26 May 2020 (UTC)

Epidemiology Section
I noticed there is almost no content in the epidemiology section. This may be a great section where we can add data regarding jaundice in different ages, ethnicities, as well as genetic factors contributing to development of jaundice-associated diseases. I appreciate your thoughts, comments, and ideas.Taglel (talk) 13:43, 27 May 2020 (UTC)
 * On Wikipedia we generally use "epidemiology" to mean incidence and prevalence. If we have data on this for different ages and ethnicities sure.
 * With respect to genetics are you referring to the pathophysiology of the condition? Or are you referring to some generic causes of the condition such as Crigler–Najjar syndrome which is discussed in the diagnosis section. Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) 05:52, 29 May 2020 (UTC)

Wonderful! I will add in some references regarding epidemiology.

I think generally, I wanted to add a sub-section on risk factors for developing jaundice including genetic and environmental. Regarding genetics, I wanted to add genetic mutations that have been shown to been major risk factors for chronic liver disease progression (both ALD and NAFLD) (i.e. I148M in PNPLA3 gene). Environmental risk factors that I think should be included are alcohol consumption, age, gender, ethnicity, obesity. Taglel (talk) 14:34, 29 May 2020 (UTC)

Sentence
"While jaundice is usually common and harmless in infants, jaundice in adults may indicate an underlying disease."

What ref supports this? Jaundice in infants may also indicate an underlying disease and this text by juxtaposing these two makes it appear like it cannot. "usually common" does not really make sense. It is simple common and usually harmless but sometimes not harmless. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 05:49, 29 May 2020 (UTC)


 * Thanks for catching this grammatical error. I completely agree that it should be stated as "Jaundice in infants is common and usually harmless (physiological)" The message I am attempting to convey in juxtaposing infant jaundice and adult jaundice was the level of concern readers may feel when exposed to a loved one with jaundice. I imagine a significant portion of readers are new mothers who may be confused by their neonate's jaundice; the most common cause being a physiologic hyperbilirubinemia caused by combination of increased fetal hemoglobin breakdown (in the first 3 months, HbF is replaced with HbA with bilirubin rising and hemoglobin drop to 10-13 g/dL) and immature hepatic conjugation and elimination (decreased uridine diphosphogluconurate glucuronosyltransferase activity). Blood disorders or genetic diseases are much less common causes of neonatal jaundice. Thus, adding "usually harmless" may be a reassuring point to put at the top in the summary. In contrast, other readers will be reading this page due to an older loved one (i.e. father, uncle, friend) with jaundice, which is likely pathophysiologic and serious. Jaundice in adults is associated with severity with up to 40% of individuals requiring intensive care experiencing jaundice either as the primary reason for ICU stay or associated with another high mortality disease process (i.e. sepsis). Also, persistence of jaundice (in general) is associated with greater morbidity and mortality. Taglel (talk) 14:49, 29 May 2020 (UTC)


 * We already say "Jaundice in babies is also common with an estimated eighty percent affected during their first week of life.[7] While most cases of newborn jaundice are not harmful, if bilirubin levels are very high, brain damage — kernicterus — may occur.[8][7]"
 * So we do not need "jaundice in babies is common and usually harmless"
 * We do not really need to say it twice. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 08:42, 30 May 2020 (UTC)

Causes Section
The table of labs currently in the causes section may perhaps be better placed in the differential/diagnostic section, as it seems to be a separate topic. I envision the "causes/etiology" section to condensed to a summary paragraph and then list of diseases format, while the diagnostic section can detail more regarding specific labs, imaging, and differential.Taglel (talk) 13:44, 2 June 2020 (UTC)

Prevention
Any recommended sources for expanding the section to cover prevention, given that medication is a or the the leading cause in the developed world?--50.201.195.170 (talk) 20:09, 22 April 2021 (UTC)

Merger proposal
I propose merging Cholemia into Jaundice. All the sources I can find seem to use the two terms more-or-less interchangeably, sometimes even with constructions like "jaundice (cholemia)", and Cholemia is tiny and undercited.

This article is long enough as it is and would distract readers from the main purpose of this article. 2601:642:4D80:9280:B9ED:4FD0:B8B1:1F4C (talk) 09:43, 14 May 2023 (UTC)


 * Support merge proposal; this seems to be a rare synonym for cholestatic jaundice; as this isn't a dictionary, we don't need a page for each term. Readers arriving at Cholemia would be better served by being redirect to the information on Jaundice. Klbrain (talk) 17:26, 11 June 2023 (UTC)
 * ✅ Klbrain (talk) 09:14, 30 September 2023 (UTC)