Talk:Mandell Creighton

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Lookover...

 * Lead -
 * You can probably drop the "Church of England priest" bit from the lead. I'd go with "...an English historian and Church of England Bishop of Peterborough and London."
 * Done – iride  scent  01:30, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Isn't "..to research a proposed book on the Papacy." a bit of overdetail on the lead? I'm assuming it never got published, so why is it so important it should be mentioned in the lead?
 * No, he eventually did write it - as it's the book he's remembered (if at all) for today, I think it warrants a mention in the lead (presumably, most people looking him up will know him as the author of History of the Papacy). – iride  scent  01:30, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Then probably should make it clear that it was written. As it is currently stated, it almost makes it sound like the book didn't get written. (and if it's that well known, probably should mention the title in the lead...) Ealdgyth - Talk 01:39, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Early life -
 * Okay, "graduated in 1866 with a First in Greats." is gobbledygook to this non-Englishperson. I see they are linked, but a quickie explanation won't hurt.
 * I've explained "First". Greats is one of those things that isn't really summarisable ("an extended four-year course in the Latin and Greek languages, archaeology, classical literature and philosophy and the history of Greece and Rome" is about as short as I can get it). How about a footnote? – iride  scent  01:30, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Footnotes work! Ealdgyth - Talk 01:39, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * More jargon - Oxford Movement? What were they most known for? Remember, linking is good, but it takes your reader away from the article which they dislike a lot.
 * Again, a tricky one to summarise; basically, believed that the church in England was the true Catholic church and the Papacy was the schism, and that the C of E should re-claim the pre-reformation liturgy. I'll see if Ottava can suggest anything. – iride  scent  01:30, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * More jargon "High Table"?
 * It's an honor given to important people in an English college - it literally is the right to eat at a separate table that's raised above the others. I've rephrased it to "academics", which is slightly misleading (all academics are High Table, but not all HT are A) but still accurate. – iride  scent  01:30, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Do we need the details on Louise's birth?
 * We don't need, but I think it adds useful background; she wasn't a typical "in the background" wife but a major author and activist in her own right, and the interplay between the two is so significant (aside from his wife's biography of him, there are two full-length bios of him, both of which actually devote more space to her than to him). If it didn't breach our conventions, I'd have actually titled this Mandell and Louise Creighton. – iride  scent  01:30, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Peterborough and London -
 * Really rough transition from "..and a novel, the Bloom of the Peach, under the pseudonum of Lois Hale." to "Mandell Creighton was a popular and conscientious..." When was Creighton consecrated? Where? When was he enthroned in his cathedral? (If you don't have access to this information, I can get it for you from the Handbook of British Chronology).
 * If you can get the actual dates, please do. All I can find are years; Life and Letters has the date of his invitation but not the actual enthronements. – iride  scent  01:30, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Need the translation date for him going to London also.
 * Ditto – iride  scent  01:30, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * The main thing I noted was that there is a bit much on his wife. Best to move the details on her life to her own article.
 * See above; normally I'd barely mention the wife, but I think she had such an impact on him (and vice versa) that she needs to be gone into quite heavily. She will get her own article at some point; at that time I'll see what if anything can be moved across. – iride  scent  01:30, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Hope this helps. Ealdgyth - Talk 01:07, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * It does - thanks... – iride  scent  01:30, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * The prose is still a bit rough, but most of the important facts seem in place, your sources are good, and the non-Brit jargon that flew in my face I've pointed out above. I'm sure Malleus will catch prose glitches, he's very very good at that. Looks pretty good! Thinking GA or FA for this one? Ealdgyth - Talk 01:44, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Maybe; at the moment there's a giant userspace slushpile from which I'm spinning off assorted parts when they become big enough to stand alone (including my favorite article title, Metropolitan Association for Befriending Young Servants, and my favorite footnote). I'll wait and see what's left when the dust settles; what I'm hoping to do is use the one on the house as the "trunk" (buildings have the advantage of not dying), with assorted redlinks and expanded stubs as the fruit. Ideally, what will be left once all the subtopics are split off is a "social history" article similar to Noel Park. – iride  scent  01:57, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Actually, I've flipped 180° and submitted it GAC now. Although it's unfinished, I think it's at least 80% done, and meets all the GA criteria already, even before I incorporate your additional sources. – irides cent 2  15:46, 12 September 2009 (UTC)

Handbook dates...
Okay, Handbook of British Chronology (you can find the bibliographical details in any of the bishop FAs I've done, it's the third edition). Mandell Creighton nominated 2 March 1891 to Peterborough, consecrated 25 April 1891. translated 15 Jan 1897 to London. He was nominated for London on 31 Dec 1896, and confirmed to London on 15 Jan 1897. The Peterborough dates are from page 265, the London dates from page 260. Ealdgyth - Talk 01:42, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks! Will put them in tomorrow. – iride  scent  01:58, 11 September 2009 (UTC)
 * ((subst:done-t}} – iride  scent  14:45, 11 September 2009 (UTC)

One more thing...
Probably should cover more on his impact as a historian. Did he have famous students? Did his work inspire others? A bit more on how long he was editor of EHR wouldn't be bad, did he set editorial policy? Ealdgyth - Talk 12:24, 11 September 2009 (UTC)


 * I tried to follow roughly the proportions of "bishop-related"/"historian related" as his DNB article (subscription required if you're outside the UK), on the grounds that their assessment of the relative importance of each is probably fair. I'll see if I can fluff it out regarding EHR (he was editor for 5 years). I'm not aware of any famous students, or at least students who cited him as an influence (I'm sure he must have had some, but nobody seems to think they're worth mentioning). He was a Rede Lecturer and a Hulsean Lecturer, which if you know academic conventions of the period are a Big Deal but would be incomprehensible to 99.9% of the population. Lytton Strachey had intended Creighton as the fifth subject of Eminent Victorians, but abandoned the section and published the book with only four biographies instead of five - I've been trying to think of ways to incorporate that but it's difficult to explain why someone not being mentioned in a book is notable. – iride  scent  13:18, 11 September 2009 (UTC)


 * I checked for him in Cantor's Inventing the Middle Ages but he's not mentioned. Another source you might hunt in is the EHR, they probably ran an obit. Check Transactions of the Royal Historical Society also, I'm not sure if they started publishing then or not. Ealdgyth - Talk 13:36, 11 September 2009 (UTC)

More sources...
RHS Bibliography for MC. The Pocock looks recent, and the Herklots might have useful information. The Strachey, McLachlan, and the Fish may also be useful. The two on the marriage also might work well. I may be able to swing by U of I soon and get some of these (I printed the interesting looking ones out for when I do so...) Ealdgyth - Talk 16:27, 11 September 2009 (UTC)

And Here about a house in London and here about a priory and here on Cambridge might also be useful. Ealdgyth - Talk 16:29, 11 September 2009 (UTC)

More from the 1911 EB here, and the article it refers to "Creighton and Stubbs" in Church Quarterly Review for Oct. 1905 might be useful. Stubbs is one of the giants in English history, if they were involved in some manner, that's worth including. here is a "reminiscene" on him, that might add some color. This and this mention him, not sure how much. This seems to imply that he was one of the first to use the phrase "English Renaissance". The subject of this article appears to have been a friend of Creighton's, so might be useful. Here he's mentioned again, not sure how much. This discusses a student of Creighton (and links Creighton with Stubbs again...). Ealdgyth - Talk 16:40, 11 September 2009 (UTC)


 * Have worked those parts that seem appropriate in, along with a long footnote about John Kensit (longer than our actual article on the man!) to try to give some more background to the schism in the Church of England during the period. I don't think the relationship with Stubbs is worth mentioning; it doesn't appear, from what I can see, than would be expected of two academics working in the same field at the same time. Creighton's famous relationship, if there is one, would be that with Lord Acton, which spawned That Quote so beloved of agitators and rabble-rousers (1528 usages on Wikipedia policy and talk pages at the time of writing!), and is duly covered in the article.
 * In my opinion, this is at its natural limit; all important aspects are covered, and while it can be expanded further, I think it would be adding trivia and minutiae for the sake of expansion. Our biographical articles should be broad overviews, not in-depth analyses, and I think this now covers everything the general reader would want to know about him. – iride  scent  14:09, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

Louise von Glehn
Do we need the redlink to Louise? I've been reading wp:redlink and I can't see whether the link fulfils the criteria for being left in, or should be removed. She does have most of a paragraph to herself here ... is she independently notable and is there enough verifiable information on her to sustain her own article, or is she best left being dealt with here? And if we do need one redlink, do we really need two? Best wishes, DBaK (talk) 23:00, 20 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Oh dear, I hadn't realized that there was a humongous FAC discussion going on: sorry. I will not hold my breath for a reply to this while the FAC process is going on. DBaK (talk) 23:07, 20 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I'd say an unqualified yes, she's a valid redlink. She was a noted historian, author and activist in her own right - see her DNB entry - and by Wikipedia's standards certainly ought to have an article. – irides cent 2  12:55, 21 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks very much for that. Best wishes DBaK (talk) 23:01, 31 October 2009 (UTC)

Rewrite
I am rewriting the article, making it more accurate, and using a better set of sources. (I had earlier been writing the article on my subpage User:Fowler%26fowler/Mandell_Creighton.) The page will necessarily be in an unfinished state (and too long for its own good) while I do this. Please bear with me. Whatever is of value in the previous version, will be incorporated into the article later. The previous version itself was created in mainspace on 11 September 2008 in one major rewrite of a still earlier version, which while being poorly sourced, and perhaps only minimally paraphrased from the 1911 Britannica, was in some respects more accurate. Fowler&amp;fowler «Talk»  08:52, 31 October 2009 (UTC)

Informal Peer Review
Hi! I was asked to conduct an informal peer review, and have printed the FAC and the article as of now. I'll be responding here in a bit. Fifelfoo (talk) 23:14, 10 November 2009 (UTC)

Prose review (FAC December 2011)
It's a pity that the above informal PR never took place. I am carrying out a prose review while the article's FAC proceeds. Here are some issues from the earlier sections:-
 * Lead


 * "as well" is inelegant and unnecessary — Brianboulton   — (continues after insertion below.)
 * "author and future women's suffrage activist Louise Creighton"; English language style guides erquire a "the" before such descriptions, to avoid lapses into tabloidese (I must admit this is a common fault in my own writing and I'm constantly being picked up on it) — Brianboulton   — (continues after insertion below.)
 * "between the two of them" - the words "the two of" are redundant. "Between" implies two persons. — Brianboulton   — (continues after insertion below.)
 * ✅ The school primers were apparently written jointly (and there were just over a dozen of them, not two); so I'm changing that instance of "between the two of them" to "together," but will change the second instance (below) as you suggest. I knew it sounded awkward, but couldn't come up with the right expression. Thanks very much, by the way, for doing this.   Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  16:50, 26 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Early childhood, 1843–1857
 * ✅ The school primers were apparently written jointly (and there were just over a dozen of them, not two); so I'm changing that instance of "between the two of them" to "together," but will change the second instance (below) as you suggest. I knew it sounded awkward, but couldn't come up with the right expression. Thanks very much, by the way, for doing this.   Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  16:50, 26 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Early childhood, 1843–1857


 * Redundant commas in 2nd paragraph, after "absence" and "childhood" — Brianboulton   — (continues after insertion below.)
 * "and decided to accept" → "and decided to accept him". — Brianboulton   — (continues after insertion below.)
 * ✅ ... and I had only just removed the "him" in a Hemingway-esque flourish.  :)  Reinstated.   Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  17:00, 26 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Durham Grammar School, 1858–1862
 * Durham Grammar School, 1858–1862


 * eleventh-century" as an adjective requires a hyphen — Brianboulton   — (continues after insertion below.)
 * Redundant comma after "a classical scholar" — Brianboulton   — (continues after insertion below.)
 * This sentence needs attention: "His tours of the countryside, often with companions, a pastime he was to indulge in for the rest of his life, covered over twenty miles a day, lasted several days, and gave him many opportunities to exercise his abiding curiosity in the local botany and architecture." It is at present far too long, far too many subclauses. Needs redrafting in the form of at least two shorter sentences. —  Brianboulton   — (continues after insertion below.)
 * ✅ Split into three sentences.  Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  17:22, 26 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Oxford undergraduate, 1862–1866
 * ✅ Split into three sentences.  Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  17:22, 26 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Oxford undergraduate, 1862–1866


 * Second sentence: the comma should be shifted to after "ask his father". — Brianboulton   — (continues after insertion below.)
 * "...walks. Walking..." should be avoided. — Brianboulton   — (continues after insertion below.)
 * ✅ Changed to: "He continued to go on walks. These, especially around Oxford for a few hours in the late afternoon, were popular among many ..."
 * Teaching and marriage, 1867–1874
 * Teaching and marriage, 1867–1874


 * "...the new teaching staff were more youthful." More youthful than...? — Brianboulton   — (continues after insertion below.)
 * :) This took me more time to fix than anything else. I had incorrectly paraphrased Covert.  I've now rewritten the first few sentences.
 * "He succeeded to a degree." Perhaps the word "degree" should be avoided, in this context? — Brianboulton   — (continues after insertion below.)
 * ✅ Removed the sentence altogether. Also, moved around a paragraph or two for more coherence.
 * "In four years of teaching, his salary had more than doubled" → "After four years of teaching..." — Brianboulton   — (continues after insertion below.)
 * "future statesman" → "the future statesman" (see above) — Brianboulton   — (continues after insertion below.)
 * "He had also become an admirer of Walter Pater..." → "He also became an admirer of Walter Pater..." —  Brianboulton   — (continues after insertion below.)
 * ".. he noticed his friend, and future author, Humphry Ward talking.." → "...he noticed his friend, the future author Humphry Ward, talking..."
 * "the scarf aroused his interest enough to ask Ward about the woman..." The scarf asked about the woman? Insert "for him" after "enough". And "it turned out" later in the sentence, is somewhat magaziney and inappropriate. — Brianboulton   — (continues after insertion below.)
 * "Valentines Day" → "Valentine's Day" — Brianboulton   — (continues after insertion below.)
 * "critic Matthew Arnold" per previous — Brianboulton   — (continues after insertion below.)
 * ✅  Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  20:29, 26 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Vicar of Embleton, 1875–1884
 * "Valentines Day" → "Valentine's Day" — Brianboulton   — (continues after insertion below.)
 * "critic Matthew Arnold" per previous — Brianboulton   — (continues after insertion below.)
 * ✅  Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  20:29, 26 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Vicar of Embleton, 1875–1884
 * ✅  Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  20:29, 26 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Vicar of Embleton, 1875–1884


 * "housebound" is one word
 * Not sure about "finalised the topic". It has a slight management-speak flavour, and I'm not altogether sure what it means; that he confirmed his intention to make the Renaissance popes the subject of his life's research?
 * :) True. Changed to:  "that Creighton made firm his intention to study the Renaissance popes for his life's research."
 * Another intrusive "as well"
 * ✅ This has to be irritating for you.  I'll try to read ahead and bump off other occurrences.
 * If the article is in British English, we don't say "until age fourteen", we say "until the age of fourteen"
 * :) Yup, definitely US and Canadian construction. Changed. ✅
 * "He was also elected to local government bodies such as the Board of Guardians, which enacted poor laws in the region, as well as the local sanitary authority" Suggest replace "as well as" with "and to"
 * "between the two of them" occurs again
 * ✅ I'm definitely beginning to feel embarrassed. :)  Look forward to more superb comments!   Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  21:30, 26 December 2011 (UTC)
 * "between the two of them" occurs again
 * ✅ I'm definitely beginning to feel embarrassed. :)  Look forward to more superb comments!   Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  21:30, 26 December 2011 (UTC)

I will continue to post here. Brianboulton (talk) 15:23, 26 December 2011 (UTC)

A bit more:-
 * Vicar of Embleton, 1875–1884


 * "Creighton proposed that the turbulence of the reformation became inevitable when the Popes obstructed the milder parliamentary reforms that had been proposed earlier." "Proposed" twice in the same sentence means some rephrasing advised
 * ✅ Replaced with "advocated earlier"
 * Prefacing a quotation with "said one woman" is OK in ordinary prose, but maybe a little quirky or novelistic in style for an encyclopedia?
 * Cambridge professor, 1885–1891
 * Cambridge professor, 1885–1891


 * "Although Creighton did not take direct part" → "Although Creighton did not take a direct part..."
 * "a compromise was reached emphasizing..." → "a compromise was reached that emphasized..."
 * "he spoke eloquently" - delete the POV
 * Large numbers are best expressed numerically, i.e. "250th" rather than "two hundred and fiftieth"
 * "Acton penned three memorable sentences" again POV
 * ✅ Also, "dictum" changed to "epigram."
 * Bishop of Peterborough, 1891–1896
 * "Acton penned three memorable sentences" again POV
 * ✅ Also, "dictum" changed to "epigram."
 * Bishop of Peterborough, 1891–1896
 * Bishop of Peterborough, 1891–1896


 * Perhaps Covert should be described as a biographer rather than just "author"?
 * "as it would turn out" is unnecessary padding. In any event, the sentence containing this needs attention – very unwieldly as it stands: "A year earlier, in 1894, the fifth, and as it would turn out, the last, volume of Creighton's History of Papacy in the Period of Reformation, entitled The German Revolt, 1517–1527 and covering the history up to the Sack of Rome in 1527, was published by Longman."
 * Another maxi-sentence that should be split: "Creighton was chosen after the Archbishop of Canterbury, Edward White Benson, begged off going to the event citing ill-health, and after the same excuse was offered for Randall Davidson, the Bishop of Winchester, who as Prelate of the Order of the Garter was the usual official stand in
 * Bishop of London, 1897–1901
 * Another maxi-sentence that should be split: "Creighton was chosen after the Archbishop of Canterbury, Edward White Benson, begged off going to the event citing ill-health, and after the same excuse was offered for Randall Davidson, the Bishop of Winchester, who as Prelate of the Order of the Garter was the usual official stand in
 * Bishop of London, 1897–1901
 * Bishop of London, 1897–1901


 * Benson was introduced in all his glory at the end of the previous section. We don't need that detail again: "Archbishop Benson" will do.
 * ✅ Thanks again, Brian.   Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  20:39, 30 December 2011 (UTC)

Continuing... Brianboulton (talk) 22:16, 29 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Final prose comments
 * Bishop of London, 1897–1901


 * General (non-prose) point: do we need the caricature and the portrait - especially as, with the boxed quotation on the right, there is severe text squeezing
 * Removing caricature. ✅
 * De-italicise Voluntary School Bill of 1897
 * "Some thirty years earlier..." → "Almost thirty years earlier..." ("Some" implies "at least")
 * Hmm. I'm happy to remove it (on account of its informal register), but that I've never heard.  See for example OED: 9a Used with numbers to indicate an approximate amount or estimate, and passing into an adv. with the sense ‘about, nearly, approximately’.  examples: 1836    J. W. Carlyle Lett. I. 56   We expect John Carlyle in some ten days.  Also, Websters Unabridged: 1 : ABOUT -- usually used before a numeral  
 * It should be possible to explain how Creighton became a member of the House of Lords. Otherwise, readers may wonder how he came to be addressing it. To avoid disrupting the text, this information could be incorporated into a footnote.
 * I see, I didn't realize that you had to be a member in order to address. Will add the note later, when I have more information and time.
 * "practice which indicated" → "practices which indicated"
 * Sorry! ✅
 * Lose the redundant comma before "John Kensit", another one after "collection of national churches", and those either side of "what he termed".
 * Now, how did I manage to put commas on either side of "what he termed?" :) ✅
 * Per the quote, did he actually say "and that any additional service which are used", thus pluralising "service" which is indubitably singular? Sham on him if he did; suggest give it a [sic].
 * :) No, as usual, shame on me. :)  ✅
 * Might be worth mentioning that Kensit was a leading light of the Protestant Truth Society. I seem to recall that he and his organisation tried to bully Lang over the same issues.
 * Will add this later.  Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  10:40, 2 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Will add this later.  Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  10:40, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

Arbitrary break

 * Legacy


 * I don't think the Archbishop did the actual interring, although he led the service.
 * :) Will fix later. ❌
 * I am against the inclusion of longish (100w+) direct quotations unless they are absolutely crucial. This one fro Phillipa Levine doesn't seem to meet that standard; a shorter paraphrase would, I believe, be preferable.
 * Agree. It is long.  Will paraphrase later ❌
 * "Overall, Creighton and his peers, left a heterogeneous legacy." I don't really know what this means; in any event, is it an opinion or did a source say it?
 * Good point. Will look into later.  ❌
 * "Lord Acton would use" or "Lord Acton used" ?
 * I want "would use," but if you think it is causing confusion, please let me know.  ❌
 * "The emphasis on concreteness and reality would remain a feature of his career as a prelate." Whose opinion?
 * :) Good point. Will fix later.  ❌
 * "During his lifetime Creighton had received honorary doctorates". Delete "had"
 * ✅  Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  11:08, 2 January 2012 (UTC)


 * Character


 * "espied" is a little twee and old-fashioned for a modern encyclopedia
 * Haha. You see I was immersed in the 1870s.  (But it was a little old fashioned even then ...)   ✅
 * I'm not altogether comfortable with the implied spectrum "radical evangelicals and conservative Anglo-Catholics". Evangelicals have usually tended towards very conservative social views. On the other hand, Anglo-catholicism has sometimes been allied to political radicalism - as I discovered when I studied ritualism in the Victorian Church of England. So maybe it's less simple than it seems.
 * You are probably right. Will have to await more reading on my part.  ❌
 * Consider swapping the order of the second and third paragraphs, to bring the article to, perhaps, a slightly more pognant conclusion.
 * Nice idea. ✅

That's me done. I hope this has been helpful. I'll look forward to looking again, when the article is re-presented at FAC. Brianboulton (talk) 00:23, 1 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks for taking the time (and the trouble!) to conduct such a thorough review. I will be traveling for the next couple of months, but will try to set aside an hour or two several times a week for the article (especially the sourcing issues).  Since I won't have ready access to books, I'll be relying on the longish bibliography I've added below (which is available for limited preview on Google books).  Please feel free to add anything you think is appropriate directly to the article.  Regards,  Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  11:28, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

Images
I discovered that some of the pictures we thought had uncertain copyright have in fact appeared in the two volumes:,. I will be adding more info here soon. Fowler&amp;fowler «Talk»  13:36, 27 December 2011 (UTC)

Suggestions
I must admit that this article is so much improved since I last touched it that I'm nervous about contributing directly. I did wonder, though, if the following should be considered: Best wishes, DBaK (talk) 14:38, 27 December 2011 (UTC)
 * 1) There is no link in the text to the vicarage building, Embleton Tower. There is, correctly, a link there from the photo caption; since the text mentions the vicarage, the building, pele towers an ting might it not be good if it also linked to the building's own article?
 * 2) The (rather good) village hall in Embleton is called the Creighton Memorial Hall. I don't know when this happened or what the whole story is, but I feel it may be noteworthy in terms of his relationship with the village ... at least it draws a contrast with the villager's 'no good ... no harm' comment!
 * 3) Similarly, but perhaps less excitingly, there are a number of things probably or definitely named after him in London. For example there are roads in (at least) E6, N2, W12, NW6, N17, and W5. This is certainly a type of legacy which differs from a foundation, lecture, scholarship or whatever but I am not sure that it is of no value, representing, perhaps, a certain type of er er civic recognition. What do you think?
 * Thanks. I like the ideas!
 * 1. I apparently wikified the Embleton Tower page two years ago, and then forgot all about it. I see that user:Rosiestep has done a lot of work there recently.  Will do.
 * 2. Will look for refs for Creighton Memorial Hall. If you have any, please post.
 * 3 Do you have any refs for the roads?    Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  16:15, 27 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Question: DBaK, do you know if this Creighton Road in London is named after Mandell Creighton? It has the right (i.e. uploadable to WP) licensing on Flickr.   Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  23:31, 27 December 2011 (UTC)

To do list

 * 1) Expand lead to be more representative of article.
 * 2) Incorporate suggestions by DBaK in Legacy section.
 * 3) Look for new refs that might have appeared since October 2009.  Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  20:09, 27 December 2011 (UTC)

References published after publication of Covert's biography
James Covert's A Victorian Marriage: Mandell and Louise Creighton is the only modern biography of Creighton. It was published in 2000 (and has preface dated December 1999). Although I had thought I had scoured the literature for other authors (especially ones published after 2000), I apparently hadn't. Most (read three-quarters) modern references to Creighton are perfunctory ones which (perfunctorily) mention Acton's remark, "Power corrupts ...," and (more perfunctorily) mention Creighton as the recipient of it. Consequently, I had to block out "Acton" in the binary search. Here then is a list for the period 1999 to 2007. I will add the more recent ones later. Please feel free to add others. Fowler&amp;fowler «Talk»  23:46, 29 December 2011 (UTC)
 * PS This is not a list generated by a computer program though it might seem like one. :) I had to go through each reference.   Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  23:50, 29 December 2011 (UTC)
 * PPS I know this is an overkill, but it might be good to have the refs in one place.  Fowler&amp;fowler  «Talk»  23:57, 29 December 2011 (UTC)

Noting that ...
... I will be editing the article again after eight years! I will start by changing some of the citations, lightening some of the load on Covert's book. Fowler&amp;fowler «Talk»  21:35, 1 February 2020 (UTC)