Talk:Maulana Azad

Untitled
Needs wikification. And NPOV rewrite. And just plain neutral language (Gandhiji?!). &mdash;iFaqeer (Talk to me!) 21:26, Dec 3, 2004 (UTC)

NPOV

I am afraid this is a rather unbalanced piece. Azad was no proponent of secularism per se. He was a composite nationalist largely because he was thoroughly discredited through his ill-advised tehreek-e-Hijrat (which finds no critical reference). His opposition to Pakistan was also based out of his own understanding of the Muslim cause. His greatest achievement in politics was Cabinet Mission Plan which was torpedoed by the Congress. 124.109.47.105 (talk) 05:54, 4 June 2009 (UTC)

I would disagree with the notion that abul kalaam azad had anything to do with the salafi school of thought


 * Abul Kalam Azad was a known follower of Ahl-e-Hadeeth beliefs, but yes his 'salafism' was not at at all definitive for his character. It is right to mention it, but it should not be emphasised at all. Tanzeel 13:34, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

Requested move

 * I've moved the page, per the above unopposed request, listed at WP:RM for five days. -GTBacchus(talk) 02:16, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Azad as religious thinker
This article - although describies thoroughly Azad a s politicians - definitly lacks discussion of his achievments as religious thinker, fe. his main work Tarjuman al-Quran is not mentioned (we do not have a list of his other books as well, as is the standart in other wikipedia biographical articles).

Islam in India
Why should this article be filed under Islam in India? Azad is of significance to all people of India not just Muslims. Otherwise on this philosophy, articles on Gandhi, Nehru etc. should also be filed under Hinduism in India. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 199.106.103.254 (talk) 03:04, 28 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Well it should be under Islam in India because in-spite of his undeniable contributions to all people of India,including but not limited to Hindus, Muslims, Christians and Buddhists, he IS as Indian and a follower of Islam. Thus filed under Islam in India Harsh Mujhse baat kijiye(Talk) 06:00, 15 March 2010 (UTC)

his origin
It is my first time participating in this topic. I edited this article only once before this and I was only here to correct a spelling mistake (Pashtun was misspelled). It looks like Abdul Kalam Azad's origin is in disbute (between IPs and a Wikipedian). Majority of the sources (net+books) only mention that he was a Bengali Muslim of Afghan origin and that his forefathers came from Herat. Four sources have been provided to prove that his origins were Persian and they all have major issues. Jagoindian - #4 has copied the article from Wikipedia. Source #3 (in German) and #2 are two books/journals, but we don't know where in those sources do they mention anything about Kalam Azad. We only know the title of the sources and that is it. Source #1 is the only source that writes "...was a Bengali Muslim of Afghan (probably Tajik) origins.". I googled Abdul Kalam Azad and I could hardly find any source which mentioned anything about his ethnic origin (whether he was a Pashtun, Persian or Tajik). Majority of the sources only write that he was a Bengali Muslim of Afghan origin and his forefathers came from Herat, Afghanistan - Maulana Abdul Kalam Azad Instituteion of Asian Studies. Therefor, I suggest that we should only add the "Afghan origin" part and leave "Pashtun, Persian and Tajik" out of this article. (Ketabtoon (talk) 05:57, 25 January 2010 (UTC))

Neither Afghanistan nor Pushtuns did existed during his ancestors days. Pushtuns were living on Sulaiman Mountains and Pakistan, Wazirista and Ismael Dera Khan. Then, the name of the region was Khorasan (Afghanistan came to birth in 1919 officially and in 1911 unofficially, gave to birth by Russia and primerly by British colonialism, so actually, we have to call him Khorasani). We could use Afghan in the right context if Afghanistan had existed before 100 years ago but not when the land was known as Khorasan and Pushtuns, specially under Babur, lived south of Kabul, which is Waziristan, Baluchistan and Peshawar, Dera Islamel Khan. With best Regards. Khawaran.com and Tajikam.com are created a study on Tajiks/Iranis and Persian-speaking people in general who lived in India and were either politicians or rulers or whatever, supported by E. Iranica and E. Islamica and some own scholars, like Shir Magan Shah Gardezi who already wrote a book. Recognize also the fact, that Pushtuns did never played any role in the modern history of India against British power. That Abul Kalam Azad did not even spoke a word Pushtu, but instead nearly 8 other languages, including the language of his house and ancestors, Persian, is also a point on his origine.--94.219.218.233 (talk) 20:00, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

Afghan is a modern citizenship that did not exist in Herat when Kalam's ancestors lived there. During the Medieval period Afghans were Pashtuns and there is not one source that can prove that there were Pashtun tribes in Herat during Babur and Homayoun's rule.--Inuit18 (talk) 20:49, 7 February 2010 (UTC)
 * The question is, do you have reliable sources to back that he was of Tajik origin? Most of the sources only mention that he was of Afghan origin - they don't mention anything about him being a Tajik, Persian, Pashtun etc. Like I mentioned in my previous reply, 4 sources have been provided and 3 of them have serious issues and I doubt the one which writes "...was a Bengali Muslim of Afghan (probably Tajik) origins." is very reliable. Extra sources would be appreciated since most of the sources on the net only mentions that he was of Afghan origin. Thank you  (Ketabtoon (talk) 03:25, 8 February 2010 (UTC))
 * Once again I googled Abdul Kalam Azad and the following links mentioned his origin and all of them write that he was of Afghan origin, , , . (Ketabtoon (talk) 04:51, 8 February 2010 (UTC))
 * Until we reach a consensus I have removed his forefathers' ethnicity. Most of your sources are also unreliable and not scholarly. The fact is that Afghan tribes first migrated to Herat in the 18th century. Herat during Babur's rule was inhabited by Tajiks with a few settlements of Barlas. if you want to add Afghan in this article you have to prove to us that There were Afghan tribes in Herat during Babur's reign.--Inuit18 (talk) 04:56, 8 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Those are 4 different websites. The 5th link is from Maulana Abdul Kalam Azad Institute of Asian Studies - "The Maulana Abul Kalam Azad Institute of Asian Studies was set up at the joint initiative of the Government of India, Department of culture, Ministry of Human Resource Development and the Government of West Bengal. Registered as a Society under the West Bengal Registration of Societies' Act of 1961, with Prof. Nurul Hasan, the then Governor of West Bengal, as the President of the Society on the 4th of January 1993." Can you find a more reliable source than that?
 * Whether there were Afghan tribes in Herat is not important. The word "Afghan" is used in all the sources when they are talking about his origin. Here in Wikipedia I linked the word to Demography of Afghanistan not to Pashtun people or Afghan - that means he can be from any ethnic group from Afghanistan. (Ketabtoon (talk) 05:09, 8 February 2010 (UTC))

The modern concept of the Afghan citizenship did not exist when Azad's forefathers were in Herat. The only way we can add Afghan to this article is to research if Afghan tribes lived in Herat during Babur's rule.--Inuit18 (talk) 23:42, 8 February 2010 (UTC)


 * Any reason why all these sources have used the word Afghan? If the majority of the sources add that, then wikipedia shouldn't be an exception. It is not only about majority sources, but even Maulana Abdul Kalam Azad Institute of Asian Studies have added the word Afghan in his biography.  (Ketabtoon (talk) 02:28, 9 February 2010 (UTC))


 * Not to forget, you want to violate WP:OR. The fact that he was of Afghan origin is supported by multiple sources of which the Maulana Abdul Kalam Azad Institute of Asian Studies is the most reliable and academic source available on him.  (Ketabtoon (talk) 02:43, 9 February 2010 (UTC))

do you know want academic means? this website might claim he was an Afghan but their claim is not rational since Afghan and Afghanistan did not exist in Herat during Babur's rule. If you find a reliable and academic source that says Afghans lived in Herat during Babur's reign then we will add Afghan.--Inuit18 (talk) 03:57, 9 February 2010 (UTC)


 * It is not a problem if you don't like the sources. It is very easy to solve a dispute here in Wikipedia (invite a neutral member for 3rd opinion) at WP:3O. (Ketabtoon (talk) 04:34, 9 February 2010 (UTC))

Hey, thanks for this detailed note.Uvav (talk) 02:49, 3 March 2010 (UTC)UvavUvav (talk) 02:49, 3 March 2010 (UTC)

Disputed ?
I find only two issues mainly discussed in the talk page here : 1) whether his ancestry was Pashtun/Afghan etc 2) His affiliation to salafi school and secular credentials

The former can be put in a dual wording sentence (is said to be.....some claim it ...etc) or avoided till the dispute is resolved. Also a disputed or a discuss tag can be put near that section which discusses it. The second needs references.Those who brought up the issue seem to citing their opinions. They don't seem to have quoted any reference.

Tagging an article as disputed just because someone cites their opinion without authentic narratives and a minor dispute about his ethnicity is injustice to the subject. A person so important in history deserves a good article and those with opinions should come up with more sources.Till then I suggest the disputed tags be removed.NMKuttiady (talk) 09:53, 1 April 2010 (UTC)

deoband supported Azad
Maulana Azad was the president of Jamiat-e-Ulema-Hind and therefore his ties with the Deoband Order and religious Muslims were very strong, he himself being very religious. Religious Muslims in any event opposed the creation of Pakistan, especially those Darul Uloom Deoband. The link given does not mention Deoband. 202.59.80.154 (talk) 08:14, 20 August 2010 (UTC) =Fake Article= The article "Maulana Abul Kalam Azad: The Man Who Knew The Future Of Pakistan Before Its Creation" is fake. There is no credible source which can date the history of this article to the year 1946. If the interview did occur how come it is never acknowledged by anyone throughout history despite of such precise predictions. More over the predictions seem to precise to possibly be real and seem to be a recent forgery. Also The Man Who Forged An Interview: Shorish Kashmiri's Maulana Azad Hoax is an article which lays out various points and systematically discredits the authenticity of the article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.74.175.181 (talk) 09:05, 8 January 2011 (UTC)

Actually it was authenticated by a number of authors including MJ Akbar which is quoted in his latest book "TinderBox: The Past and Future of Pakistan". MJ Akbar is a well renowned scholar and historian and also a leading Indian Jounarlist and Director of India Today. His work would be more credible than a blog written by some unknown person. Moreover, most of his "points" have been discredited in the comments itself. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.34.60.142 (talk) 04:11, 18 April 2011 (UTC)

Reference for Herat, where does it say his ancestors came from herat
any reference would be appreciated or else the line has to removed

Assessment comment
Substituted at 06:32, 29 April 2016 (UTC)

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Social
What changes will done by the molana Abdul Kalam Azad if he will be alive 106.195.70.135 (talk) 18:48, 15 December 2022 (UTC)

Requested move 18 January 2023

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion. 

The result of the move request was: moved. (closed by non-admin page mover)  The Night Watch     (talk)   19:44, 25 January 2023 (UTC)

Abul Kalam Azad → Maulana Azad – Per WP:COMMONNAME. Capitals00 (talk) 19:13, 18 January 2023 (UTC)

Also see:





Capitals00 (talk) 19:09, 18 January 2023 (UTC)
 * Support Absolutely. Abhishek0831996 (talk) 08:01, 19 January 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
 * Support per nom. This is exactly how he is known as. >>> Extorc . talk  11:04, 19 January 2023 (UTC)
 * Support A google search reveals that "Maulana Azad" gets "enough" more results that just Abul Kalam Azad. It satisfies WP:COMMONNAME. ─ The Aafī   (talk)  06:39, 20 January 2023 (UTC)

Atheist phase
He seemed to have gone through a phase of atheism in his early life as quoted by some sources like these - 1. https://southasia.ucla.edu/history-politics/independent-india/abul-kalam-azad/ 2. https://www.jstor.org/stable/24159314

The second source quotes him as saying - “I was by now a complete atheist. I took great pride in my belief in 'materialism' and 'rationalism' and saw in religion only ignorance and conjecture."

It further says, “This period lasted from 1902 to 1910 i.e. from the age of fourteen to twenty”

I think this deserves a mention in this article. If someone could edit the article to include this, it would be nice. AbdulKareem92 (talk) 19:06, 28 March 2023 (UTC)

Urdu
Moulana Abul kalam azad information in urdu 103.164.200.162 (talk) 17:07, 18 February 2024 (UTC)