Talk:Sint Maarten/Archive 1

Name is incorrect
I have never encountered any English speaking source ever using "Saint Martin" when referring to the Dutch side. If one can be found, please present it. As far as I know, there is no such thing as Saint Martin (Netherlands). The English name for the Dutch side of this island is St. Maarten (or Sint Maarten) --- "Saint Martin" is the French side. For examples of English language scholarly texts using St. Maarten see Google scholar search results here. For books see this Google list. Also, please note that St. Maarten is part of the anglophone Caribbean, although some Dutch is spoken by some layers of the population. St. Maarten is thus a name used by a native English-speaking population for their territory. How can such a name be "translated" to something else? Afv2006 10:13, 30 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I fully agree. "The Bonaire Reporter" and "The Daily Herald", the only two English-language Antillean newspapers I'm aware of, use only "Sint Maarten". I would like to make "Saint Martin (Netherlands)" redirect to "Sint Maarten", instead of the wrong way around like it is currently. Kww 13:16, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

Population...... accordging to the government can be found ok its website as of today (19-nov-2014) its 37, 224 ... source.. www.stats.gov.sx (the governments website)

Requested move
This page should be the lead page, and "Saint Martin (Netherlands) should redirect here. "Saint Martin (Netherlands) is both kludgy sounding, and, more importantly, completely unused outside of Wikipedia. Kww 21:17, 31 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I support this move request as per my post above. Afv2006 08:44, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

This article has been renamed as the result of a move request. Vegaswikian 02:39, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Official language English?
Is it really true that, as the infobox states, English is besides Dutch an official language of Sint Maarten? Gugganij 18:04, 16 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes. Legislation was passed earlier this year to elevate Papiamentu and English to "official" status for the Netherlands Antilles. I believe the impact was countrywide, but in practice, Papiamentu is rarely used by the government in the northern islands, and English is rarely used by the government in the southern ones.Kww 19:07, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

St. Martin's name is just that........St. Martin !
As a native St. Martiner, I can tell you that the post-columbian and traditional spelling of the name of our island is "St. Martin." Historical and official documents for both parts of the island, for over 300 years, reflect this. I have documents from the 1800s, which clearly show that "St. Martin" was the way the name of our island was written. I dare say that the Dutch/French spelling "St. Maarten/Saint-Martin" was a political decision after the 1920s, and reinforced later as a tourism marketing tool--both identifying colonial division as opposed to the unity in the spelling of the name and how St. Martiners have lived as one people for over 300 years (remember the nation tongue of St. Martin is English, thus the spelling). This is one island. according to one of our old sayings: "The gale does not stop at the frontier.Arisutton 13:27, 15 August 2007 (UTC)


 * == St. Martin's name is just that.......Saint Martin ! ==

I dare to agree with this post with one correction.... The official name for both sides of the Island is the French spelling "Saint Martin" as the island was named after the "Saint" Martin of Tours who was of French descent. The use of the abbreviation "St." was for convenience purposes only and to this day does not reflect the official terminology.

Also the "Dutch side" government has taken the decision that when "St. Maarten or Sint Maarten" receives its new status (anticipated December 15, 2008) to officially re-instate the official name of "Saint Martin". Tommylee31 (talk) 10:04, 20 February 2008 (UTC)


 * This is just nonsense. 94.209.79.128 (talk) 19:16, 12 June 2009 (UTC)

motto: semper pro grediens?
my latin is a bit rusty but.... i think the right form should be "progrediens" ...anybody agrees? 87.11.35.221 (talk) 21:58, 13 May 2008 (UTC)
 * You are definitely correct as a matter of Latin grammar. However, the official flags on St. Martin all have this apparent typo.TJOB (talk) 20:38, 31 December 2009 (UTC)

Sport
Sint Maarten national football team

I think this should be added, dont you guys?  Royal  Mate1  02:35, 26 October 2008 (UTC)

Links to external resources
Looks like recent changes to the External Resources section have been somewhat spammy / self serving. I have tried to verify the quality and content of the various resources as best as I could. Also, I believe that "commercial" sites that offer relevant information should not be removed solely for that reason. The following updates have been made as a result:

Reverted link added on 4/13 by 24.117.38.196 Official Caribbean Guide - St. Maarten Misleading, not an official information source, no actual content

Reverted deletions made on 7/7 - 14:21 by Kww St. Martin / St. Maarten Restaurants - Dining guide St. Maarten Hospitality and Trade Association - Destination site These are both solid sources of information, no "non-commercial" alternatives available

Agree with prior deletion of link added on 7/7 - 14:31 SHTA St.Maarten Blog Tourism Blog This blog is of a strictly promotional nature, think we should draw the line here (Link was already removed prior to my edits)

Deleted link added on 7/15 by 69.125.105.54 St Maarten/St Martin Restaurants- Restaurant Information No relevant content there

Other: Homogenized names / spelling of organizations and schools Removed Zebrabot link, this site has been repurposed / changed content Added SHTA link - the islands largest business association Added Chamber of Commerce link - the entity that is responsible for all company registrations InfoCatch (talk) 20:20, 8 September 2009 (UTC)

name
I think this should be at Saint Martin (Netherlands). Do English speaking people really use "Sint Maarten" - I find that hard to believe.....We dont call the Netherlands article..."Nederlands" etc. I mean why do we treat the two differently? Thanks. LeFigaro (talk) 22:22, 9 November 2009 (UTC)
 * I happen to agree; in fact, this article started at that location and got moved to "Sint Maarten" at some point later on. The Tom (talk) 21:39, 10 November 2009 (UTC)

Yes, English speaking people use "Sint Maarten". The Dutch side of the island is Sint Maarten, the article title is correct.Dideler (talk) 02:50, 26 September 2013 (UTC)

External Link Police
The following links were removed by Ohnoitsjamie without proper consideration. After I undid the user's wrongful deletion, he or she decided to get personal and give me a warning for vandalism. The warning in undeserved, as I was acting in good faith.

I have requested that the person be specific and list the grounds for removal for each link. Also: I would like to request the opinion of other proper contributors to this page before going head on with this fellow, since I think the links are helpful.

Sorry, forgot to sign the above. I notice that the person who deleted the links is a Wikipedia administrator. Let me take this opportunity to remind him of the following: [administrators] are expected to observe a high standard of conduct, to use the tools fairly, and never to use them to gain advantage in a dispute. Wikipedia:Administrators --InfoCatch (talk) 12:37, 8 March 2010 (UTC)
 * Princess Juliana International Airport - Official site
 * St. Maarten Directory - Business directory
 * St. Martin / St. Maarten Restaurants - Dining guide
 * St. Maarten Hospitality and Trade Association (visitor information) - Destination site
 * St. Maarten Island Times - News and current events
 * St. Martin News Network - Local news and opinion
 * SXM Private Eye - Current events blog and discussions —Preceding unsigned comment added by InfoCatch (talk • contribs) 12:15, 8 March 2010 (UTC)
 * I'm not required to give you a detailed rationale for each link's removal. I restored the airport site, and never deleted the visitstmaarten site in the first place.  Official and/or non-profit sites are usually fine, as are sites of notable newspapers and magazines.  Directories, portals, blogs, and similar sites rarely meet WP:EL/WP:SPAM guidelines.  OhNo itsJamie  Talk 16:35, 8 March 2010 (UTC)
 * I also note that on your first edit, you added a link to dinesxm.com, a site administered by Infocatch Business Solutions. You may want to read our conflict of interest policy (and note that WP:EL makes note of it as well). Wikipedia is not a vehicle for businesses to promote their clients, period. OhNo itsJamie  Talk 17:05, 8 March 2010 (UTC)
 * Thank you for undoing most of your deletions. This leaves the business directory, the dining guide, and the news blog as removed. I would still appreciate the input of Netherlands Antilles work group regarding those. You are correct re your second note: the link was added simply because the resource is useful and I guess it withstood the test of time and some 100 revisions... I'll be happy to let members of the work group decide on whether continued inclusion of any of those links appropriate. This being a start class article, you might appreciate the fact that it takes people with an actual interest in the subject matter to invest any energy into an article's improvement.   --InfoCatch (talk) 22:53, 8 March 2010 (UTC)
 * I didn't undo most of my deletions; I only undeleted the removal of the airport site. A commercial dining guide (added by the owner/maintainer of the site) is not acceptable. Period. Did you not read WP:COI? OhNo itsJamie  Talk 22:59, 8 March 2010 (UTC)

I think that`Ohnoisjamie did a good job in identifying inappropriate links.&mdash;Kww(talk) 23:04, 8 March 2010 (UTC)
 * Fair enough. I hope that this page will thrive in the future, and that the both of you may win many Wikipedia Awards. Good luck, and have a nice day! --InfoCatch (talk) 23:23, 8 March 2010 (UTC)

Calling Code
Slated to change soon to +1 721... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.162.148.199 (talk) 23:27, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

Country status
As Sint Maarten will become an autonomous country on 10 October 2010, I guess this article and many articles surrounding it are in dire need to be substantially expanded. I already created articles like Constitution of Sint Maarten, Governor of Sint Maarten, etc. but I find it too much work to do it all myself. Help is very much appreciated! Fentener van Vlissingen (talk) 14:56, 9 September 2010 (UTC)

Is it Political independence? Barbados still maintains the Queen (of U.K.) but has independence of the UK, do nationals of St. Maarten have their own passports or do they still say "Netherlands" ? 128.103.247.147 (talk) 17:04, 4 November 2011 (UTC)
 * Still part of the Netherlands. Chipmunkdavis (talk) 19:35, 4 November 2011 (UTC)
 * To be precise, it's "Kingdom of the Netherlands". Styath (talk) 12:08, 5 November 2011 (UTC)
 * Which in shortform and common language is called the Netherlands! :) Chipmunkdavis (talk) 12:13, 5 November 2011 (UTC)
 * Which is confusing since it is also the name of one of its countries... In Dutch common language its shortform is simply the Kingdom. Anyway, English is different than Dutch. :P Styath (talk) 12:48, 5 November 2011 (UTC)

Corruption
I was reading the article and wondered why the part about crime and corruption were added on the page of the island itself. I do not see the relevance of this information on a page dedicated to the island or island territory in general. If this is to be mentioned shouldn't this be somewhere else? I would suggest on the page of island history as a current event or on a page of it's own. It seems rather out of place as it is now.For example, why would it be before geography or economy? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 145.97.240.225 (talk) 21:51, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

I agree this should go to history or a page of it's own. It makes no sense. Other countries don't have their corruption scandals on their main country page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.123.201.26 (talk) 09:52, 27 June 2011 (UTC)

Population
There's two different population estimates for 2009: In the infobox there's 40&thinsp;917, whereas in the article, it's 50&thinsp;300. Why is there a difference? (I realise they're both estimates and so perhaps the St Maartenese stats office has one figure and the CIA World Factbook has another, but an explanation would be nice... —Felix the Cassowary 11:50, 11 October 2010 (UTC)

Official (full) name of Sint Maarten
In the title of English text of the constitution the name “Country of Sint Maarten” is used (twice in the form “Country of Sint Maarten”, once in the form “Country Sint Maarten”). But in Dutch text of the constitution correspondence name “Land Sint Maarten” is not used (only form “Sint Maarten” is used). The constitution was passed by Eilandsraad in Dutch, not in English, and English version is only translation made by translator from Scotland (see pages 36 and 37). So, if in the official text of constitution long name “Land Sint Maarten” is not used, we can’t say that name “Country of Sint Maarten” is official one. Aotearoa (talk) 08:01, 28 December 2010 (UTC)

Demonym?
Does anyone know if there is an (official) demonym for the residents of Sint Maarten? If it does not exist, how does 'Sint Maartenese' sound? &#160; thayts &#160;t&#160;  12:56, 9 October 2012 (UTC)
 * St. Maartener — Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.52.10.36 (talk) 12:19, 14 April 2014 (UTC)
 * What if you're not talking about a person? thayts  💬  16:01, 19 April 2014 (UTC)

Airplanes near beach
"within at least 20 feet" ... this is meaningless. Maybe "at most" would be meaningful, but without a citation, it still doesn't belong. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 139.68.134.1 (talk) 21:18, 26 August 2015 (UTC)

Name
Earlier this article had its (local) English name as "Saint Martin" as a translation, it may be that outside of the island "Sint Maarten" (the Dutch name) may be WP:COMMONNAME for the island, but on the island itself the Anglophone population refers to the island as "Saint Martin" (which would be unique that only a single Anglophone nation would use an English name for itself, while the rest of the English-speaking world would use a non-English name for the entity), of course it was incorrect to call it "Country Saint Martin", but in general the English name is still widely used. --86.81.201.94 (talk) 11:04, 23 September 2015 (UTC)


 * The local English language press uses only Sint Maarten. Vernoeming (talk) 08:08, 8 December 2015 (UTC)

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Move discussion in progress
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