User talk:Wasted Time R/Archive 5

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Bruce Springsteen discography
Can you tell me what song are not singles so i can add them in the Other charted songs section. --Be Black Hole Sun (talk) 08:48, 9 August 2008 (UTC)


 * You can start work on it now, i'll add the lead later okay. :) --Be Black Hole Sun (talk) 17:52, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

Rock music WikiProject
I'd like to invite you to join the newly-formed Rock music WikiProject. There's alot of Rock-related articles on Wikipedia that could use a little attention, and I hope this project can help organize an effort to improve them. So please, take a look and if you like what you see, help us get this project off the ground and a few Rock music pages into the front ranks of Wikipedia articles. Thanks! --Be Black Hole Sun (talk) 08:50, 9 August 2008 (UTC)


 * See my answear on the talk page, oh and i really appreciate your work on the discography thanks. --Be Black Hole Sun (talk) 11:54, 10 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Take a look AGAIN. --Be Black Hole Sun (talk) 12:12, 10 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Don't worry, i'll add sources for the music video directors. --Be Black Hole Sun (talk) 13:01, 10 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Are you finished with the single section? --Be Black Hole Sun (talk) 18:53, 15 September 2008 (UTC)


 * No, I got up through 1994, then got distracted onto other articles. Will try to finish it.  Wasted Time R (talk) 19:03, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

Guess what
Can you give Springsteen a rest for a little while?Ferrylodge (talk) 09:00, 10 August 2008 (UTC)


 * If you'd like to bring up the issue about the background, here's the link to the discussion at peer review. Also, here's the discussion at the Graphic Lab.


 * I noticed yesterday that the Senate itself has changed the background of this image. How do you feel about that background?  On the assumption that you prefer the Congress-approved blue-and-white background, I have submitted a request to the Graphics Lab.Ferrylodge (talk) 19:01, 10 August 2008 (UTC)

(undent)WTR, I think maybe we’re getting diminishing returns now on the McCain article. My understanding was that your main concern about the article related to stability, and I didn’t realize that you also want to make lots of substantive changes. Is the article getting close to where you want it? If not, then maybe I should reconsider the FA nomination.Ferrylodge (talk) 01:08, 12 August 2008 (UTC)


 * No, no. I had a queue of changes I intended for the main article, that I hadn't gotten to before I left due to working on the Elmc FAC and to working on a bunch of music article emergencies.  I'm doing the main article changes now to get them in for FAC, because I think they're important.  I'm just now done with everything on my list, except for expanding the Almanac of American Politics ratings averages to a much broader base of years.  And that one I may not get to within the FAC timeframe because I still have to hit a not-quite-local library, and it's a very isolated change in any event.  The FAC is doing fine and should continue!  Wasted Time R (talk) 01:19, 12 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Okay, thanks. I'd suggest leaving the Almanac stuff until later.  Arzel, for example, indicated at the FAC that his "support" is only temporary.  Cheers.Ferrylodge (talk) 05:36, 12 August 2008 (UTC)

I know you've been asked this before
but I do think you'd make a great admin, and would certainly nom you at WP:RFA if interested. Any thoughts to reconsider? Wizardman 23:48, 10 August 2008 (UTC)


 * No, still feel the same way. Admin stuff is just not what I want to be doing here.  But thanks for the kind words.  Wasted Time R (talk) 23:51, 10 August 2008 (UTC)

Hillary image
I feel your pain... I found that photo looking through files here and later searched around for a close up, but to no avail. One does exist, because I remember seeing it in a book but I'll have to find the source and perhaps contact the Reagan library. In any event, I'm glad to help out.

And WTR, I should apologize to you. You asked me to take a look at the Early life and military career of John McCain article when it was up for FAC. But the next thing I knew, I was nominated for adminship and my week was gone. I completely forgot about your notice, but my sincerest congratulations to you on getting that to FA and I commend you for your hard work both on that article and the John McCain article itself. You are a tremendous editor! Best as always, Happyme22 (talk) 19:02, 11 August 2008 (UTC)


 * No apology necessary, and thanks. Wasted Time R (talk) 01:35, 12 August 2008 (UTC)

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Redirect of Kelly and Mario
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McCain
WTR, would you please be willing to reconsider my offer to conominate the McCain article? I feel kind of silly being the sole nominator, given that you've done such an immense amount of work on it, and given that you continue to do excellent work protecting the article and discussing changes at the talk page. We've had disagreements, but I think we've been able to discuss them constructively, and the article continues to benefit from that. What do you say?Ferrylodge (talk) 03:17, 17 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Not necessary. I was FAC nom on Early life and military career of John McCain, which is the subject I put the most effort into, and I have vague plans to nom a couple of the other subarticles for GAC.  FAC nom is more about gruntwork burden than anything else, and you've taken the lead on that for the main article.  And you thought it had a chance to succeed  when I didn't.  So you as the nom is appropriate.  Wasted Time R (talk) 04:56, 17 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks, but let me put it this way. Will you object if I add you as co-nominee?  You really have done no less than me to write and maintain this article, perhaps more.  Please?Ferrylodge (talk) 04:58, 17 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Yes, I would object. Since you're being insistent on this score, I have to say that I haven't been all that satisfied with the main article ever since the big split-out.  Most of that is due to the inherent limitations of summary form, and some of that is due to the outcomes of the various disagreements we've had.  Nevertheless, I decided to support the FAC: nothing's ever perfect, most good editors disagree with me over the value of summary style, and I think it's important for WP to show it can reach its best level on hot-button topics like this.  But if being an FAC co-nom implies a fully enthusiastic endorsement of the article, no I don't want to do that.  Wasted Time R (talk) 13:35, 17 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Okay, thanks for thinking it over. There are parts of the article that I'm not 100% thrilled with too, but overall it seems like a very high quality article.  I hope you'll hang around to keep on doing what you've been doing (for the most part!).  Cheers.  :-)Ferrylodge (talk) 18:19, 17 August 2008 (UTC)

It passed
Check out the gold star. Congrats! Best, Happyme22 (talk) 07:08, 18 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks WTR, for your message at my talk page. The stability thing must be in reference to the subject's personality.  :-)  Seriously, you will always be the co-nom according to reality, if not formality.  Thanks for continuing to collaborate on this.  As you know, Wikipedia's articles on candidates are an interesting experiment in democracy, and they will hopefully help the public.  In short, it seems like a decent way to waste our time.  Cheers.Ferrylodge (talk) 16:31, 18 August 2008 (UTC)

Award
$\sim$ Justmeherenow    19:58, 18 August 2008 (UTC)

And where is the cookie treat :o) ? Got one left over for you: 

Floridianed (talk) has given you a cookie! Cookies promote WikiLove and hopefully this one has made your day better. Spread the WikiLove by giving someone else a cookie, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend. Happy munching!

Spread the goodness of cookies by adding {{subst:Cookie}} to their talk page with a friendly message.

Enjoy but don't swallow it all at once. --Floridianed (talk) 01:39, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

Help with a bad reference
I don't know what I did wrong, but in the Dixie Chicks band page, under "Political Controversy", I added text and a reference about the band's participation in "Rock the Vote". No matter what I did, it screwed up the reflist, even though the source was from Rolling Stone Magazine. Can you check it out? Here's the info I wanted to add: , among other problems. Wasted Time R (talk) 10:47, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

OK!!--leahtwosaints (talk) 19:34, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

McCain article's
About this edit: (that I missed by myself, too.)

My intention is not to blame you but as I see you as a main editor regarding McCain articles (and you're on my trust list) I would wish, you'd pay more attention to such edits, but I certainly don't think the burden is solely on you. Please see it as a friendly reminder and positive thought towards your great work at those articles. Whenever I see your name I just assume that at least most is "ok with me" and within WP-guidelines. Kindest respectful regards, --Floridianed (talk) 01:33, 20 August 2008 (UTC)


 * The John McCain presidential campaign, 2008 article is the one that I've paid the least amount of attention to, of all the McCain articles. In part that's because campaign articles are best written after the campaign is over, when there are better and more analytical sources available and we have a better chance for perspective on what was important and what wasn't.  Thus, I've spent more effort on John McCain presidential campaign, 2000, which I hope to bring to GA at some point.  Wasted Time R (talk) 12:46, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

I'm inviting your comment
Here (and also, if possible, ) $\sim$ Justmeherenow     05:07, 20 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Did so on the first. But be careful on WP:CANVASSING rules. Wasted Time R (talk) 12:58, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

Joe Biden
I left a comment for you on the article talk page. --Mr. Vernon (talk) 18:31, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

John McCain
Didn't really appreciate your comment "we know what we are doing". The Barack Obama article uses the same template at the top of the article that I added to the McCain article. Perhaps you should look into WP:OWN. Asher196 (talk) 04:44, 24 August 2008 (UTC)


 * The Obama article usually does not have the tag, it was just added an hour or so ago, and it'll be removed once the editors get past their usual edit war craziness there. This practice has been established the whole campaign by a number of editors, not just me.  The point is that 95% of the main bio article has nothing to do with the campaign, and doesn't change as the campaign goes on.  Thus the full article does not deserve the tag, only the campaign section.  Wasted Time R (talk) 04:58, 24 August 2008 (UTC)

FYI
The Nixon/Clinton graduate degree issue has come up Talk:Pat_Nixon. Perhaps you would like to check it out? --Happyme22 (talk) 02:45, 25 August 2008 (UTC)

AfD nomination of The Cheetah Girls tours
I have nominated The Cheetah Girls tours, an article you created, for deletion. I do not think that this article satisfies Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion, and have explained why at Articles for deletion/The Cheetah Girls tours&. Your opinions on the matter are welcome at that same discussion page; also, you are welcome to edit the article to address these concerns. Thank you for your time. Do you want to opt out of receiving this notice? Ten Pound Hammer and his otters • (Broken clamshells • Otter chirps • HELP) 23:20, 25 August 2008 (UTC)

Re: Advice for editing political articles
[moved here from my user page] yet you win awards and get your work noticed nationally for doing just that. fascinating that most of those barnstar awards apparently are given for all your work 'cleaning up' the Hillary and the McCain pages. (btw, the approval/adulation given you by Big News sez to me only that your editing meets their self-declared 85% + liberal/left/babyboomer POV. what does that say about your 'npov' editing?)

call me a crybaby, but 'consensus' as the arbiter of 'factuality' is far more likely to result in articles with more fluff than fact. the premise that factuality, let alone truthfulness, is based on consensus is rapidly turning WP into the largest collection of fansites on the www, with no regard for any POV but the most partisan.

thus, i agree wholeheartedly with your assertion that attempts to edit political, or almost any other, articles will be fruitless for any seeking to use WP to publish facts which do not conform to your 'neutral' pov.

other than those attempts which are yours, of course...

Yet, you and others of your editorial ilk continually put on the appearance of surprise that such page locking and reversion-hawking in order to eliminate edits you find disagreeable, and to those few fanatics who can afford to spend enough time on WP to 'earn' the coveted privileges regarding page locks, thus cabalistic control over WP content, result in WP pages differing little from the standard crap promulgated by Big News or found on myspace.

more real-life folks every day are learning to ignore WP due to precisely such attitudes displayed so contemptuously, patronizingly, and condescendingly, (as well as perfectly encapsulated), in your above 'advice' to any showing a desire to 'join with' and 'add to' the 'editorial consensus.'

Frankly, the resemblance between the manner in which WP 'editors' manage the 'editorial consensus' from within the shielding offered by their anonymous claims to their own 'editorial objectivity', and the manner in which Big News have done so the last 50 years or so, becomes daily more clear.

Howzzat for time wasting, my friend?

Ban me if you want. that just makes it easier to further ignore the dreck that WP is daily slipping into. (hey!: improper sentence ending. now you can inform me how poor are my usage and grammar.) Cheers!, --Whraglyn (talk) 22:38, 25 August 2008 (UTC)


 * I welcome incoherent rants on my talk page, but not on my user page. You are free to completely and utterly ignore Wikipedia, and look at any other website or publication you want.  And for your information, I'm not an admin and I can't ban you, block you, or lock pages.  Wasted Time R (talk) 00:02, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

Greetings. Just enjoyed some of the links on your media coverages. Congratulations and thanks for all your hard work here. HG | Talk 21:34, 26 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks. Wasted Time R (talk) 14:25, 27 August 2008 (UTC)

Grand Ole Opry's New Star
Great work on the rescue/cleanup job of Grand Ole Opry's New Star. I knew it could be done! Andrew Lenahan -  St ar bli nd  14:19, 27 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks. That was an insane AfD, but it's an interesting challenge to dig out stuff from 50 years ago ... Wasted Time R (talk) 14:26, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Well, I can see the reasoning behind the original AfD, as the article was in a pretty sad state at that time, but you've improved it immeasurably. By the way, I think this is the same album as "George Jones Sings His Greatest Hits", also released on Starday a few years later.  The track listing is exactly the same, just in a different order. Andrew Lenahan -  St ar bli nd  14:54, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks for cleaning that up for me. The print sources really helped; I had no access to print sources. Ten Pound Hammer  and his otters • (Broken clamshells • Otter chirps • HELP) 18:25, 27 August 2008 (UTC)

Dominant editor
Is it true that you described yourself as a  "dominant editor", who "is certainly always able to keep what they *don't* want out of" articles, such as the Hillary Clinton article? Just asking if the same thing is going on with you and the McCain article where out of "sheer power of will" you try to keep away things you personally "don't want" regardless of their importance and significance as compared to other quotes already in the article? Hobartimus (talk) 15:04, 27 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Yes, I stand by what I said in that interview: "So then I became the dominant, and gradually have been altering things to try to find the right balance in the article and its subarticles. I think there have been roughly the same number of "this is a whitewash!" versus "this is a hatchet job!" criticisms; this doesn't guarantee fairness, but at least might be indicative of it." The reason I don't want one class of things in articles like these is because they confuse short-sighted political debate with long-term biographical significance.  Such is the case with the Hillary-McCain quote you are so determined about.  Regarding the McCain article, I have lost many discussions and arguments about its content and form; if others agree with you and not me regarding this particular quote, I will lose that too.  But I don't think that will happen.  Wasted Time R (talk) 01:37, 28 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Of course you stand by it it's a nice interview, however I must ask something for my own benefit. Are you currently the dominant editor for the McCain article? I ask this exactly because I think most of the stuff is exactly correct in your interviews. So I would really only "Waste Time" trying to include something when the dominant editor "is certainly always able to keep what they *don't* want out of". Since you noticed that I'm so determined about the qoute (not really) I will post about that maybe a couple of times but certainly leave the rest to your dominance in case your response is affirmitive. Hobartimus (talk) 19:33, 28 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Some simple observation of the McCain article and talk page will tell you that it has two principal editors (one of them me), who sometimes agree and sometimes do not agree at all. I simply don't think there's a case for including this quote.  If you can convince other editors that it does belong, my view won't matter for much.  Wasted Time R (talk) 21:11, 28 August 2008 (UTC)

Clinton script glitch
Oops, sorry; I'll bring this to the attention of the script writers; thanks for bringing this to our attention (it's partly why I'm running the script at the moment—to perfect it). Tony  (talk)  02:58, 28 August 2008 (UTC)

HRC Campaign post mortem articles
I thought the newest one of this trio would interest you, with copies of internal memos, and links to other articles that  are most enlightening. It's now possible to write a "mistakes of planning and strategy" section/article for the campaign. And it shines a light on the effectivness of the Obama campaign committee for the beginning of drafting similar sections on that article. -- Yellowdesk (talk) 06:02, 1 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Yes, I read these pieces when they came out, along with some other good post-mortems. Reworking some of the HRC campaign material is high on my queue, once I get done with topical tasks such as expanding Geraldine Ferraro. Wasted Time R (talk) 19:46, 1 September 2008 (UTC)

NowCommons: Image:WhiteHouseTourAfter.jpg
Image:WhiteHouseTourAfter.jpg is now available on Wikimedia Commons as Commons:Image:White HouseTour.jpg. This is a repository of free media that can be used on all Wikimedia wikis. The image will be deleted from Wikipedia, but this doesn't mean it can't be used anymore. You can embed an image uploaded to Commons like you would an image uploaded to Wikipedia, in this case:. Note that this is an automated message to inform you about the move. This bot did not copy the image itself. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 01:27, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

Date autoformatting
Note that date autoformatting (wikilinking of full dates) is now deprecated, per MOS:SYL. Thus articles are being gradually changed to not use them. Yes, this is a big change that hasn't gotten much publicity, and that many editors are not aware of yet. Wasted Time R (talk) 23:43, 29 August 2008 (UTC)


 * You're right, I hadn't heard about that, and am planning to completely ignore it. That has to be the stupidest decision I've seen in a while, and have no doubt it will be changed back soon enough (and I may help to do so.)  Autoformatting of dates is one of the most useful features on Wikipedia, since it prevents a lot of pointless edit-warring on date formats.  In fact, the autoformatting should be extended to eliminate the BC/BCE dispute as well.  [16:26, September 2, 2008 UC Bill]


 * Well, I think date autoformatting would be a good thing, but it has to work for unregistered as well as registered users (via the browser locale setting, I've argued on MediaWiki) and it has to work via some markup mechanism other than linking (you want the date in the right format, you don't need or want the ability to click through to some day of the month, it just results in excess blue). The ultimate markup would include something to give alternate spellings as well, color vs colour etc., so those disputes on Anglo-American articles could go away too.  Wasted Time R (talk) 23:36, 2 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I've submitted a patch to bugzilla so that autoformatting of dates will work even when the dates aren't wikilinked. I disagree about the usefulness of wikilinked dates &mdash; I find them to be useful meta-data, and I do occasionally click through specifically to find out what else happened on that date &mdash; but since the majority seems to dislike the links, and since it makes more sense to have it be an editorial choice, I'll go with that approach.  I also agree about the spelling difference, and would add to that unit conversion.  If this first patch is accepted and proves popular, I'll consider submitting more.  --UC_Bill (talk) 19:41, 3 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks for the info. Could you tell me what the bugzilla number is, I'd be interested in seeing the approach you're taking.  As for metadata, I'd love to see more of it in WP, since right now we just have these many blobs of text, with no way of indexing them, coherently replicating them, no semantic tags, no nothing.  But I guess that's a whole other topic.  Wasted Time R (talk) 23:51, 3 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Here it is. The problem with trying to use the browser locale setting is that it would need to integrate with the parser cache mechanism, since the autoformatting isn't done each time the page is loaded but only when an edit is made.  One version of the page per preference setting is parsed, autoformatted, and cached after an edit.  I think it's still workable (by having the preference-checking code look at the locale setting prior to deciding which cached copy of the page to use) but it's not as simple as it would be without the cache.  I'm not going to bother working on it unless some consensus is reached that autoformatting should stay though, since I'd hate to do all the work and then have it left unused because of how some people hate autoformatting in general.  There's an argument (several actually) going on here and on that talk page, if you'd like to chime in.  Cheers!  --UC_Bill (talk) 15:20, 4 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Belated note that I was indeed familiar with this bugzilla, having commented on it in the past in favor of using the browser locale setting as the default for unregistered users. Hadn't known about the cache issue, but sounds like that can be overcome.  Have been tied up in various article talk disputes, but if I can get a handle on the whole MOS:SYL discussion, may try to comment there ...  Wasted Time R (talk) 13:32, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

Registered Democrat
I can't find the article now but I read somewhere that you are a card-carrying registered Democrat and public supporter of Hillary Clinton, an other article also had a picture of you. Did I understand the situation right? I guess this would show your opposition to the quote based on no research into it's notability or your attack on YoungTrigg (perhaps fishing there for a quote by the media?) in a much different light. And I think it's also not healthy for the developement of the article if a political opponent (you) plays such a dominant role in it's creation (talking about the McCain article). In case you did not publicly state that you support Hillary Clinton and I misread something please just remove this post as I'm going from memory here. Hobartimus (talk) 18:54, 2 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Card-carrying no, registered yes, public supporter no, voted for in primary yes. The opposition to your quote is for reasons I've stated several times; when politicians involved in primary fight say their opponent is worse than someone from the other party, it's always an expression of their real feeling about their opponent, not the other party's person.  I don't think I attacked Young Trigg, I just didn't like his/her "create a SPA for each new article worked on" approach (on WP not ideological grounds) and said so.  I stand by my work on the McCain articles; this is biography, not advocacy.  The main article before I started work on it was badly slanted against McCain in places and missing whole chunks of his career; you can see it here and judge for yourself whether it's been improved.  And I'm almost completely responsible for the Early life and military career of John McCain featured article; you're welcome to tell me what in that you think isn't "healthy".  Wasted Time R (talk) 23:54, 2 September 2008 (UTC)
 * OK, now I'm confused :) So you support or oppose McCain if you don't mind telling? By looking at the article it seems that you do great work overall it comes to little details it's harder to tell. I'm fascinated for a time by comparision of the articles on Obama and McCain and the differences between tone and how controversies are handled etc. On Young Trigg you wrote to him definitely after he was in huge media spotlight AND he already said he is 'done' and won't edit any more under that account and to boot as you noted you never had an interaction with him previously. But anyway the only remaining thing I'm intrested in (however your interviews are quite intresting) if you'd tell me if you oppose McCain or not. Hobartimus (talk) 08:25, 3 September 2008 (UTC)
 * You shouldn't be able to tell, that's the whole point. For me, or for any other editor.  As for the Obama and McCain articles looking different, that's Wikipedia for you.  The sets of editors working on them are largely disjoint.  But this isn't necessarily a bad thing.  I don't know what the best biography of Barry Goldwater is, but it probably doesn't look or read anything like the Caro biography of Lyndon Johnson.  Wasted Time R (talk) 11:50, 3 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Wasted Time R has done a superb job on both Hillary Rodham Clinton and John McCain, and a great deal of first-rate work on many subarticles and articles on other political figures all over the political spectrum, and his point is quite correct - you shouldn't be able to tell by his edits who he supports - and you can't. And it's no one's business who he votes for. Tvoz / talk 05:03, 4 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Oh come on. Enquiring minds want to know.  Will you at least tell us (yea or nay) whether you've decided whether you're going to vote for or against McCain?  :-) Ferrylodge (talk) 04:09, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

Palinsanity
Yeah, it makes the Obamathon seem positively sedate. I'll definitely have a look at Gerri. Meanwhile, this evening Greta Van Susteren was introducing a pre-recorded, not live (and therefore editable), Fox lovefest-documentary about Sarah, and she intoned - amazingly - that this year, for the first time (that is a quote), there's a chance that a woman will preside over the United States Senate as VP. Huh?? If I were Ferraro, I'd sue. Tvoz / talk 03:42, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Mondale/Ferraro never had a chance. Asher196 (talk) 03:45, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Maybe not, but that's lousy journalism - Greta should have qualified her statement. But on Fox, this passes for fair and balanced. Tvoz / talk 04:13, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
 * There is plenty of lousy journalism to go around. Olbermann and Matthews almost had an orgasm after hearing Obama's convention speech. Asher196 (talk) 04:21, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
 * You always have some chance, even if slight ... if the Ferraro husband taxes/finances issues hadn't existed, if Reagan had doddered in the second debate like he did in the first, if this, if that ... Wasted Time R (talk) 04:19, 7 September 2008 (UTC)

image glitch again
thanks and sorry. The images occur only very occasionally, and are a problem because they're so hard to pick out in the diff. I'm going to have to get Lightmouse and Gimmetrow to think of a way out of this. Perhaps they can make the double-square brackets and "Image:" turn red in the diff. Cheers. Tony  (talk)  16:17, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Your post has led to this suggestion. Tony   (talk)  16:27, 7 September 2008 (UTC)

Listen Mr R
Biden is, by far, the most respected and honoured man in the American election (more than Obama even more than Palin-even discounting the fact that she's not a man). Unlike that Lofties fellow, I want a dignified article but we need the information. His hair, his aneurysm, and his asthma are important. Just because someone has hair transplant or breast implants doesn't mean that's bad. It's only bad if we mock him or her. 903M (talk) 01:31, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

Response: I'll look into it. Also note that there are at least 50 pages of links if you google Joe Biden hair. Many of these are message boards about hair transplantation. They are not anti-Biden boards but men who are asking about Biden's hair because they have problems, too. The silence is deafening. He has had it. We need a very brief mention about it. Not a ha ha, he can't get an erection but just a matter of fact short phrase or sentence. 903M (talk) 01:40, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

About the hair, the San Francisco Examiner, a respected city paper and the Boston paper reference his hair. They don't stoop to National Enquirer levels. 903M (talk) 01:49, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

Is this the broken link? http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=940de5d81739f937a35756c0a96e948260

, I will AGF but you have twice removed correct information and replaced it with false information. See http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=940de5d81739f937a35756c0a96e948260 He had a 2nd brain surgery. Jimbo Wales says for living people, we MUST get it right. So correct information, please! Read the link and I hope you'll agree. If you think the NY Times should is an unreliable source, then say so. It is a very well respected newspaper. 903M (talk) 01:53, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

per your request
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=940de5d81739f937a35756c0a96e948260

(publlished May 4, 1988) here are some quotes.... Senator Joseph R. Biden Jr. underwent surgery today to correct an aneurysm in an artery that supplies blood to the right side of the brain, a spokesman for the Walter Reed Army Medical Center said. ...... after the operation, his second this year to correct an aneurysm .....The 4 1/2-hour procedure was similar to that performed Feb. 12 on the left side of Mr. Biden's brain

903M (talk) 02:02, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * OK, the problem here was your non-formatted citation didn't make clear you were pointing to a different NYT story from the first. That's what I and the other editor who reverted weren't understanding.   Wasted Time R (talk) 02:04, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

You should award me a cookie for finding an error in this article which is supposed to be so carefully written that it has no errors! :)  903M (talk) 02:07, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * No, I'm not going to give you a cookie. If you had calmly explained on the talk page that there was a second surgery three months after the first, the reversions and the stupid "stop sign" you put on my page above could have been avoided.  Wasted Time R (talk) 02:11, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

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Why Baby Why
Thanks for adding more info to this page. Also, I would say that it is indeed "from" the album, even if it predated the album by two years. Sometimes there's a longer gap between single and album; Jeff Carson, for instance, had a couple chart singles in 1998 that were from an album released in 2002. Ten Pound Hammer and his otters • (Broken clamshells • Otter chirps • HELP) 20:30, 12 September 2008 (UTC)

Political positions of John McCain
Hi.

I see you erased the stuff that I added about taxes to Political positions of John McCain.

I won't put it back into the article, because I don't want to get into an edit war.

However, the reason that I added it is because the paragraph right before it said that McCain's tax plan would cause tax revenues to fall. The reason that prediction is wrong, is because it doesn't take into account the fact that people alter their behavior in response to changing tax rates. Grundle2600 (talk) 22:26, 13 September 2008 (UTC)

I see you also erased my entries to Political positions of Barack Obama. Sigh. Grundle2600 (talk) 22:28, 13 September 2008 (UTC)


 * If you can find some reasonably objective study that uses dynamic scoring that comes up with a different estimate than the Tax Policy Center one that's currently in the McCain article, that would be okay. But Wall Street Journal editorials are famous for their rampant boosterism for one particular economic viewpoint that not everyone else shares, and thus cannot be used as sources.  Wasted Time R (talk) 22:44, 13 September 2008 (UTC)

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Biden
The truth is that the time has passed, and the nomination was removed from the page. I just haven't updated the Talk page as I've been busy. You can nominate it again, though - that's the best course of action I think. Minute Lake (talk) 13:13, 17 September 2008 (UTC)


 * OK, thanks, I understand that school year has started ... Wasted Time R (talk) 13:36, 17 September 2008 (UTC)
 * You're welcome. ;) --  ThinkBlue  (Hit BLUE) 23:07, 19 September 2008 (UTC)

Thanks
Thanks for fixing some problems on the Summer of '69 article. --Be Black Hole Sun (talk) 11:02, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

Hillary pic
Hi WTR, I have a question for you about the pic at the top of the Hillary Clinton article, if you've got a moment. Has anyone objected that her head is too small in proportion to the image as a whole? And what was the reaction to that objection? Thx for any assistance.Ferrylodge (talk) 06:04, 23 September 2008 (UTC)


 * No, don't remember an objection like that being raised. A number of people haven't like the picture, but usually because it doesn't look like her now, or because her expression seems a bit possessed, or something like that.  But we've retained it on the grounds that it's the most recent official-style face-forward Senate portrait of her.  Wasted Time R (talk) 11:05, 23 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Okay, thanks. The current pic at the top of the Palin article has about the same dimensions, and someone was saying the head was too small.Ferrylodge (talk) 18:52, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

The three pics of her overseas were all taken by the military, and so are public domain. In contrast, pics at the web site of the Alaska state government are not public domain. So, this is just the way it worked out. It just happens that the highest quality public-domain pics of her happen to be by the US military overseas.

As far as the top pic on the article, which one would you replace it with? I agree that it's not very sharp, but there are problems with the other available pics too.Ferrylodge (talk) 01:44, 24 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Yes, I know that the PD/fair use rules distorts our image distribution. But still.  There are at least ten different pictures of her in the article.  There's no way three overseas ones are justified; it's a gross example of undue weight.  The one of her in the mess hall, for example, is completely superfluous.  As for the top pic, the one before (blue parka) was better.  Wasted Time R (talk) 03:13, 24 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Maybe it would help to modify the picture captions so that it's not stated that she's overseas. I think the close-up of her in the mess hall is one of the best pics we've got of her, and same goes for the Ramstein close-up.  We simply haven't got other close-ups like that.  And, I think juxtapositioning the mess hall pic with the pic of her holding the weapon is kind of priceless.  Anyway, regarding the pic at the top, I certainly don't regard the present pic as a permanent solution, and I'll be vigilant to find a better one.  I disagree that the blue parka pic was better (she would be gazing away from the text and it's kind of informal with zipper and all); but, feel free to chime in at the talk page.  Everyone else has!Ferrylodge (talk) 04:21, 24 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Only one caption now indicates that she's overseas.Ferrylodge (talk) 01:19, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

Can we find a better photo?
Biden's official picture is so crappy. Can we find a better and more representative photo? I didn't want to say crappy on the article talk page. 903M (talk) 04:32, 24 September 2008 (UTC)

Don't think that I'm trying to fight you. Think that I am trying to make the best article possible. At times, I think outside the box, thinking "how can this improve". That's the sole reason for the picture discussion. Just because you said that nobody has complained about the photo doesn't mean my ideas are bad.

Nobody has complained about these articles. These two article are not very good. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hendursaga http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clifton_Young 903M (talk) 04:55, 25 September 2008 (UTC)


 * The reason no one complains about Hendursaga is that it's gotten 53 page views during this month. Clifton Young has gotten 243.  Meanwhile, Joe Biden has gotten 690,959.  If everyone was as shocked by his not wearing a tie as you, we would have heard about it.  Wasted Time R (talk) 05:00, 25 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I have job skills that less than 1,000 people have in the world (probably more like 500). So if there are 6 billion people in the world, that's 6 million people (or 12 million) per one of me.  That's much less than the 1:690,959 that you quote.  Of those 500 people, possibly I'm the only one to write for Wikipedia.  I am sure we have other super-specialised experts in Wikipedia. 903M (talk) 05:19, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

hotel california
Can you explain the song "Hotel California". I don't get it? 903M (talk) 05:24, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

You mean you're not going to explain it? Please, please, please. 903M (talk) 01:07, 26 September 2008 (UTC)


 * There's nothing I can say that wouldn't seem a bit trite. Great art is always abstract enough to allow multiple interpretations, so yours is more or less as good as mine and as Henley's.  But pretty certainly a desert vision of America in the mid-seventies, for starters, and how society had lost its way.  One of a piece with his "Last Resort" and "Boys of Summer" and "End of the Innocence" and so on.  Wasted Time R (talk) 02:28, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Palin Pic
Hi, After taking into consideration the feedback from other editors regarding the Carson City image at Sarah Palin, I have created a new version with the intent of pleasing those who have contributed to the discussions. The quality of the image has been significantly improved. I would appreciate your opinion here: []. Thanks, IP75 75.25.28.167 (talk) 20:31, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

Great work on Keating 5 article
I don't know how to give you a virtual cookie or medal or plaque or whatever, but I just want to tell someone that the Keating 5 article is one of the best wiki articles I've ever read, and your contributions look like they have been significant. It's lucid, compact, well-referenced. Kudos! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cheakamus (talk • contribs) 01:13, 26 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks very much. It's a hard article to write, given that the S&L scandal had a huge scope, Keating's actions took place over a long time span, and the final results were so diffuse.  But the article has gotten a big readership spike since the current financial crisis accelerated, so I'm trying ...  Wasted Time R (talk) 02:20, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

McCain category
Hi Wasted Time R. I think you made the right decision by moving the Jeopardy! bit to the "early life" subarticle, but the category belongs on the BLP article. Don't you think that Category:Jeopardy! contestants should only only show articles with persons as their subjects? I mean, an "early life" can't be a contestant. And McCain wasn't a "different person" in his early life. Robert K S (talk) 04:05, 28 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Moved to Talk:Early life and military career of John McCain and responded to there. Wasted Time R (talk) 13:29, 28 September 2008 (UTC)

903
Hi, sorry I genuinely had somehow missed your comment on my talk page until now. 903 has an interesting (and not the most endearing to other editors on articles) manner of communicating and is full of opinions. I have praised her for edits where she collaborates well with other editors, and encouraged her to develop this. However, infuriatingly, her suggestions often also have a point:) For instance, I don't know much about the McCain subject, but it appears other editors have acknowledged she had a point about the 1982 business and changed headings etc. Sticky Parkin 00:35, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

Re: Biden image
The older image is at a higher resolution. If there is a problem with its appearance, the brightness/color levels can be adjusted. In fact, I slightly darkened and increased the contrast of the old image based on your washed-out comment. --Tom (talk - email) 03:15, 29 September 2008 (UTC)

Hillary Clinton presidential campaign, 2008
This guy (both User:Iisxbi and User talk:67.160.164.94) is most likely trolling. At least he registered an account to do the trolling. Look at the edits: Special:Contributions/67.160.164.94. Especially this one and this one. I looks like he was blocked at one point and is trolling. Sigh. It is all very boring. --HoboJones (talk) 23:19, 2 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Yeah. An unwelcome flashback to when Hillary was a leading troll/vandal target.  Wasted Time R (talk) 23:23, 2 October 2008 (UTC)

Biden
Medical stuff is reported on Wikipedia. Even breast enlargements are mentioned in some people's articles. Hair loss is not shameful. I have long been opposed to any mention of it in a mocking sort of way. But for facts, we should have it.

You say that we don't know the exact year or type of transplant. What better reason to be vague and factual. Just mention that he has had hair transplantation. The Times (London) is one of the world's most respected newspaper and they say it. Like me, they don't mock Biden.

Even if someone (not saying you) wants only positive information about Biden, his hair loss is not shameful. Former Presidents George Bush (Senior), Nixon, Ford, Johnson, Roosevelt, all had substantial hair loss. A big paragraph is not appropriate. A short 6 word sentence is. We can even hide it in a new medical section, listing his asthma, brain surgery, and hair. 903M (talk) 03:30, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

About your debate edit that you just did, at least we can agree on one thing. Look, I want the article nice which I assume you do, too. We agree 95% of the time, just not on the hair. If he had Botox, I wouldn't be for that because it's temporary and doesn't do anything a fuzzy focus by a camera can't do. But hair stays there. Reagan's did he dye his hair or not was an issue. 903M (talk) 03:58, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

Don't ask me to do illegal things, please! :(
It is well documented that there was a controversy about Reagan's hair. The trouble is that there are no reliable sources that say he did or did not.

What you are asking me to do seems like a WP:POINT violation. I will not do a POINT violation.

Biden is different. There are many, many sources that confirm his surgery. Some of them are very reliable. 903M (talk) 04:06, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

Answering your question, we have no sources with the exact date and exact type of surgery for his brain so your requirement is not a necessary one for Wikipedia. Similarily, we have no exact description of his son's injuries in the car crash but it is reported in WP.

Furthermore, if we mention all the details we want, we turn the hair into a section, not the one sentence which I think should be the limit. 903M (talk) 04:15, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free media (Image:WMCA570970.gif)
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BLPs
WTR, if you get a chance, would you mind commenting here. There's a general and fundamental disagreement about how to write a BLP, so I started a thread at the BLP Noticeboard, but the only people commenting are the people who disagreed at the article in question (Palin). It's not a content dispute, but rather a disagreement about what the BLP rules mean. Some say that it's okay to insert material even if there's been a discussion that reached no consensus about whether to insert it, provided that the material is factually true and not private info about the subject. Others say that lack of consensus means the material ought to be kept out, if concerns have been expressed about undue weight or other guidelines. Also, any advice from you about how to resolve this question would be appreciated.Ferrylodge (talk) 20:10, 4 October 2008 (UTC)

Image:IndiaGateAtNight.jpg listed for deletion
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Thumbs up
Hi, thanks again for the explanation. You see, when I noticed that you I feature repeatedly in the discussion as a voice of reason, I checked your user page and let me say I was impressed: I've stopped hoping to see a Wikipedian so sane, informed, aware of Wikipedia's deficiencies - and yet able to do something about them. Barnstars from an unknown wikignome would be kinda meaningless, but I guess I might be good for a few seconds of teh warm fuzzy feeling (which is the most important thing anyway, right?). Actually, now that I see that you patrol the article, I might be tempted to fix a few details that irk me without fear of being reverted out of hand... --Kalupinka (talk) 14:17, 7 October 2008 (UTC)


 * OK, thanks for the kind words. I went through your wording and usage edits on John McCain, most were improvements, a few I disagreed with and backed out or revised, that's the way it goes ;-)  Wasted Time R (talk) 00:50, 8 October 2008 (UTC)

thanks
Thanks for finally having Charles Keating get into rational shape as an article! Collect (talk) 00:12, 18 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks, but there's a long way still to go. Wasted Time R (talk) 00:15, 18 October 2008 (UTC)


 * If you but knew the struggle I went through to get as far as I did -- and the personal attacks made on me. Collect (talk) 11:30, 18 October 2008 (UTC)

Apologies
Hello WT, you posted at McCain Talk: ''Writegeist, you've called me a string of names here. I don't intend to reply in kind [...]You've called me a censor, an article owner, a filibusterer, a hyena, a stooge, and a Republican. The last one really hurts!''

Censor, article owner, filibusterer: No. I simply explained where you were in violation of WP:FILIBUSTER,WP:CENSOR and WP:OWN. No name-calling there. Hyena: I used hyenas' occasional antagonism towards other members of their pack to illustrate the logical fallacy of arguing that your occasional antagonism towards another editor proves that you do not share a common interest in owning the article. And also, I must admit, to show my aversion to that particular common interest. Had I known that merely directing your attention to certain WP rules and guidelines would cause you to feel you were being attacked with insulting names, I would not, of course, have used the hyena metaphor. Or at least, should not have. I apologize for offending your sensibilities. Stooge: used as a synonym for "shill", and applied also, you will note, in the same context, to myself. I did not take any offense at it myself but I fully accept that you did, for which again I apologize. Republican: You're right, that is profoundly wounding and no honorable person would tolerate it. I apologize, but I know it's woefully insufficient. It is only fair that you be permitted to choose: pistols, sabers or wet kippers at dawn? — Writegeist (talk) 18:48, 18 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Look, I've been working on political pages here for a long time, and I've been called worse. I wasn't offended; I just pointed out the names to indicate that we weren't getting very far in our discussions.  As to the particulars, I may be guilty of a few (but not most) of the items in the tendentious editing list, but that pretty much comes with the territory in these kind of articles.  I believe censorship is something governments do and is not at issue here.  I don't own the John McCain article and I assure you that my disagreements with Ferrylodge are far more than occasional.  But the hyena metaphor was actually pretty imaginative of you and I should have saluted it at the time!  I've been accused of shilling for a variety of political figures with opposite viewpoints and partisan affiliations, so that one doesn't hold water either.  As for the last, just your kind offer of a duel will suffice to make amends.  Wasted Time R (talk) 19:22, 18 October 2008 (UTC)


 * An actual duel would be much more enjoyable for spectators. :-)  In the mean time, we'll have to settle for Palin on SNL tonight, and Powell on Meet the Press tomorrow.Ferrylodge (talk) 03:03, 19 October 2008 (UTC)

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AfD nomination of Christina Aguilera Latin American Tour 2001
I have nominated Christina Aguilera Latin American Tour 2001, an article you created, for deletion. I do not think that this article satisfies Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion, and have explained why at Articles for deletion/Christina Aguilera Latin American Tour 2001. Your opinions on the matter are welcome at that same discussion page; also, you are welcome to edit the article to address these concerns. Thank you for your time. Rwiggum (Talk /Contrib ) 20:45, 21 October 2008 (UTC)   Rwiggum  (Talk /Contrib ) 20:45, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

AfD nomination of What Will the Neighbours Say? Live
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AfD nomination of The Cheetah Girls tours
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John McCain presidential campaign, 2000
I am reviewing John McCain presidential campaign, 2000 for GA status. Please take a look at Talk:John McCain presidential campaign, 2000/GA1 for the review. Anonymous101 (talk) 09:23, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Placed on hold to await improvements required. Anonymous101 (talk) 12:13, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for addressing my concerns. I have promoted that article to GA status. Congratulations! Anonymous101 (talk) 16:33, 25 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks very much! Wasted Time R (talk) 16:45, 25 October 2008 (UTC)

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?
Speaking of things premature....Ferrylodge (talk) 01:03, 29 October 2008 (UTC)


 * The count in my "my preferences" page says 40,088. Don't know why this other count is less; maybe it doesn't include the impressive 866 "deleted edits" (concert tour articles are perpetual AfD bait) and some other stuff.  Anyway, I made a thousand edits as IP addresses before I knew for sure what my username should be, so I know I'm over the 40,000 mark one way or the other.  Wasted Time R (talk) 01:12, 29 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Okay, congratulations. :-)Ferrylodge (talk) 01:13, 29 October 2008 (UTC)

Thanks
> And I'll never criticize Henrik, given how many times I've used the wonderful page view count tool!

Thanks, I'm glad you find it useful :) (Though that's not a very good reason not to criticize me if I happen to do something silly) henrik  • talk  13:00, 30 October 2008 (UTC)

WP:TFAR for Nov.4, Nov.5
Your name was brought up at WP:TFAR as a main editor of John McCain. In particular, there is some support for having a double "Today's Featured Article" of McCain and Obama (see Wikipedia_talk:Today%27s_featured_article/requests) on Nov. 4 or Nov. 5

There are some serious issues here inlcuding Obama being on TFAR 4 years ago, no precedent for a double TFAR, likely vandalism, various alledged biases, ...

If you wanted to nominate this, your nomination (especially if you haven't had a previous TFAR) might be the key. On the other hand, if you were opposed, that might have a major effect as well.

It's an interesting idea and I'd be glad to see what you think.

Smallbones (talk) 15:39, 30 October 2008 (UTC)

Image copyright problem with Image:SixthAvenueElevatedAtThirdSt1928.jpg
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Later
The McCain article is now full-protected for the duration, and will be featured on the main page tomorrow with the Obama article. As I said previously, you ought to be very proud of your diligent work on the McCain article. McCain has an outside shot to win tomorrow, but Obama seems to have the edge. See you after the storm.Ferrylodge (talk) 00:41, 4 November 2008 (UTC)


 * You've certainly been diligent as well. But the locking of the main article just means that nonsense spreads out to the subarticles and auxiliary articles, so my watchlist will still need watching ...  Wasted Time R (talk) 01:10, 4 November 2008 (UTC)

Image copyright problem with Image:WPATgaslight.gif
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Orphaned non-free media (Image:ChemistryTourPoster.jpg)
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John McCain presidential campaign, 2008
A request for mediation has been filed with the Mediation Committee that lists you as a party. The Mediation Committee requires that all parties listed in a mediation must be notified of the mediation. Please review the request at Requests for mediation/John McCain presidential campaign, 2008, and indicate whether you agree or disagree to mediation. If you are unfamiliar with mediation on Wikipedia, please refer to Mediation. Please note there is a seven-day time limit on all parties responding to the request with their agreement or disagreement to mediation. Thanks, Regards. FangedFaerie ( Talk  |  Edits ) 06:14, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

thanks!
Appreciate the star ... am re-charging and getting ready for the fun ahead. Tvoz / talk 23:35, 7 November 2008 (UTC)

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Harding, Kennedy, Obama
Nitpicking, I know. Many sources claim Harding's Senate term ended March 3, 1921 (not sure why his article says begining in January 15, 1915), 12 hrs before he became President. Kennedy resigned from the Senate 'bout 2-month before he became President. Assuming Obama resigns from the Senate before Noon EST, January 20th, 2009. Nobody moved directly from the Senate to the Presidency. GoodDay (talk) 23:02, 9 November 2008 (UTC)
 * PS - Why does CNN continue to say, the Democrats will control the 3 Branches of government? The Democrats don't/won't control the Judiciary Branch. GoodDay (talk) 23:04, 9 November 2008 (UTC)

PPS - Thank goodness Wikipedia got'em right. GoodDay (talk) 23:12, 9 November 2008 (UTC)


 * The first refers to the position you hold when you're elected, obviously, not when you actually assume the office. The second is wrong, also obviously; sometimes you see "the three houses of government", which is a little closer. Wasted Time R (talk) 23:14, 9 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I kinda figured CNN ment White House, Senate & House; they gotta be more careful & accurate. What's the scoop on Harding's Senate term; did it end March 3 or 4, 1921. I've noticed the Represenatives & Senators pre-1933 biographies tend to have their terms ending on March 3 (IMO, it should be March 4). A date which is reflected on the United States Congress articles (up 'til 1933). GoodDay (talk) 23:21, 9 November 2008 (UTC)
 * No clue on what the term-ending dates were back then. Wasted Time R (talk) 23:22, 9 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Okie Dokie. GoodDay (talk) 23:34, 9 November 2008 (UTC)

Joe Biden presidential campaign, 1988
Nice job.--William Saturn (talk) 00:43, 12 November 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks. Wasted Time R (talk) 00:45, 12 November 2008 (UTC)

AfD nomination of The Roger Rabbit (dance)
I have nominated The Roger Rabbit (dance), an article that you created, for deletion. I do not think that this article satisfies Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion, and have explained why at Articles for deletion/The Roger Rabbit (dance). Your opinions on the matter are welcome at that same discussion page; also, you are welcome to edit the article to address these concerns. Thank you for your time. --EEMIV (talk) 17:45, 12 November 2008 (UTC)

Info box names
I'm really appreciated for your input at the Obama talk page (even so the thread should be at a more general page like wp:MOS (for example). Again, thanks, --The Magnificent Clean-keeper (talk) 23:24, 12 November 2008 (UTC)

Ron Paul
Ron Paul has been nominated for a featured article review. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets the featured quality. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Remove" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Reviewers' concerns are here. --Andrew Kelly (talk) 05:22, 13 November 2008 (UTC)

NBWA
Think some of your research on the Hensley & Co. article could be put to good use on the NBWA article, which is currently a slightly edited version of their "about us" page. 70.26.0.154 (talk) 04:45, 18 November 2008 (UTC)


 * Uh, yes, looks like WP:COI and WP:V and WP:NPOV are at play there. Wasted Time R (talk) 04:51, 18 November 2008 (UTC)

Hey!
I stumbled across your page with Tony Bennett's new Christmas album while doing some random clicking and noticed you left off the song composer info temporarily. I located the AllMusic page for the album and put it in (some slight changes to track times from it too), added the AllMusic link, and such. See if the page now is to your liking. =)

I removed the reference to "The Count Basie Big Band" in the infobox. If you have it there, in the Artist item, then what will happen is the infobox disc. section says "Tony Bennett and The Count Basie Big Band discography" when it's actually only Bennett's discography. I see that they've done other albums together, so if you want to list their chronology together separately, go for it and use the "Extra chronology 2" template. I can help with that, if you wish; you can also list Bennett's Christmas chronology, making THREE sets of discographies. (Your page does not state you're an admin., so I hope I'm right in giving this advice. I've done a lot of these templates recently. ^_^ )

Cheers, and thanks for posting this album. I didn't know about it initially. =)

CycloneGU (talk) 03:11, 22 November 2008 (UTC)


 * OK, thanks. I did the initial article in a hurry and so didn't get to the songwriters.  As for the infobox, yes I've seen those extra chrono templates too, but I don't think they're warranted here, since the other ones they did were in the 1950s.  And I think his last Christmas album before this was in the 1960s.  But if someone puts them in I wouldn't object either.  Wasted Time R (talk) 05:03, 22 November 2008 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free media (Image:ArkansasChildrensHospitalLogo.jpeg)
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Opinion on footnotes
Hey Wasted, it's good to talk to you again. I've been working on the Margaret Thatcher article pretty recently and now it's up for GA. The reviewer moved all the footnotes within one sentence to the end of that sentence. Many sentences had multiple footnotes which supported different parts of the sentence. By moving them all to the end, readers and editors are unable to know which cite supports what in the sentence. I asked him why and he said it was to make it more "FA worthy", or something along those lines (see User talk:Happyme22). I know that the Reagans and Pat Nixon don't have all the footnotes at the end of the sentences and I remember some discussion regarding this at John McCain. If it's not too troubling, could I get your opinion on the matter? My best, Happyme22 (talk) 00:23, 25 November 2008 (UTC)


 * Responded to on your talk page's Thatcher section. Wasted Time R (talk) 00:52, 25 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks Wasted. I'll talk to you sometime soon, hopefully :) --Happyme22 (talk) 01:29, 25 November 2008 (UTC)

Joe Biden
Thanks for researching the facts of Biden. Generally, this project includes restraints. If they have done something significant here or annual, I include them in the project. For example, I included the first George Bush because he earned his wings in Hyannis. Bill Clinton summered in Marthas Vineyard. I included him because he seems to have vacationed here during this holiday for at least ten years. Kevin Rutherford (talk) 02:53, 28 November 2008 (UTC)

Out of curiosity
How does this look?  Just tips me hat but then 〜on thoght bows deeply   20:46, 30 November 2008 (UTC)


 * Even worse. Now, some of the regular text is bleeding into the ToC.  I'm not sure what problem you're trying to solve here ... whitespace isn't the end of the world.  In fact, WP's basic layout emphasizes whitespace, for example for longer articles the whole left side frame is unused once you get past the toolbox and foreign language links.  Cramming text into every nook and cranny of an article's layout is not a useful goal, IMHO.  Wasted Time R (talk) 20:52, 30 November 2008 (UTC)
 * To mimic um I guess Amber Lee Ettinger (mimicking Tina Fey mimicking -- nevermind -- )....."o-kee....."   Just tips me hat but then 〜on thoght bows deeply   20:59, 30 November 2008 (UTC)

Wow, live and learn, I guess
Are you on a palm held device? 'Cause, for example, at "Rudy Giuliani" as viewed on my laptop, there could be yet again another "navbar" sandwiched in, in the middle before there would even begin to be any squishing of even Rudy's longest of Table of Contents entries, "Documentaries, topic pages and databases." IAC, which ones do ya suggest I undo. All of em?  Just tips me hat but then 〜on thoght bows deeply   21:36, 30 November 2008 (UTC)


 * No, I'm on a regular-sized IBM R52 laptop. Again, I don't know what problem you're trying to solve here, by changing so many articles without being able to test how the changes affect rendering in different types of browsers.  Wasted Time R (talk) 22:06, 30 November 2008 (UTC)

Invitation for comment
Hello Wasted Time R, I currently have a workpage up for a detailed ANI that I intend to file reporting csloat for disruptive editing. The first incident that I am citing is one that I was not involved in; it pertains to a page protection that was applied a little over a month ago on the John McCain presidential campaign, 2008 article. This is the first of several incidents that I will report, so this is a work in progress. Since you were more involved in this one, I was wondering if you could review my current write up for this section and provide any commentary if you have the time. The workpage is tongue-in-cheekly named User:Amwestover/Swiftboating. Any comments or input would be greatly appreciated. Thanks! --Amwestover (talk|contrib) 02:42, 2 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Sorry, I'm not going to get involved in the long edit war and personal attacks over this article. None of the content you've been battling over is anywhere near important enough to justify this amount of bickering and article lockdowns.  Wasted Time R (talk) 02:47, 2 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Thank you for the reply, and I can understand your reasoning. I'd like to say that my intention with this is to end all those things you just mentioned, and that the intent is to focus on behavior, not content. I hope that this will somehow be accomplish by the ANI. --Amwestover (talk|contrib) 03:19, 2 December 2008 (UTC)

Caroline
Hey there - if you're looking for an article that needs work, Caroline Kennedy can use some - I've been getting some refs, but in general it could use your special touch, if you're getting bored. Especially if she gets the job. Tvoz / talk 00:19, 6 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Yes, I can see it needs work. As it happens, I just embarked on trying to improve Charles Rangel, which is a total embarrassment.  But in my usual fashion, I started at the beginning and got interested in his first 40 years, and I haven't even reached his first House term!  Much less cleaning up all the recentism.  And I still haven't worked on the last two sections of the Ferraro article.  And I still haven't written the last part of the campaign in the McCain main article.  And I still haven't finished uploading all the useful photos from my Arkansas trip.  And I still haven't ... arrgghhhh!! ;-)  Wasted Time R (talk) 00:34, 6 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Hey, that's dedication - you went to Arkansas just to improve Hillary's article? I'm impressed. I still intend to take a look at Gerri.... one of these days.... Tvoz / talk 00:44, 6 December 2008 (UTC)


 * We went for other reasons – mini-vacation, see the new Clinton Presidential Center, get one state closer to having been in all 50 (am at 47 now), see Hot Springs National Park which I've wanted to go to for decades, see the Little Rock Central High School national historic site, etc. – but taking photos that I could use in articles here was definitely on my mind. Indeed I spent so much time scoping out Rose Law Firm one morning that someone came out and interrogated me!  I told them the truth ("Heard of Wikipedia, the online encyclopedia?  I'm a writer for it, and I'm trying to ..."), which the person clearly didn't believe.  The tourist bureau in the state puts out a "Billgrammage" pamphlet and 'passport' which points one to a lot of the Clinton sites, but some of my photos need Early life and career of Bill Clinton and Governorship of Bill Clinton articles to have a home – such as the McDonald's that he used to stop at for a snack while on his jogging runs from the state capitol!  Wasted Time R (talk) 01:04, 6 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Ha! You're lucky they didn't arrest you! Tvoz / talk 02:08, 6 December 2008 (UTC)

Image:WideOpenSpacesSongSheetMusic.jpg listed for deletion
An image or media file that you uploaded or altered, Image:WideOpenSpacesSongSheetMusic.jpg, has been listed at Images and media for deletion. Please see the to see why this is (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry), if you are interested in it not being deleted. Ten Pound Hammer and his otters • (Broken clamshells • Otter chirps • HELP) 20:29, 10 December 2008 (UTC)

I invite your comment
Here: Template talk:Obama family. Thanks.  Just tips me hat but then 〜on thought bows deeply …  23:22, 14 December 2008 (UTC)

McCain campaign
Thanks for "spiffing" up the bit about the TV ad. I understand your point about the parens, and don't object. It's clear to me, though, that the work "attack" when used in connection with the word "ad", is not NPOV, hence my edit. At any rate, thanks. Newguy34 (talk) 00:32, 17 December 2008 (UTC)

Disputed non-free use rationale for Image:FifthDimensionWeddingBellBluesClip.jpg
Thank you for uploading Image:FifthDimensionWeddingBellBluesClip.jpg. However, there is a concern that the rationale provided for using this image on Wikipedia may not meet the criteria required by Non-free content. This can be corrected by going to the image description page and add or clarify the reason why the image qualifies under this policy. Adding and completing one of the templates available from Non-free use rationale guideline is an easy way to ensure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy. Please be aware that a non-free use rationale is not the same as an image copyright tag; descriptions for images used under the non-free content policy require both a copyright tag and a non-free use rationale.

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Jersey Girl (song)
Great job with the improvements to this article! --Oakshade (talk) 19:58, 21 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks. And thanks to you for un-redirecting it.  I had it watchlisted, but somehow missed when TenPoundHammer took it down.  Wasted Time R (talk) 22:28, 21 December 2008 (UTC)

I made this change change to Jersey Girl (song) based on a comparison of the lyrics (see references). Could you verify that this fits with your book reference (or just that it's correct :-)? The old text didn't seem to make much sense to me ("replac[ing] a Waits line about "whores on Eighth Avenue" with a line about taking "that little brat of yours and drop[ping] her off at your mom's."). --Manscher (talk) 12:01, 23 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Yes, that's correct, I should have made this clearer in the original go-around of the article. Note however that I've deleted the footnotes to lyricsfreak, because per WP:ELNEVER we can't give links to sites that practice copyright violations.  Wasted Time R (talk) 13:05, 23 December 2008 (UTC)

CA-32
Good point. We can't be sure Solis will be confirmed. Do you know, by the way, if she said she would resign if/when confirmed? I know Clinton did. Some nominees resign ahead of time, and some wait. I really don't know. I think the language you just added should do the trick for now.—Markles 15:06, 26 December 2008 (UTC)


 * I don't remember seeing anything regarding when she would resign. Wasted Time R (talk) 15:13, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

MCain citation templates
Hi. On templates - I realize that "work" and "publisher" work differently; I do try to use "work" for the name of the appropriate publication that the article is printed in. I used to use cite web for most everything, but have tried to go to the ones more specific for type of reference - which might be helpful in automatically taking on new formatting, etc. cite magazine redirects to cite journal. Guess it is just the gnomish part of me - as an article is moving up the quality latter, consistency seems to be reviewed with more detail, so things that are easy fixes can be helpful - especially in FAR where the fine-toothed comb seems to come out. BTW - very interesting article. &mdash; ERcheck (talk) 22:44, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Disputed non-free use rationale for Image:FifthDimensionWeddingBellBluesClip.jpg
Thank you for uploading Image:FifthDimensionWeddingBellBluesClip.jpg. However, there is a concern that the rationale provided for using this image on Wikipedia may not meet the criteria required by Non-free content. This can be corrected by going to the image description page and add or clarify the reason why the image qualifies under this policy. Adding and completing one of the templates available from Non-free use rationale guideline is an easy way to ensure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy. Please be aware that a non-free use rationale is not the same as an image copyright tag; descriptions for images used under the non-free content policy require both a copyright tag and a non-free use rationale.

If it is determined that the image does not qualify under the non-free content policy, it might be deleted by an administrator within a few days in accordance with our criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions, please ask them at the media copyright questions page. Thank you. Stifle (talk) 15:48, 30 December 2008 (UTC)

Screenshot image
Regarding File:FifthDimensionWeddingBellBluesClip.jpg, okay, I'm not going to go around on this yet again, I give up, go ahead and do what you will. Wasted Time R (talk) 15:56, 30 December 2008 (UTC)
 * I've transferred the listing to IFD to get a community opinion. Please do understand, though, that non-free images are only used when they are a major aid to understanding an article. Stifle (talk) 16:00, 30 December 2008 (UTC)

Hanoi Hilton comment
Regarding your comment at Talk:Hanoi Hilton about people incorrectly believing not all prisoners were returned, your input on the RfC at Talk:Missing in action would be most useful. Wasted Time R (talk) 17:18, 31 December 2008 (UTC)


 * I made myself dizzy trying to follow your Missing in action edit war with ToTheCircus, who seems to have had the last edit on Dec 21 (an edit which needs to be reverted). I like your separate article on the Vietnam War POW/MIA issue, which for some reason ToTheCircus doesn't seem to have bothered.


 * I don't really have any hard information on this topic, but I will put my two cents in, as requested. HowardMorland (talk) 18:35, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

Joe Biden/stroke survivor
Hi. I've started a discussion on the talk page about whether Joe Biden should be described as a 'stroke survivor'. I reckon the category fits. - Richard Cavell (talk) 21:53, 31 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Responded to there. Wasted Time R (talk) 22:11, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

Last names
I don't make fun of other peoples' last names, for reasons you doubtless are aware. :-)Ferrylodge (talk) 20:49, 1 January 2009 (UTC)