Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Africa/Archive 9

Africa stubs
The Africa stub tag is being placed on articles that are clearly not stubs (e.g. Yorùbá, Fulani Empire). I think rather than relying on a category for articles that are too short it would be better to have a simple list of articles that could use expansion. - SimonP 18:00, Dec 7, 2004 (UTC)

Copied from User talk:SimonP: Stub defines a stub as "a very short article, generally of one paragraph or less." Stub messages are not for any article that needs expansion, but rather for articles that are so short they aren't even real articles. I see what you are trying to do with Category:Africa-related stubs, but I feel a better solution would be a list at Africa-related articles in need of expansion. Such a list could be broader in scope than just stubs, and could also be annotated so that exactly what is missing can be pointed it. - SimonP 18:16, Dec 7, 2004 (UTC)


 * Thanks for the detail. I did wonder about that a wee. Great idea for the list.


 * BTW, why did you also take out Category:Sultan of Sokoto from the Usman Dan Fodio article? That's going to have a lot more members than Category:Kings of Iran, for example. &mdash;iFaqeer (Talk to me!) 20:08, Dec 7, 2004 (UTC)

Notice
The past few days I've been adding new maps and satellite pictures to some articles in the Great Lakes (Africa) region (notably Lake Kyoga, Lake Albert, Lake George (Uganda), Talk:Lake Victoria) and in the Nubia region (Aswan dam, Lake Nasser). More are to come. Now I noticed that those articles are mostly stubs &mdash; maybe this is a good reason to start expanding them! &mdash; mark &#9998; 14:22, 11 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Algeria news
Thought this might be a good place to announce that I'm more than halfway through Algerian civil conflict - other editors welcome! - Mustafaa 23:51, 28 Feb 2005 (UTC)
 * Great! I'll take a look as and when I can. &mdash;iFaqeer (Talk to me!) 06:38, Mar 1, 2005 (UTC)

Neglected topic
I just put up a tiny stub on Zanj, a rather important historical state, surprisingly neglected until now. Anyone who knows more about this, please help it expand.--Pharos 17:30, 5 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Africa geo-stub split-up
Further to the comments I put on the board a day or two about subcategories of Africa-geo-stub, you might like to see where things stand (and join in the debate) at WikiProject_Stub_sorting/Criteria. Grutness|hello? 08:02, 15 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * As it turned out, there were some 800 geo-stubs from Africa (excluding the existing separate South Africa category), but no one country had more than 50 - not really enough for separate stub categories (yet, but possibly in the future if this number grows). In the end it was decided to split Africa geo-stubs into five regions, with the following three comments:


 * 1) The general africa-geo-stub can still be used for those unsure with the exact location of countries;
 * 2) stub growth may see individual countries split off these categories at a later stage;
 * 3) The SA-geo-stub (for South Africa) will also continue in use, wih that category a subcategory of borth "Africa geography stubs" and "Southern Africa geography stubs".
 * The general form of the stub template is simply AfricaX-geo-stub, where X is the initial of North, West, Central, East, or Southern. This allows for easy editing of generic Africa-geo-stubs into the more specific subcategories. Grutness|hello? [[Image:Grutness.jpg|25px|]] 04:55, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)

South Africa meetup
Please see Meetup/Pretoria for details of a Wikimedia meetup in South Africa. Angela. 12:20, Apr 3, 2005 (UTC)

Wikiportal
I noticed that a Wikiportal Africa has been created: Wikiportal/Africa! Great work! &mdash; mark &#9998; 19:24, 7 May 2005 (UTC)

WikiProject Cricket/Collaboration of the fortnight
WikiProject Cricket is launching a collaboration of the fortnight. All cricket-loving Wikipedians are invited to come along and help choose our first collaboration and, of course, to help in the collaboration itself.

Also, if you are interested in helping improve and expand WP's cricket coverage, please feel free to sign up to the Cricket WikiProject. Kind regards, jguk 18:42, 15 May 2005 (UTC)

Breakfast
Breakfast has been expanded to cover most of the world thanks to CSB contributors, but there is no section on Africa. What do people from Africa eat for breakfast?--nixie 08:29, 21 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * I've added a short section. My knowledge is limited to Cameroon, though, so others should contribute, as well. BrianSmithson 12:41, 14 July 2005 (UTC)

African perspective on general topics
The breakfast article is only one of many examples of how Wikipedia articles on general topics neglects the African perspective. In many cases, the Wikipedia articles focus on the situation in the U.S. and UK only. Other examples are closely-related dinner, as well as totally different subjects such as Freedom of speech Journalism scandals and Trade union. A list of articles lacking a global perspective is found at Countering Systemic Bias project. In many cases, adding an overview or an example from an African country can be done by anyone with a general experience of everyday life in the region. I think this is an important task, as it would serve to remind readers of the existence of Africa. As it is now, you could get the impression that concepts such as lawyers, policemen and traffic congestion do not exist outside the Western world. / Alarm 09:03, 21 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * The same holds for Beekeeping and Market town, which I stumbled upon lately when I was writing articles on some hunter-gatherer societies and ancient trading towns. It's a little disheartening sometimes. &mdash; mark &#9998; 09:33, 21 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Indeed. Would it be OK to add a few of these articles to the To-do list on the project page? / Alarm 20:33, 22 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Lang-stub split-up for African languages
Three special stub categories exist now for the three major African language families: (There are too few Khoi-San languages to merit its own stub category; the treshold seems to be 60-70 potential articles.)
 * nc-lang-stub for Niger-Congo language stubs
 * aa-lang-stub for Afro-Asiatic language stubs
 * ns-lang-stub for Nilo-Saharan language stubs

Use them! &mdash; mark &#9998; 21:13, 22 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Wikipedians living in African countries
Hello,

I am seeking to enter in contact with editors on the english wikipedia, living in African countries. This is at the same time for Wikimania and to prepare a report on African participation to Wikipedia. If you fit the profile, or know someone who fits the profile, please contact me on my user talk page or by email at anthere9ATyahoo.com

Thanks.

Anthere 05:40, 24 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * Be sure to contact, see for example this great picture he provided. is just back from Cameroon. Did you leave your message at Talk:South Africa also? There are quite a few South-Africans contributing.  might know more, and  is from SA also. Also,  might be living in somewhere in the Puntland region. I met a few Kenyans and Tanzanians at East African topics, but they were contributing anonymously and don't seem to be active anymore.  lives in Ghana according to Wikipedians by region; see also this and this list. &mdash; mark &#9998; 09:10, 24 Jun 2005 (UTC)


 * I don't know the location of User:Agurzil and User:Ameno, but they're both North African, as is User:Khalid hassani. - Mustafaa 23:50, 24 Jun 2005 (UTC)


 * See Wikipedians/South_Africa for a list of South African editors on the english wikipedia --Jcw69 13:07, 25 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for all the names :-) I could not comment yesterday as wiki was read-only and this morning is time to go to work, but I'll contact these guys later today. I already know Guaka and Khalil (both are french-speaking) but not the other ones. So, great :-) Anthere 28 June 2005 06:03 (UTC)

Slight change in Africa-geo-stubs
There has been a very minor change to the Africa geo-stubs. Up until now, all Indian Ocean island groups normally associated with Africa have been categorised as Southern Africa for the sake of geo-stub articles. The Seychelles have now been moved to East Africa, mainly because, well, they are east, and mostly far further north that any of the countries listed as southern Africa. Since this only currently affect four stubs, it is a very minor piece of fine-tuning. Also, it is possible that in the next couple of months several countries will be split off with their own geo-stubs - several African countries are getting fairly close to the threshold normally used by WP:WSS. Grutness...  wha?  07:24, 25 Jun 2005 (UTC)
 * There are now three new country-specific geo-stubs for African countries, listed on the project page. Grutness...  wha?  08:35, 14 July 2005 (UTC)
 * A Nigeria-specific geo-stub has also now been added. Note that someone outside the Stub sorting WikiProject has created a Rwanda-geo-stub, but it may yet be deleted if it does not conform to stub-sorting conventions (it is currently up for debate at WP:WSS/D). Grutness...  wha?  08:19, 11 August 2005 (UTC)

African COTW
Revolución has created an African COTW for anyone interested. Falphin 7 July 2005 23:00 (UTC)
 * African Collaboration of the Week &mdash; mark &#9998; 7 July 2005 23:04 (UTC)

Ethnic group template
I'm ready to write another article on a Cameroonian ethnic group (this time the Duala). There's a wiki template for ethnic groups out there somewhere, though, and I'd like to use it. Can anyone point me to the thing? I know that Zulu uses the infobox part of the template, but I'm not sure if the whole article is written to conform to it. Thanks! BrianSmithson 01:14, 16 July 2005 (UTC)
 * I believe you are looking for WikiProject Ethnic Groups Template. - SimonP 01:37, July 16, 2005 (UTC)

Symphony of Fire
I'm looking for imformation about the Symphony of Fire held in Capetown, South Africa. Was it also sponserd by Benson & Hedges? Are there other Symphony of Fire events around the world? I can find only very little information. Thanks for your help. &#0149;Zhatt&#0149; 23:09, July 27, 2005 (UTC)

New Cultures of Africa template
I created a new template for African cultures.

culture-africa

Naming convention for African cities
I have proposed a naming convention for African cities at Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (city names). It basically restates current practice; I would appreciate any comments on it. Warofdreams 15:18, 8 August 2005 (UTC)

Deletion list
Hi folks,

I just wanted to let you know that there is a list of transcluded deletion debates on Africa-related articles. You can find it here: WikiProject Deletion sorting/Africa. The list also contains sublists for individual countries.

If you find this list useful, please help to keep it up to date by archiving old items and adding new ones. Thanks!

By the way, new members are needed at WikiProject Deletion sorting. Hope to see you there!

-- Visviva 17:42, 15 August 2005 (UTC)

Left-wing Politics in Africa
It has been noted on the Talk:Left-wing politics page that Africa is noticably missing from the discussion of the left. If any one has any information on this, particulary on how the national liberation movments saw themselves as left-wing/communist please contribute to the page.--JK the unwise 12:58, 16 August 2005 (UTC)

Anyone speak German?
I found a website with a large number of pictures from the German colonial period in Cameroon. These photographs would be wonderful additions to a number of Cameroon-related articles, and I'd like to ask the website owner where they came from (they appear to have been scanned in from a book). Problem is the site's in German. Is there anyone here who can help me out by contacting this person? (Or is it safe to assume a web-savvy German probably knows English?) Thanks. . . . BrianSmithson 03:17, 31 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Hi Brian. Here you have the machine translation of the website in English. It's poorly translated but it would help somehow. . Interesting pictures. -- Svest 16:55, August 31, 2005 (UTC) Wiki me up&#153;
 * It's safe to assume he knows at least basic English; if he does not, I can help. [[Image:Flag of Austria.svg|15px]] ナイトスタリオン ✉ 09:18, 29 October 2005 (UTC)

Current events in Africa
The Current events in Africa page has been revived. It serves to compile current events related to Africa. Please add to your watchlist and check out this page for news and updates, and contribute if you like to. Cheers. --Vsion 00:53, 15 October 2005 (UTC)

Pictures
I've been looking through Wikimedia commons and adding pictures to some African country articles. There are many more there which would look great in some of the articles. Cfitzart 11:03, 22 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Good job. However, I don't recommend the use of those pics in excess as it happened here by Astrokey44 . The pics should be used in relationship with the context of a section. The template of the Wikicommons serve than to guide the readers to check other pics related to the aricle. It doeasn't mean we have to include them all to articles. -- Svest 19:11, 26 October 2005 (UTC) Wiki me up&#153;

New Category
I've been creating a lot of historical kingdoms that were annexed by Ethiopia in the late 19th century, & marking them Category:Former monarchies, only to discover that they got lost amongst all of the other articles in that category. So I created a new category, Historical African monarchies, & have been fitting it into the larger scheme of things. Any comments? -- llywrch 00:43, 26 October 2005 (UTC)
 * Good idea. I do have a question about the use of "historical" - does it include current monarchies as well such as Buganda, which have a historical presence, or is it strictly for monarchies that no longer exist?  Thanks,   BanyanTree 00:55, 26 October 2005 (UTC)
 * I intend to limit this category to monarchies that no longer exist -- although I'm not quite sure whether Ethiopia should be in this category because the state outlived Haile Selassie. I have included Central African Empire in this category, which replaced & was replaced by the Central African Republic. I admit I'm inconsistent, but I'm content to let the community decide. IIRC, Buganda is a kingdom that has been reduced from a state to a quasi-official status, which has happened to a number of African kingdoms, & I think is unique to Africa: these kingdoms deserve their own category. -- llywrch 19:54, 26 October 2005 (UTC)

I think Category:Historical African Kingdoms would be more accurate as a title. -- Svest 20:18, 26 October 2005 (UTC) Wiki me up&#153;

Assorted African politics questions
Copied from here:

1. What happened to 🇨🇻's ... plans to introduce the €? 2. What happened to 🇨🇻's bid to join the EUn?

Thanks for any information you might be able to contribute. ナイトスタリオン ✉ 09:23, 29 October 2005 (UTC)


 * Regarding your second question, there is some information in our article on EU expansion; given the speed at which the EU tends to work on these issues, I wouldn't be surprised if nothing has happened since. However, given the EU's previous rejection of Morocco's bid to join, it seems unlikely that they will permit Cape Verde to join either. Warofdreams talk 20:37, 29 October 2005 (UTC)


 * Well, the mention in the EU expansion article came from the one single article that was published sometime this spring at EUbusiness and africanews, IIRC; I was wondering whether there had been any further discussion in Cape Verde internally, or some bilateral discussion with Portugal... Thanks, either way! [[Image:Flag of Austria.svg|15px]] ナイトスタリオン ✉ 07:43, 31 October 2005 (UTC)

Heads of state lists
I think that the information held in List of Presidents of Sierra Leone and Heads of Government of Sierra Leone could best be given in a single page. But if you take a look, there are some complications. Please, come talk about it at Talk:List of Presidents of Sierra Leone.Smmurphy 12:14, 29 October 2005 (UTC)

Banket
Was just looking at orphaned articles, when I came across the above. The article talks abt Banderoles while it is titled Banket. Thought that I shd leave a note here, as ppl here wd be better placed to link it to some article or correct it or put it for vfd as a hoax. Thanks, --Gurubrahma 07:16, 14 November 2005 (UTC)

Ivory Coast/Côte d'Ivoire
A highly contentious vote is shaping up over at Talk:Côte d'Ivoire on which form of the country's name is the accepted English standard; I'd encourage interested editors to drop by and note which usage you prefer, as this vote will (hopefully) establish the article's place for some time. --Dvyost 07:41, 14 November 2005 (UTC)

Bounty for Africa country article
See Bounty_board. I've thought for a while now that I should chip in a bit to the upkeep of the Wikipedia servers, and the new "Bounty Board" system seems a good way to do this while also creating a small incentive for editors to work on Africa country articles. I've pledged £15 (~US $25) to be donated to the Wikimedia Foundation for the next Featured Article on an African country. Currently we only have South Africa, so I'm hoping someone will take me up on this. Also, if anyone else wants to commit a little to increase this bounty, please feel free! &mdash; Matt Crypto 16:16, 25 November 2005 (UTC)

Africa in topic
I've created Template:Africa in topic which can be applied to almost any series of articles about African countries. For instance, using the arguments "Geography" and "of", it produces the box below. All suggestions for making it clearer or prettier are very welcome; and please feel free to add it to any relevant articles. Warofdreams talk 13:19, 2 December 2005 (UTC)

Let's see if it works:

Aha, very revealing! Thanks for that! &mdash; mark &#9998; 13:53, 2 December 2005 (UTC)


 * Thanks! I see you've added it to an article on my watchlist (Holidays in Somaliland); it made for an informative series box addition to the article. This is a very useful template! Wikiacc (talk) 20:29, 2 December 2005 (UTC)


 * I've piped Algeria and Angola, any objections to doing it to the rest? It makes the box smaller and removes the repetitive parameters from showing. — Jeandré, 2005-12-05t11:11z


 * I've piped a few more to see how it looks - and so far as I'm concerned, please feel free to do the rest. Warofdreams talk 13:05, 5 December 2005 (UTC)

Wow! I wish this was around when I had to create the Cultures of Africa template by hand. This simplifies the process greatly. --Revolución (talk) 20:08, 15 December 2005 (UTC)

Various issues regarding Somalia-related articles
Of the subjects with which this notice board is concerned, I am most familiar with Ethiopia-related topics. In the process of watching/maintaining these articles, I've become alerted to some Somalia-related issues, as well. As I'm less familiar with Somalia and Somali people, I'm hoping someone more knowledgeable will have a look at these articles. Verifiable sources would be most helpful. I thought I would first mention this here, before posting it on the project page itself. Thanks for your time, -- Gyrofrog (talk) 18:55, 7 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Recently there has been a series of edits to Somali-related articles (mainly about regions or clans) on the part of various anonymous editors, and my gut feeling about this activity is that one or more people wish to assert one clan's superiority over the other, and they are using Wikipedia articles to do so. Example: the Bari Region article has a list of districts, each followed by (I assume) the name of one or more clans (more details at the article's talk page). On the one hand, the demographic information for a particular region is relevant, but in this case it is not given in terms of numbers, or a percentage of population, nor do they cite any references. On the other hand, part of me asks (rhetorically) why this should be relevant at all. Another example: the Galdogob region article states that the Leelkase clan makes up most of the population, then goes on to say that the water system "was founded by a group of Leelkase businessmen." Assuming that the population data is true, this seems like a given, so I'm not sure why it was necessary to specify the clan background of the investors. And another: someone changed Mohamed Farrah Aidid to indicate that he was a member of the Hawiye clan, rather than Habr Gidr as previously stated. There were no sources cited for either assertion, and I wonder why this would be in dispute. (If it seems I am not assuming good faith concerning these edits, I apologize. Perhaps I'm reading between the lines and drawing the wrong conclusions, but I remain skeptical regarding the edits in question.)
 * (Update: See Talk:Mohamed Farrah Aidid regarding a partial resolution of one of these examples. -- Gyrofrog (talk) 05:45, 10 December 2005 (UTC))
 * On a somewhat related note, the articles about the Darod and Hawiye clans have been subject to an on-and-off revert war (invlolving an anonymous editor) regarding which of these clans is the largest. I was unable to find a source that would settle this; two sources that I did find gave conflicting data, so I cited both and noted the discrepancy. There has been an edit war ever since, and I've created an RfC regarding the anonymous user's actions.
 * Should the names of Somali city articles use the English or Somali spellings? (Example: Bosaso vs. Boosaaso.) The articles in question may be found within Category:Cities in Somalia.


 * On your last bullet point, the Somali spelling should only be used if it is more common in English sources than the English transliteration, per Naming conventions (use English). On the face of it, English should be the default for this group. - BanyanTree 19:07, 7 December 2005 (UTC)


 * That's what I had figured, but thought I'd ask in case someone could give a good reason to the contrary. -- Gyrofrog (talk) 19:29, 7 December 2005 (UTC)

Proliferation of stub templates
Some of you will have noticed the proliferation of geo-stub templates for individual African countries. There is a general guideline at WP:WSS that when a country reaches 60-70 geography stubs, a new stub category for it is proposed. With Africa, until recently there were a large number of countries with well under that threshold, but several countries have recently passed it and several more are likely to in the next few months (notably Zimbabwe and Chad, which are both very close). We at WSS keep track of the numbers by tallying tohe numbers in the parent regional categories every couple of weeks. Sorry that I've been forgetting to undate your list recently - I'll try to remember to when any new geo-stubs are created! Grutness...wha?  06:01, 10 December 2005 (UTC)
 * both of those now exist and so does Namibia-geo-stub. BL   kiss the lizard  02:13, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

Two more have now been added, for Mali and Mozambique. Grutness...wha?  05:47, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Template
Is it just me or is that template literally painful to look at? the strong contrast between green and yellow wouldn't be too bad, if it weren't on a page that was almost completely white (the talk page of most any Africa-related article). i recommend different colours :P SECProto 00:09, 9 January 2006 (UTC)

Style for names of African languages
I'm trying to start a debate on this over at Talk:African languages. I feel we can do better than random use of kiSwahili, Swahili, etc. A style (plus explanation of prefixes/capitalisation) would make Search less painful and be more accessible for the casual reader. JackyR 00:37, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

INCUDE ALL OF AFRICA
I am not a fan of this word sub-Sahara (spit). It is profoundly racist and stems from imperialistic ideologically. It attempts to divide Africa by skin-shade concentrations. This is evident when you see articles on ancient Africa, they always forget to include Egypt, Morocco etc. I have read recent articles on "African immigrants in Morocco" - perhaps Morocco is in now in Antartica... If people just accept that most of the world's population are now of mixed heritages then we all might stand a chance about getting authentically educated about who we all are - and each other. The first maps that were found (in ancient Africa) show so-called 'sub-Sahara'(spit) at the top. Ref: Upper and Lower Nile are fine examples of how ancient Africans viewed their land - therefore, according to fact, history,and anthropolgy, 'sub-Sahara'(spit) should really be referred to as Upper Africa. (Oops...racists and imperialists all over the globe just collapsed - no loss there...) I'll say it again UPPER Africa. This 'sub-thingy concept' is a massive insult. Sub means beneath. The world was round, last time I heard, and the last map that I looked at still depicts Europe much, much larger than it actually is. This is no accident.

Africa includes ALL the countries that lie on the continent, so I shall look forward to more intelligent and inclusive features on Africa, African history, and African people. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.203.221.140 (talk • contribs) 13:32, 12 January 2006
 * Wikipedia is not a soapbox. &mdash; Matt Crypto 12:54, 12 January 2006 (UTC)


 * Africa can be divided in numerous ways, and the division into North Africa and sub-Saharan Africa is often a useful one.  The Sahara has acted as a dividing line between distinct cultures, often with limited contact (although see trans-Saharan trade).  Many people in North Africa have regarded Africans as those living south of the Sahara - e.g., see the Senegal-Mauritania border war.  That's not to say that this is neccessarily a useful definition, but it does illustrate that the "African immigrants in Morocco" usage is not purely imperialist.


 * Whether Upper Africa would be a better term for sub-Saharan Africa is a fair question. However, the term is hardly used (and Wikipedia is not the place to invent terms), and besides, when "Upper Africa" is used, it has precisely the opposite meaning - it is identified with North Africa. Warofdreams talk 13:03, 12 January 2006 (UTC)

Cameroon Pictures
I tried out Wikipedia Commons today, and I realised it'll be way too slow to try and upload every pic that might be relevant. So if anyone's looking for pictures for a Cameroon related article, leave a note on my talk page, there's a good chance I'll have some useful ones.Nick.annejohn 02:35, 1 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Thanks Nick. One way to do it may be to upload them to Flickr under a license usable on Wikipedia, such as CC-by-SA, and just make a note here so people can browse your photos and download them without bothering you everytime they want something.  I'm moderately sure that Flickr has some superefficient way to do a mass upload. - BanyanTree 03:42, 1 February 2006 (UTC)


 * You could also scale down the photos before you upload to the commons and leave a note on the image description page mentioning that you have higher res images available on request.--nixie 04:06, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

WikiProject Chad
I just wanted to anounce to anybody that may be interested that WikiProject Chad has just been started, with the goal to better the quality of Chad-related articles and provvide the many articles needed. To those interested you may consider participating to the project and adding your name. Free entree ;-) Aldux 23:37, 11 February 2006 (UTC)

Lagos and History of Lagos
I'm currently rewriting and adding a lot to this article, but I'm having huge amounts of trouble with the history. In trying to counter the systemic bias, I'd like a lot of the history to describe the time before the colonial powers (first Portugal then UK) arrived, but finding information (or more accurately, useful information) is proving difficult. So, if anyone at all could help me with this, I'd greatly appreciate it. I'm a member of too many other projects already for my free time to consider joining another but I greatly admire what you guys are doing. Nach0king 21:23, 28 February 2006 (UTC)


 * As far as I know, Lagos wasn't really a significant settlement until some time after the arrivel of the colonial powers. Before that, the Yoruba were more of an inland people, with the most important settlements (Oyo, Ife, Ibadan, etc.) all being situated quite far from the coast. This is one of the reasons for the fact that it is difficult to find Yoruba and the Yoruba coast mentioned in the records of seafaring nations of Old Europe (the Portuguese, the Dutch, and then the English). A good source is Biobaku (ed.) (1973) Sources of Yoruba History, and especially Robin Law's articles therein. (Will crosspost this to Talk:History of Lagos.) &mdash; mark &#9998; 13:04, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

Zambian uprising
My father told me once of a massacre he saw in Zambia, where he grew up. He told me of a woman who inspired people in her village to sprinkle urine on themselves, which she claimed would make them invincible. Apparently she got a crowd of villagers to charge at British machine- guns, which cut them all down. As it were, alot of these villagers were women, with their children at their side.

The thing that reminded me of this was an article I read on this website about the Lords Resistance Army, in Uganda. the article said similar tactics were used by the LRA in their early days. Here is the article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lords_Resistance_Army

If anyone knows anything of this massacre, information would be appreciated, I'll check back on this and might even get the article started. (edit by Ernestleonard)


 * I know some Zambian history, and Zambia was always considered one of the most pacific colonies, and a massacre like the one you describe I believe I should at least heard of it (but you never know). In my opinion this could be an episode of the "Lumpa rising" of 1964, a bloody affaire which caused 1500 dead in clashes between the Lumpa church guided by a prophetess and UNIP militants. Aldux 12:42, 2 March 2006 (UTC)
 * The woman from the LRA is Alice Lakwena and I believe she is still alive. I'm almost positive the woman you're thinking of is not her, as she told her followers to use "holy water" that she blessed. I believe she now lives in Kenya. KI 00:26, 3 March 2006 (UTC)


 * Just to clarify, Alice Auma was the leader of the Holy Spirit Movement, which preceded the LRA, and believers were smeared with oil made from the shea fruit, although holy water was used for a number of purposes by the "controllers" in the HSM.
 * But I believe that the article relevant to the original question is Lumpa Church, which is begging for expansion and maybe a new article at Alice Lenshina. (Weird that they're both named Alice.)  - BanyanTree 01:12, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

More geo-stubs
Hi all - there are two more new country-specific geo-stub emplates: Libya-geo-stub and Tunisia-geo-stub. Grutness...wha?  07:28, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

Military history
Hi, I've been sorting stubs for WikiProject Military history/Middle Ages task force and noticed a significant shortage of Africa-related articles. Just about all I've found is the Islamic conquest and a single Ethiopian battle. There isn't much at my local library, so I'm soliciting material from editors who are familiar with pre-European conquest military history. Wars, campaigns, battles, weapons, armor, and military biographies are all welcome. Please point me to existing articles and help create new ones. Regards, Durova 01:55, 17 March 2006 (UTC)


 * What age counts as Middle ages? There should be quite a few battles from the 1500s invasion of Ethiopia by Ahmed Gragn that could be added, as well as the 14th century conquests of Amde Seyon and the 15th century conquests of Zar'a Ya'iqob, but those might be too late (the later ones would be considered during the Renaissance, wouldn't it?).


 * Yom 15:30, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

Fourteenth and fifteenth century events generally qualify. Regarding the sixteenth century, that would be a judgement call for someone who knows the subject well. The task force is flexible with parts of the world that may define historical periods differently from Europe. As a basic guideline, an event is too recent if involves struggle against European colonialists or the use of rifles. You could set a precedent by creating a category and specifying inclusion criteria on the category page. Thanks for expressing interest, Durova 19:07, 17 March 2006 (UTC)


 * Well, the 16th century ones I was talking about was mainly the battles against Amhed Gragn, which involved rifles and artillery, but not any really modern weaponry (because rifles were horribly inaccurate back then, they were used mainly to scare enemies more often than to kill them up until the 18th and 19th centuries). Are you proposing that I create a category specifically related to African military history in the Middle Ages (w/ specific requirements)?


 * Yom 22:16, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

That would be excellent, if you would. I've been assembling subcategories under Category:Medieval warfare. We've been using the arquebus and shipboard cannon as the dividing points between Medieval and early modern. I'd really appreciate the help - when I studied African history in college the course began with colonialism. Cheers, Durova 22:42, 17 March 2006 (UTC)


 * (Worried over the silence) If you don't have time to do that, could you point me toward existing categories or hub articles where I could glean information myself? Durova 01:25, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

Africa Award
We should probably be a bit more generous with awarding editors who contribute to African related articles. I spurs them to continue contributing. It may also invigorate participation to this page. --Ezeu 06:45, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

Age of consent laws in African nations - looking for contributors
Hello all, I'm hopeing that this is the right place to find some help. The Age of consent article has six sub pages that atempt to list current laws regarding the ages of consent for sexual activity. One of these pages that is looking a bit sad at the moment is Ages of consent in Africa.

If there's anyone who is familiar with the laws of African nations and has access to any legislation or appropriate case law (or Sharia law as appropriate) and who is willing to add to this page that would be wonderful.

To see what a properly referenced page looks like see Ages of consent in Australia and Oceania.

Cheers! --Monotonehell 14:25, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

WikiProject Africa
Mark had mentioned the possibility of WikiProject Africa in the exchange about the Africa Award and I didn't want it to get lost in the shuffle. I would like to register pretty strong opposition on the basis that organizationally it doesn't make sense. A WikiProject should be expected to create synergies across individual editors' efforts, and the topic of "Africa" is too broad for this to happen. Coordination requires focus, so WikiProject Rivers and lakes in Africa, WikiProject Sudan, etc are all feasible with a minimum 3-5 active and knowledgeable editors. I would rather let people concentrate on their respective editing spheres and occasionally touch base here for advice or call for assistance in a particular topic. I do not want to relearn the lessons from WP:CSBCOTW or African Collaboration of the Fortnight that, in order for a coordinating mechanism to work, there must be specific activities and knowledge in common to be coordinated. Of the list of notice board members, what proportion does your editing intersect with regularly? While I hope that the community of Africa editors will grow so that there are many active WikiProjects with a crosscutting group of editors, I do not foresee there ever being a need for a continent wide WikiProject. - BanyanTree 20:36, 23 May 2006 (UTC)


 * These are very sensible points and I couldn't agree more. Thank you for correcting me. &mdash; mark &#9998; 21:11, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Akee or Ackee
Would anyone from west Africa (Nigeria to Gambia) like to comment at Talk:Akee as to whether the English name of the west African tree Blighia sapida should be Akee or Ackee? - MPF 10:05, 3 June 2006 (UTC)

Icon on WesternSahara-stub
There was an edit war on this template a few months back, and it's been without an icon since then. I've initiated a vote at Template talk:WesternSahara-stub - hopefully that will give some indication of what to do for an icon - please feel free to comment/vote on it there. Grutness...wha?  00:56, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

Religious group editing Voodoo, Vodun, Mami Wata
(I placed this on the main notice page, but I'm copying here in case anyone wishes to discuss the issue.) There have been some questionable edits lately to articles on religions of the African diaspora, specifically, Mami Wata, Voodoo, and Vodun. From what I can tell, Voodoo currently covers Vodun, but a couple of users have tried to change Vodun from a redirect to a new article. Similarly, extensive point-of-view additions have been made to Voodoo and Mami Wata discounting the articles as simply the scholastic viewpoint and not indicative of reality. The edits seem to be originating with a religious group in Georgia, based on the captions to the photos they've uploaded. I don't meant to condemn these people, and I've tried to alert at least one of the editors (there may be only one) about Wikipedia policies regarding neutral point of view, verifiability, and citing sources. Voodoo and Mami Wata might very well need to be de-POV'ed so as not to discount the reality of what are to many adherants living faiths. Any help is appreciated. — BrianSmithson 13:38, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
 * I'm at three reverts, and this person keeps adding the disclaimer to the top of the article. Attempts to communicate on the talk page are being ignored. Can someone take a look at this, revert if deemed necessary, and try to get this person to talk? — BrianSmithson 17:00, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Hope it's ok now. Articles are semi-protected by User:BorgQueen and myself. -- Szvest 18:11, 8 June 2006 (UTC) Wiki me up&#153;
 * Thanks; that seems to have solved the problem for now. I just wish this person/group would discuss the matter with us. His/her/their stony silence is quite odd. — BrianSmithson 20:29, 8 June 2006 (UTC)