Talk:Harriet Tubman/Archive 2

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Edit request from 98.27.243.107, 13 June 2010

{{editsemiprotected}} The article indicates that Harriet Tubman made 13 trips on the underground railroad escorting 70 slaves to freedom; according to Howard Zinn's "A People's History of the United States," she made 19 trips, escorting more than 300 slaves (pg. 171).

http://www.historyisaweapon.com/defcon1/zinnslaem10.htm

-Max W.

98.27.243.107 (talk) 05:50, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

Yes, there appears to be some disagreement with the references. PBS also says 19 trips and more than 300. However, Larson does indeed say 13 and 70. Which is correct? Is there a better way to resolve this? Thanks! Plastikspork _―Œ^(talk) 04:31, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Okay, before we change anything, we should read this. There appears to be a story behind the 19 trips figure. Thanks! Plastikspork _―Œ^(talk) 04:36, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Not done: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit semi-protected}} template. -- /DeltaQuad|Notify Me\ 10:46, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Because Zinn wrote Peoples' History before the millennial biographies came out, he probably used figures from Bradford or some source which cited it. And as the article clearly states:

One admirer, Sarah H. Bradford, wrote an authorized biography entitled Scenes in the Life of Harriet Tubman. The 132-page volume was published in 1869, and brought Tubman some US$1,200 in revenue. Criticized by modern biographers for its artistic license and highly subjective point of view, the book nevertheless remains an important source of information and perspective on Tubman's life.

So I say we leave the article as is. Scartol • Tok 20:35, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Mentioned on the Daily Show

Harriet was mentioned on the Daily Show with Jon Stewart (Oct 26 2010). I'm not sure about what else she did but this should probably have its own section. Can someone go ahead and add that?

Tubman is internationally famous for what she did in her life. She gets mentioned in popular culture so often that including every instance of that occurring would negate the point of this article. Wikipedia cannot be a repository of popular culture references. --Moni3 (talk) 15:07, 27 October 2010 (UTC)

Sorry

Edit request from 128.146.27.194, 24 May 2010

{{editsemiprotected}}

The article indicates that Harriet Tubman made 13 trips on the underground railroad escorting 70 slaves to freedom; according to Howard Zinn's "A People's History of the United States," she made 19 trips, escorting more than 300 slaves (pg. 183).

-Max W.

128.146.27.194 (talk) 18:11, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

• ( Can you give us a readily available web resource to reference? -- Matthew Glennon (^T/_C\^D) 18:30, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

^This - and then reinstate the request.

Requests to edit semi-protected articles must be accompanied by reference(s) to reliable sources. If you can supply such a reference, please reinstate your request. Thanks,  Chzz  ►  22:18, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

I can name a reference for the 19 trips and more than 300 slaves rescued: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/aia/part4/4p1535.html. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Hikeyosemite (talk • contribs) 01:30, 19 November 2010 (UTC)

These above mentioned references are now out-of-date. The latest research confirms the new numbers. Approximately 13 trips and almost 70 rescued. The old numbers were never accurate to begin with - they were made up by Sarah Bradford in 1868. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.110.195.141 (talk) 17:49, 28 January 2011 (UTC)

 Not done

Bristol, PA Memorial

In Bristol, Pa, they have a statue to Harrie Ross Tubman, I attatched pictures for your use on this page. I am unsure how to attach picture files, Please feel free to e-mail me at FredTheMan68@Yahoo.Com if desired

FredTheMan (talk) 03:39, 4 February 2011 (UTC)Fred

it says that harriet escaped with her brother ben and henry but actually the poster beside it says harry and the caption of the poster refers to her brother as harry no henry —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.26.70.222 (talk) 01:48, 11 March 2011 (UTC)

Important information missing - Harriet Tubman Institute

York University is home to The Harriet Tubman Institute for Research on the Global Migrations of African Peoples. It should be added in the appropriate place. URL: http://harriet.tubman1.yorku.ca/

I cannot because I do not have sufficient rights access to do so. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Fennerator (talk • contribs) 13:10, 18 August 2011 (UTC)

File:Statue of Harriet Tubman Ypsilanti Michigan.JPG Nominated for Deletion

An image used in this article, File:Statue of Harriet Tubman Ypsilanti Michigan.JPG, has been nominated for deletion at Wikimedia Commons in the following category: Deletion requests January 2012 What should I do? Don't panic; a discussion will now take place over on Commons about whether to remove the file. This gives you an opportunity to contest the deletion, although please review Commons guidelines before doing so. If the image is non-free then you may need to upload it to Wikipedia (Commons does not allow fair use) If the image isn't freely licensed and there is no fair use rationale then it cannot be uploaded or used. This notification is provided by a Bot --CommonsNotificationBot (talk) 20:45, 9 February 2012 (UTC)

hey

this article is great

--Troy Jr. (talk) 17:16, 21 February 2012 (UTC)

I had to write a research paper and this page was amazing I will always come to this website for information

Not an African American if

How can this wiki state she is an "African American" if she did not come from Africa, and was born in America? Some may say that would make her an American, but the "blacks" would get offended. I am Mexican so I can say these things, she is Black American if anything. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.215.58.190 (talk) 18:56, 13 August 2012 (UTC)

I believe the consensus these days is to use "African American" to refer to American persons of African descendance (in the same manner as "Italian-American" or "Irish-American") and not just to persons who personally immigrated from Africa to America. --Partnerfrance (talk) 14:11, 17 September 2012 (UTC)

Tubman, Harriet life

She was a caring person. Even though she was a slave, her heart(spiritually) did not stop. She helped slaves go in the Underground Railroad. Abraham Lincoln noticed and stopped this race with slaves. He was against it.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.50.209.145 (talk) 01:57, 5 February 2013 (UTC) 

harriet tubman

dfdrttilkfkfdjgfjg; — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.92.65.185 (talk) 14:33, 7 February 2013 (UTC)

Suggested link to replace broken link

Under the section "Movies," The Quest for Freedom (1992) needs a link. May I suggest http://www.graceproducts.com/tubman/? TNContributor 17:31, 16 March 2013 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Colivesay (talk • contribs)

merger of Harriet Tubman Grave?

I realize this article is about the person, and the other is about the grave, but obviously they are closely related, and could be a easily merged into one article, with the grave article redirecting to the relevant section here. Beeblebrox (talk) 20:09, 14 November 2009 (UTC)

I don't agree. I believe the Harriet Tubman Grave article should remain separate as a site on the National Register of Historic Places. See the list of related Tubman sites at National Register of Historic Places listings in Cayuga County, New York.--Pubdog (talk) 20:11, 14 November 2009 (UTC)

OK, I see both of your points, and they both are very good ones. However, I would have to agree with Beeblebrox. By merging, the article could be more of an all in one package- making navigation of the website less of a hassle for those with less understanding of the website. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.68.115.9 (talk) 01:19, 16 November 2009 (UTC)

Haymarket affair is an article about a historical event and a place on the National Register. Considering that Harriet Tubman Grave is only a paragraph, I think it could be merged here, but I don't feel strongly either way. — Malik Shabazz ^Talk/_Stalk 04:40, 17 November 2009 (UTC)

I know this hasn't been discussed in a long time, but the tag's still there. My personal preference is always to have a separate place article for sites on the National Register of Historic Places. Lvklock (talk) 22:57, 1 January 2011 (UTC)

Considering the grave article is extremely short, in its current form it could easily be added as a section of the biographical article. That would also lead to a more whoilistic article. We can always split it out at some later time if it becomes overly long. --Polaron | Talk 18:48, 3 January 2011 (UTC)

Yes it should be merged. After all it is so short that it is kind of pointless to have a separate article anyway and they are very closely related.Lee Tru. (talk) 15:10, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

References

I'm tempted to tidy up the references using {{sfn}} and {{harvnb}}, effectively adding links from the references to the bibliography. Would you see that as an improvement? It'll likely be a few hours' worth of work, so I'd like to get some consensus before I do it lest it be a wasted effort. Huon (talk) 19:30, 23 June 2013 (UTC)

Edit request on 18 April 2013

There are some details on this page that need to be changed. I have a reliable source to prove it as well as I used a school History textbook and an Encyclopedia. Site: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/aia/part4/4p1535.html

The thing that I have found that needs to be changed is that the page state she did over thirteen trips and saved over 70 slaves That is true but it could be improved. She did 19 trips to Maryland and to Save slaves + She saved over 300 slaves You can see this in the Page and it was stated in my textbook and encyclopedia I hope you can fix this, Thanks! Brianmolloy (talk) 14:34, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

Done Michaelzeng7 (talk) 01:04, 26 April 2013 (UTC)

The documentation is clear - Tubman rescued about 70 people in about 13 trips. The 19 trips and 300 people was made up in 1868 by Sarah Bradford (read the biography carefully - Bradfor even says that Tubman did not tell her those inflated number.) Tubman repeatedly told people she rescued 50-60 people in 8-9 trips before she made her laast rescue mission in 1860, when she rescued 7 people. As a Tubamn biographer who has researched her life for 20 years, I can assure you that Tubman did not rescue that many people - not that many people ran away from her home community (where she exclusively rescued people) in the 30 years before the Civil War, so there is no way she could have rescued that may. And we know she went back for family and friends, not people in communities and landscapes she was unfamiliar with. I have been unable to edit, so please correct back to earlier version. The PBS site and other sites and text books have not been updated. The Tubman Byway and Tubman National Monument (March 2013) both use the smaller numbers. Kate Larson — Preceding unsigned comment added by KateLarson (talk • contribs) 14:49, 29 August 2013 (UTC) Additionally, we have documentation (payment to a midwife) that Tubman was born in 1822, not 1820. Please correct. See Bound for the Promised Land: Harriet Tubman, Portrait of an American Hero. — Preceding unsigned comment added by KateLarson (talk • contribs) 14:53, 29 August 2013 (UTC)

Henry not Harry

They have her brother's name as Harry under a picture — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.139.179.234 (talk) 00:16, 3 January 2014 (UTC)

Thank you for bringing the error to our attention. It has been fixed. — Malik Shabazz ^Talk/_Stalk 02:58, 3 January 2014 (UTC)

RE: ["Moses"]

"The U.S. Congress meanwhile passed the Fugitive Slave Law of 1850, which heavily punished abetting escape and forced law enforcement officials--even in states that had outlawed slavery.."

Forced law enforcement officials to do what? What is the full sentence supposed to say and why two periods at the close?72.185.231.195 (talk) 17:20, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

Edit Request Section 5 Incomplete Sentence.

RE: ["Moses"] "The U.S. Congress meanwhile passed the Fugitive Slave Law of 1850, which heavily punished abetting escape and forced law enforcement officials--even in states that had outlawed slavery.."

Forced law enforcement officials to do what? What is it that this sentence is supposed to say? And why two periods at the close?72.185.231.195 (talk) 17:29, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

Harriet Tubman's "Employer"

I believe calling Edward Brodess Harriet Tubman's employer is a gross misnomer. Employer suggests a freedom which Harriet and her family did not have. He was her enslaver, pure and simple. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.85.191.121 (talk) 13:42, 30 October 2013 (UTC)

He was NOT her employer--he was her slaveowner and should be listed as such. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.73.137.97 (talk) 16:58, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

Done Sam Sailor ^Sing 00:29, 16 March 2014 (UTC)

Google Doodle

Would someone please add the following (or similar verbiage) under the "Legacy" section:

On February 1, 2014, Tubman was honored by being featured in a Google Doodle celebrating the first day of Black History Month.

Also, (for "extra credit" *grin*) the Time newsfeed (second reference used above) mentions a Maryland state park (besides the national monument included in the article already), if someone wants to include the state park as well -- "In March 2013, President Barack Obama signed a proclamation to establish the Harriet Tubman Underground Railroad National Monument, and a state park is expected to open in Maryland in 2015." (emphasis - italics - mine). Additionally, the aforementioned newsfeed article has a link to National Park Service page (http://home.nps.gov/hatu/planyourvisit/things2do.htm) which lists additional honors if desired to include any of those under the "legacy" section (e.g. "All-American Road" which is the highest level of "scenic byway" designated nationally in the USA).

98.70.76.106 (talk) 03:24, 2 February 2014 (UTC)

Partly done: I don't see any added value in adding the second part, but I have added the first part for you and done a basic cleanup as well. — {{U|Technical 13}} ^{(t • e • c)} 18:54, 20 March 2014 (UTC)

References

She never advocated violence against whites?

Yet, the article goes on to state that she cooperated with John Brown, who started an insurrection in Virginia and who was hanged for treason.John Paul Parks (talk) 18:16, 27 November 2010 (UTC)

So? John Brown was white. Neither he nor Tubman advocated violence against whites specifically, but they did advocate violence against the institution of slavery.98.125.235.208 (talk) 22:48, 16 September 2011 (UTC)

Yes he did, what about his raid in Kansas? He killed six white people then.Lee Tru. (talk) 15:07, 5 April 2013 (UTC)

Lee Tru., that's not the same as advocating violence against whites...as in targeting people because they are white. Flyer22 (talk) 08:14, 1 February 2014 (UTC)]]

I am sure the distinction would be lost on those who were killed by John Brown.John Paul Parks (talk) 15:02, 1 August 2014 (UTC)

Recordkeeping

The article indicates that records of slave births, etc., were not common. This seems dubious. Slaves were property, and they were taxed as such. Detailed records would be required to maintain the tax system. A more likely reason for the unavailability of information is that the slaves could not read, and that the records that were available were destroyed either during or after the war.John Paul Parks (talk) 15:04, 1 August 2014 (UTC)

Addition: Asteroid named in her honor

Could this information be added? The asteroid (241528) Tubman has been named in her honor. See: http://minorplanetcenter.net/db_search/show_object?utf8=%E2%9C%93&object_id=tubman

 Done Huon (talk) 23:45, 15 September 2014 (UTC)

Map edit suggestion

The map showing locations in Tubman's life is careful to show many U.S. state borders, even for those which don't figure in her life (uncolored). But for Canadian provinces, there are no borders shown. If the map is meant to reflect current boundaries (which I'm guessing it does, given that West Virginia is shown), the Ontario-Quebec line should be inserted, and areas in Quebec discolored. If the map is meant to show boundaries at the peak of the Underground Railroad's activities, West Virginia would disappear, the color across Ontario and Quebec would remain (since they were the United Canadas--Canada West and Canada East--from 1841 to 1867), but the reference would be "St. Catharines, Canada West" or "St. Catharines, C.W.". The name "Ontario" didn't apply until 1867, after the UGRR had finished. In any case, it's probably best to show current boundaries and names, in which case "St. Catharines, Ontario" suffices. There's no need to add "(Canada)" unless you're going to add "(United States)" to the three U.S. locations. Yoho2001 (talk) 12:13, 19 December 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 25 February 2015

96.242.185.149 (talk) 21:52, 25 February 2015 (UTC) there were some mistakes while i was reading it may i fix it please and thank you

                         from, 
                         Sarah

--96.242.185.149 (talk) 21:52, 25 February 2015 (UTC)

Would you be able to tell us what those mistakes are? Stickee (talk) 23:08, 25 February 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 19 March 2015

199.255.95.26 (talk) 22:03, 19 March 2015 (UTC)

Please state what changes you request. Huon (talk) 22:14, 19 March 2015 (UTC)

broken source link

I have a question on the first sentence...Harriet Tubman (born Araminta Ross; c. 1822 – March 10, 1913) was a legendary[1] black US slave who managed to escape her slave owners and subsequently aid thousands of other black slaves in their escape attempts.[1] ...the link is broken — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kellyngaris (talk • contribs) 17:08, 13 May 2015 (UTC)

The link should have been this, but it's been removed from the article. — Malik Shabazz ^Talk/_Stalk 17:16, 13 May 2015 (UTC)

Harriet Tubman's nomination for portrait being on $10 bill

A second issue, for which I haven't got wording, so this isn't part of he above edit request, but in the "Legacy" section, the movement to put her on the $10 bill seems worth mentioning. But the story is tangled and hard to summarize: there was a movement to put a woman on the $20, and Tubman won a poll (with Eleanor Roosevelt in second place) but the $10 bill is next up for redesign, so that's where attention has shifted. This is getting legislative backing. Other sources:

• http://www.cnn.com/2015/06/19/politics/10-dollar-bill-money-woman-harriet-tubman-womens-suffrage/index.html
• http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2015/07/09/mikulski-harriet-tubman-currency/29922461/
• http://www.cnn.com/2015/06/18/opinions/brazile-choice-for-10-bill-harriet-tubman/index.html
• http://www.inquisitr.com/2182912/legislation-pushing-to-put-harriet-tubman-on-the-new-10-bill/

etc. etc. 71.41.210.146 (talk) 05:37, 31 July 2015 (UTC)

I agree on both counts, and have made the change for the Combahee River link to the more appropriate Raid at Combahee Ferry link. As for the $10 bill, it is certainly warranted to include something in Tubman's "Legacy" section regarding her nomination to appear thereon, et al. I would take a shot at it myself, but am not very knowledgeable on the details of the issues surrounding those nominations, etc. Perhaps some other conscientious editor will step forward to undertake this. (My own thoughts on the whole currency issue, for whatever it's worth: the Mint should put Harriet Tubman on one of the two bills, and Eleanor Roosevelt on the other. That would obviate the need for any of us to have to choose between two very important and significant figures in the history of the United States.) --- Professor JR (talk) 07:42, 31 July 2015 (UTC)

Thanks! I deactivated the edit request, since you did it. Since it appears you want to leave this discussion opened, I split things into two sections. 71.41.210.146 (talk) 13:00, 31 July 2015 (UTC)

Google doodle as an important part of her legacy

Is being featured in a "doodle" an important part of Harriet Tubman's legacy? I think not. See WP:Trivia. Modernist. -- CFCF 🍌 (email) 12:44, 6 August 2015 (UTC)

• And I think it is - how many people have been so singled out. The acknowledgment here is totally appropriate...Modernist (talk) 12:48, 6 August 2015 (UTC)

I agree that mention of the google doodle belongs in the article. Just as the asteroid named for her is in the article. --Prairieplant (talk) 13:44, 7 August 2015 (UTC)

But that is absolutely absurd! She is one of the most important people of 19th century America. Being featured for one day on a silly logo is not a significant part of her legacy! -- CFCF 🍌 (email) 14:03, 7 August 2015 (UTC)

I'm not sure if I'd delete, but agreed with CFCF that it certainly isn't part of her "legacy"; at best it (and the asteroid!) are popular culture references and should be in a separate section about that. (If I had to choose between "legacy" and deletion, I'd vote deletion.) —Luis (talk) 22:36, 7 August 2015 (UTC)

• Incorrect the google notice belongs in the article, and you should undue your erroneous deletion...Modernist (talk) 14:23, 7 August 2015 (UTC)

Why around March 1922?

So, the Wikipedia page about Harriet Tubman says she born around March 1922, although I could not find any sources to back this up. Most sources say she was born between 1920 and 1925, so I was woundering why this specifically said March. Should this claim be removed? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Proud User (talk • contribs) --Proud User (talk) 13:41, 24 August 2015 (UTC)13:38, 24 August 2015 (UTC)

@Proud User: You will note that Tubman's date of birth is indicated as "circa" in each instance, and there is corresponding explanatory text for this approximat date in the article --- in the first paragraph of the "Early life and education" section, beginning with the 3rd sentence, which reads:

"As with many slaves in the United States, neither the exact year nor place of Araminta's birth is known, and historians differ as to the best estimate. Kate Larson records the year as 1822, based on a midwife payment and several other historical documents, including her runaway advertisement, while Jean Humez says "the best current evidence suggests that Tubman was born in 1820, but it might have been a year or two later." Catherine Clinton notes that Tubman reported the year of her birth as 1825, while her death certificate lists 1815 and her gravestone lists 1820. In her Civil War widow's pension records, Tubman claimed she was born in 1820, 1822, and 1825, an indication, perhaps, that she had only a general idea of when she was born."

--- Professor JR (talk) 15:55, 24 August 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 24 September 2015

Harriet Tubman Public School was opened on September 8 2015 in St Catharines Ontario Canada. Davwil123 (talk) 15:48, 24 September 2015 (UTC)

Not done: as the article states "Dozens of schools were named in her honor2 - we don't need to list them all.
More importantly, you have not cited reliable sources to back up your request, without which no information should be added to, or changed in, any article. - Arjayay (talk) 16:53, 24 September 2015 (UTC)

Unsubstantiated mythology of Tubman's war years Edit request

Unsubstantiated mythology of Tubman's war years Edit request

Forth paragraph of article states "armed scout and spy" There is no evidence the Union or anyone else ever armed Harriet Tubman during the war. She was known to carry a pistol in pre-war activities.No primary citations are given for this statement.

"The first woman to lead an armed expedition...." again no primary source. The sources cited in the article give no primary sources. Unsubstantiated. reference

Heading American Civil War First paragraph, "Hilton Head District". There was no "Hilton Head District". It was the Department of the South commanded by General David Hunter which contained Florida, Georgia and South Carolina. Tubman settled in the Beaufort area, not Hilton Head.

Heading Scouting and Combahee River Raid "..leading a band of scouts..." There is no documentary evidence nor any primary sources she ever led or spied in Confederate held territory. For a discussion and sources reference

"...key intelligence that led to the capture of Jacksonville, Florida." again no sources other than the authors speculation.

Second paragraph first sentence "... first woman to lead..." this is a myth that has never been substantiated. Although attributed to General Rufus Saxton no sources have been found to substantiate this statement.

"Tubman guided three steamboats..." again conjecture. While she was on the raid the actual guidance of the ships was done by local scouts. No evidence she ever scouted previous to the raid and hence could not guide the boats. Only 2 made the trip up the river, one ship having gone aground.

Forth paragraph, "scouting into Confederate territory" unsubstantiated. " nursing in Virginia" this sentence gives the impression she spent the last two years in Virginia. She actually went North in 1864 and although planning on returning to Beaufort, instead went to Fortress Monroe in Virginia in 1865.

Reference for the edits is

My apologies if the format for these edits is not correct. Jeff G (talk) 15:04, 29 September 2015 (UTC)

• Not done: According to the page's protection level you should be able to edit the page yourself. If you seem to be unable to, please reopen the request with further details.
• @Jeff G: I am a little confused about your edit request. You are autoconfirmed and have been for years. If you can make improvements to this article please do so. The worse that can happen is someone reverts you. --Stabila711 (talk) 21:08, 5 October 2015 (UTC)

References

Semi-protected edit request on 30 December 2015

Harriet Tubman freed many slaves, she also got married in 1844 and she was 25 years old. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Swordsphotograpy (talk • contribs) 01:38, 30 December 2015 (UTC)

Update Legacy to include Drunk History Episode

Her raid on the Combahee River was dramatized in Drunk History in Season 3 Ep 4, Spies, and she was portrayed by Octavia Spencer. Other historical figures often have Drunk History episodes about them listed in their legacy or popular culture sections. Sarahlpatt (talk) 08:27, 16 February 2016 (UTC)

Honestly seems trivial to a historical figure's biography. I understand putting it on actors' pages, but not here. EvergreenFir (talk) Please {{re}} 22:30, 24 February 2016 (UTC)

I tend to agree with EvergreenFir. Drunk history tends to make contributions of an individual seem less at best, insane at worst. (talk

Semi-protected edit request on 15 February 2016

Please change the fact that Harriet Tubman made 13 trips back to the South and rescued 70 slaves, she actually made 19 trips and rescued approximately 300 slaves. This should be changed, and a source to use would be . 142.134.203.83 (talk) 14:14, 15 February 2016 (UTC)

Not done for now: I'm going to start a section below requesting comments on how to word this. There's a lot of discrepancy on the number of people she rescued. EvergreenFir (talk) Please {{re}} 22:52, 24 February 2016 (UTC)

References

Number of slaves freed - Proposed wording change

There seems to be large discrepancies on the number of trips taken by Tubman and the number of slaves Tubman freed. Currently the article says, "Over eleven years Tubman returned repeatedly to the Eastern Shore of Maryland, rescuing some 70 slaves in about thirteen expeditions." But other sources use other numbers. Below is a small summary of sources I looked at:

• 11-12 trips, 66-77 slaves. Humez, Jean. Harriet Tubman: The Life and the Life Stories (p. 352, Appendix B). "Adding the last documented trip (December 1860) with its party of seven would make the grand total, but this conservative method, eleven (or twelve) trips, with sixty-six to seventy-seven rescued."
  • Comment on "highly inflated" number of 300 slaves by Humez on p. 365, "Following Sarah Bradford's 1869 biography most later biographers of Tubman have repeated the assertion that Tubman made nineteen trips south and personally rescued over three hundred fugitives. However, the documentary record produced during the 1850s and the early 1860s bu Tubman's friends and supporters indicates that these figures are very likely highly inflated."
• 13 trips, 70 slaves. Larson, Kate. Bound for the Promised Land: Harriet Tubman: Portrait of an American Hero (p. xvii). "Over the next eleven year Tubman returned to the Eastern Shore of Maryland approximately thirteen times to liberate families and friends; in all she personally brought away about seventy former slaves..."
• 19 trips, 300 slaves
  • National Women's History Museum webpage "As part of the Underground Railroad, she made 19 trips into slave holding states, leading some 300 individuals to a new life in the areas that had banned slavery."
  • America's Library.gov "Tubman made 19 trips to Maryland and helped 300 people to freedom."
  • PBS Africans in America "During a ten-year span she made 19 trips into the South and escorted over 300 slaves to freedom."

How should we reconcile these sources and the various numbers? As a start, I offer the following wording: Over eleven years Tubman returned repeatedly to the Eastern Shore of Maryland, rescuing at least 66 slaves in about 12 expeditions, and possibly as many as 300 slaves over 19 expeditions. We can add a footnote detailing the number variations.

Hoping some page watchers reply. Will do an RfC if we need more input.

EvergreenFir (talk) Please {{re}} 23:29, 24 February 2016 (UTC)

Editing

I noticed a grammatical error under the section about her escape. The sentence is: This informal, but well-organized, system was composed of free and enslaved blacks, white abolitionists, and other activists. The comma between well-organized and system is incorrect. Thanks! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ethanweightman13 (talk • contribs) 22:05, 3 March 2016 (UTC)

Harsh Canadian winters.

The Clinton source reports that one of the reasons for moving from St Catherine's to Auburn was to escape the Canadian winter. A problem with that is that St Catherine's and Auburn are at almost the same latitude, with winters being somewhat colder in Auburn according to the climate stats in our articles on the cities. - SimonP (talk) 18:28, 20 April 2016 (UTC)

Can someone please add this

I tried to add this to the Legacy section but it wouldn't take. Apparently I'm still not trustworthy after thousands of edits.

The Harriet Tubman House in Boston's South End is a site on the Boston Women's Heritage Trail. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Rosekelleher (talk • contribs) 23:28, 11 January 2016‎

References

This was done. Bmclaughlin9 (talk) 22:25, 20 April 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 21 April 2016

In the legacies and honors section, add that on April 20th, 2016 it was announced that she would appear on the 20 dollar bill. Zjaffee (talk) 03:24, 21 April 2016 (UTC)

It's already in there. —C.Fred (talk) 03:26, 21 April 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request

I think the "raid on the Combahee River" in the fourth paragraph of the lead should "raid at Combahee Ferry" instead, since there is an article specifically about the incident.

Also, how do we know she "led" an armed assault? The only source of this "leading" was a book written by a Dr. Lumumba Umunna Ubani. Where did he get his information? I think it's a shaky source at best. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Arminius Hermann (talk • contribs) 13:39, 21 April 2016 (UTC)

Dr. Lumumba Umunna Ubani's claim she was the first woman to lead an armed assault in the Civil War

Dr. Lumumba Umunna Ubani's claim she was the first woman to lead an armed assault in the Civil War is speculative, is it not? What source does he use in his book, "NEW Afrikan Mind Reconnection & Spiritual Re-Awakening"? Thank you! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Arminius Hermann (talk • contribs) 13:42, 21 April 2016 (UTC)

Why is her religion associated with a head injury?

A:She was religious B: She had a head injury

are these related? Is there proof these are related? This document is written as if A is only true because of B. This is not what the source material states, or should be conveyed on this page — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gmort (talk • contribs) 19:59, 20 April 2016 (UTC)

You are correct to point out this inappropriate conflation of her religiosity and her head injury. I've separated the two. Bmclaughlin9 (talk) 22:23, 20 April 2016 (UTC)

Respectfully I came here to say the exact same thing but read the page after your edit. The sentences are now one right after the other, and it still looks like the article suggests her religious faith comes from a head injury. 66.44.32.208 (talk) 12:10, 21 April 2016 (UTC)

I came for the same request. Or at least one similar. I mean she is a true blue American hero and a human rights hero at that. She took even bigger risks then the great MLK Jr himself. Being designated a mental case seems very cruel. I know religion shouldn't be brought in here either but implying it was all due to a head injury is also pretty disrespectful. It was her religious beliefs and there are many other explanations. I tend to believe as she did but it also could have been her imagination. Regardless lend her some dignity. The feds choosing the worst pic I've seen of her for her bill is bad enough. I mean C'mon.(talk —Preceding undated comment added 02:24, 23 April 2016 (UTC)

Wrong 20$ image

What's the right image? http://www.tagesschau.de/multimedia/bilder/blickpunkte-1887.html or http://money.cnn.com/2016/04/20/news/10-bill-hamilton-20-tubman/index.html ? Or are they all just guessings? --SI 11:16, 21 April 2016 (UTC)

Not even guessing, just silly illustrations. The bill is still being designed. The picture will have to be engraved. You've been looking at too many euros lately, haven't you? Smallbones_(smalltalk) 02:25, 23 April 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 23 April 2016

Head injury

As a child in Dorchester County, Maryland, Tubman was beaten by masters to whom she was hired out. Early in her life, she suffered a severe head wound when hit by a heavy metal weight. The injury caused disabling epileptic seizures, headaches, powerful visions, and dream experiences, which occurred throughout her life.

Calling a celebrated abolitionist, freedom fighter, and human rights activist mentally challenged due to a head injury is pretty insulting. Even more so that some one made her religious beliefs sound like it merely is based off from head injuries despite them being a major driving force behind her efforts. LegendaryStormcrow (talk) 02:10, 23 April 2016 (UTC)

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. clpo13_(talk) 19:39, 23 April 2016 (UTC)

Error in archiving

I adjusted the automatic archiving to archive stale posts/threads with no responses within the past 30 days (rather than every 3 months) but there is an error in the way it was set up and I am unsure how to fix it completely and correctly. The counter was set to 9 and should have been set to 2, so lowercase sigmabot III went straight from Archive 1 to Archive 9, the talk pages archive has Talk:Harriet Tubman/Archive 1 and Talk: Harriet Tubman/Archive 9 with no linkage to the second archive (named "Archive 9" on this main talk page... If some admin could move/rename/delete/whatever/etc that would be awesome. Thanks, Shearonink (talk) 04:27, 25 April 2016 (UTC)

• I have renamed Talk:Harriet Tubman/Archive 9 as Talk:Harriet Tubman/Archive 2. Anthony Appleyard (talk) 13:36, 25 April 2016 (UTC)
  • Thank you both. When I copied the code for archiving, I must have forgotten to fix the archive number. (I used 120 days because I didn't want to be too aggressive, but I don't mind a shorter period. My talk page is archived after 5 days. ) — MShabazz ^Talk/_Stalk 19:34, 25 April 2016 (UTC)

Party Affiliation?

Because Tubman's name was removed from the List of African-American Republicans today, I've started this thread to enlist knowledgeable folks to discuss this issue, perhaps become more important because of the US currency announcement today. Anyone care to discuss? BusterD (talk) 02:20, 21 April 2016 (UTC)

I want every one to remember that the party stances were once that the Democrats once supported slavery. Republicans were abolitionists. Trying to white wash this and hide facets of heroes (in this case heroines) lives and our history is not only disrespectful but very dangerous. History repeats if forgotten. LegendaryStormcrow(talk

Not quite true and it's ignorant to paint the politics then as Democrats/Republicans. There were anti-slavery Democrats and Lincoln's VP was a Democrat for Christ's sake. The slavery issue was a North/South issue. Also, considering Harriet Tubman couldn't vote, to claim she was a Republican is just ludicrous and revisionism. 75.18.168.105 (talk) 18:28, 23 April 2016 (UTC)

Tubman was not affiliated with the Republican Party because she was a woman and could not vote. Period. — Preceding unsigned comment added by KateLarson (talk • contribs) 16:11, 12 May 2016 (UTC)

Signature???

I noted the image of Tubman's signature is not really hers, but an "X", with a signature from someone else noting that it was Tubman's mark. The image seems misleading to me and I would suggest removing it. That is to say, I had to study the image close up for about 30 s to figure that out, and I doubt an "X" is particularly interesting to anyone. Bdushaw (talk) 22:45, 4 May 2016 (UTC)

Agreed, her 'X' mark witnessed by another doesn't add anything and is unintentionally deceptive. A better source exists, if it can be properly licensed for use. According to "Museum's Latest Treasure: Harriet Tubman's Hymnal" (NPR), the Smithsonian National Museum of African American History and Culture has a copy of Tubman's hymnal with her signature. "According to [collector Charles L.] Blockson" (who received the artifact from one of Tubman's last living descendants), "Tubman didn't learn to write until later in her life, and the signature inside the hymnal is one of her early attempts at signing her name." Another source names descendant who willed it to collector Blockson as Mariline Wilkins, great grand-niece of Tubman: "Collector donates Harriet Tubman artifacts to African American History museum" (Washington Post). Article states: "an ordinary hymnal was raised to the status of a historical object with the simple signature of its owner, Harriet Tubman Davis". Let's get that image on this page. -- Paulscrawl (talk) 15:10, 5 May 2016 (UTC)

Image from Washington Post, so not usable: Tubman's hymnal signature. Can we get an image from Smithsonian licensed for use on Wikipedia, if not Commons? Link to Harriet Tubman Collection, with image Perhaps reach out to WP:GLAM/Smithsonian Institution- Paulscrawl (talk) 15:22, 5 May 2016 (UTC)

I've reached out to GLAM/Smithsonian Institution on their Talk page. I'm on it - please allow me to follow through tonight so I can learn a valuable skill in requesting archival permissions with GLAM supported methods. -- Paulscrawl (talk) 15:41, 5 May 2016 (UTC)

(In for a penny, in for a pound... :) ) I've poked around looking at the signature images via google, and I am suspicious of that hymnal signature. The "X" signature dates to 1898, apparently, so presumably the hymnal signature occurred after that. What I am suspicious of is that someone may have signed her hymnal for her. On the other hand, an NPR google find states that the hymnal signature was one of her earliest attempts at a signature. In short, given the new prominence of the subject, I think we should have a quite good scholarly reference for her signature. We want to avoid speculations and original research. An official document with her signature (e.g., a voter ID card (note scathing, sarcastic, political humor)) would also do, I think. (No edit battle from me! Just some concern to get it right... Google search shows endless sites that have picked up this Wikipedia "error"!) Bdushaw (talk) 10:09, 6 May 2016 (UTC)

Agreed, need to get it right; any signature needs scholarly verification. The best I've seen re: the hymnal comes from collector, Charles L. Blockson, and words of the director of the Smithsonian's National Museum of African American History and Culture, linked above. Smithsonian should have more details some 6 years after donation of hymnal. -- Paulscrawl (talk) 17:54, 6 May 2016 (UTC)

The signature in the Hymnal is not Harriet Tubman's signature. She could not read or write. Her will, deeds, and mortgage documents from 1859 through the early 1900s before her death all show an X for her signature. The "Harriet Tubman" signature in the Hymnal is that of Tubman's great niece, Eva Katherine Stewart Northrup. Tubman helped raise her during the 1890s and early 1900s after Eva's parents died. Charles Blockson does not know these details, and therefore assumed that Tubman learned to write later in life. I traveled to the Smithsonian with a Tubman relative who has family correspondence (including from Eva Stewart Northrup, Mariline Wilkins's mother) to view the hymnal and other items donated to the museum by Mr. Blockson, and the signature in the hymnal matches Eva Stewart Northrup's handwriting. Harriet Tubman may have held that Hymnal, but it is unlikely she used it to sing songs, as she could not read. It is very likely that Eva used it as it was probably a fixture in the home she was raised in - Eva was raised by Tubman and Tubman's brother, William Henry Stewart, Eva's grandfather, in Auburn, NY. I directed Smithsonian staff to Tubman's will, deeds, and mortgages, on file at the Cayuga County, NY, Courthouse to verify her X-mark signature. — Preceding unsigned comment added by KateLarson (talk • contribs) 16:22, 12 May 2016 (UTC)

I just remembered that Tubman's lengthy Civil War widow's pension claim has her X mark in several places as well. It is available online for free at the National Archives website. Just type Harriet Tubman into the search box and filter digital copies and it will pop up.

Thank you, @KateLarson:, for that rapid response to my email (a copy of what I sent the Smithsonian days ago, with no response still). Worth noting: that particular page does not claim her signature is in the hymnal. Link to Harriet Tubman Collection, with image

While we can not cite what Wikipedia would call original research (WP:OR), the lack of any printed reliable sources (WP:RS) not originating from the hymnal collector (Charles Blockson) or the museum director (Lonnie Bunch), both interested primary sources (WP:Primary) in this context, speaks for itself.

Following our discussion above (preceding your just posted expert commentary), @Bdushaw: has helpfully deleted the misleading X mark image (with a witness's now confusing "Harriet Tubman" surrounding her "X"), in the "signature" field of the infobox for this article.

Thanks again to both. Dr. Larson, I hope a citable article might come out of this! -- Paulscrawl (talk) 17:14, 12 May 2016 (UTC)

A pretty interesting, if not fascinating, situation. Even now the horrors of slavery have a faint echo here on these pages. Pretty amazing that images of her civil war claims are available! Not quite sure how to include this discussion on the article page, but I still think an image of an "X" as a signature is not quite appropriate. Perhaps just some text in the article itself ("She remained illiterate for the duration of her life and could only sign documents with an "X" mark.")? In any case, it is not my inclination to work on this page. Just to note, however, that I did not "delete" the image, just commented it out with html markings, in case the element was needed at some future date. Bdushaw (talk) 21:16, 12 May 2016 (UTC)

That proposed wording sounds perfect. If you are not inclined to add it, I will as soon as I can add a citable reliable source, perhaps coming soon on biographer Kate Larson's Harriet Tubman Myths and Facts page. -- Paulscrawl (talk) 09:07, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

Rewards for her capture?

The lead section currently says "Her actions made slave owners anxious and angry, and they posted rewards for her capture." There's no evidence to support this in the body of the article; rather, there's a section describing several legendary rewards offered, but the section says there's no evidence for these rewards. (There's also a reward of $100 for each of her and her two brothers, but that's simply because they were runaway slaves, not--as implied in the lead section--because they were helping other slaves to escape.) See, e.g., Kate Larson's Harriet Tubman: Myths and Facts page.)

I'm going to remove that sentence from the lead--if anyone restores it, please only do so if you can also provide a cite that a reward was offered because of her actions in rescuing slaves. — Narsil (talk) 00:55, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

Good catch, good reliable source. Thanks. -- Paulscrawl (talk) 09:12, 13 May 2016 (UTC)

Monument to Harriet Tubman in Delaware

Sculpted by Mario Chiodo in 2012, "Unwavering Courage in the Pursuit of Freedom" includes two fugitives following Tubman, and abolitionist Thomas Garrett, who lived in Wilmington, DE, and offered a resting spot to those on the Underground Railroad.

• File:Http://www.freedommarchofart.com/tubman.html

Agapoff (talk) 21:55, 4 July 2016 (UTC) <ref> Francine Agapoff, Director of the Chiodo Art Studio

Face in infobox?

Hello. Why on earth doesn't the infobox here conform to every other biography on Wikipedia and contain an image of the subject's face? I could understand this if no portrait existed. But we do have a perfectly good photograph of the subject's head. I have never seen a full body, head-to-toe image in an infobox before, ever. -SusanLesch (talk) 16:02, 1 January 2017 (UTC)

Hi SusanLesch. Is there a requirement or convention that infoboxes include portraits instead of other images? Two other featured articles on my watchlist, Malcolm X and James Joyce, don't have portraits either (the Joyce article doesn't have an infobox, by talk page consensus). I don't have a preference with respect to this article, I was just wondering, because I've never heard that before. Thank you. — Malik Shabazz ^Talk/_Stalk 16:56, 1 January 2017 (UTC)

Greetings, Malik. In James Joyce, we have one RFC with 6 votes in favor of an infobox and 1 vote against. The discussion was closed as "no consensus." I'm not going to argue with you because counting like that gives me the creeps. Thank you for your time. Best wishes. -SusanLesch (talk) 22:38, 1 January 2017 (UTC)

Hi SusanLesch. I'm not really interested in debating whether the Joyce article should have an infobox. I'll merely point out that there was an straw poll and lengthy discussion that showed overwhelming opposition and the feeling of the closer of the 2015 RfC (from which I abstained) was that the views expressed earlier should be considered in closing the RfC.

My question, though, relates to your suggestion about this article and how it might relate to other biographies. Except for the strong suggestion that photos face the text of the article, is there another rule or convention that the image be a portrait? Thank you. — Malik Shabazz ^Talk/_Stalk 00:58, 2 January 2017 (UTC)

Just passing through but it strikes me that a photo of the complete person is interesting. It shows how they stood, what they were wearing that day, the demeanor. Personally, I find it more interesting when the main image in an article shows more of the whole person, be it from the waist up or of the entire body - as in Albert Gallatin, Elizabeth Taylor, Mary Shelley, Jimi Hendrix, George Washington, George Otto Gey, Henrietta Lacks... Shearonink (talk) 01:29, 2 January 2017 (UTC)

False. Gentlemen, I will not be back. Your long list of examples includes exactly one full length person (Jimi Hendrix).

Malik, yes, Wikipedia has a rule that suggests that we conform to high-quality reference works at MOS:IMAGELEAD. We are talking here on a fringe of reality, one that might imagine a wheelchair would illustrate Franklin Roosevelt and a tennis racket for Serena Williams. I came here to find out why there is a memorial statue of Tubman in Ypsilanti, Michigan. That answer isn't here either. Bye. -SusanLesch (talk) 15:33, 2 January 2017 (UTC)

Ok. I was just stating that I don't mind when WP infoboxes have photos with varying degrees of close-up: headshot/face, full-length, waist-up, etc. As to why there is a statue of Tubman in Ypsilanti, am sure you probably already found it but in case other editors have not this Ann Arbor News article has some background. Shearonink (talk) 16:37, 2 January 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 11 January 2017

Hi I would like to fix some info. HACKER1234567890 (talk) 17:10, 11 January 2017 (UTC)

Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. Sir Joseph ^(talk) 17:19, 11 January 2017 (UTC)

If I may interject, don't let this editor receive access to editing. He's made many unconstructive edits and basically destroyed at least two templates. UNSC Luke 1021 (talk) 19:40, 11 January 2017 (UTC)

Critique an Article English 101.38

I think that, in this article, the section "Nicknamed "Moses"" is quite interesting. However, I do think there is a lot of unnecessary info in this section. For example, in this section it mentions her returning to Dorchester County for her husband John, I don't think it important to mention this because it gives no insight on the fact that Tubman ran the Underground Railroad. One section that I think is lacking, is the subsection concerning her head injury. Early in her life, Tubman developed narcolepsy after her slave owner hit her in the head with a brick. This subsection is lacking information on how she managed to smuggle 70 enslaved families while suffering from narcolepsy. All of the information is up to date and the only thing that i think should be added is some more elaboration on Tubman's narcolepsy. Jacob.zehnder (talk) 01:43, 9 February 2017 (UTC) Jake Zehnder

The points you bring up are interesting so let's discuss:

• Per the Head injury section Tubman didn't suffer from narcolepsy, according to Tubman biographer Kate Clifford Larson she probably had temporal lobe epilepsy. Her lifetime of coping with the epilepsy is mentioned within the article every time the reader sees the words: headaches, visions, dreams, vivid dreams and so on. (The word "headache" is mentioned twice, "dream" or "dreams" is mentioned 6 times, "visions"/"vision" mentioned 11 times, and so on.)
• This is an article about a person, their whole life, not just what she was most well-known for - that of being an abolitionist and taking enslaved people to their freedom. Tubman - using her knowledge of the Underground Railroad - went back for her husband and he chose his bigamous life in slavery with another woman over escape to freedom with her. Wikipedia can't include every known fact about a person in a WP:BIO but John was her husband - editors can't just delete a family-member from a biographical article especially when that person's information is well-sourced from reliable sources.
• It is interesting to think about - how did Tubman manage to get all those people to freedom while suffering from her medical condition? I think it was a matter of pure, sheer will - Tubman decided to work towards freeing people and nothing - no man, no law, no weather, no thing would stop her. But that's just my opinion and a Wikipedia article is written according to published reliable sources - it can't use unpublished opinions (no matter how much sense I make). Shearonink (talk) 03:41, 9 February 2017 (UTC)

manumitted ???

Can this be changed to be "freed from slavery (manumitted)"? Or use emancipated or liberated from slavery? I thought the idea of an encyclopedia was to inform and not to use rare obscure $5 words at every opportunity to show off how smarty pants someone is. This isn't 1803 or 1827 when the word was most popular, according to google bookks ngram viewer. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.218.60.226 (talk) 06:58, 10 March 2017 (UTC)

Sorry, but "manumission" is one of those five-dollar words that a reader needs to understand if she or he wishes to read about slavery in the United States. Manumission, emancipation, and liberation each carry different connotations (sorry to use another five-dollar word), and in context, only the word "manummitted" is appropriate. It's hyperlinked to the Wikipedia article manumission, so readers who aren't familiar with the word, or who wish to learn more about the subject, can click to read more about it. — Malik Shabazz ^Talk/_Stalk 03:54, 12 March 2017 (UTC)

And the first sentence of the Manumission article is "Manumission, from manumit /ˌmænjəˈmɪt/, is the act of a slave owner freeing his or her slaves." The definition when inputting into google the word manumit is "release from slavery; set free." I managed to go through my entire American education career without hearing this word. Why is "manumitted" the only appropriate word for this context versus emancipation or liberation? Connotations is now a common word widely understood - manumit, not so much. PS no need to get snotty and seem to talk down, ie "sorry to use another five-dollar word". — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.218.60.226 (talk) 07:48, 13 March 2017 (UTC)

Feminist categories?

Can someone please explain to me why the feminist categories are added to this article? There is nothing in this article that suggests she was a feminist of any kind. Feminism as we know it today was not even around in her time. 88.98.201.124 (talk) 04:21, 19 May 2017 (UTC)

Suffrage is mentioned in the lead. See Waves of feminism. EvergreenFir (talk) 04:30, 19 May 2017 (UTC)

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Massachusetts 54th?

I just found an article in The Columbian (Bloomsburg, PA) from 8 July 1897 about Harriet Tubman that states "At the breaking out of the war she was sent to the front by Governor Andrew of Massachusetts to act as a spy and scout for the union armies, and to work in the hospital. She was with the Fifty-Fourth Massachusetts." Her name does not appear in the final roster published by Captain Luis Fenollosa Emilio (nor does any woman's.) Does anyone have other evidence to support this? I'd love to add this to the page if there's decent supporting evidence! -kim. (talk) 09:11, 20 January 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 9 May 2017

Are you really claiming that she was an American Spy? If you are citation, please.-------> Harriet Tubman (born Araminta Ross; c. 1822 – March 10, 1913) was an American abolitionist, humanitarian, and an armed scout and spy for the United States Army during the American Civil War. Andradejf 03:34, 9 May 2017 (UTC)

References

According to the article, it's reference 148 EvergreenFir (talk) 04:01, 9 May 2017 (UTC)

The reference to being an "armed" scout is pure speculation. Please cite a reference to this.Jeff G (talk) 01:35, 13 June 2017 (UTC) There is no evidence that Tubman led the raid, in fact even in her own biography she acknowledges Col. James Montgomery as the leader of the raid. Jeff G (talk) 01:38, 13 June 2017 (UTC)

See update in 54th section below, there does seem to be some material about her at least being a spy from 1897. -kim. (talk) 09:13, 20 January 2018 (UTC)

"no white ascendants in Tubman's family tree or oral histories"

Psmith85 recently edited the article to say, as quoted above, that Tubman's oral history speaks of no white ancestors. This is flatly contradicted by both of the sources cited at the end of the sentence:

• Larson, p. 10: "Another interviewer later reported that Tubman believed ... that Rit [her mother] 'was the daughter of a white man, an American.'"[1]
• Clinton, p. 6: "In one biographical article published the year before Tubman died, the author alleged her mother, Rit, was the daughter of a 'white man,' but there is no mention of this in any other records or in family lore." Clinton then spends two paragraphs explaining why Rit probably was her (white) owner's daughter. "If Harriet Green had been the daughter of a white man—even of Pattison himself—this would explain why she was given this special dispensation. It was not an uncommon practice among Chesapeake planters to make a provision for the emancipation of illegitimate, mixed-race offspring." "It was also not uncommon for the father of an illegitimate, mixed-race daughter to 'give' the slave daughter to his legitimate white daughter—much as Sally Hemings was brought to the Thomas Jefferson household by his new wife, Martha, as part of her dowry. Half sisters commonly lived under the same roof as mistress and slave."[2]

So, we do have oral history of a white grandfather, from Tubman herself, who told at least one one biographer. Clinton also provides plenty of circumstantial evidence to support Tubman's assertion. And "no white ascendants in Tubman's family tree"? What do you call her white grandfather? — Malik Shabazz ^Talk/_Stalk 02:51, 25 January 2018 (UTC)

The interviewer who reported oral history is never named in the first source (and where is the interview subject named as the grandfather?), and the second is hearsay (from another unnamed author), followed by raw speculation based on other cases where partially white offspring were freed, where there are countless cases of non-white offspring being freed for other reasons. To me this remains speculation. Sources meant as evidence for a claim must be identified so they can be judged for reliability. While I would omit the ethnic speculation altogether - since it is generally not a major part of biographical articles, and since slaves are known to routinely have had mixed black, Native American, and sometimes white heritage - that the 'white grandfather theory' is aired but counterbalanced with mention of the absence of white ancestors in genealogical records seems an acceptable compromise.

Psmith85 (talk) 03:01, 25 January 2018 (UTC)

Huh? The interview subject was Tubman herself. Please read what I wrote instead of replying to what you imagine I wrote. — Malik Shabazz ^Talk/_Stalk 03:11, 25 January 2018 (UTC)

Harriet Tubman

What day and /or time was Hariet Tubman Born Sanaian (talk) 22:44, 14 May 2018 (UTC)

As stated in the article - in the Birth and family section, the exact circumstances - the day, the month, even the year, as well as the time of Tubman's birth - all those facts remain unknown. Shearonink (talk) 23:45, 14 May 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 31 December 2018

42.111.16.241 (talk) 10:10, 31 December 2018 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. – Jonesey95 (talk) 13:25, 31 December 2018 (UTC)

Recent photo controversy

We have two versions; each person putting picture on site believes theirs is bettter; consensus should decide.Mwinog2777 (talk) 16:46, 30 March 2019 (UTC)

See also this version downloaded from the National Museum of African American History and Culture website itself. Abecedare (talk) 17:53, 30 March 2019 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 17 June 2019

Please consider the possibility that there is an error in the following statement, where "John Brow" might need to be corrected to "John Brown". Thanks for your attention. StephenJohnC (talk) 02:44, 17 June 2019 (UTC) S. Codd

Current version: (consider the text "John Brow") Douglass and Tubman admired one another greatly as they both struggled against slavery. When an early biography of Tubman was being prepared in 1868, Douglass wrote a letter to honor her. It read in part: You ask for what you do not need when you call upon me for a word of commendation. I need such words from you far more than you can need them from me, especially where your superior labors and devotion to the cause of the lately enslaved of our land are known as I know them. The difference between us is very marked. Most that I have done and suffered in the service of our cause has been in public, and I have received much encouragement at every step of the way. You, on the other hand, have labored in a private way. I have wrought in the day – you in the night. ... The midnight sky and the silent stars have been the witnesses of your devotion to freedom and of your heroism. Excepting John Brow – of sacred memory – I know of no one who has willingly encountered more perils and hardships to serve our enslaved people than you have.[67]

Suggested version: (consider the text "John Brown") Douglass and Tubman admired one another greatly as they both struggled against slavery. When an early biography of Tubman was being prepared in 1868, Douglass wrote a letter to honor her. It read in part: You ask for what you do not need when you call upon me for a word of commendation. I need such words from you far more than you can need them from me, especially where your superior labors and devotion to the cause of the lately enslaved of our land are known as I know them. The difference between us is very marked. Most that I have done and suffered in the service of our cause has been in public, and I have received much encouragement at every step of the way. You, on the other hand, have labored in a private way. I have wrought in the day – you in the night. ... The midnight sky and the silent stars have been the witnesses of your devotion to freedom and of your heroism. Excepting John Brown – of sacred memory – I know of no one who has willingly encountered more perils and hardships to serve our enslaved people than you have.[67] StephenJohnC (talk) 02:44, 17 June 2019 (UTC)

 Done You were right, but all I had to do was consult the sources. Shearonink (talk) 03:30, 17 June 2019 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 23 July 2019

This page appears to have 'scout' misspelled as 'scount' in the section 'Later Life.' — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.80.123.208 (talk) 17:15, 23 July 2019 (UTC)

Fixed. Good catch. --RL0919 (talk) 17:35, 23 July 2019 (UTC)

Nominated for second appearance at TFA

Since most of the "top contributor" editors for this article are either long inactive or seem to edit only occasionally these days, I wanted to post a note here that I have nominated the article for a second appearance as Today's Featured Article on September 17, the 170th anniversary of her escape from slavery. You can see more details and comment on the nomination at Wikipedia:Today's featured article/requests/Harriet Tubman. --RL0919 (talk) 22:33, 1 August 2019 (UTC)

Number of freed slaves

I've seen in other texts where Harriet Tubman is said to have freed almost 300 slaves. What is the origination of the number 100 in the wiki page? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Vcw2121 (talk • contribs) 00:31, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

The number given in the article is approximately 70 that she led to freedom herself, and another 50 or 60 that she provided instructions for escaping. Both numbers are cited to Kate Larson's 2004 biography of Tubman. As to other numbers, it isn't discussed in the article, but there were stories told about Tubman that magnified her accomplishments. These stories are not conisdered entirely accurate by modern historians, so we use the best numbers given in reliable sources such as Larson's book. --RL0919 (talk) 01:06, 2 November 2019 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 8 June 2020

There’s a line in the first paragraph that says “She was also a queen that was way ahead of her time.” While entertaining, that statement is not factually correct as she was never the monarch of any country. 71.202.0.235 (talk) 17:45, 8 June 2020 (UTC)

 Done JTP ^{(talk • contribs)} 18:01, 8 June 2020 (UTC)

Terminology of 'slaves' vs. 'enslaved persons'

The first paragraph on the page says " Born into slavery, Tubman escaped..." Does the 2nd paragraph also have to say "Born a slave" and if so, can it be written to say "Born an enslaved person" That same 2nd paragraph says the metal weight was intended for "another slave" this should read "another enslaved person" The 3rd paragraph mentions that she "guided dozens of other slaves" This should read "guided dozens of enslaved people" this paragraph goes on to mention "Newly freed slaves" This should read "formerly enslaved people" The 4th paragraph reads "liberated more than 700 slaves" Slaves should be replaced with "Enslaved people"

The sidebar with fast facts says "Known for Freeing slaves" This should be edited to be "Known for: Freeing enslaved people.

Under "Birth and family" the 1st paragraph contains the phrase "As with many slaves" This should read "As with many enslaved people" 3rd paragraph read "aided by other slaves" This should read "aided by other enslaved people"

Under "Childhood" there's a retelling of the metal weight story. It says "another slave" this should read "another enslaved person"

Under "Nicknamed "Moses" in he 4th paragraph, it reads "Suppressing her anger, she found some slaves" This should read "She found some enslaved people" In the 5th paragraph it says: "former slave Frederick Douglass" it should read "Formerly enslaved person" The last paragraph in this section says "rescuing some 70 slaves " This should read "70 enslaved people" later it says "eight escaped slaves" that should read "eight people who had escaped being enslaved" or "eight escaped enslaved people" it goes on to say about the city that "of former slaves" This should read "of formerly enslaved people"

Under Routes and Methods, the 1st paragraph says "with escaping slaves" should read "with people escaping slavery" Later in that section she is described as "disabled slave who had run away years before and never come back, was behind so many slave escapes" this should read as "enslaved person with disability......was behind the escape of so many enslaved people" The next sentence says "as secretly enticing their slaves away." should read "enticing their enslaved people away." — Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.105.207.238 (talk) 16:54, 12 June 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 22 June 2020

In paragraph starting with Tubman had to travel by night, Please add the fact that she used the call of an owl. Source is linked and book reference ISBN-13:9780345456281 Title: Bound for the Promised Land: Harriet Tubman: Portrait of an American Hero, Random House Publishing Group.

Harriet Tubman used the call of an owl to alert refugees and her freedom seekers that it was OK, or not OK, to come out of hiding and continue their journey...It would have been the Barred Owl, or as it is sometimes called, a 'hoot-owl.' https://www.audubon.org/news/harriet-tubman-unsung-naturalist-used-owl-calls-signal-underground-railroad Kiserius (talk) 02:35, 22 June 2020 (UTC)

 Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. JTP ^{(talk • contribs)} 03:03, 22 June 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 21 July 2020

Update section on film and tv portrayals to reflect:

She was portrayed by Christine Horn in NBCs TIMELESS (Season 2, episode 9 - The General)

Source: <https://www.imdb.com/title/tt6885546/>

185.239.100.23 (talk) 13:36, 21 July 2020 (UTC)

 Not done; this is merely trivia. –Deacon Vorbis (carbon • videos) 14:14, 21 July 2020 (UTC)

Reference to Pennsylvania as a "border state"

The article mentions “the border states of Pennsylvania, Maryland and Delaware,” but Pennsylvania does not fit the definition of “border state” in the subsequent hyperlink — that being a state that permitted slavery at the outset of The Civil War, but did not secede from the union.

Maybe put in an aside, or maybe put that in parenthesis right next to Pennsylvania? Eruditess (talk) 09:35, 24 July 2020 (UTC)

Reference: An Act for the Gradual Abolition of Slavery — Preceding unsigned comment added by Timcgrant (talk • contribs) 21:00, 5 July 2020 (UTC)

St. Catharines (Ontario) on the map

St. Catharines (Ontario) is misspelled on the map. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.11.249.188 (talk) 19:24, 27 July 2020 (UTC)