Talk:Elric of Melniboné

Merge discussion for Elric of Melniboné
An article that you have been involved in editing, Elric of Melniboné, has been proposed for a merge with another article. If you are interested in the merge discussion, please participate by going, and adding your comments on the discussion page. Thank you. Ace Class Shadow; My talk. 16:22, 28 May 2011 (UTC)

So about the actual guy
Didn't see much about the actual character Elric or his adventures in this article... Ideally, it should be about him, right? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 219.182.170.179 (talk) 05:20, 23 November 2008 (UTC)
 * That's the rumor. ;) - Arcayne   (cast a spell)  15:49, 23 November 2008 (UTC)

Moorcock's doomed albino antihero is one of the better known in fantasy literature, having crossed over into a wide variety of media, such as role-playing games, comics, music, and film.

You know, compared to all the other doomed albino anti-heroes.

seriously, who writes this shit? 108.249.235.44 (talk)

Cleanup, sources
I've done some work on the article, sorting the sections so as to remove a lot of the in-universe cruftiness of the article. I've also added in a section about the fictional character history; please feel free to revise or edit, so long as citations from reliable sources are added. Some sources:
 * 1
 * 2 - not the best of sources, as it contains evaluations by someone who might not be notable enough for inclusion.

Of course, more sources, specifically those speaking of Elric as a construct of Moorcock, would be especially useful. - Arcayne   (cast a spell)  18:45, 23 November 2008 (UTC)

family rivalry
Do I remember right that Yyrkoon is Cymoril's brother? —Tamfang (talk) 09:16, 26 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Yep, and both are Elric's cousins. Yrkoon is heir to the Ruby Throne. - Arcayne   (cast a spell)  11:45, 26 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes, that much is in the article already. —Tamfang (talk) 18:00, 26 November 2008 (UTC)
 * What would be excellent to add is how Moorcock developed out his plotline and developed the character relationships. It must be somewhere, since Mike is something of an interview machine. :) - Arcayne   (cast a spell)  18:09, 26 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I actually think the character could probably be broken out from the book series, and doing so would allow both articles to improve. Jclemens (talk) 18:12, 26 November 2008 (UTC)

Looks like a little more information is needed
I've grown up reading and re-reading Michael Moorcock's Elric Saga and all related materials since I was just eleven years old, and I've always loved it. I think that the article is decent, but I noticed a couple things that could be added or modified. I don't think there is enough information about Elric himself, as in, the actual character and personality. Also, does anyone else think that adding brief synopses of each book would be too much? Just wondering. Lyrical Israfel (talk) 20:20, 14 April 2009 (UTC)

I dont know how to add an extra topic here, but: Appearances in other media Computer games Arthas in wow=Elric, anyone thought about that?

Also, what seems a very obvious homage, The Witcher. The main character, Geralt, is an albino swordsman who even goes by the moniker "The White Wolf". http://www.ign.com/videos/2007/10/26/the-witcher-pc-games-trailer-quest-string-video?show=hi —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.234.109.229 (talk) 17:46, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

Actually, in the wikipedia page for The Witcher there is reference to Moorcock's reaction to this homage (the creator of the The Witcher has not, it seems, acknowledged a debt). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Witcher —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.234.109.229 (talk) 17:49, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

Here's your little info with enough sources(books) to back the accusations of plagiarism, not just some small details... The Witcher vs. Elric: Popular Plagiarism — Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.87.162.151 (talk) 04:12, 4 July 2020 (UTC)

Merger proposal
So, I was strolling the 'pedia this morning and I came by Elric (comics). Anyone else notice this article? It kind sucks. Worse yet, it's essentially redundant to this one. So, I say we just merge/redirect. I'm assuming this won't be controversial, so I'll leave it off the list. (Less paperwork). Comments, questions, objections, etc. are ever welcome. Ace Class Shadow; My talk. 16:22, 28 May 2011 (UTC)
 * If there are no objections, I'll probably wrap this up on or after Memorial Day. Ace Class Shadow; My talk. 16:29, 28 May 2011 (UTC)

Oppose. It's a legitimate spinout, and both articles are capable of significant expansion. If anything, it would be better to expand the comics spinout into a more general piece on Moorcock's Eternal Champion-related characters in comics. Hullaballoo Wolfowitz (talk) 17:18, 28 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Aww, c'mon! *sigh*
 * Look, I'll agree that both articles could be improved. I'd even go as far as to say we could have another Featured candidate before Doomsday. (Since it's apparently coming up and all.) Still, I don't like the redundancy, or the clutter of it all. Plus, at this point, neither article is long enough. As I see it, we just don't need both.
 * Later, maybe, but not right now.
 * And yes, before any says it, I understand the precedent of Conan (comics). It doesn't apply here, though. Both those articles are decently developed and distinct. Elric (comics) just looks like a retread of the comics section from over here.
 * Basically, I'm saying that Elric's fans should focus on one article for the time being. Only after this one is full--like, bursting at the seems--should it have spinoffs.
 * Ace Class Shadow; My talk. 23:39, 28 May 2011 (UTC)


 * Our coverage of the comics and graphic novels is terrible. Start with Star Reach #6 (1976) and work up to the current stuff, I guess. You could almost fill a longbox with the number of Elric comics that have been put out over the years (probably more than a longbox, if you had all the alternate covers. :-)   — SMcCandlish ☺ ☏ ¢ ≽ʌⱷ҅ᴥⱷʌ≼  16:14, 14 October 2015 (UTC)

Hang on a minute...
In the "Influences" section, there is a line that reads "The Silmarillion was not published until 1977, sixteen years after the first Elric story."

Tolkien's major work (The Lord of the Rings) was published 1954–1955, so it could well be within the time frame to have influenced the Elric stories.

I'm trying not the be biased either way, but I think that quoted line may be irrelevant. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 143.97.2.35 (talk) 12:14, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Though the paragraph, as it was presented, could be improved, I would disagree with your apparent thesis that the dates are irrelevant. Firstly, Moorcock insists that he was not directly influenced by Tolkien. I take this to mean he didn't base any of his work on LOTR or anything else by Tolkien that came out prior to Conan/Elric. Further, the main Tolkien character referred to in the paragraph was featured most prominently, in an Elric-esq manner, in a story that Moorcock couldn't have read before he wrote Elric.
 * Perhaps you misunderstood, and thought the influence question was reversed. If it were, as in Moorcock influencing Tolkien, one could easily argue that Tolkien's writings were started (though not finished) before Moorcock's. Much like a composer can argue he wrote--but didn't publish--a work well before a similar work was released.
 * Anyway, I've fixed the paragraph so that it'll hopefully make more sense to future readers. Ace Class Shadow; My talk. 17:43, 1 June 2011 (UTC)

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Those two "siscon"-ning princes.
As further evidence of his decadent ways, he openly desires his sister Cymoril and intends to make her his wife and Empress
 * Cymoril: A Melnibonéan, Elric's cousin and consort. He (Elric) hopes to one day make her his wife and empress.
 * Yyrkoon: Prince of Melniboné, Elric's cousin. He is next in line for the throne.... secretly plots Elric's demise.

Somehow Elric's wanting the same with her is not "decadent ways", go figure... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 176.115.60.63 (talk) 12:29, 8 May 2017 (UTC)

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Overlapping sections?
Are the 'Appearances in other media' and 'References in popular culture' sections both needed? There seems to be some scope for confusing overlap here. JezGrove (talk) 22:53, 7 February 2019 (UTC)

Sapkowski / Geralt of Rivia
So there is this statement:

''The Witcher series' main character, Geralt of Rivia is nicknamed the White Wolf; the character also shares a number of features with Elric, including appearance (Geralt is also an albino), skills and character traits (both characters often act as anti-heroes, both extensively use potions). While some argue this is 'homage', author Andrzej Sapkowski's refusal to acknowledge the inspiration has been taken by some (including Moorcock) to be an act of plagiarism.[28]''

The source given is a guy on youtube stating basically what's said here. But he does not provide any evidence for his words, particularly that Moorcock considers this to be plagiarism. I wasn't able to find any Moorcock statements on The Witcher either. Anyone can make a youtube video and claim all sorts of things, it's not a reliable source. What this source is good for at best, is a statement that "A guy named Razorfist on his youtube channel said he considers Witcher novels to be plagiarism of Elric novels" or something along these lines. But if you state it this way - the correct way - I suppose one can question whether one guy with youtube channel is even notable enough to be mentioned at all. --Nomad (talk) 13:51, 9 July 2019 (UTC)

I was wanting to add some observed similarities between Elric and Geralt of Rivia from The Witcher series to the page's References in popular culture section, but can't seem to find much in the way of quality sourcing regarding those similarities. Lots of blog and forum posts. However, some people in these blogs/forums seem to be referencing Michael Moorcock reacting (negatively I believe) to Geralt, but I can't find that anywhere. Has anybody come across this? Central Midfielder (talk) 16:37, 10 August 2020 (UTC)

Moorcock reacted to it on his own forums. Here


 * For the record, the first book in the series was translated into Polish in 1985 so it is possible Sapkowski read it. But the rest of the series was not translated into Polish until 1994 (based on the dates at ). Sapkowski wrote his short stories in the late 1980s / early 1990s, with the first debuting in 1986, and published Blood  of the Elves in 1994. I am unsure how fluent he was in English back then, although he worked in the international trade and does know English and several other languages, so the odds are he did know it back then. Whether he was familiar with the series, shrug - some journalist should ask. Until we have reliable sources, it's all speculation. (Also, what is inspiration and what is plagiarism is best left to literary scholars). --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here  11:49, 19 February 2022 (UTC)

Should this be rewritten into an article about the "Eric series"?
In light of the Articles for deletion/Heechee which ended up with the Heechee article rewritten from being about fictional race to that about a book series, as well as Articles for deletion/Stormbringer, which seems to be about to end as a keep, should this be rewritten into a series article, or should the series information be split into a stand-alone article, with this remaining dedicated to the character? If the latter, this needs reliable sources about the character's importance, not just plot summary and trivia about publication history and unsourced inspirations. See Stormbringer for how an encyclopedic section about a fictional character, provin their notability (significance, etc.) should look. Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 11:53, 19 February 2022 (UTC)