Talk:Lionel Messi/Archive 24

Leo Messi's Transfer to Inter Miami
I just saw the news that said messi announced he's moving to Inter Miami. Can you change his current team? GuacoTacos73 (talk) 19:06, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
 * No, because the deal isn't 100% confirmed, and he's still contracted to PSG. Joseph2302 (talk) 19:08, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Inter Miami has officially confirmed it on their account, and Messi said it himself too. Ilay0101 (talk) 19:29, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
 * It will be changed when it's confirmed, which shouldn't be long. Black Kite (talk) 19:09, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
 * This video is from the Inter Miami official Twitter
 * https://twitter.com/InterMiamiCF/status/1666525630454812686?t=qWSoiYZVAlop09RPklatXw&s=19 MasterCartoonist (talk) 20:12, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
 * That's a tease video to build anticipation, it does not announce anything formally. Radagast (talk) 22:14, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
 * irrelevant, it implies that Messi is joining 87.236.212.59 (talk) 15:27, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
 * I believe it has just been confirmed with him saying so too. The change still hasn't happened however Patriciogetsongettingridofhiswiki (talk) 19:26, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
 * While Messi has announced his intentions to join Inter Miami, no official signing has been made as of yet, yes there’s an agreed upon deal but the contract needs to be signed first 2601:1C1:8583:73E0:8CFA:AAF2:5C66:DC2A (talk) 20:14, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
 * To add on to this, it says that the deal is "100% confirmed", that should be changed to "not 100% confirmed", as Messi himself says in this video: https://www.mundodeportivo.com/futbol/fc-barcelona/20230607/1002019978/messi-vuelvo-barca-ire-inter-miami.html Burgervan128 (talk) 23:10, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Fabrizio Romano has comfirmed it man. When Romano say:"Here we go" that mean 100% comfirmed 2001:EE0:5292:E940:1C73:4902:E487:FF3C (talk) 00:07, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
 * i'm a foreign so forget about my wrong about confirmed or grammar 2001:EE0:5292:E940:1C73:4902:E487:FF3C (talk) 00:09, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Probably because Fabrizio Romano currently is not a reliable source on Wikipedia per WP:RS and WP:RSP. Hddty (talk) 05:40, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
 * More reliable than you. JoshuaInWiki (talk) 08:15, 9 June 2023 (UTC)
 * @JoshuaInWiki ??? Hddty (talk) 23:13, 9 June 2023 (UTC)
 * It is a fallacy to consider that Hddty is a less reliable source than Fabrizio Romano. A source should be judged based on its history and the results that stem from their announcements. Hddty made zero annoucements regarding a player being transferred to another club, and have implied zero announcements, which could be rephrased to "every announcement they have made regarding a player being transferred to another club is true", as can be inferred using hypothetical syllogism. That being said, Fabrizio Romano may have stated several sound arguments, but that does not conduct him a "more reliable source", as Hddty have not yet committed a fallacy to be determined "less reliable", as a void number has no means of comparison to non-void ones. Therefore, your statement is a fallacy and Hddty cannot be deemed a less reliable source than Fabrizio Romano. Nevechear (talk) 21:00, 12 June 2023 (UTC)

Goals in Barcelona
You saying that he scored 474 goals in 520 appearances. Thats only his LaLiga stats. The right numbers for Barcelona is 672 goals in 778 apps. Please fix it as soon as possible. Also his PSG stats are 32 goals in 75 apps. GreekNikoss (talk) 09:22, 14 June 2023 (UTC)
 * We only include league stats (Club domestic league appearances and goals), as the infobox clearly says. Joseph2302 (talk) 09:27, 14 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Why so? Its a bit misleading. GreekNikoss (talk) 09:31, 14 June 2023 (UTC)
 * It's consistent with all other football biographies. For other countries, it's hard to find reliable stats on cup matches, which is why WP:FOOTY decided to say league matches only. Joseph2302 (talk) 10:58, 14 June 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 14 June 2023
change current club “argentina” to “inter miami fc” 2A01:CB15:325:DF00:51:4B1A:32E4:DDE7 (talk) 13:52, 14 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Clearly you ignored the warning message about this: If you have come here to post that Messi has moved to Inter Miami, we already know. The page will be updated when a contract is signed. Please don't post a message saying his club should be changed, it won't happen until that time. Thank you! Joseph2302 (talk) 13:59, 14 June 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 16 June 2023
Please change the picture of Messi to him kissing worldcup one, Maradona also has same type of picture in wiki 27.56.88.78 (talk) 04:46, 16 June 2023 (UTC)
 * none such photo available on Commons --FMSky (talk) 08:15, 16 June 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 18 June 2023
Messi has the most assists of all time and has scored the most goals in Europe. Blitz1864 (talk) 18:07, 18 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Actualcpscm (talk) 18:51, 18 June 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 20 June 2023
I read the warning but it has been confirmed by MLS and the team owner and fc barcelonas website 96.56.100.118 (talk) 18:37, 20 June 2023 (UTC)


 * But he hasn’t signed. He is going to Miami but for now he’s a free agent. 92.99.7.90 (talk) 04:17, 23 June 2023 (UTC)

Greatest of all time
Shouldn’t it be stated, “and considered by many pundits the greatest”? I mean there’s a plethora of highly reputable sources stating this - it appears near unanimous. Of course, that’s why I merely suggest “and considered by many …” rather than “is”. Shouldn’t we at least discuss this? 45.2.48.137 (talk) 18:59, 23 June 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 17 June 2023
2001:D08:E3:FEF3:5407:B82E:4F5E:62F0 (talk) 16:27, 17 June 2023 (UTC) Update inter Miami
 * If you have come here to post that Messi has moved to Inter Miami, we already know. The page will be updated when a contract is signed. Please don't post a message saying his club should be changed, it won't happen until that time. Thank you! <b style="color:#0033ab">Joseph</b><b style="color:#000000">2302</b> (talk) 17:23, 17 June 2023 (UTC)


 * Well at least list him as “most recently played” instead of saying he is still a PSG player. 92.99.7.90 (talk) 04:16, 23 June 2023 (UTC)
 * He is a PSG player until June 30th (inclusive). Football contracts usually start on July 1st, and expire on June 30th. 2A01:4B00:C00D:6000:FC82:D854:2D2A:2749 (talk) 19:31, 28 June 2023 (UTC)

Messi filmography
acted in los protectores series KingBaba99 (talk) 02:42, 29 June 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 29 June 2023
Inter Miami and Messi Agreed to a deal to Joeste656 (talk) 23:48, 29 June 2023 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. Mattdaviesfsic (talk) 06:58, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 1 July 2023
Add that Messi will be moving to Inter Miami next season 2A00:23EE:1008:9162:BD73:7F70:1299:FA60 (talk) 18:50, 1 July 2023 (UTC)
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Cherrell410 (talk) 20:37, 1 July 2023 (UTC)
 * https://www.instagram.com/reel/CtM19jGL_P8/?igshid=NTc4MTIwNjQ2YQ== 2001:16A2:CDE4:2B00:E442:9419:3D11:2CAE (talk) 10:57, 2 July 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 3 July 2023
Add in Senior Career Tab Inter Miami 2023-2025 103.87.28.36 (talk) 07:14, 3 July 2023 (UTC)
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format and provide a reliable source if appropriate. Mattdaviesfsic (talk) 08:18, 3 July 2023 (UTC)

Add inter Miami
Add inter Miami to his introduction as it just says “he plays for and captains” WrexhamAFCManU (talk) 07:27, 5 July 2023 (UTC)
 * This will be done when he signs a contract, not before. Black Kite (talk) 08:14, 5 July 2023 (UTC)

tribute to messi
Fossil and lizard named after messi KingBaba99 (talk) 18:21, 7 July 2023 (UTC)

Messi Statue
add pic of messi statue KingBaba99 (talk) 04:38, 9 July 2023 (UTC)

Messi
Bro messi has literally signed the contract and is joining Inter Miami on 16th July. Kronjay (talk) 10:07, 9 July 2023 (UTC)


 * Can you show us a link that says he's actually signed the contract? Inter Miami haven't officially presented him as a player yet, so it's not accurate to say he's an Inter Miami player at this time. – PeeJay 13:19, 9 July 2023 (UTC)
 * Here are 2 reliable sources, and please check for yourself on the official MLS website.
 * https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-12287613/Inter-Miami-let-season-ticket-members-Lionel-Messis-July-16-unveiling-free.html#:~:text=Inter%20Miami%20season%20ticket%20holders,unveiling%20event'%20on%20July%2016. and https://www.sportico.com/personalities/athletes/2023/messis-miami-contract-50m-60m-annually-before-adidas-apple-money-1234726627/ Kronjay (talk) 16:24, 11 July 2023 (UTC)
 * The Daily Mail is not a RS, as per WP:DAILYMAIL. <b style="color:#0033ab">Joseph</b><b style="color:#000000">2302</b> (talk) 16:25, 11 July 2023 (UTC)
 * https://www.mlssoccer.com/news/mls-statement-on-lionel-messi-and-inter-miami-cf
 * https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ur-6MUcrjN4&vl=en
 * both sites are part of the official MLS community Kronjay (talk) 16:30, 11 July 2023 (UTC)

Change to some information in "Early Life"
Quote 19

"He was scouted by Buenos Aires club River Plate, whose playmaker, Pablo Aimar, he idolised, but they declined to pay for his treatment."

The bolded part is false. Already clarified by Messi himself in an interview.

it should say something like this:

"He was scouted by Buenos Aires club River Plate, whose playmaker, Pablo Aimar, he idolised. The club wanted him and were willing to pay for the treatment, but they needed Newell's Old Boys to make the transfer, which was denied by his president."

Transcription from the interview in spanish and translation after:

"Yo estaba en Newell's y fui a probarme a la escuela de River, en Rosario. Uno de los chicos iba, me dijo de ir y dije que sí. Después me trajeron a Buenos Aires. Eran categoría 85, todos más grandes. Yo jugué 15 o 20 minutos. Me dijeron que vuelva en 10 días con mi categoría. Volví e hice tres o cuatro goles y me dijeron que me tenía que quedar, que tenía que llevar el pase".

"Se iban a hacer cargo del tratamiento. Newell's nunca me bancó en ese sentido, nunca me lo pagó, mi vieja renegaba y era complicado en esa época". "Mi viejo hacía un esfuerzo grandísimo para bancarme el tratamiento. En River me dijeron que llevara el pase, y cuando fui a Newell's me sacaron cagando. Nunca me dieron el pase. Después salió todo lo del Barcelona".

(https://i.imgur.com/6xKxcpl.jpg) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4j_9BM75kS0

Translation:

"I was in Newell's Old Boys and went for a River Plate tryout in our city, Rosario. One of my teammates was going and told me to go, so I went. They were all bigger than me, category 1985. I played around 15 to 20 minutes and they told to come back in 10 days to play with players of the same age. After 10 days, I returned, played and scored 3 or 4 goals and they told me stay, that I had to get the transfer from my club in order to sign.

They said they were gonna pay for the treatment and everything. Newell's Old Boys never stood by me in that aspect, never wanted to pay for the treatment. My mom was angry about it and it was quite complicated in those times. My dad did a tremendous effort to pay for the treatment. At River Plate, told me to bring the transfer, and when I went to the Newell's Old Boys office to ask for it, they denied the opportunity and never went along to with it. After that Barcelona happened."

More from different news media sources in Argentina:

https://www.ole.com.ar/messi/messi-river-prueba-escuelita-jugo_0_lrEGauv8y.html

https://www.tycsports.com/river-plate/la-verdad-sobre-la-frustrada-llegada-de-messi-a-river-id503047.html

https://tntsports.com.ar/ligaprofesional/Lionel-Messi-River-Seleccion-Argentina-Newells-20221115-0007.html

Dexsoul (talk) 19:40, 11 July 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 17 July 2023
Could you add Messi's profile at Inter Miami website: (https://www.intermiamicf.com/players/lionel-messi/) into (External links)? 154.180.86.103 (talk) 14:28, 17 July 2023 (UTC)
 * ✅ --FMSky (talk) 14:34, 17 July 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 17 July 2023 (2)


Rickmunroe01 (talk) 15:06, 17 July 2023 (UTC) ❌ clear copyright violation, I will nominate it for deletion on Wikimedia Commons, rather than adding it here. <b style="color:#0033ab">Joseph</b><b style="color:#000000">2302</b> (talk) 15:13, 17 July 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 22 July 2023
Messi has just scored his debut goal Themadridista14 (talk) 12:04, 22 July 2023 (UTC)
 * As the article says. Lionel_Messi. Black Kite (talk) 12:20, 22 July 2023 (UTC)
 * Messi's bio table under "Senior career*" 	 Inter Miami needs to be updated as well. Traintrak (talk) 13:11, 22 July 2023 (UTC)
 * The senior career section only lists matches and goals in domestic leagues (e.g. La Liga, Ligue 1, MLS), excluding cup competitions. Annh07 (talk) 13:44, 22 July 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 22 July 2023 (2)
Apps and goals for Inter Miami need to be changed from (0) (0) to (1) (1). 2603:6081:4DF0:6290:A4AB:639B:6DD7:3F57 (talk) 14:05, 22 July 2023 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: See edit request above ARandomName123 (talk) 16:45, 22 July 2023 (UTC)

Appearance and Goal
Messi scored his first goal for Inter Miami. Update this please. Harry Tootmorsel (talk) 14:24, 22 July 2023 (UTC)


 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: See edit request above ARandomName123 (talk) 16:45, 22 July 2023 (UTC)

Most recent FK scorer of 4 teams
Under the Inter Miami part of the “Club Career” section, could someone please add that in scoring his debut free kick against Cruz Azul, as of July 21st 2023, he has achieved the rare feat of being responsible for the most recent free kick goals of 4 separate teams: Barcelona, PSG, Argentina and Inter Miami?

Sources:

Barca: https://www.sport.es/en/news/barca/barca-have-yet-to-break-their-free-kick-drought-since-the-departure-of-lionel-messi-14421459

PSG: https://www.ligue1.com/Articles/Match-Reports/2023/02/19/messi-free-kick-wins-seven-goal-thriller-for-psg-mbappe-neymar

Argentina: https://keepup.com.au/news/argentina-2-0-panama-messi-scores-stunning-free-kick-to-bring-up-800-career-goals/

Inter Miami: https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/lionel-messi-free-kick-debut-30526404

- I’m not certain if this feat is unique to Messi but if anybody can verify that it would also be appreciated! Kovidc (talk) 21:55, 22 July 2023 (UTC)
 * seems like WP:Fancruft and will become outdated in 2 weeks anyway --FMSky (talk) 22:01, 22 July 2023 (UTC)

Update first paragraph of the article
In the first introduction paragraph of the article, the statement "With his country, he won the 2021 Copa América and the 2022 FIFA World Cup." is missing the Finalissima trophy, for completeness, since the "and" indicates a complete enumeration. This trophy/cup is mentioned later in the article.

References within Wikipedia itself:

Alecordev (talk) 11:48, 18 July 2023 (UTC)
 * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_Finalissima
 * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CONMEBOL%E2%80%93UEFA_Cup_of_Champions


 * is the finalissima really that important though? Patriciogetsongettingridofhiswiki (talk) 19:32, 23 July 2023 (UTC)

Requested edit
Change all uses of "football" to "soccer". He plays for a US team, so a lot of American readers will come here and think he's playing American football. 85.238.69.176 (talk) 10:36, 22 July 2023 (UTC)
 * ❌ I doubt if there is anyone who would think that. Black Kite (talk) 12:19, 22 July 2023 (UTC)
 * Also, this would violate MOS:TIES. He's Argentinian, so we should use the terminology in Argentina, which is football. Which is applied consistently by WP:FOOTY, so Americans playing in non-American league will be referred to as "soccer players" too. <b style="color:#0033ab">Joseph</b><b style="color:#000000">2302</b> (talk) 13:24, 24 July 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 24 July 2023
Messis Appearances and Goals need to be changed for Inter Miami. Appearances: 1 Goals: 1 YessirDV (talk) 13:19, 24 July 2023 (UTC)
 * Clearly you didn't read the warning on the edit page: If you have come here to post that Messi's appearance and goals total in the infobox should be updated, please note that these totals only include league games. The total appearances and goals are displayed at the bottom of the article. <b style="color:#0033ab">Joseph</b><b style="color:#000000">2302</b> (talk) 13:22, 24 July 2023 (UTC)
 * To be fair to this editor, editnotices for mobile web editors (which this one was) are notably flaky. They do appear to work for all other clients now, though. Black Kite (talk) 13:42, 24 July 2023 (UTC)

July 21st Free Kick Goal
All goals made in Major League Soccer matches are accounted for no matter the player or tournament. Add his Inter Miami goal 2001:56A:F09F:6300:E818:DEE1:E6C3:4116 (talk) 22:26, 25 July 2023 (UTC)
 * League goals only. Cup game is not a league game. <b style="color:#0033ab">Joseph</b><b style="color:#000000">2302</b> (talk) 22:35, 25 July 2023 (UTC)

Messi scored in his debut so that should be changed
W ITSAINSIDEJOB (talk) 02:58, 22 July 2023 (UTC)


 * The documentation for the infobox being used on this page states that the caps and goals displayed for a particular club should only count league competition. Messi has so far only played a cup competition game for Inter Miami, and not any league competition games yet. — AFC Vixen 🦊 06:30, 22 July 2023 (UTC)
 * What?!? Any goal made under major league soccer is counted for any player no matter the match 2001:56A:F09F:6300:E818:DEE1:E6C3:4116 (talk) 22:25, 25 July 2023 (UTC)
 * Yes, exactly. Messi scored in a Leagues Cup game, not a Major League Soccer game. — AFC Vixen 🦊 00:59, 26 July 2023 (UTC)

Club and international career split proposal
Lionel Messi Lionel Messi, Club career of Lionel Messi, and International career of Lionel Messi — The prose word count for this page is over 23,000. This far exceeds the rule of thumb defined by WP:SIZERULE, which recommends articles with over 15,000 words of prose "almost certainly should be divided." I can't imagine most find this page a comfortable read, so I'm wondering if it's too crazy of an idea to split the content in the "Club career" and "International career" sections into their own articles, and replace them here with shorter, more concise sections consisting a few paragraphs written in summary style. That way, readers wanting a more general overview of his career don't have to read... all that, for the lack of a better description. — AFC Vixen 🦊 06:17, 22 July 2023 (UTC)
 * Endorse this completely. To repeat what I said on your talk page (along with an apology for jumping the gun), its not been done before I don't think, but a topic of this size could do with it. We've had to trim the Messi article before, but your proposal would allow us to do that most effectively while still having sub articles to provide more club/international detail. Had a look at a featured article of another sportsman (Michael Jordan), and that's pretty much the way to summarise seasons. Basically have the crux of each season, the notable games, achievements, events etc. Similar to Jordan an article on Messi is always going to be bigger than the norm given the subject matter. Jordan's article is just over 200Kb, and doing this proposal to Messi's would allow us to get similar. Nampa DC (talk) 08:54, 23 July 2023 (UTC)
 * seems needless.Muur (talk) 03:17, 25 July 2023 (UTC)


 * Oppose the solution is to cut the article down to a manageable size, not create lots of spin-off articles to hide the underlying problem. So many arbitrary stats listed in prose that could be cut down as a start. <b style="color:#0033ab">Joseph</b><b style="color:#000000">2302</b> (talk) 09:43, 26 July 2023 (UTC)
 * I wouldn't be opposed to this idea but I agree with Joseph that it would be a good idea to start by reducing the article size to see if it that would solve the problem. Stevie fae Scotland (talk) 10:59, 26 July 2023 (UTC)
 * I find it incredibly difficult to imagine how we can consolidate these extensive sections full of well-sourced, notable events in Messi's career into just a few paragraphs, without straight-up erasing them from Wikipedia. — AFC Vixen 🦊 07:19, 27 July 2023 (UTC)
 * I highly doubt that every fact mentioned in the article is encyclopaedically relevant. – PeeJay 16:28, 27 July 2023 (UTC)


 * Oppose per Joseph; we are an encyclopedia, not a sports almanac.
 * Oppose The club career season sections especially are bloated in many cases. Black Kite (talk) 18:30, 27 July 2023 (UTC)
 * Comment: I agree with PeeJay et al. suggesting that there is likely encyclopaedically irrelevant content on the article, but I don't quite buy the "we're not a sports almanac" argument, there is literally articles such as the Religious views of the Beatles and Muhammad Ali, is this website a religious forum? The vast majority of content on this article is notable and would probably be mentioned in any other GA/FA sports biography. Culling the bloated information is a very good start but in the chance that its not enough, then an option like this is certainly reasonable.


 * Oppose: Simply not necessary. Sadsadas, (talk), 31 July 2023, 20:11.

Goals messi in inter miami
Google please Add goal messi now in inter miami now messi Have a 3 goal with inter miami Thanks. 130.193.253.13 (talk) 12:27, 28 July 2023 (UTC)


 * First, this is not Google. Second, I assume you're talking about the goal tally in the infobox at the top of the article? That box only shows league statistics, and Messi has not yet scored for Inter Miami in the league. Hope that helps. – PeeJay 12:48, 28 July 2023 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 1 August 2023
Messi has scored 3 goals for Inter Miami 148.252.133.178 (talk) 16:01, 1 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: See the responses in two previous sections above this. We are only counting league goals. <b style="color:#000080; font-family:Tahoma">WikiVirus</b><u style="font-family: Tahoma">C <b style="color:#008000">(talk)</b> 16:05, 1 August 2023 (UTC)

New stats in MLS
5 goals in 3 matches with the Inter Miami Club 74.57.83.45 (talk) 06:37, 3 August 2023 (UTC) ❌ league matches only, not the League Cup that he's been playing in. <b style="color:#0033ab">Joseph</b><b style="color:#000000">2302</b> (talk) 08:03, 3 August 2023 (UTC)