Talk:PlayStation 2/Archive 4

Piracy!
I was just reading the Dreamcast history of which it blames Piracy for one of the reasons it did not do well, well what ever the maybe, how come nothing was mentioned on this PS2 page, about piracy? look how much people have abused it by installing modchips! totally unfair to make the PS2 look so good when its a pile of garbage!! Thanks KaKoRoT KaKoRoT@Gmail.com


 * What are you on about? Abusing the PS2 by installing a modship?  The PS2 is now an old piece of hardware - nearly 8 years since Sony finished development - so it's graphics are somewhat dated.

why the ps2 page has been edited to craps????


 * I agree with this. There is no criticism of the console (although the partisanship apparant on this page may make that a good thing. And there is no mention of the 'modchipping' of the console, which took place on a massive scale, so merits mention on the article.--Macca7174 01:40, 26 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Also the PS2 was victim to non- modchip methods as well, thanks to the independance exploit, a hard drive and hdloader you could copy games using your pc and run them of the PS2 whether or not they were legit.--[anonymous] —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 172.189.104.56 (talk • contribs).

Professional gamer quit outing strike thru other peoples sentences just because you don't agree. God you're such a fanboy. Wera 03:25, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

Emotion engine and graphic systhesiser
are these chips all in one in the slim ps2?


 * Yes they are. These are the CPU and GPU and have not changed specifications besides possibly die size.

Horrible grammar!
What is wrong with the sentance structuring in this article? Just look at this: "Although Sony placed little emphasis on online gaming during its first year, that changed upon the launch of the online-capable Xbox. Sony adapter in late 2002 to compete with Microsoft, with several online first party titles released alongside it, such as SOCOM: U.S. Navy SEALs to show its active support for Internet play. Sony also advertised heavily, and its online model had the by Electronic Arts." The sentances aren't completed, the second sentancfe starts with "Sony Adapter". What? That doesn't make any sense! Should this possibly be "Sony released an ethernet adapter in late 2002(...)"? "and it's online model had the by Electronic Arts" Had the what? Comma-and? Very wrong, I'd say. Also note spelling errors such as 'its' instead of 'it's'. This whole article needs reviewing, correcting and locking down for a week or so because of recent vandalism. The part about heavy advertisement is also extremely out of place, it isn't contextual enough to be just about the online and seems to be the about any advertisement made by Sony for PS2.

But then again, I'm not a born English speaker, so I may be wrong. br> -AARST Friday, November 17th 22:25

All Playstation Systems Pages Merge
I propopse a merge of all of the Playstation pages making the playstation page contain information about the ps2 and ps3Shrek976


 * I dont think they should be merged as some could be considered a waste of space, but they should at least be a link to it. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 172.189.104.56 (talk • contribs).

Best Selling Game
The best selling game is not Gran Turismo 3: A Spec

It is definitely either Grand Theft Auto Vice City or Grand Theft Auto San Andreas. According to another article in wikipedia, GTA VC just edges out GTA SA for best selling game, closely followed by Gran Turismo 3

Actually, no. The top-selling game still retains Gran Turismo 3: A-Spec, because the game still outsells Grand Theft Auto: Vice City and Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas, so it cannot be changed until further notice. Professional Gamer 01:01, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Proof of best selling game
can anyone get proof of what the best selling game is from a trusted source? that will set this issue straight because many people genuinely believe that gta vice city outsold gt3, and there are articles on the internet and wikipedia supporting that... here is a link

The top-selling game still remains Gran Turismo 3: A-Spec and will not allow anyone to change the top-selling game. Even though Grand Theft Auto: Vice City, the top-selling game cannot be changed. Professional Gamer 21:50, 3 December 2006 (UTC)

Does anyone else agree with me that Professional Gamer is not being professional and is just using his own biased preferences for Gran Turismo? There has been proof shown that GTA Vice City outsold Gran Turismo, so please accept it or show proof that Gran Turismo 3 was indeed the best selling game. I would gladly accept the fact that Gran Turismo 3 is the best selling game if you can find citations for it. Thanks. 67.82.102.212 22:43, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

Don't you dare try to harass me. I'm as professional as I can, and you, are just an anonymous user, who never resgisters. Be careful who are you messing with, because then, you are blocked. Professional Gamer 16:32, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Professional Gamer is right about Gran Turismo 3.  That site (and plenty of others, Google it) cites sales of 14.36 million copies for GT3 (which is certainly more than the 13 million cited in that other article), and unless GTA:VC managed to sell an extra two million copies within the few months between the source used in the other Wikipedia article for that and this one (which is extremely unlikely, especially considering how long VC had been out by then) Gran Turismo would still have been in the lead at the most recent point we can see. In either case, the most recent source I've seen for Gran Turismo 3 shows higher sales than the most recent one for GTA:VC, so it's still safer to say that it's the best-selling game.

Also (and this is the reason I'm actually bothering with this), maybe I'm just missing it but it seems that someone removed any reference to the best selling game from the actual article entirely. Rabish12 00:44, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

I don't see the point in it anyway. Seems like it's just fanboy ammo to me.--172.147.21.78 21:01, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

I never intended to harass you, Professional Gamer. I stated before that the only citations we had at the time showed that Grand Theft Auto VC was the best selling game, and you completely ignored me multiple times and refused to change the best selling game despite me showing proof that VC sold more copies. You accused me of being a vandalizer when all I was doing was trying to make sure that there was correct information on wikipedia. I never intended to harass you, I just wanted to make sure that what was on Wikipedia was right, not just someone's opinions.

And thanks, Rabish12 for providing us with the citation, and I agree with you, 172.147.21.78 that the best selling game is only ammo for fanboys, especially when it is hard to find a respectable source (like an NPD press release) for these stats. I think it would be a good idea to remove it if possible.

And Professional Gamer, I just wanted to make sure the facts on Wikipedia were right. I just took offense when you accused me of being a vandalizer, but I never intended to harass you. No hard feelings, all right? 67.82.102.212 01:39, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

Mistakes usually happen to me a lot. Professional Gamer 19:42, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

Hi first edit/thingy here, Anyways Theres a lot of fanboyism here Can't you just leave the thing blank? There's obviously no "Real" Proof as to what the best selling game is leave it blank or put up multiplies games using the "," Wera 07:23, 9 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Okay....now it has San Andreas listed up there as best selling. Yet, when you click on the link to show the list of best-selling games....Vice City is first. One of the articles is wrong and needs to be fixed. Abalu 12:19, 29 May 2007 (UTC) Abalu

A better EyeToy picture?
Could someone put in a better EyeToy picture? The current one is kinda fuzzy and the redness around it makes it harder to see clearly. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 70.170.93.169 (talk) 21:42, 10 December 2006 (UTC).

Einstein & Jefferson?
Who put that Einstein and Jefferson thing under the DRE section? Someone remove that. I don't think it's relevant. (67.180.78.96 05:50, 11 December 2006 (UTC))

Main infobox picture
Wouldn't it be more appropriate for the article to have a picture of the classic PS2 rather than the later "slim" design? I know it's a better picture, but the larger one is the original product and was the one purchased by the great majority of PlayStation owners. -- Grandpafootsoldier 21:18, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Yes the original design has been around for longer but was succeeded by the 2004 slim-line model and (as far as I am aware at least) has not been available for first-hand purchase for many months; in the same way the iMac article shows the current iMac Core 2 Duo model, not the original translucent Bondi Blue that is arguably much more recognisable to the majority of people. If anyone agrees with me, please feel free to change the picture to the one of the slim-line model.


 * Just have both of them, we should at least have a picture of it for historical matters (i.e. someone looking this up in 20 years). —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 172.189.104.56 (talk • contribs).

Some knowledge, also gameplay is not made out of fillrate, sorry my dears.
Everyone has said this on IGN.com to other sites when talking of triangle performance, but the truth is that gameplay is accumulated in flops not pixels. People get confused about this because game engines, the game engine is like a graphics card. If it uses little numbers of the overall console, then they will have slowdown when getting to the higher numbers higher then the built engine. The only effect gameplay will have is flops, if it's beginning to go down in flops then it means the Vu0 is being taxed, though the ps2 could still render the same fillrate as this is seperately on the GS, just they couldn't render so many high AI people on screen because the operations used for each chara. This means ps2 can go over 16,000,000 million polygons with gameplay(physic more persice, which is basically just AI).

Jak1 proves this, in psm, they stated from source that it displays about 15,000,000 triangles at a given scene and it has huge noticeable LOD(if you get it just right, when you swim to the beach from the village at the beginning and you get the cam to hide this huge LOD, when it puts the cam behind you again you can see this major click to a low res model if you swim towards the village a bit and stop and turn the cam). Now it's that JAK3 has much more poly detail in the BG's and much bigger BG's and much less an smoother(slower) LOD at a time that shows that it can go over 16,000,000 triangles with gameplay.

Confused? This means high AI would limit number of certain high AI people on screen, when a site says this as if they mean real polygons limits they are actually misleading you a bit.

Also full texture like silent hill 3 would be 1 texture, 2 texture just means to add an additional layer, ps2 can render about 36,750,000 with silent hill 3 textures and AI, though the amount of AI would limit how many enemies on screen if they each had high numbers of code in them, but still the AI doesn't make the poly limit itself go down just flops account too for how many smart people are on screen. But remember 1 operation is one flop and it doesn't take too many operations in comparison to the vector to make good level AI to that it would limit a big amount of em on screen with much other stuff. Now when team silent says they use another layer for the "evil" effect, they mean they use the second texture unit though they could do it less fillrate taxing and use 1 simple pass to add the evil effect.

On Zanir's gfx demos page(I was going to link but it seems down for now), look closely, he says he uses another texture unit(what they call texture layer at times) for multi-texturing, or he can also use a single pass with the texture info in it for this, overall multi-pass rendering is a fillrate saver if your choosing to do a texture effect on all surfaces. Download some of the emboss and multi-texture demos from there when the site is back up.

raw facts -gameplay don't effect poly limit, just flops and therefor it's that you can't have so many high AI guys on screen with all the other objects using up flops -one texture unit or layer is the traditional flat looking textureing from games like silent hill 2 or 3 or Ico -two layers mean adding bump mapping using this layer or alpha or specular, or a blended other flat texture like the evil effect in silent hill 3.

Bob Bye.

PS:xbox cant render as many polygons as ps2 with one real layer texture and even using only about 2 passes(one for bump maps as grayscale can be done in one pass)250x4=1.0=31,250,000t/s vs. ps2's 1.2 with one texture=36,750,000, though xbox has a texture pipe for each pixel pipe so it doesn't matter how manny textures you got on it, it won't effect the raw poly #, so xbox has an advantage with two layers(and could go up to 4 layers per surface). —The preceding unsigned comment was added by BobtheVila (talk)

PSS. The 16million thing comes from the VERY inacurate people thinking the tranformations ps2 can do when using curved surface as the textured poly performance. Also gameplay wouldn't effect this number either, as that seperatly on the fpu and VU0. And texturing I don't think factors in here as this only feeds data for those polygons, I think this comes from where they first saw ps2's numbers and saw the tranformation as the number of polygons the pixel fill rate could do, as ealier mag specs just showed 66M polygons/sec when talking about the poly number.

• BobtheVila 22:07, 17 December 2006 (UTC).

PSSS(ah that felt good)Also it's come to my attentien that the actual draw rate of consoles is how many can be done in a frame, i'll add this to each console section(per frame numbers), per sec is how many it did in a second total. It's also factor too though, that's why you'll have slow down, ex: the engine can do only 10mill a sec, so 333,333 polys a frame at 30fps, then they accidently go over 333,333 polys so it will lower the frame rate to equal 10,000,000 a sec. Also errors in programing and unoptimized code will factor in too. BobtheVila

Semi-protect this article
Seriously, I have had it with those anonymous vandalizers vandalizing the PlayStation 2 article. Please semi-protect it, so registered and administrator users can edit it greatfully. Even though some of the anonymous users don't vandalize this article, we still need it to keep it locked to avoid vandalizers. Professional Gamer 14:19, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Yes cause I don't want any gamesite editor learned moron who thinks AI is made out of fillrate and not seperate operations of the cpu adding lies like ps2 can only do 8 or 10 mill polys with gameplay. The GS is what handles polygons and texture operations and is un-affected by cpu and vu0 AI operations which are just the movments and physics of those pixels. Also the whole thing of GTA and GT3:Aspec.BobtheVila

This page was semi-protected today. Look for a little padlock in the upper right of the article. Tocharianne 23:12, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

Yeah. I tried to semi-protect it manually, but does'nt seem to work. Thanks for semi-protecting the PS2 article. Seriously, over 4 months that the PS2 article was attacked by anonymous vandalizers, and they need to be stopped. Professional Gamer 01:12, 4 January 2007 (UTC)


 * I complained on one of the noticeboards and an admin came and protected this and PlayStation as well. (I think PlayStation3 was already protected.) Tocharianne 04:21, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Top-Selling Game Change
Was there any announcement for the new top-selling game? Professional Gamer 19:16, 3 March 2007 (UTC)

Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas was the new top-selling game, but did Sony announced the new top-selling game? Professional Gamer 20:19, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Japanese name
Is it necessary to have the Japanese kana (プレイステーション2)? The English word "Playstation" isn't a case of translating from the Japanese, rather it is the English name for the product. In this case, the name of the product when it's sold in Japan is no more relevent to this article than the name it's sold under in any other country. In the case of an article about a Japanese person or cultural artifact (e.g. Kappa (folklore)) the English term would be a rendering of the original Japanese, but in the case of "Playstation", this was always the name it had in English. (And the name was obviously coined from English anyway.) Tocharianne 15:55, 29 December 2006 (UTC)


 * Maybe Pureisusheison Tsu? I could'nt write it in Japanese, because my computer won't let me download it. Professional Gamer 12:34, 5 January 2007 (UTC)


 * No, no, my point is we shouldn't have any version of the Japanese name, whether in kana or romaji. In this particular case, the Japanese name is not relevent to the article because the English name is not a translation of it. What the product is called in Japan is basically trivia. Tocharianne 15:04, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

Castlevania: Symphony of the Night
I have removed the sentence that claims Castlevania: Symphony of the Night does not play properly. Specifically, it said that some items are unattainable while using a PS2, which is untrue. If anyone has a good source for this claim, feel free to put it back. Cinder6 19:44, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * What about the Konami Justifier light gun? It doesn't work on my 3009 model, but does it work on the new slim models?  Best, --164.107.223.217 22:43, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

Ps2 online
what game has the most people online
 * Unless I have misunderstood you, I think the question you are asking would be better at the Entertainment Reference Desk, since this is the place intended for discussion of changes to the PlayStation 2 article. Thanks. Trixovator 18:50, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

EE+GS in scph-70000 series
are the emotion engine and graphic synthesizer in one chip in the silver ps2? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Falcon866 (talk • contribs) 22:14, 4 February 2007 (UTC).

Most likely and actually I think they said the last model before the slim ones where on one chip too. They said in a mag before the slim ones they acheived that and hoped they'd use it to make small ps2's using the technology...and here we are now!!BobtheVila

Multitap.
in the slim case design section, there is this line "The SCPH-70000 is also the only series to work with the MultiTap expansion allowing 4 players to play at the same time" What is this about?

The first PS2 had a multitap that worked for 4 player PS2 games, and it was compatible with the PS1 multitap for 4 player PS1 games.

due to the case design, the origional PS2 multitap didn't fit into the slimline case, but there was a new MultiTap released. the PS1 multitap was also compatible with the slimline case. 131.216.14.246 20:34, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

Limited Edition Silver PS2
There is now a "Limited Edition" Silver slim PS2 avalible online at Amazon, eBay, etc. There should probably be a section about this on the main article. --PSRising 22:21, 4 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Is this version compatible with the Konami Justifier light gun controllers made for the PS1? I think that we should include more specifics on backwards compatibility.  Thanks!  --164.107.223.217 16:24, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

Controversy
What the hell is that bit about Saddam Hussein there for? 193.1.36.14 16:45, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

They said on some mags that they heard a rediculous romur Saddam bought tons of ps2s, the weren't saying it was true though.BobtheVila

Playstation 2 DVD-9 compatibility
Supported Disc Media: PlayStation 2 format CD-ROM, PlayStation format CD-ROM, Compact Disc Audio, PlayStation 2 format DVD-ROM (4.7 GB), DVD Video (4.7 GB). Later models are DVD-9 (8.5 GB Dual-Layer), DVD+RW, and DVD-RW compatible.

This seems to suggest that older models are not DVD-9 compatible, when all models are able to play movies and games on DVD-9 media. It is only writable dual-layered media that is incompatible with older PS2 models. 172.203.25.189 19:39, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Might put a tech demo section
Should it be new or should it be put in with games or an other section?BobtheVila

Age Demographics
You might consider including some information of age demographics in this article 139.168.243.230 05:03, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

PS2 Logo on disc tray
Just a minor fact which might be worth mentioning; the fact that the small ps2 logo on the disc tray can be rotated manually 90degrees to fit with the console being either vertical or horizontal. Just wondered if it could be incorporated anywhere in the article J S Firefox 11:23, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

Playstation Backwards Compatibility issues?
The article states that the PlayStation 2 can play PlayStation controllers. I have a fat model PlayStation 2 and green Konami Justifier light guns designed for the original PlayStation. These guns do not work in the second controller port of my PlayStation 2 (obviously DualShock works fine) and only work in the first player controller port when I plug them into a DVD remote thing. Therefore, if others know more about this and there are issues if incompatibility with some controllers, I would urge this to be mentioned in the article. --24.154.173.243 04:50, 14 April 2007 (UTC)

Software emulation on PC
Think it is worthy of mention that, like previous consoles such as the SNES or Playstation (PSone), various individuals have been able to emulate the playstation 2 on PC? PCSX2 is by far the best emulator for x86-based PC's. Any way to implement this into the article? Dashboardy 20:36, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

Adding a tech support site
Hi, I was thinking about to add a technical support/troubleshooting community to the external links. I Believe it will help viewers to solve common troubleshooting and support problem.

Let me know what you think
 * Good idea. Remember to sign your posts using the four tildes J S Firefox 16:40, 19 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the comment. I do think it's a good idea, yet would you consider a different site, such as the | official support site, which I think may answer more technical queries regarding the PS2. Let me know either here, or on my talk page, and I'll edit it in for you J S Firefox 20:27, 22 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Sorted :D J S Firefox 14:55, 23 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I tried to register on that fixya site to find an answer for 24.etc.'s backwards compatibility question: "The article states that the PlayStation 2 can play PlayStation controllers. I have a fat model PlayStation 2 and green Konami Justifier light guns designed for the original PlayStation. These guns do not work in the second controller port of my PlayStation 2 (obviously DualShock works fine) and only work in the first player controller port when I plug them into a DVD remote thing. Therefore, if others know more about this and there are issues if incompatibility with some controllers, I would urge this to be mentioned in the article." Anyway, I was unsuccessful in helping my fellow anonymous editor out. :( --164.107.223.217 22:06, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

Japanese mispronounciations
Again, this time without my rage, how can you justify using japanese mispronounciations as the correct pronounciation? This isn´t just for the playstation articles but most articles related with Japan. It´s an english name, post the english (correct) pronounciation... —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 82.117.96.5 (talk) 13:01, 11 May 2007 (UTC).

PSX DVR
Was this machine the first Sony device to contain the XMB (Cross Media Bar) used on the psp and Ps3. Atirage 12:08, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

PS2 "Internal Display Clock"
What merits that to have it's own page separate from the PlayStation 2? Yeah, it's different, but its a component of the machine, theres no article on the touch buttons for the PS3. Let PS2 assimilate it and forget that dumb article.

Cheers, Dubbya9 14:52, 27 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Yes, let's combine the two articles as it is extremely stupid to have an article just for the clock of a PS2. Xtreme racer 15:01, 27 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I'll have to disagree. It looks like the reason it is separated is because the author wanted to explain the inherit math and time elements, and how it is incorporated with the system clock. Putting the entire explanation of how the clock works within the main PS2 page would make it too irrelevant and convoluded compared to the rest of the article. I think it needs to stay separate. Besides, there's no where else on the internet anywhere that explains the mechanics of the PS2 system clock. And I'll bet you most unobservant people wouldn't even know that it was a clock turning in the background.


 * Calling articles "dumb" or "stupid" to you may be "interesting" to somebody else. Don't be so narrow-minded. Please follow talk page guidelines and do not "bite" new authors. —Preceding unsigned comment added by User: (talk • contribs)


 * I think that the clock article should be linked from the PS2 page, but not included, as the PS2 article is already getting a bit long, so it would be beneficial to leave it out and keep it on its own, as long as it's linked. J S Firefox 16:23, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

Hardware Failiures
When the PS2 was first lauched in Britain (late 2000), majour hardware problems arose where alot if not most of the inital batch of units broke. I saw this on a an episode of Watchdog in 2000 and I think this should be mentioned. There was also another case where alot of the first few batches would brake just after a year (again from watchdog). —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 172.189.104.56 (talk • contribs).

Fair use rationale for Image:Eyetoybox.jpg
Image:Eyetoybox.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in Wikipedia articles constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 06:26, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Cog-ni-zant
In the section Technical Problems the assertion that "The first problem was easily remedied by opening the console's casing and tweaking a cog that controlled the lens' distance from the disc" is something where I would cast some doubt. It is my experience that the lens's distance from the disc is controlled by a motor and the 'cog' referred to here is part of the mechanism which will reset when power is applied. Djmips 19:02, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

For some reason the main article won't let me edit it. Anyhow, the Irecommend link in the unofficial pages links section is broken, and I sort of doubt that even if it were not broken it would be an appropriate thing to have in the links section.

Top Game
The source used is almost 3 years old. Hardly reliable nowadays. Phediuk 16:38, 8 July 2007 (UTC)