Talk:Gran Trak 10

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BetacommandBot (talk) 23:06, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

3rd opinion on inclusion of Wozniak liking Gran Trak 10
and I disagree on whether or not their addition of Steve Wozniak considering Gran Trak 10 to be his favorite game is a good one in this article. The statement is well-supported by RSs, so that's fine, but since Wozniak did not work on the game, or even work directly for Atari at any point, in my opinion it's trivia- "relatively famous person liked this game". We've gone back and forth a couple times, so rather than edit war, I'm requesting additional comment from WT:VG members here. -- Pres N  16:07, 14 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Trivia - There's no mention that he was inspired by it or that it helped him specifically in the development of Breakout nor is he a reviewer. At this point it's just a guy who liked a game and is only included because he's well known for other things.  Cr im so nF ox  talk 16:16, 14 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Remove. The statement tells us something about Wozniak and nothing about Gran Trak. Mention it on Wozniak's article, but not here. If it inspired his game design philosophies or something it would be very different and I would argue to include but unfortunately that's not the case.  TarkusAB talk 16:30, 14 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Remove. For the same reasons you presented. Just an opinion of a famous person.Blue Pumpkin Pie (talk) 16:46, 14 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Leave (in the latest version):
 * The mention of Wozniak is intended to illustrate the reception of the game at its time (normally, it goes into section "Reception", not "Legacy"). Currently the article only mentions that the game was successful, but there is no indication that the game was even considered "addictive" so much, as to make people like Wozniak spend lots of money playing it, as was the case.
 * Yes, Wozniak is not a professional game reviewer (like the guys mentioned in "Reception" section of more modern computer games). However, I doubt that such profession existed/was popular in 1974. (Play Meter's first issue got published in December that year.)
 * I strongly disagree that Wozniak was "just a guy who liked a game" or that this is just "an opinion of a famous person". Was he indirectly employed by Atari? Yes. He had access to all the games of Atari for free and preferred to play specifically Gran Trak 10 "all night long". Was he involved in game design? Yes. He implemented the first version of highly successful Breakout. Therefore, he is mentioned not only based on his current celebrity status, but as a person involved in computer game design. --Amakuha (talk) 02:24, 15 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Doesn't him being employed by Atari actually make this a counterpoint? It makes it a primary source and isn't be a reliable measure of a games quality as he was an employee of the company?  Cr im so nF ox  talk 11:39, 15 February 2019 (UTC)
 * No, because this article is about one specific game of Atari, and Wozniak was not even involved in its development. Moreover, I believe that even if president of Atari stated that this was his "favorite game ever" it would be useful to mention that opinion here, since it would distinguish one game of Atari among hundreds of others. --Amakuha (talk) 03:08, 17 February 2019 (UTC)
 * It doesn't matter if he didn't work on the game directly. Him being an employee of Atari is the problem and makes his opinion potentially biased. Why would someone openly criticise games from the company that is currently employing them? Sure he might be the type of person to do so but we don't know and it makes it unreliable.  Cr im so nF ox  talk 09:21, 18 February 2019 (UTC)
 * The point is not whether he praised or criticized it. The point is that he singled out this game among hundreds. And he did so while not being involved in Atari anymore. --Amakuha (talk) 04:39, 21 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Remove. Based on the current context, this factoid illuminates no larger point besides Woz liking the game. I can't recall doing the same for any other figure in any industry. czar  02:46, 21 February 2019 (UTC)

Grease patch?
I remember a cabinet of a game that looked just like this (a dot-delimited track, steering wheel etc) at a local shop, and one outstanding feature I noticed was a small glass (or plastic?) plate smeared irregularly with grease, stuck to the screen over a part of the track the middle, raised from the screen by four rubber pads in the corners, to symbol a slippery segment of the track - there was no in-game visual cue the part was slippery but the car handled differently over that segment. Can anyone elaborate on this? Was this some later version or something? Sharpfang (talk) 13:39, 20 November 2023 (UTC)
 * May have been LeMans (1976), though that has visual oil slicks, or a clone version of that or Gran Trak 10. -- Pres N  14:46, 20 November 2023 (UTC)
 * LeMans has its slicks displayed on screen as darker squares though and they change location throughout the game with track changes. I specifically remember this one due to that peculiarity of a crudely greased rectangle of glass, maybe 3x5cm in size, affixed to the CRT screen as the only visual cue there was a slick there. It could have been some unauthorized clone though - it was in Poland, sometime in the 80s, with IP laws non-existent and still behind the iron curtain. Sharpfang (talk) 14:56, 20 November 2023 (UTC)