User talk:Trackinfo/Archive 2

A warm welcome
Welcome to our group. Glad to see your name associated with the squadron. {| style="border: 4px solid #C00; padding: 6px; width: 80%; min-width: 700px; background: #FFFAF0; line-height: 20px;" cellpading="30" align="center" Hi, Trackinfo, welcome to the Article Rescue Squadron! We are a growing community of Wikipedia editors dedicated to identifying and rescuing articles that have been tagged for deletion. Every day hundreds of articles are deleted, many rightfully so. But many concern notable subjects and are poorly written, which can be fixed and should not be deleted. We try to help these articles quickly improve and address the concerns of why they are proposed for deletion. This covers a lot of ground and your help is appreciated!
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Removing unreferencedBLP
May I ask what you are doing with edits like, ? IMDB is not a reliable source (per RSN, FAC, etc. discussions), and therefore, any links to it go in the external links section. Could I please ask you to not remove the unreferencedBLP tags unless you add a reliable source? Thanks. NW ( Talk ) 20:45, 1 March 2010 (UTC)
 * Considering the expansive use of IMDB throughout wikipedia, I have always assumed it to be a reliable source. And certainly it IS as source, so the articles I have removed such tags DO in fact have sources, whether you choose to recognize them as such.Trackinfo (talk) 21:17, 1 March 2010 (UTC)
 * liked your essay at BLP, and as confirmation, you see the above argument, where references are now "not reliable" (could be worse, i had someone try to argue that the NYTimes was "not credible") as response i will be using more IMDB references in the BLP context, i recommend more of the same from you.  doollee and fandango are similar. WP:RS: "Wikipedia articles should be based on reliable secondary sources. This means that while primary or tertiary sources can be used to support specific statements, the bulk of the article should rely on secondary sources.  Tertiary sources such as compendia, encyclopedias, textbooks, and other summarizing sources may be used to give overviews or summaries, but should not be used in place of secondary sources for detailed discussion. Wikipedia articles are tertiary sources and should not be used as sources within articles, nor should any mirrors or forks of such articles be accepted as reliable sources for any purpose."
 * we also see some references are blocked, where there is an allegation of copyright vio's at a website, (regardless of the reference copyright) Pohick2 (talk) 16:31, 3 March 2010 (UTC)

Jordan Hasay
Sorry about that. Fixed my oversight with a reference to her mother being British. Topcardi (talk) 09:30, 6 March 2010 (UTC)

Talkback
Kudpung (talk) 19:07, 6 March 2010 (UTC)

Proxy
I'm just fed up with this BLP deletion discussion. Since your position seems to be as close to mine as any, I'm giving you my proxy, and I've indicated this on that page. I really think anything you'd agree to would probably be OK with me, but I don't have the time to keep up with this, so please accept my delegating you with the power to speak for me as well as for yourself. -- BRG (talk) 20:54, 6 March 2010 (UTC)

BLP discussion
Hi ! If there is any consensus at  at all,  it  is that  the entire discussion has become a tangled confusion, and as a result both  proponents and opponents of the issues under discussion  are abandoning ship. None of us want this. It is still not  clear which  way  consensus will  fall and your contributions to the discussion are invaluable. However, In an attempt to  keep  the policy  discussion on an even track, some users have decided to  start  the ball rolling for clarity by creating a special  workshop pages. The first of these is for the technical development  of a template at  WT:BLP PROD TPL in  case policy is decided for it. The taskforce pages are designed keep irrelevant stuff off the policy discussion  and talk  page, and help a few of us to  move this whole debate towards a decision of some kind or another. The pages will be linked in a way  that watchers will  still find their way  to them. This move is not intended to influence any  policy whatsoever; It  is to keep  the discussion  pages focussed on the separate issues. Cheers. --Kudpung (talk) 22:56, 6 March 2010 (UTC)

Award of a Barnstar

 * I hate to be a party pooper, but the link you added to Mark Montano does not count as a reference per WP:RS, and I have restored the BLP tag. This is not enough to make a BLP "referenced". Drmies (talk) 04:03, 10 March 2010 (UTC)

William S. Nicolai
Sorry, but your removal of the UnreferencedBLP tag on this article is completely unwarranted. You removed the tag and in your edit summary said "references added"--but what you added was a single link (no plural here) to an unreliable source. Such removal of valid maintenance templates is incorrect, and I have reverted your change. Drmies (talk) 04:15, 10 March 2010 (UTC)
 * Trackinfo, will you please explain a number of your edits, such as those on William S. Nicolai, Pete Wilson (bass guitarist), Leeman Bennett, and others? In all those cases you removed the "unreferenced BLP" tag after adding a single reference to the article. In some cases, such as Nicolai's, the reference is not to a reliable source; in all cases, the reference added does not cover all the facts in the article. In all cases, therefore, at the very least you should have left a "refimproveBLP" or something like that. Thank you, Drmies (talk) 04:20, 10 March 2010 (UTC)
 * As for your message on my talk page, in regards to Hans R. Camenzind, "If you have an issue with it, spend a couple of minutes adding it to the article, rather than 10 seconds to revert the article and those same minutes to complain"--you are right: it is no use complaining to an editor who can't be bothered to spend a minute looking for reliable sources, an editor who adds URLs to Amazon and Barnes & Noble and thinks that those are acceptable. That you would accuse me of laziness when I take the time to go through your edits and check your sources, which you seem to be unwilling or incapable to do, that only shows a bad conscience. Drmies (talk) 15:25, 10 March 2010 (UTC)

March 2010
Welcome to Wikipedia. It might not have been your intention, but your recent edit removed maintenance templates from Hans R. Camenzind. When removing maintenance templates, please be sure to either resolve the problem that the template refers to, or give a valid reason for the removal in the edit summary. If this was a mistake, don't worry, as your removal of this template has been reverted. Take a look at the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia, and if you would like to experiment, please use the sandbox. Thank you. Drmies (talk) 04:32, 10 March 2010 (UTC)
 * This was just a very clear-cut case of you removing a valid template based on the claim that an interview with the subject on a doubtful website (for the "Semi Conductor Museum") would sufficiently reference a BLP. I have looked at maybe a dozen edits you made similar to this one, and have yet to find one where you validly removed the BLP unsourced tag. Drmies (talk) 04:34, 10 March 2010 (UTC)

Video links
Sorry! Just realised that I got the wrong end of the stick and realised it wasn't you who made these edits. Please ignore and carry on as you were! Sillyfolkboy (talk) (edits) Join WikiProject Athletics!  03:25, 11 March 2010 (UTC)

Nicola Ward
Hey Trackinfo, if you're still into sourcing BLPs, this one needs work. Sources can, no doubt, be easily found. I'd love to do it myself, but I gotta run (literally). Good luck. Drmies (talk) 16:49, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

Hi
You have new messages at my talk page :) --5 albert square (talk) 20:47, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

a warm welcome
Glad to see a wonderful editor join our ranks.

{| style="border: 4px solid #C00; padding: 6px; width: 80%; min-width: 700px; background: #FFFAF0; line-height: 20px;" cellpading="30" align="center" Hi,, welcome to the Article Rescue Squadron! We are a growing community of Wikipedia editors dedicated to identifying and rescuing articles that have been tagged for deletion. Every day hundreds of articles are deleted, many rightfully so. But many concern notable subjects and are poorly written, which can be fixed and should not be deleted. We try to help these articles quickly improve and address the concerns of why they are proposed for deletion. This covers a lot of ground and your help is appreciated!
 * colspan="2" |

Athletics + Track field
I have been writing out a draft for a new track and field article in my userspace for the last few hours. There will certainly be more improvements to make but I believe I'm making a good start of it!

The way I have things in my head (and what can be guessed at by the skeleton structure of the draft) is that the "track and field" article will have links and descriptions of all the track and field events we have articles on. I think the event articles are very much worth having – no article could adequately tackle the entire histories of each event on one page. As you suggested (I think?) the main page at track and field will have a short summary and a link to a sub-article for each event or topic.

On the other side of things, the athletics article will have a brief summary of what types of events are held (e.g. sprints, long-distance, jumps, walks etc) and leaving the further explanation to the five sub-articles of track and field, road running, cross country running, mountain running and race walking (and the event sub-articles that are linked from there).

I urge you not to get too worried because I am confident that I can start something much better than what we've got currently at Track and field athletics. Things might be a bit work in progress for the next week or so though! Your input is always welcome and hopefully together we can deliver something readers will understand and enjoy much more! Sillyfolkboy (talk) (edits) Join WikiProject Athletics!  19:16, 25 March 2010 (UTC)


 * Hi, I understand your concerns that I have removed some information from the athletics main article. It is possible that you might disagree with me on this point, but it is my philosophy that articles should not random trivia that does not figure into the greater significance of the subject matter. Examples of things I deleted include:


 * "Steeplechase and long hurdle races are generally not held indoors, though inventive people have created some unique events. "


 * "In the mid 20th century, there was a series of "duel" races on Madison Square Garden's indoor track, some of which featured two men racing a marathon (42.2 km)."


 * I also removed many of the uncommon events because, frankly, almost every distance one can imagine has been contested in some organized fashion at some point or another. More exotic events can eventually be listed in the separate Track and Field article that is to be developed soon. However, I do recognize your concern, and I'll try to re-incorporate the deleted information where I can. Mipchunk (talk) 00:48, 26 March 2010 (UTC)

About Pat Martin (Broadcaster) being tagged for rescue - I did that
The user, who nominated PM for deletion has a record of going contrary in advocating AfD's. I live in the Sacramento region and know that this radio person is a good guy but that a lot of his references are fleeting. Normally as a Page Patroller, if I nominate an article for Speedy Delete and other regular editor, who has a good history of contributions, comes along and says he declined the nomination. I let it. Not so with TonyB or whatever his username is. I put rescue on it because I did not have the time to rescue it myself. In addition, I did not want to appear as I had POV or WP:OWN issues. Anyone, who lasts 20 years in one market, is a survivor in my book and probably notable if not for that fact alone. If you are involved with the Radio Wikiproject, then I am preaching to the choir. --Morenooso (talk) 23:17, 26 March 2010 (UTC)
 * I don't know Pat Martin and am not involved in either Radio or Sacramento. I do have a long history in electronic media that started with California radio, back in the early '70's.  My days in radio made me a lifelong amateur musicologist, which helps adding to wikipedia articles.  But my interest primarily is in rescuing the unreferenced BLPs which are currently under attack.  My simple message is that the vast majority, all but a microscopic percentage, are good faith articles about real people with real accomplishments.  Most of the subjects belong on Wikipedia even tough the editor of the article didn't do a good job.  They just haven't been sourced either due to lack of wiki knowledge, or outright laziness.  The fact that someone took the time to read the article and tag the article, without making a effort to source the article is the height of laziness.  If you know enough to tag an article, you know how to fix it.  You have the tools, use them.  As I happen on tagged articles, most source relatively easily.  If they don't, I give up easily.  You can tell if somebody exists and the claims are legit.  Unfortunately for local radio personalities, there aren't standard sources to fall upon.  This guy had lots of corresponding or corroborating stories written about him.  He certainly is notable in his area.  He's not something worth deleting, except that there is a small minded faction of wikipeople who just like to delete stuff.  Since this was already on the path to deletion, I had to speak up.Trackinfo (talk) 05:27, 27 March 2010 (UTC)
 * That is precisely what I tried to tell that user both in my edit summaries and then on the article talkpage. Usually, when an article comes up like this, I will place the appropriate tags on it so other editors can take it over and improve it. Often I don't have time to save it myself especially if it is not of interest to me but like your observation deserves to be on Wikipedia. Then when I next see it come up on my Watch list, I will do some small edits to try to improve it. I think that in his heart of hearts, the nominator knew this article should not have been sent to AfD. --Morenooso (talk) 05:35, 27 March 2010 (UTC)

Wikiproject Running
Wikiproject Running has been serving Wikipedia since 2006 by covering the portion of sports that is not covered by then then sister projects Triathlon and Bicycling. I see that you are interested in the area, and invite you to get involved with our WikiProject. (We chose the name "Running" rather than athletics because in the United States, the word "athletics" also refers to basketball, baseball, football, etc.) We are a very congenial group and would welcome your involvement. Thanks, Racepacket (talk) 20:01, 2 April 2010 (UTC)

BLP work -- barnstar
I know you already have one for similar stuff, but great work gets lots of prizes! :-) Hobit (talk) 02:01, 3 April 2010 (UTC)

Kellie Shanygne Williams
Please see the talk page for this article. - SummerPhD (talk) 05:15, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

Football 40
Hi track info! Are you referring to the Super 60 event at the Millrose Games? If so, I think that was just a plain 60-meter event. I removed the info as a football 40, by definition of its timing, can never be held as a race, but rather a time trial. I can see your point about US readers expecting some info there –I'll add back a short bit of the info just to clarify, but in my opinion a football 40 has about as much to do with athletics world records as a "longest football throw" record does. Sillyfolkboy (talk) (edits) Join WikiProject Athletics!  09:31, 9 April 2010 (UTC)
 * I've restored and changed it a bit to say that track times and football times are incomparable. Previously it said that time was "artificially reduced", but this is not entirely correct. I agree that hand timing allows for great inaccuracies in football times (I'm sure that no coach actually believes they can get that 100th bang on with a stopwatch!).
 * Also, on top of this significant factor, its common knowledge that some figures are exaggerated to work to the ends of some interested party or other–many of these so-called "fastest men in the world" ran 6.80s for the 60-meter college track teams! (A time that might just beat the great Reza Ghasemi when he's having a bad day).
 * Besides all this, I think the key point is to state that track and football times are simply incomparable as they don't start out to measure the same thing. We should leave football fans to argue over whose inaccurate/falsified times are the best – from an athletics point of view, we must just stress that track conforms to consistent, strict criteria. I'm sure that if anything approaching these criteria occurred in a football 40, it would be accidental rather than by design (!). Sillyfolkboy (talk) (edits) Join WikiProject Athletics!  10:36, 9 April 2010 (UTC)

Notability Essay
Hello, thanks for your thoughtful comments on the notability essay. I agree that many Afds don't seem to recognize the nuances of our sport. This is why I think it is important to have a an essay to point to for notability. We should probably start it as something non-controversial, by adding the top lists clause. I think the miler you mentioned might make it under WP:GNG as it seems that there should have been significant print coverage anyway. Would you like to help me write a Notability essay for Athletics perhaps starting as a user extension page, then moving it to the community, and then moving it to an essay? I think we have similar goals. While I don't want a bunch of non-notable people getting articles I think the generally likes to exclude in our sport more than they should (hence why I think adding the top lists clause is very important, it is something that is very concrete that we can point to). MATThematical (talk) 23:50, 15 April 2010 (UTC)

Jerry Brown
See Talk:Jerry Brown.  Will Beback   talk    00:51, 17 April 2010 (UTC)

Sources for BLPs
Thanks for adding source to BLPs. However, after checking a few that you've worked on I think you may not be aware of the limits on what sources are considered reliable. NNDB and similar sources which allow readers to edit the content do not qualify. Also, the only blogs that can be used are those that are written by the subjects (for information about themselves), and those published by newspapers as part of their regular editing process. See WP:V, WP:RS, and WP:BLP. And a minor detail: references go after punctuation, like this. See WP:CITE.  Will Beback   talk    01:42, 17 April 2010 (UTC)

Israel
Israel is a member of the European Athletics Association. Geschichte (talk) 06:35, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

Blogs and Forums
Hi TrackInfo. I totally sympathize with you regarding the idea of "reliable sources" excluding blogs and forums. The thing is, Reliable sources is merely a guideline. However, people regard it much more seriously than that and most of them would be surprised to realise that the following sits a the top of the page: "It is a generally accepted standard that editors should attempt to follow, though it is best treated with common sense, and occasional exceptions may apply." Jorge Stolfi's comments from February remain all in all very true.

On the flip side of this, WP:RS is regarded as just a suggestion but it is technically impossible to link to many blogs on articles because they have been blacklisted (wordpress etc). How's that for a strong enough guideline? In athletics, however, such problems can be resolved by reading blogs then finding the statistical information that backs them up. Pre-internet subjects remain hard to get a complete picture of (without extensive research that grad students might do for their theses). For example: The Central African Games was regarded as a minor soccer tournament until I actually did some reading on the subject. Books heal all, but will also drain you of much time!

Luckily, the IAAF, USATF, and European Athletics, can be used as a source of information for all major competitions from 2000 onwards. However, the fact that many competitions which GBR Athletics has results for are mentioned only there (and here if sourced) shows how much is missing. Non-specialist editors often sport-specific notability guidelines as a method for declaring all modern athletes notable – clearly missing the point that it is pre-internet age athletes who these guidelines can be most important for.

Getting the correct, contemporary sources for an Olympic finalist from 1960 might take weeks of work, or we can point out the obvious and say "yes they are notable" and get what's available written down without needing weeks of research! The digitized newspaper archives of all News Corp publications will be put behind pay-per-view walls this summer, just as the works on Highbeam will likely continue to go unused here.

Unfortunately for you, I think most of the things you are interested in (track/road/cross country in the US) remain very poorly covered. High-standard, dedicated websites like Bloomsday Run remain the exception rather than the rule. The "Rock and Roll Marathon" brand sums up the approach really (all promotion/no history). Back issues of Track and Field News might help you if you can get your hands on any. Content building is an arduous (and generally thankless) task for most people here. Sillyfolkboy (talk) (edits) Join WikiProject Athletics!  13:53, 3 May 2010 (UTC)

Overseeing
Hiya Trackinfo! Could you check quick to make sure I answered your question the way you intended at Arbitration Committee/CheckUser and Oversight/May 2010 election/Oversight/Arbitrarily0? I had some trouble understanding it, so I just wanted to make sure I answered what you meant. Hope you are well, cheers!   A rbitrarily 0   ( talk ) 13:06, 9 May 2010 (UTC)

AfD for Linda Black
I'd appreciate it if you would stop insinuating that I'm a rabid Deletionist. On the contrary, my views are very inclusionary; however, I do have a very high standard for sources that are used in articles, particularly in WP:BLPs. This standard is backed up at the BLP policy Biographies of living persons. None of the sources you have added to the article qualify under WP:V as reliable sources. Please also take a look at WP:SELFPUBLISH, which states that self-published sources cannot ever be used as a source for a BLP. Please let me know if you have questions on this, but as it stands, the sources added to Linda Black will have to be removed to comply with policy. --Joshua Scott (LiberalFascist) 06:50, 14 May 2010 (UTC)

Adrian Royle
Thank you for posting this article but unfortunately the personal info was incorrect. I have corrected this and hope you will respect that. The sources you used have been wrong from day 1. Sorry I do not have any more sites for you to quote but as the subject is me I think I can vouch for the quality of the info :-)

As I am very new to Wikipedia please excuse any communication problems I am having. It isn't the easiest interface I have used.Old dead runner (talk) 09:53, 14 May 2010 (UTC)

I stumbled upon the article while I was doing a regular check for sites "borrowing" my photos without permission, which happens far too often. As for sites with good info I'm sure there are some which could easily be found with a quick Google. But rules are a quick turn off for me. If Wikipedia wants to survive and be a respected source of accurate information it needs to adapt to the real world. My life continues quite nicely without it, as much as I enjoy the Web I know crap when I see it ;-) It was good to be able to set the facts right after putting up with pathetic journalists, who couldn't even spell my name, for so long while running.

I did enjoy the article, always good to read somebody's thought regarding what I did. I can supply facts and you now have the correct info so you can link to any sites that agree. You can contact me on adiroyle@aol.com Old dead runner (talk) 20:51, 14 May 2010 (UTC)

LOFA Sandbox
The reason why I created the sandbox is because the useful parts of it can be moved on something like the article Archenemy or it can also be edited by others to make it better. If you feel like something can be done with the useful information if the main article gets deleted. You can discuss it on the discussion page of the sandbox. Cheers! Jhenderson777 (talk) 18:46, 29 May 2010 (UTC)


 * Oh and another thing since the article is deleted. I noticed you put sources on the article which I did not have on the sandbox. You are welcome to put that on there for the ones that don't have citations are only hidden not deleted. Cheers! Jhenderson777 (talk) 15:10, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

thanks for pointing out High School NCAA record holders
I was the one who originally added that (a very long time ago). If this does not get added back because it doesn't fit well with other sports we should figure out how to put it in the athletics section. --MATThematical (talk) 19:55, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

Re: Grohl
- Created a discussion here. Would've ultimately preferred it to you reverting me :-) Anyway, I do hope we can come to some agreement. Scarian Call me Pat!  06:23, 3 June 2010 (UTC)

Good News!
The article you wanted to stay, List of fictional archenemies is back sort of. Just click on the link of it and put the main article on your watchlist. Cheers. Jhenderson777 (talk) 00:43, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

Tagging and vandalism
Hi Trackinfo, would you be so kind as to revisit your comment and consider rephrasing "The tagger, essentially the vandal"? Even editors like myself who would agree that some over-enthusiastic tagging is counter-productive usually draw the line at comparing tagging to vandalism; not least because regardless of the effect, the motives are very different.  Ϣere Spiel  Chequers  14:51, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

Darrell Robinson
I thought you might be interested in this article! If you've got anything to add to it then please do. I can't find much about what happened after the allegations... Cheers! Sillyfolkboy (talk) (edits) Join WikiProject Athletics!  12:54, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

You are now a Reviewer
Hello. Your account has been granted the "reviewer" userright, allowing you to review other users' edits on certain flagged pages. Pending changes, also known as flagged protection, is currently undergoing a two-month trial scheduled to end 15 August 2010.

Reviewers can review edits made by users who are not autoconfirmed to articles placed under pending changes. Pending changes is applied to only a small number of articles, similarly to how semi-protection is applied but in a more controlled way for the trial. The list of articles with pending changes awaiting review is located at Special:OldReviewedPages.

When reviewing, edits should be accepted if they are not obvious vandalism or BLP violations, and not clearly problematic in light of the reason given for protection (see Reviewing process). More detailed documentation and guidelines can be found here.

If you do not want this userright, you may ask any administrator to remove it for you at any time. Courcelles (talk) 17:32, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

Tartan track
Hello - I see you reverted my edit to the above article. I had removed Category:Sports equipment because the article is also in child Category:Artificial turf. If Category:Artificial turf is the correct category for the article, then Category:Sports equipment should be removed. Gjs238 (talk) 17:03, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
 * Actually I did not revert your edit, I left it in tact. I re-added the Sports Equipment category because I felt it was still appropriate, not realizing the child status.  The parent/child status game is yet another issue.  When I've seen such situations, more often than not, they bury and confuse information.Trackinfo (talk) 18:30, 23 June 2010 (UTC)
 * I removed the parent cat, then you put it back - but you claim that doesn't constitute reverting my edit. If you're dissatisfied with Wikipedia categorization (which is perfectly understandable) then perhaps you should open a policy discussion.  Otherwise I am inclined to follow policy and remove the child category IAW policy (not an edit dispute, just following policy.) Gjs238 (talk) 19:08, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

Pat Smear
Please read WP:LEDE. For an article of this length, the lede should be 1-2 paragraphs long, not three sentences. It is a fallacy that the lede of an article is meant to do the bare minimum to introduce the subject; it should serve as an acceptable overview of the entire article. Right now roughly 75% of the article has no representation at all in the lede. I'll be re-tagging on my next pass if the lede remains inadequate. Chris Cunningham (not at work) - talk 08:54, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

Stephanie Hightower
For this edit, do you mean the Olympic Trials? To me, The sentence implies the Olympic race, especially since it's possible that an alternate could compete there.

Also, I don't see where the ref backups either of these claims "This was possibly the closest elite race in history, the photo of the finish still used for instruction in the use of Photo finish devices". I'm looking at page 207, is that correct? While it certainly says it was close, I don't see where the historical perspective is coming from.

Given that it is such a long document, do you think a page number in the citation would be useful?

Thanks. --Omarcheeseboro (talk) 11:24, 9 July 2010 (UTC)

Edit waring
Recently I removed the Thomas template from the George Carlin article. I did so because the template adds a great deal of unneeded information to the biography on Carlin that is potentially confusing to readers. The template is, after all, about Thomas, not about Carlin. There is already mention of Carlin's role in the Thomas TV series in two places in the article, so the Template is simply repeating this, but also adding a great deal of unrelated information. I am going to remove this template once more. If you continue to think that it should be in the article, please discuss it on article talk page rather than edit waring. Thank you. Sunray (talk) 08:06, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

Medal templates
Damage? I've been converting Infobox runner to Infobox athlete because the former is deprecated; I had nothing to do with that decision. Infobox athlete has the field  hidden by default; this is also not my doing. If you want to display these medals, it's a simple matter of adding  to the templates. You can easily do this yourself or, if you still want me to help, I can do that. That having been said, none of this constitutes "damage" to the articles or templates. —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 01:45, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

Slash
...research before you kill a contribution.
 * material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately. If users don't add references is not my problem. Tb hotch Ta lk C. 00:18, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

RE:
Yeah, I agree. I don't have any against the WP:ATHLETE criterion exactly, but it was just a general frustration I've had. Yeah, maybe I should have posted at WP:PROF, but honestly, I don't want to get into a large debate about particular points. Both criterions seems pretty good, they just don't seem to be applied very well (especially to new articles). Danski14(talk) 15:40, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

Flagging articles
Hi Trackinfo - an answer awaits you at Wikipedia talk:Contributor copyright investigations/Darius Dhlomo/How to help! SFB/talk 22:34, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

CCIs
Hi. I appreciate your willingness to help with the cleanup of Contributor copyright investigations/Darius Dhlomo, but unfortunately only members of the community who have no history of copyright infringement are able to assist with CCIs. To quote from the board " All contributors with no history of copyright problems are welcome to contribute to clean up." I'm afraid that you do have a history of copyright problems, although not an extensive one, with the earliest version of Ventura County Transportation Commission supplied by you deleted as a copyright infringement in September 2008 and more recent issues in 2010 with Andy Bakjian following too closely on, with some verbatim following and some close paraphrasing. Although you might, as you indicate here, "be willing to overlook the tendency toward copyright violations", the community is not. Please do not remove the tags from these articles yourself, but leave their review to those without copyright problems in their history, as the process board directs. --Moonriddengirl (talk) 00:02, 13 September 2010 (UTC)

Copyright violation
One good reason that you should not participate in clean up, you have again violated our copyright policy. You claim to have rewritten the content at Pat McCormick (diver). Your rewrite included the following:

The source says:

Other content, too, is duplicated.

Please be careful. Restoring copyright violations to Wikipedia carries the same sanction as placing them, and as you were notified by the "how to help page," "If you restore a copyright violation, you will be held responsible for that violation, as if you had written the text yourself." --Moonriddengirl (talk) 00:13, 13 September 2010 (UTC)


 * Rewriting involves more than changing words. While facts are not copyrightable, creative elements of presentation - including both structure and language - are. So that it will not constitute a derivative work, this content needs to be rewritten "from scratch". This takes time. The essay Close paraphrasing contains some suggestions for rewriting that may help avoid these issues. The article Wikipedia Signpost/2009-04-13/Dispatches, while about plagiarism rather than copyright concerns, also contains some suggestions for reusing material from sources that may be helpful, beginning under "Avoiding plagiarism". --Moonriddengirl (talk) 00:37, 13 September 2010 (UTC)


 * Hi Trackinfo, just letting you know that I took a look at these contributions too, and although we definitely appreciate your contributions and I can see you're making an effort to avoid copyright infringement, there is still some substantial similarity between the structure of the source and that of your edits that is clearly over the line. For example, the paragraph in which you describe her family is identical in the selection of facts presented and the order in which they are presented as the source material. The standard advice I give to avoid close paraphrasing is: 1. read and understand two or more sources; 2. summarize the topic based on your understanding, without looking at the sources; 3. consult the sources again to double-check your own writing. Let me know if you have any questions or need more help. Dcoetzee 00:58, 13 September 2010 (UTC)

Brandon Richards
Please don't lecture me on the proper use of warning tags at Wikipedia. I am experienced enough to know their proper use. The tone of your comment is quite condescending and unnecessary. The only reason I have not commented further is because I was called away from the computer as I was addressing the issue. My issue is with the overall tone of the article. It seems to be more of a put-down of Richards for not living up to the legacy of his father. Whether or not he is a failure is not a matter of discussion for a Wikipedia article (and frankly, I don't have my own opinion on the matter). Phrases such as "There is an asterisk to Richard's vaulting" tend to impart a point of view about the subject. The same information could be presented without the editorializing. Again, I'm not disputing your opinion, but pointing out that Wikipedia's neutral point of view policy dictates that its use is strongly discouraged. Let's see if we can find a less-opinionated way of stating the same facts. - Realkyhick (Talk to me) 07:05, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

Talkback
Replied there. - EdoDodo talk 07:24, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

Disruptive anon editor on Jerry Brown article.
Hello. Regarding the issues you are having with the anon user, in the Jerry Brown article, this user seems to have a political axe to grind, in this case, an anti-Democrat one. In addition to the negative wording the user attempts that article, the user has also made disruptive edits like deleting an entire biography section on the Georgia Democratic gubernatorial candidate Vincent Sheheen. Given the user's Washington D.C. location and relatively subtle spin in the edits to candidates' articles, I have a feeling this is a seasoned political operative of some kind. Anyway, I have warned the user against edit warring and will alert admins if he/she continues to violate 3RR.--Oakshade (talk) 03:16, 27 September 2010 (UTC)

Re: Polly Plumer etc
Mmm, makes it hard when different seemingly reliable sources disagree. But I see it's back at Polly Plumer now, so if you're sure that's the correct spelling then I guess everything's ok. Adrian J. Hunter(talk•contribs) 11:52, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

100 yard dash
I located a reference for my great great grandfather's listing from Sports Illustrated. When I added it, I saw it backed up by several other references in listed in old published works available through Google Books but I was unsure how to cite them.--T1980 (talk) 18:54, 30 September 2010 (UTC)

Jon Stewart
I decided to delete my edit solely so that I could avoid dealing with people exactly like you. Did you even read what I wrote? I agree with you that it was probably overly complicated for the intro, but reading the word “although” as dismissive? That the show is “fake news” is not disputed. It's called “fake news” in all the commercials, etc. It is simply a fact, as opposed to a contentious assertion of some kind. The word “although” in that sentence serves the simple, grammatical function of marking contrast between clauses. The critics in question are arguing a point (in the second clause of that sentence) which contrasts with the very understanding of “fake news” (an understanding which is referred to by the first clause of the sentence). Please, go back to primary school.

Next you claim that I “follow up with the critics assertion of what he 'should' do,” which you claim violates NPOV. I'm not sure where to even begin. Even if I had written what you claim, I would have been very definitely adhering to NPOV, as I mentioned both sides of the argument, and in a very neutral form. In reality, though, I didn't even come close to writing what you claim. No argument which I related could even remotely be construed from their original articles or my paraphrasing as asserting what HE “should do”, as you claim. I wrote that the critics in question were arguing for THEIR right to judge Stewart by journalistic standards. Then, in the next sentence, in full marks, NPOV fashion, I made clear Jon Stewart's counterargument on that point so that both sides' arguments would be fairly represented, even though the critics in question are clearly wrongheaded.

The best part is how your ego is so massive that you really couldn't resist messaging me about it, even though I had obviously decided not to include my edit, and therefore nothing you would say on the matter would have any effect on the world, whatsoever. At any rate, I don't engage in wikipedia pissing contests, so write whatever you want, I really don't care. Write that he's actually a zombie-robot if you want, I won't stop you. Don't bother replying to this because even if I read it (which I probably won't) I won't be replying again.WildlifeAnalysis (talk) 23:36, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

List of California schools closed in the 1970s and 1980s
The topic is a good one I think, but the year of closure should be listed. What do you think about adding the year of closure & dropping the "in the 1970s and 1980s" in the title? Lionel (talk) 19:13, 8 October 2010 (UTC)
 * Great idea. We could set this up like a table.  However, as I have found, information about defunct schools is not always easy to find.  I continue to find out about additional schools to add to the list, but information is sketchy.  You know on WP, we strive for accuracy and verifiability.  There is also the factor of how to present the case of a few schools that changed names, assuming the name of an older school at the former school's newer location.


 * Buchser High School, is now Santa Clara High School--the old downtown location has become Buchser Middle School
 * Chester F. Awalt High School became the new location of Mountain View High School.
 * Blackford High School is now operating as Boynton High School
 * Perhaps we can even address the fate of the schools or location. Most have not been torn down, or torn down in their entirety, but have become another school, community center or other public asset.  And all these pieces of information should work up and down into the various articles about each.


 * Most importantly, I'm glad somebody else recognizes the significance of the article and that it is worthy of attention. This was one of my first articles on WP, perhaps I need to go back to look at improving it.  I welcome the help. Trackinfo (talk) 19:32, 8 October 2010 (UTC)
 * I've been cleaning up some Catholic HS articles, and about to move my Mt Carmel into article space. I've been adding to a mini closed list here. Anyway, all of the Cali HS school lists are a total mess! Take a look at this. Perhaps some kind of structure could be developed, based around a table. A comment column could address the fate. Lionel (talk) 19:49, 8 October 2010 (UTC)

Masters Athletics World Records
Great work!! I'll control the spelling of Dutch names and places. I forgot my log-in for the english wiki, but I jumped 1.47 in Naaldwijk some weeks ago, you know. 82.215.59.20 (talk) 10:37, 15 October 2010 (UTC)

Re: Masters Athletics World Records
I'm not "trashing" your work, simply because your work is already found on the target page, there's no reason for you to create another page with repeated content. Victão Lopes I hear you... 23:54, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
 * OK then, go ahead and explain your intentions. I just want to know why do we need that page for just some data if that data is already found at the target page. Victão Lopes I hear you... 00:02, 17 October 2010 (UTC)
 * Ok, but I didn't understand the "redirect code in each of these lines " part. I mean, where is that code, exactly? If you are trying to make more detailed tables, maybe it's better just to rework the main table of results in the target page, because although this encyclopedia is unlimited in terms of space, creating multiple separated pages with little data can confuse readers and make it kind of hard to navigate through articles on that subject. Victão Lopes I hear you... 00:21, 17 October 2010 (UTC)
 * I'm starting to get it...but remember that everytime you want to test something regarding to formatting, then you should use the sandbox or create an userpage. I'm afraid I cannot help you with that, since I just copy other's people formattings too. Keep in mind that if the page proves unhopeful to grow beyond that small table, it may be redirected again, if not by me, by another editor that come across the article. Victão Lopes I hear you... 01:00, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

Your contributed article, Hubert Indra M50 World Record Score
Hello, I notice that you recently created a new page, Hubert Indra M50 World Record Score. First, thank you for your contribution; Wikipedia relies solely on the efforts of volunteers such as you. Unfortunately, the page you created covers a topic on which we already have a page - Masters Athletics World Records. Because of the duplication, your article has been tagged for speedy deletion. Please note that this is not a comment on you personally and we hope you will to continue helping improve Wikipedia. If the topic of the article you created is one that interests you, then perhaps you would like to help out at Masters Athletics World Records - you might like to discuss new information at the article's talk page.

If you think that the article you created should remain separate, you may contest the deletion by adding  to the top of the page that has been nominated for deletion (just below the existing speedy deletion or "db" tag - if no such tag exists then the page is no longer a speedy delete candidate and adding a hangon tag is unnecessary), coupled with adding a note on the talk page explaining your position, but be aware that once tagged for speedy deletion, if the page meets the criterion, it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself, but don't hesitate to add information to the page that would render it more in conformance with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. Lastly, please note that if the page does get deleted, you can contact one of these administrators to request that they userfy the page or have a copy emailed to you. Additionally if you would like to have someone review articles you create before they go live so they are not nominated for deletion shortly after you post them, allow me to suggest the article creation process and using our search feature to find related information we already have in the encyclopedia. Try not to be discouraged. Wikipedia looks forward to your future contributions. Simon-in-sagamihara (talk) 02:04, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

Your contributed article, Kip Janvrin M40 World Record Score
Hello, I notice that you recently created a new page, Kip Janvrin M40 World Record Score. First, thank you for your contribution; Wikipedia relies solely on the efforts of volunteers such as you. Unfortunately, the page you created covers a topic on which we already have a page - Masters Athletics World Records. Because of the duplication, your article has been tagged for speedy deletion. Please note that this is not a comment on you personally and we hope you will to continue helping improve Wikipedia. If the topic of the article you created is one that interests you, then perhaps you would like to help out at Masters Athletics World Records - you might like to discuss new information at the article's talk page.

If you think that the article you created should remain separate, you may contest the deletion by adding  to the top of the page that has been nominated for deletion (just below the existing speedy deletion or "db" tag - if no such tag exists then the page is no longer a speedy delete candidate and adding a hangon tag is unnecessary), coupled with adding a note on the talk page explaining your position, but be aware that once tagged for speedy deletion, if the page meets the criterion, it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself, but don't hesitate to add information to the page that would render it more in conformance with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. Lastly, please note that if the page does get deleted, you can contact one of these administrators to request that they userfy the page or have a copy emailed to you. Additionally if you would like to have someone review articles you create before they go live so they are not nominated for deletion shortly after you post them, allow me to suggest the article creation process and using our search feature to find related information we already have in the encyclopedia. Try not to be discouraged. Wikipedia looks forward to your future contributions. Simon-in-sagamihara (talk) 02:04, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

Your contributed article, Gary Miller M50 World Record Score
Hello, I notice that you recently created a new page, Gary Miller M50 World Record Score. First, thank you for your contribution; Wikipedia relies solely on the efforts of volunteers such as you. Unfortunately, the page you created covers a topic on which we already have a page - Masters Athletics World Records. Because of the duplication, your article has been tagged for speedy deletion. Please note that this is not a comment on you personally and we hope you will to continue helping improve Wikipedia. If the topic of the article you created is one that interests you, then perhaps you would like to help out at Masters Athletics World Records - you might like to discuss new information at the article's talk page.

If you think that the article you created should remain separate, you may contest the deletion by adding  to the top of the page that has been nominated for deletion (just below the existing speedy deletion or "db" tag - if no such tag exists then the page is no longer a speedy delete candidate and adding a hangon tag is unnecessary), coupled with adding a note on the talk page explaining your position, but be aware that once tagged for speedy deletion, if the page meets the criterion, it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself, but don't hesitate to add information to the page that would render it more in conformance with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. Lastly, please note that if the page does get deleted, you can contact one of these administrators to request that they userfy the page or have a copy emailed to you. Additionally if you would like to have someone review articles you create before they go live so they are not nominated for deletion shortly after you post them, allow me to suggest the article creation process and using our search feature to find related information we already have in the encyclopedia. Try not to be discouraged. Wikipedia looks forward to your future contributions. Simon-in-sagamihara (talk) 02:07, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

How to make a template
click the move button, and rename it to template:Gary Miller M50 World Record Score I am doing this now for some articles. But for your new record pages, create it as Template:Gary Miller M50 World Record Score or whatever. The transclusion works the same and you do not need the word template in the curly brackets. The problem is that they do not make a stand alone article. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 10:40, 17 October 2010 (UTC)
 * Hi, instead of  or   use  Graeme Bartlett (talk) 20:57, 17 October 2010 (UTC)
 * We have improved this further to a decathlon score template. What was perviously lined above is now expressed as

*Note: 800g javelin Be sure to use the correct decathlon score template for the appropriate age and gender division.Trackinfo (talk) 21:50, 14 July 2017 (UTC)

Hi!
Saw your comments at the Youth Olympics AFD, so checked out your userpage. I'm not sure if you're aware, but there's an Unreferenced BLP Rescue WikiProject you might be interested in joining. Cheers! Strange Passerby (talk • c • status) 11:10, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

The Trades, Le Show
If needs be, I'll contact KCRW to verify that The Trades deals w/ the Ad Industry. Is this necessary? Tapered (talk) 02:58, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

Do you listen to the show? I know the opening capella classica is Mozart, but don't know the exact piece, so refrained fr/ edit. I've listened to the show for 20 years. The subject of "The Trades" is common knowledge to regular listeners. The Trades = advertising. Tapered (talk) 06:48, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

My bad. Reverted to your edit. Tapered (talk) 07:09, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

Thanks
No problem. Wikipedia seems to have a shortage of athletics enthusiast like yourself. You obviously are doing your part! You know, San Onofre isn't that bad. It takes some getting use to but it grows on you. I've seen worst!Philipmj24 (talk) 22:03, 10 December 2010 (UTC)

Mistake (AN/I)
Jarkeld (talk) 00:40, 19 December 2010 (UTC)

Masters
I don't know if you saw my reply: summary redirect created, you can create them though, without the admin bit.

Couple of things I'm interested in, relating to your work:
 * 1) Why the creation of templates that are only used once?
 * 2) The references you are putting in the templates (at least the one I saw) belong in the article - if you are using a standard set of references this is fairly easy to achieve.
 * 3) I noticed you use "onlyinclude" nothing wrong with that, but it is fairly rare, and IMHO worth avoiding in templates, as it makes them harder for people to understand.
 * 4) I had a look at the website, although it is very slow, it should be possible to script the data import if it is considered reliable.

Rich Farmbrough, 19:30, 21 December 2010 (UTC).


 * The two articles that house the destinations for these templates are: Masters Athletics World Records and United States records in masters athletics.  There is some duplication in some of the data.  The templates were the only way I could find to lay out a different set of columnar data (the 5, 7 or 10 columns of results) within another table of different formatted columns (11 columns for World, 10 for USA), without destroying the layout of the original table.  In html, it would be equivalent with creating a table with a table-a very common layout technique.  In wiki, I haven't found any other means of accomplishing that deed, nobody has suggested one.  Originally I created these tables within tables as articles, which is why the original formatting was more detailed information to turn the articles into stand-alones.  "Onlyinclude" was necessary to separate data.  It still didn't work, as articles these were sent up AfDs and lots of discussion ensued.  So people with higher wiki skills than I certainly had an opportunity to see what I was doing and why.  They had the opportunity to make suggestions, but other than converting this to template (to avoid AfD issues), no other suggestion was forthcoming.  Regarding wiki formatting, if I were to have my way using direct html, I'd force the width of the "athlete" and "birthdate" wider, to make those important elements more readable, and I'd shrink the size of the "references" column, maybe even the "meet" column to compensate (in case you have any suggestions on how to accomplish that).


 * The references (which do change in some cases, though there is one common source) are specific to that template, not the group of templates or the page. I guess those sources could be put in the references column on the main article, it was easer as I assembled them to place the appropriate reference in the same template as the appropriate data.  In mentioning the slow website, I think you are referring to the source that is common to the majority of these templates:   Unfortunately that site masks the exact location of its specific data.  I'd certainly prefer to direct to the actual source of the data, rather than forcing anybody checking the data to have to call it up (on that slow website) from the generic home page address.  I'm not what you consider reliable, or from what perspective.  Now typed, this specific data is historical and is highly unlikely to change.  If a new record is accomplished, new data will have to be generated to replace this data, but the only changes will be if a correction is needed.  As for the reliability OF the information; when I can cross reference it (or even the official data from official sources), certainly I am finding many more errors than I'd like.  However, within this niche, this is the best we've got.  I am actively pursuing finding additional back up sources for all of this and the new USA page will be announced to the general Masters athletics community in the next couple of days.
 * It is a perennial problem, duplicating data an be considered a fork, or useful redundancy. Access for editing is also slightly vexed, regardless of the on-wiki methods available currently. Rich Farmbrough, 01:09, 24 December 2010 (UTC).

{| class="wikitable" style="font-size:100%; width: 100%;" !Name !Hammer Throw !Shot Put !Discus Throw !Javelin Throw !Weight Throw

{| class="wikitable" style="font-size:100%; width: 100%;" !Name !Country !Hammer Throw !Shot Put !Discus Throw !Javelin Throw !Weight Throw

This sort of thing might help It can of course be done better.
 * 1) avoid the box in a box
 * 2) allow references to be used better

Redirects
Regarding Lasse Viren 20K and Viren 20K.

You needed to make those into redirects, by putting the code;


 * 1) REDIRECT Lasse Viren Finnish Invitational

I've done that, now, so they'll now take the reader to the article itself. For example, this edit.

Cheers,  Chzz  ► 20:53, 24 December 2010 (UTC)

Re: How did you do that?
Well, I'm glad you were pleasantly surprised... :-) A bit of a coincidence, really: every once in a while I go to Special:NewPages - and this time, the word "athlete" in the article title was magnet for my eyes... GregorB (talk) 19:59, 6 January 2011 (UTC)

Moved page
I've moved your new page to USATF Masters Hall of Fame, as that appears to be the name of the subject, and because I think the original name of the page is unhelpful in the encyclopaedia, as it could be in any field. It has automatically created a redirect from the old name. --ColinFine (talk) 08:38, 12 January 2011 (UTC)

Talkback

 * And one more... – ukexpat (talk) 20:16, 14 January 2011 (UTC)

Well said
Just a note to let you know that I thought your comments at Articles for deletion/David Merkow were on target, and well put. Best.--Epeefleche (talk) 21:50, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

removed dup --Fizbin (talk) 02:01, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

High school national record holder cat
Nice new category - thanks! A couple of considerations:

1. It might be useful to highlight in the name that this is US high schools. If you open it up to other countries you potentially open up a lot of hard-to-verify info. (Not to mention that in many countries - England and Canada for two - high schools have little to do with T&F.)

2. There was a comment when you created the cat that the NFHS generally are the arbiters of US high school records. In fact there are many many issues with the records kept by the NFHS, making them a constant joke amongst high school T&F fans. The primary arbiter for most knowledgeable folks is the mag Track & Field News, and their high school editor Jack Shepard, who publishes an updated record book annually.

edit: and there is no indication that this cat is limited to T&F records. Might want to further define the title. --Fizbin (talk) 02:05, 4 February 2011 (UTC)


 * Trackinfo,
 * Thanks for the feedback. Question on Cory Schubert. When did she hold a HS record? T&FN has her second all-time in the 3k, :but running it eight years after the current record holder. Maybe one of those NFHS-only records?
 * Thanks for the feedback. Question on Cory Schubert. When did she hold a HS record? T&FN has her second all-time in the 3k, :but running it eight years after the current record holder. Maybe one of those NFHS-only records?


 * http://www.trackandfieldnews.com/index.php/tafn-lists?list_id=34&sex_id=W&yyear=2008
 * --Fizbin (talk) 23:23, 4 February 2011 (UTC)


 * Not only are open races out with the NFHS folks (killing Ryun's 3:55 and Webb's 3:53 amongst many, many others), so are the post-season meets (GWI and such in the old days, those and the NON-types now), so Michael Carter's 81' footer doesn't exist. The NFHS stuff is almost useless, in my opinion, other than your idea of using it to justify more articles. (BTW, I believe that Ryun's 3:51 was run while he was at Kansas.)--Fizbin (talk) 00:58, 5 February 2011 (UTC)


 * The lack of credible info from NFHS and T&FN's inconsistent web-based lists are the reasons I buy Jack Shepard's book every year, and have used it a few times here in Wiki for citations. Reminds me that I need to buy the current version, which hit the shelves a month or so ago.--Fizbin (talk) 01:23, 5 February 2011 (UTC)

Gaston Roelants
The birthplace is not supposed to be in the birthdate section. You can move it somewhere else if you think it fits better. Deb (talk) 17:49, 27 February 2011 (UTC)
 * This is nonsense. I have not edited "a whole bunch" of articles, I have just amended one or two to bring them into line.  I see no problem with my edits.  And, like I told you before, if you want to put the birthplace somewhere else, feel free. Deb (talk) 19:03, 28 February 2011 (UTC)
 * It is fine in the birthdate section, and in accord w how other encyclopedias do it as well as logical. There is something illogical to my mind about splitting "was born in" and was born on" into separate sections.--Epeefleche (talk) 20:51, 28 February 2011 (UTC)
 * You're mistaken. The birthdate section is for birthdates.  Adding place of birth and death makes it cumbersome and difficult to follow.  Moreover, birthplace is also held in the infobox.  Deb (talk) 22:48, 28 February 2011 (UTC)

Your comment: "What your edits are doing is creating are sentences like: "McTear was born in Okaloosa County, Florida. He recorded an 9.0 mark in the 100-yard dash as a high schooler at Baker School, in Baker, Florida,. . . " and before I added to it "Raschker was born in Hamburg, Germany.[3] She has amassed 68 Gold Medals at the World Masters Athletics Championships. . . " Essentially you are leading the paragraph with something that is unrelated to the rest of the paragraph. Thats just not good english."


 * 1) I see nothing wrong with the McTear example. To start with his place of birth and continue with his school career seems perfectly logical to me.
 * 2) I agree that there is a lot of biographical information missing from the Raschker article but I don't see how that is my fault.
 * 3) "Thats just not good english" is bad English. Deb (talk) 12:19, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:Emil Pawlik M65 Pentathlon
Template:Emil Pawlik M65 Pentathlon has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. — This, that, and the other (talk) 07:17, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

Speedy deletion of Template:Kaija Jortikka W75 Record
A tag has been placed on Template:Kaija Jortikka W75 Record requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section T3 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because it is a deprecated or orphaned template. After seven days, if it is still unused and the speedy deletion tag has not been removed, the template will be deleted.

If the template is intended to be substituted, please feel free to remove the speedy deletion tag and please consider putting a note on the template's page indicating that it is substituted so as to avoid any future mistakes (transclusionless).

Thanks. — This, that, and the other (talk) 01:09, 26 April 2011 (UTC)

Pat Crandall
Trackinfo,

Yeah, I can see the issues with old folks who keep using the kid's toys. I did note in each article that the 42" hurdles are legit to some extent in masters racing. I would think that we can accommodate events not commonly recognized by teh governing bodies as long as they are using legit senior distances/implements and the meets are legit. As for a cite, I could not fine one for this online but this was a USATF state association champs meet (not masters, so they would have the 110m 42") so there are records somewhere.

And definitely, if you can run the 42" guys at age 55 and above, go for it! The record must be a tad soft because of lack of studly 58 year olds willing to give it a try. Crandall's not bad though. Was a walk-on hurdler at Stanford in the 60s, and never stopped.--Fizbin (talk) 01:36, 13 May 2011 (UTC)

high school attendance cite fpr Henry Thomas
Hi- I'm guessing you have cites for Henry Thomas; can you add one indicating attendance to his 'notable alumni' entry? Thanks. tedder (talk) 19:27, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

Talkback
I'd prefer to have a centralized discussion, let me know if you need further talkbacks or if you are following my talk page. tedder (talk) 21:17, 15 May 2011 (UTC)

TV.com
Hi, I responded on my talk page. I don't think there is much of an issue here since TV.com isn't a reliable source for information (it's a wiki). IMDB is a different story, since it's not a wiki, and doesn't appear to be under pressure to be removed from Wikipedia articles. Thanks! Plastikspork <sub style="font-size: 60%">―Œ <sup style="margin-left:-3ex">(talk) 00:43, 14 June 2011 (UTC)

Nomination of CIF California State Meet alumni for deletion
A discussion is taking place as to whether the article CIF California State Meet alumni is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Articles for deletion/CIF California State Meet alumni until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on good quality evidence, and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion template from the top of the article. Jrcla2 (talk) 13:03, 22 June 2011 (UTC)

Discussion at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Justin Orenduff (2nd nomination)
You are invited to join the discussion at Articles for deletion/Justin Orenduff (2nd nomination). —Bagumba (talk) 23:57, 21 July 2011 (UTC)

RfA/MOS/KCOY-TV
I have to admit I am genuinely confused by your comments on my RfA. What do you believe a user should do when they see an incorrectly formatted sentence, or a misspelled word, or what have you? Are they supposed to leave the error but start a talk page discussion about it? If I see a named editor, or a single static IP, repeatedly trying to change something in a way that seems wrong to me, I'll gladly start a discussion about it, but those wikilinks seemed to me to being added by a long term disruptive editor (see User:Anna Frodesiak/Black sandbox) who keeps adding highly dubious unsourced info to the slogan sections of TV station pages; that's why I continued to revert (as I and others are reverting this same editor on an almost daily basis across dozens of TV station pages) without any discussion. If you follow up on the history discussed at that sandbox (and it goes back farther than that, to a few other editors who've since given up), you'll see that that disruptive editor has been active on very many TV station pages, has been warned and/or blocked numerous times, has had over 30 different IP addresses, and has never once used an edit summary or responded to any request for discussion; thus, we have taken the only stance we can, which is simply to revert all of their additions on sight. It's not about "my way or the highway", it's about a group of users (of which I am but one) trying to stop someone who won't listen, who won't discuss, and who is adding information that is dubious at best and completely fabricated at worst. The wikilinking is just a side issue, just something that I've been noticing recently that the same user is also doing, and which I believe is also against the guidelines.

Please know, if you ever have concerns about any edit I make, just tell me. Leave a note on the article's talk page or my user page, or even revert me in an article with an edit summary that briefly explains why you think I'm wrong (all things that the dynamic IP has never done). If I never know that you have a problem, I really don't know what I can do. Qwyrxian (talk) 03:39, 26 July 2011 (UTC)

NCAA Champions
Hi Trackinfo, hope you are well! I've had the idea to start putting together lists of the NCAA champions in track and field. Given the long history of the competition, I was thinking of dividing it along the lines of event, for example: List of NCAA Champions in the 400 meter dash would contain all the outdoor and indoor Division I 400 m winners (male and female). I'm ignoring the other divisions because that information would be a lot more specialist and frankly not worth the effort from my point of view!

My question is: do you know where I would be able to find historical information on the NCAA championships online? I've only been able to find this year's championships info. Hope you can help! SFB 10:29, 7 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Actually, never mind! I've found an archive of champions here. I'm not sure if you're interested in making any of the NCAA champion lists, but I'll make a start now anyway. SFB 13:29, 7 August 2011 (UTC)
 * I hope you enjoyed your time at the championships. With so many categories and events, I can understand the amount of time that masters athletics can take up. I wouldn't wish that amount work on anyone and I find the sheer number of events at the regular championships overwhelming anyway! You're entirely right about Wikipedia making this information more accessible. From our perspective, it should help us identify NCAA champions easily through the "what links here" button as well. The NCAAs are certainly of much importance beyond just the US: my draft of 400 m list has already shown how true that is!
 * Some good news is that the guy at HickokSports.com has already put up the NCAA champions information in the same format I am currently doing. There's a very, very good chance I'll be able to write a mini program which could do all the time-consuming list-y bits for us! I'll keep you informed. SFB 18:14, 7 August 2011 (UTC)

Bare links
Okay Give me an example of an article that I tagged with cleanup-linkrot that didn't warrant it. Every one that I've looked at has had one. —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 05:23, 10 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Right You haven't given me an example of a page which I have tagged incorrectly. Never Let Go (live) contains two references--the second is such: . This is a bare URL as a reference, which leads to link rot. Link rot is the guiding how-to page here; if you've not read it, I suggest that you do. Maintenance templates are to be added to pages to improve their quality, not denigrate them. If they aren't added, then the articles aren't added to Category:Wikipedia cleanup and it's harder to improve their quality. In fact, this is especially true of obscure articles--they are particularly vulnerable to these sorts of issues and are more likely to be improved by tagging than the heavily-trafficked and heavily-edited articles. Applying maintenance tags is likely to increase the quality of obscure articles and simply posting to talk will be very unlikely to increase the quality of obscure articles. It is important to clearly and concisely identify problems with Wikipedia pages to allow other editors to fix them and this must be done in a responsible manner. The nice thing about barelinks versus, say NPOV or Peacock is that the problem is very straightforward to diagnose (just look under "References" and you can see the bare URLs, rather than combing through the text to determine where the POV pushing lies or where vague terminology is applied.) Consequently, it is not necessary to explain yourself on the talk page. Also, there are tools like User:Dispenser/Reflinks that fill in references semi-automatically, which would not be possible with POV disputes. —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 06:57, 10 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Okay I have gone to great lengths to address your every claim--from the mundane and empirical (that I have mis-tagged pages) to the more serious (I have vandalizes articles) to the histrionic (I discredit Wikipedia itself.) It's sad to me that it came to posting to AN so quickly, especially since I think that your concerns are based on a fundamental misunderstanding of core content policies and the purpose of my editing. I was willing to take your serious claims seriously and talk them through on our talk pages, but I guess it will have to play out there. Either way, I feel confident that my edits are in the right and will only serve to enhance the quality and credibility of the project. —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 08:00, 10 August 2011 (UTC)

World records in athletics
Hi. Don't know why you changed Mosops record and date. Please look at http://www.iaaf.org/news/newsid=61123.html .Montell 74 (talk) 14:33, 28 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Please have a look at http://www.diamondleague-eugene.com/Live-StartlistsResults/Overview/ and http://www.iaaf.org/competitions/dlm/news/newsid=60218.html. The maine event of Prefontaine Classic took place on June, 4 but Mosops run took place a day before! Apart from that IAAF Statistic Hand Book was published in June. Ratification (IAAF News) from August!Montell 74 (talk) 19:18, 28 August 2011 (UTC)

Sogelau Tuvalu
Hi there - judging from the pre-event entry lists, Sogelau Tuvalu was actually entered into the 100 metres. As noted in the qualifying rules, unqualified field event athletes need special dispensation from the technical committee to compete. I presume this caveat was written to allow in top level athletes who haven't achieved the mark within time (through injury, for example), not to permit athletes not capable of competing at that level to compete.

From my point of view, if the IAAF did not permit his entrance as a shot putter, but allowed him to take a spot in the 100m and the Samoa Federation accepted this change, then the federation de facto entered him in that event. Either way, I don't think it's an aspect worth covering too deeply in the article when there is so much more going on in that event. SFB

Camel
Yes, you are completely right; Thank you for informing me. Nima1024 (talk) 09:46, 10 September 2011 (UTC)

Cinder track
Please consider WP:LINKSTOAVOID in the future. Linking to discussion forums as you did here and here should be avoided. Thank you. --Fayerman (talk) 01:40, 16 September 2011 (UTC)

In response to your edit summary...
on KCOY-TV, it's pretty easy: I'm removing it because neither you nor other editors have ever provided any verification that the information is accurate. My opinion has long been that all of the station slogans should be removed from all articles until they are sourced. This is especially true for all of those alleged "localized" versions, given that me and 4 other editors spent 6 months reverting an IP hopping vandal who just kept adding them over and over and over again (hundreds of times, at least) and never once provided any source. Others have recommended a more temperate approach, so I will take that on this article. I'm going to add an "unreferenced section" template, and a comment on the article's talk page. Anything that isn't verified in a few weeks comes out. If we don't get verification of this info, what stops me from going to some other random TV station article and adding a slogan like "Channel 7, it's bad ass" or "Channel 10, the best news. EVER!" and just insisting its true? This is why one of Wikipedia's core policies is WP:V. Qwyrxian (talk) 02:33, 11 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Sorry, I had to revert. Youtube is almost never a reliable source.  But we definitely can't link to it if the uploader isn't the  copyright holder, because otherwise there is a possibility that we're engaging in contributory copyright infringement; this is why we're almost never allowed to link to YouTube.  Qwyrxian (talk) 12:37, 11 October 2011 (UTC)

Occupy
Not sure what you see in this reference which makes it say that Van Nuys, California is part of this protest. — <font color="DD0000">Moe <font color="0000FF">ε 22:27, 29 October 2011 (UTC)
 * My mistake. Copy and paste from another edit.  Apparently the link I intended didn't copy and I didn't notice.  Adding a new source. Trackinfo (talk) 04:23, 30 October 2011 (UTC)
 * That's fine, I thought it was strange. I found out about an album I never heard of before though after reading an article looking for signs of Occupy. — <font color="DD0000">Moe <font color="0000FF">ε 04:47, 30 October 2011 (UTC)
 * Oh, and Cedar Falls, Iowa got the same progressiveworld url as Van Nuys if you can help find where you saw that too. — <font color="DD0000">Moe <font color="0000FF">ε 04:48, 30 October 2011 (UTC)

Lead section
I noticed you removed the lead too short tag I added to Cathy Freeman. I think you are mistaken. If you read the WP:BCLASS criteria you will notice that a lead section is required. If you read WP:LEAD you will discover that the lead section should be able to stand alone as a concise overview. The lead section needs to summarize the most important points and include key facts. - Shiftchange (talk) 23:35, 15 November 2011 (UTC)
 * I have expanded the lead section as you suggested. The reason why I prefer to add the lead too short tag is because I am not overly familiar with the subject. It gives a chance for editors who have worked on the article previously to fix it themselves and because generally I do not contribute to biographical articles.  However it is sometimes better for an editor who is unfamiliar with the article to expand the lead because of their objectivity, so I went ahead and wrote one. Please tweak it, where you see fit. Maybe you could write a lead for Brisbane River in return. - Shiftchange (talk) 03:14, 16 November 2011 (UTC)

Source misrepresentation
You have repeatedly added contentious material which is unsupported by the sources it cites, even replacing the content after it was removed without commenting on the previous objections that the material is not supported by the sources. Please see the talk page and engage in discussion there, and don't add this exact material again, because it misrepresents the sources it cites. Centrify (f / k / a FCAYS)  (talk)  (contribs) 17:24, 23 November 2011 (UTC)


 * You added it again! Didn't discuss it on talk, didn't mention it in the edit summary, didn't even reply to my comment above -- just like last time. Please stop.  WARNING, you're edit-warring and also violating core content policy in the process. Centrify (f / k / a FCAYS)   (talk)  (contribs) 16:18, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

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U.S. Open Track and Field
Thanks for starting this article. It's a bit sad to see the Millrose Games leave MSG, especially because it has been usurped by another high level meet of a similar type. Hopefully the Millrose Games keeps going and the U.S. Open meet doesn't become another US meet with a constantly changing title sponsor name and no history. SFB 17:53, 23 December 2011 (UTC)

Pictures
I see you have added several older pictures to athletics articles, replacing action photos from the World Championships. I am curious where you base your photo judgement. Is there an ongoing discussion or process, or is this just your unilateral decision? Trackinfo (talk) 20:43, 30 December 2011 (UTC)
 * No, it's just my "unilateral decision" by replacing them with more recent photos. You can undo my changes if you want. Selligpau (talk) 07:47, 31 December 2011 (UTC)

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Steve Williams - athlete
Thanks for your comments on this page.

I am glad I am not the only person to remember Steve.

I came across him first as a teenager when I received as a Christmas present a copy of the Guiness Book of World Records, where he was pictured as the latest claimant to the title of the "world's fastest man". This concept fascinated me and I followed Steve's career as best I could, cheering him on in the 1977 Athletics World Cup for instance.

When I first came across his Wikipedia page I could not believe how sparse it was. I felt he deserved better and I could thank him in my own way for that enjoyment by improving it. As a result, I've learnt he was greater athlete and person than I ever realised. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dnd25 (talk • contribs) 15:17, 28 January 2012 (UTC)

Nomination of List of films considered the best for deletion
A discussion is taking place as to whether the article List of films considered the best is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

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Sebastian Coe
I remove other bio articles from the category as well. They are sort of "out of place" The main article about the Olympics should mention him. Categories should have a set of topics that are all equivalent in the article hierarchy. -- Alan Liefting (talk - contribs) 19:57, 20 February 2012 (UTC)

February 2012
Welcome to Wikipedia. Although everyone is welcome to contribute constructively to the encyclopedia, we would ask that you assume good faith while interacting with other editors. Take a look at the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia. Thank you. -- Alan Liefting (talk - contribs) 20:54, 20 February 2012 (UTC)

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List of world records in masters athletics
Hi Trackinfo. Sorry for that. What about uncommon distances like 1000 or 2000 metres? Are they "unofficial"? Do they have to be a part of the list? I just have the infos about W35 and W40.Montell 74 (talk) 07:49, 24 February 2012 (UTC)
 * Again. I'm very confused about Lev Lobodins M 35 decathlon record (8558 pts). Official Hypo-Meeting Result is 8240 pts ([]), so IAAF declared Kip Janvrin with 8241 pts as the record holder, but Decathlon All-Time Ranking is 8574 pts. The same confusing with M40 Class. Other question: How to add wind marks in Lev Lobodin M35 World Record Score? Thank you.Montell 74 (talk) 11:21, 26 February 2012 (UTC)

Sara Hall
I'm requesting help regarding the format of an IAAF ID. I've obviously placed many of them in the past, the one that is on the Sara Hall article seems no different from the others. Her ID number is 188211. Finding it manually on IAAF.org it works fine, but when it processes through the WP template and resolves on IAAF as an error. I can't find documentation on how this kind of template works so I don't now where to fix it. Trackinfo (talk) 17:52, 8 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Here is a link to the template documentation, which shows that occasionally the first letter of the surname is required. I tried this, and it worked. -- Dianna (talk) 18:20, 8 April 2012 (UTC)

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Thanks for the cleanup
Thanks for catching my mistake at List of world youth bests in athletics. I guess I should have thought of the right way sooner, since my daughter's always complaining about having to compete "up" an age with her late-in-the-year birthday. --LarryJeff (talk) 21:46, 13 April 2012 (UTC)

Portal:Athletics
A request has been made for this portal to be portal peer review. Contributions and suggestions are welcome. --Kasper2006 (talk) 15:25, 16 April 2012 (UTC)

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Category:Member of American Legislative Exchange Council
Hi, I see you are adding "former" and "current" sortkeys to articles in this category, but I'm afraid that the result is not really clear (unless you click edit in one of those articles and check the actual sortkey, which is not normally visible). Either you should split this category in two subcats, or leave out the sortkeys. It's not really logical to have to look for "Reed Elsevier" under "F" or "Koch Industries" under C... --Guillaume2303 (talk) 06:40, 24 April 2012 (UTC)


 * Hello, I notice that you were adding this category to a variety of Biographies. There is no ref for their membership in the articles. In particular, Tommy Thompson couldn't be a member of ALEC since at least 2000 (when he left as governor) and perhaps 1986 (when he ceased being a legislator). I think it is important that adding such a category to a BLP be verified in each article. Capitalismojo (talk) 10:00, 24 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks for responding on my talk page. I am a little confused though. You say that you found the names on the ALEC website. That would make these names Original Research and not suitable for inclusion. Are there RS that could be used instead? ...Also this category should be divided into current members and former members, it is unclear in it's present format.Capitalismojo (talk) 22:58, 24 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Well, that was easy. I found two RS sources, not the ALEC site, with Thompson mentioned. I'll add back the Cat.Capitalismojo (talk) 23:02, 24 April 2012 (UTC)

Technical help
I created the which has already come under attack by a POV oriented deletionist. One of the attacks is based on me trying to get too fancy by sub-categorizing the members, corporate members, former members etc. Unfortunately this separation is necessary for the proper use of this category. I use the pipe to separate the sub-category in the articles, but all that does is force the entry into a particular letter and it loses the title of the sub-category that is necessary to explain inclusion. How do I force the entries into the relevant sub-category, and how do I make that category one level down in the category? Sorry for the urgent request, but I need to get the faults settled to keep the category above water before they use this as a justification to snuff it out. Trackinfo (talk) 04:17, 25 April 2012 (UTC)
 * No problem, you just had them backwards. When citing categories & templates without using them, precede it with just a colon Category:Member of American Legislative Exchange Council produces Category:Member of American Legislative Exchange Council. Dru of Id (talk) 06:54, 25 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Now just replace the category on the article pages with the subcategory, and then they'll show up there, instead. Dru of Id (talk) 07:16, 25 April 2012 (UTC)

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My apologies
Hello T. I just wanted to offer apologies if it seems that I was ignoring your concerns when you made your report to ANI yesterday about the IP that was vandalizing various track articles. I was in the middle of doing three other things and didn't take the time to explain things fully. First, it is a good idea to post at least one or two warnings on the talk page of the offending editor. Most admins wont block without any warnings having been issued. I would have used or  but there might be others that would work too. I think that you could have reported them to AIV but it wasn't wrong of you to report at ANI. The one thing that can help when you report to ANI is to use this template as you can see here  it brings up all sorts of links so that the admins can check their edits or previous blocks etc more quickly. All though it didn't get to this point the one other thing to be aware of is that blocks are meant to be preventative not punitive. In this case you reported the IP some time after it had stopped editing and most (95% at a guess if not higher) would not have blocked. Finally, I know just how frustrating this kind of low level vandalism can be - in some ways it is worse than an outright vandal who has typed in "poop" or worse. I do a lot of work with films and we had a person who was going in and changing release dates and dollar figures just to mess with the articles. It went on for months and was a real pain. Now I know that you may already be aware of some or all of this but I thought I would pass it on in case any of it helps. To wrap up I want to say thank you for all of your good work here at WikiP and thanks for your vigilance in protecting all of the articles that you have on your watchlist. Cheers and have a nice weekend. MarnetteD | Talk 14:07, 4 May 2012 (UTC)

Salt River Project edit placement
Hello - I work at Salt River Project and saw your latest edit to our company’s article. We think it’s valuable to add employee involvement in active organizations, and we'll contribute in developing this idea in the future. In the meantime, would you have any problem if we moved your recent addition of the membership of one employee in an ALEC committee to the bottom of our page (similar to the placement of your edit on the Peabody Energy article)? We think this would give the information a more appropriate, hierarchical order. AdamatSRP (talk) 20:07, 11 May 2012 (UTC)

Category:High school national record holder
Category:High school national record holder, which you created, has been nominated for discussion. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the Categories for discussion page. Thank you. Courcelles 04:27, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

Nomination of Brandon Richards for deletion
A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Brandon Richards is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

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WP Athletics in the Signpost
The WikiProject Report would like to focus on WikiProject Athletics for a Signpost article scheduled to coincide with this summer's European Athletics Championships. The article about WikiProject Athletics would serve as the beginning of a special "Summer Sports Series", giving you an excellent opportunity to draw attention to the project's efforts and attract new members. Would you be willing to participate in an interview? If so, here are the questions for the interview. Just add your response below each question and feel free to skip any questions that you don't feel comfortable answering. Multiple editors will have an opportunity to respond to the interview questions, so be sure to sign your answers. If you know anyone else who would like to participate in the interview, please share this with them. Have a great day. -Mabeenot (talk) 04:08, 6 June 2012 (UTC)

An aside
Hi Trackinfo! Thanks for adding to the WikiProject interview, your opinions are always welcome. Reading your missives at the end of that interview and on your talk page, you seem a bit disgruntled with things on Wikipedia at the moment (to say the least!). I hope this isn't affecting your desire to contribute too much, because I always value the things you do.

I fully understand virtually all of your complaints, although I will say that with bare url sources you miss out the title, which can often be the easiest way to relocate lost sources. Either way, you'll have noticed that I too ignore the "easy" reference templates, which take up twice the space of a manually written one. I actually semi-automate the manual ones too using AutoHotkey (willing to share and teach if you're interested, it's super easy to use).

I actually have a theory about the editors involved in the tagging and bot-style admin work – namely that they are people disposed towards autistic/asperger's behaviour, which would explain their consuming desires to put everything in its "right" place, their asocial editing styles, their need to set inflexible rules regarding everything, and their tendency to avoid engaging in real subject matter (which often demands emotional engagement and knowledge-based value judgements which are of less interest to such people).

Still, I feel like we're making good progress covering track and field and the like. And I'm one of the few people who is happy to point out that there are only notability guidelines that stemmed from this essay. Despite the reams of digital paper that notability has now taken up, the community's beliefs have not really moved on from that old page. You'll also note that the whole idea stems from people trying to delete articles on verifiable topics! — For all the virtual "bosses" around, I'm actually confident that we can still decide our own destinies to a good extent here. SFB 20:57, 11 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Hey Trackinfo. I'm putting the final touches on the WP Athletics article for publication tomorrow. I understand the aggravation you endured as a result of the copyvio incident and you are right to point out the shortcomings of Wikipedia's bureaucracy. However, your final comment could come off as a little abrasive and may scare off new contributors to your project. If you wish, there is still time to smooth out that comment before we publish, although this not a requirement. I'm planning to publish your responses in their entirety either way. -Mabeenot (talk) 21:47, 24 June 2012 (UTC)

United States at the 2012 Summer Olympics
Horn will not compete in London, doesn't have an "A" standard. Also, we don't know who will be the third American woman to compete in the 100 metres, there was a dead heat. 108.222.5.90 (talk) 03:47, 24 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Yes I've noticed both issues. Thank you.   This is all a developing situation.  I was late to notice Gray Horn not making the A standard.  I added the tie to the Felix article. We will have to wait on what happens in the official decisions.  I have more experience reading automatic timing pictures that just about anybody (I started in 1970) and I wouldn't want to pick that one with all that on the line. Trackinfo (talk) 04:02, 24 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Ok, thanks for your hard work! 108.222.5.90 (talk) 04:04, 24 June 2012 (UTC)

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 * Already fixed. Trackinfo (talk) 21:06, 28 June 2012 (UTC)

Liu Xiang in London
Hi. Could you tell me where I can find a schedule for London Olympics track events? I'm especially interested, havng followed the Chinese athlete Liu Xiang somewhat, in the 100 meter hurdle, his signature event. After the disappointment on his 'home ground' so to speak 4 years ago, I'm hoping for the best for him. Can you give me specifics? --Christofurio (talk) 19:20, 15 July 2012 (UTC)

Re tables
Hi Trackinfo The way that I added the tables was that I went to an athletic event from the 2008 Summer Olympics and just copyed the table from there and then pasted it into the different athletic events in the 2012 Summer Olympics. As for th world leader part I would say you could just add an extra row to the table. Hope this helps.Eh Oh Canada (talk) 00:35, 30 July 2012 (UTC)

Re: World leader
Thats fine, but it ought to explain thats 2012's best.Lihaas (talk) 10:29, 3 August 2012 (UTC)

Gettting Wikimedians to the Olympic Games
Hi. I am part of an effort to get Wikimedians access to the 2016 Summer Olympics as accredited reporters and photographers. Part of this effort includes covering the 2012 Summer Paralympics. Two Wikimedians have credentials to attend these games as reporters through Wikimedia Australia. As English Wikipedia does not allow original reporting, this is largely through Wikinews with a project page found at Wikinews:Paralympic Games. If you are interested in helping to get Wikimedians to the next Summer Olympics,I'd encourage you to assist with Wikinews efforts, and also to work on all language 2012 Summer Paralympic Wikipedia articles before, during and after the Games to demonstrate a track record of success. Thank you. --LauraHale (talk) 04:05, 17 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Awesome. Fantastic experience.  I look forward to your assistance at Wikinews during the Paralympics, as that sort of experience would be extremely valuable in getting WMF recognised as a media organisation by a national Olympic committee. --LauraHale (talk) 06:59, 17 August 2012 (UTC)

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Re: Athletics at the 2012 Summer Olympics – Men's 100 metres for DYK?
Hello, Trackinfo. Thank you for your work on this wikiarticle. I have nominated it for DYK on MainPage. Could you take a look at the nomination, please? I hope I did not miss anyone in the list of (major) contributors. Thank you. Looking forward to seeing this wikipage featured on MainPage. Happy editing. Cheers! --PFHLai (talk) 10:17, 20 August 2012 (UTC)

DYK for Athletics at the 2012 Summer Olympics – Men's 100 metres
Best wishes Victuallers (talk) 08:03, 26 August 2012 (UTC)

Olympic Official Video
--Ymblanter (talk) 07:11, 31 August 2012 (UTC)

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Track and field conversions
Please see here SFB 18:46, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

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Thanks
I missed that. Andreasm <sup style="color:green;">just talk to me  05:58, 20 September 2012 (UTC)

Reversions at Occupy movement and Occupy Oakland
Please, when you have a moment: Is Occupy Oakland ongoing or defunct? JohnValeron (talk) 19:09, 29 September 2012 (UTC)

Edit warring
I guess we need to report the anon for edit warring at the Occupy article. Do you know how to do it? What a pest and waste of time, eh? Gandydancer (talk) 20:56, 30 September 2012 (UTC)

Brooks Johnson
Do you have a reference for Brooks Johnson being a member of the USA sprint relay winning team at the 1963 Pan American Games?

I've seen him listed elsewhere as a member but I could never find any corroborating source material, hence why I never included it myself.

It is certainly never mentioned in any articles on Brooks I've read, including ones that interview the man himself.

I hope it is true, but I just have this lingering doubt.

Medals
Regarding Tommie Turner: the 'default' opening medal template is Template:MedalTableTop, not Template:MedalTop. I know this isn't perfect, but it's the result of a long history of muddled up usage. I've actually already reduced the number of medal templates from 45 to 24. It remains an ongoing issue. I hope to set up a bot account in the future to resolve this because it's not feasible to fix 20,000 templates manually.

In terms of usage of the updated templates, you can read the documentation at Template:Medal (the first example listed being the one of most relevance to you). Send me a message if anything is unclear there and I'll attempt to clarify it. SFB 19:27, 5 October 2012 (UTC)

more on ALEC
Hi Trackinfo,

Thanks for the work you've put into the ALEC article. Now, straight up, we might disagree about the usefulness or the appropriateness of including the transcript of Bill Moyers' show on Democracy Now. And that's okay, as long as we have some broad agreement in the middle, say anywhere between 30% and 70%, I think we can work together.

Basically, I think there's considerable value to having a written transcript, and if it happens to be on Democracy Now, so be it.FriendlyRiverOtter (talk) 20:13, 8 October 2012 (UTC)

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Gabre Gabric was born in 1917
I translate for you this source: «The Lady Gabric-Calvesi obviously knows for certain that she was born in 1917, but because of his transfer from one country to another bureaucracy has produced a transcription error of his year of birth became the 1914.». Therefore I'm a FB friend of her doughter and her grand-sons. On it.wiki I explained the facts: The question of the date of birth I'll be do the same soon also her. ;-) --Kasper2006 (talk) 09:58, 23 October 2012 (UTC)
 * Other sources talk about 10-17-1914 which in reality would overthrow the real 10-14-1917. However, it is right to leave the date recognized by the Master's Federation and maybe explain the question in the body of the article. Maybe I'll do it and then we talk again if you want. --Kasper2006 (talk) 16:41, 23 October 2012 (UTC)

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Reference format
Thank you for the references you added to General Motors streetcar conspiracy. However, they should be formatted in the same style that the rest of the article uses. In this article, references use the, , , ... series of templates. Thanks.  Stepho  talk 01:43, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

Talkback
Gtwfan52 (talk) 10:40, 26 December 2012 (UTC)

Re:Vitaly Petrov
Of course, I began to put the link because I'm going to create the page. I will work here. Stay in touch. ;-) --Kasper2006 (talk) 11:53, 2 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Really I am honored for your collaboration to the "clean up". Petrov, as you know, works in Italy (Formia), and brought my compatriot Gibilisco to win the gold medal at the world championships (with 5.90) ​​and the Olympic bronze. The two had left, then there was a return in 2011, but with little success. --Kasper2006 (talk) 18:59, 2 January 2013 (UTC)

Category:Female athletes
Your own opinionin this discussion. ;-) --Kasper2006 (talk) 14:02, 21 January 2013 (UTC)

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International Track Association
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Proposed deletion of Sunnyvale High School (California)


The article Sunnyvale High School (California) has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:
 * Unsourced, generally feels like it could be an A7 Candidate if it was under any of its categories.

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. MIVP - (Can I Help?) (Maybe a bit of tea for thought?) 11:47, 19 March 2013 (UTC)

Hurdlers categories
Hi Trackinfo - Just just catching up on discussion on the wikiproject and would like more feedback on my hurdler category proposal. At the elite level (which is mostly what we deal with biography-wise) it is relatively unusual for an athlete to be competitive in both sprint and 400 m hurdles events. Do you think the sprint/400 categories would be a reasonable division? SFB 22:28, 21 March 2013 (UTC)

Pietro Mennea
Hello.

Thanks for fixing my error on Pietro Mennea. I was so sure it was about the 4 x 100, and not the 4 x 400, that I looked in the wrong place.

Regards

HandsomeFella (talk) 09:13, 22 March 2013 (UTC)

Drive-by tagging
FYI please see User talk:Klemen Kocjancic -- PBS (talk) 14:34, 28 March 2013 (UTC)

10K run
Hi Trackinfo. I've just created this article today. It's been missing for a long while and I know it's in your area of knowledge. I've written it with more of a focus on its usage as a mass participation event, rather than just narrowly focusing on the profession side of things. Could you have a look at it? I've tried to cover the basics but please add more if you notice anything that I've missed (I've just noticed that I've made no reference to course types and rules, for example). Cheers. SFB 19:05, 8 April 2013 (UTC)

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May 2013
Hello. Regarding the recent revert you made to Don Benton: you may already know about them, but you might find Template messages/User talk namespace useful. After a revert, these can be placed on the user's talk page to let them know you considered their edit inappropriate, and also direct new users towards the sandbox. They can also be used to give a stern warning to a vandal when they've been previously warned. Thank you. Gold   Standard  07:38, 13 May 2013 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of Jeremy Fischer (athlete)
Hello Trackinfo,

I wanted to let you know that I just tagged Jeremy Fischer (athlete) for deletion, because it seems to be inappropriate for a variety of reasons.

If you feel that the article shouldn't be deleted and want more time to work on it, you can contest this deletion, but please don't remove the speedy deletion tag from the top.

You can leave a note on my talk page if you have questions. DAR (talk) 22:54, 19 May 2013 (UTC)

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Re: Edit summary on Pole vault
Re: [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Pole_vault&diff=559544155&oldid=559543491 this edit summary]: the edit you undid was just regular testing; someone was just playing around with the toolbar. Graham 87 14:30, 12 June 2013 (UTC)

June 2013
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Darius Dhlomo
I'm afraid I simply do not have the time to do what you're asking. Enormous numbers of copyright violations are added to Wikipedia every day, and most of our copyright processes are heavily backlogged. The Darius Dhlomo investigation has been ongoing for nearly three years, and it's not even the oldest outstanding investigation. Darius Dhlomo made over 160,000 edits to over 23,000 pages, all of which have to be checked for copyvio. He added hundreds if not thousands of copyright violations. Rewriting every one of them would make an already time-consuming process far worse. Obviously removing these violations results in the removal of information, but we cannot use copyrighted text, no matter how useful it is. Our policy makes it clear that copyright violations need to be removed, rewrite or no rewrite. <b style="color:#FF0000;">Hut 8.5</b> 09:29, 19 June 2013 (UTC)


 * Rewriting absolutely is not a matter of "moving words around in the sentence", and if you believe it is then I strongly recommend you stop rewriting copyright violations. If you want to rewrite these articles then you have to do so from scratch. Of course this is almost as time-consuming as writing the content in the first place. Looking at this page I can see that you were told to stop helping with the Darius Dhlomo investigation because your attempted rewrites were not sufficiently different from the originals. I suggest you reread the comments that were left then.
 * Your comments about the amount of content are mistaken. The size of diffs given on the CCI pages refer to the total number of bytes added, not the total amount of text. In the case of edits which did not add a large amount of template formatting it is quite easy for an edit on one of the lower pages to add a paragraph or two of text, which is certainly enough for a serious copyright violation. <b style="color:#FF0000;">Hut 8.5</b> 18:10, 19 June 2013 (UTC)

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Missing article
Hi Trackinfo. I hope you're doing OK. I was reading this summary of Carl Lewis when I noticed a mention of the USOC National Sports Festival. This isn't even mentioned on the United States Olympic Committee article. There are barely two mentions of it on our whole article base! Do you have any knowledge around it? Just thought I'd alert you to this gap in what appears to have been quite a mid-sized track and field event at its peak. SFB 15:30, 3 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Also - I see your talk page is getting quite long. Would you like me to helparchive older messages for you? SFB 15:31, 3 July 2013 (UTC)
 * I recall the National Sports Festival. It was the USOC's answer to the Soviet and East German Spartkiade which at the time was assessed as their advantage in finding the superior pseudo-professional athletes (particularly women, to pump full of steroids, as it turned out) that were dominating medal counts during the 1970's. The origins of Renate Stecher, Bärbel Eckert-Wöckel, Heike Drechsler and Marita Koch as we know.  I further note, the East German version, the one that was the big talk of the 1970's, also has no mention in the wiki-linked article.  Here's some stuff to talk about that etc etc.   This was also the transitional period before professionalism was allowed, which in turn allowed athletes like Lewis to train on a more full time basis Bruce Jenner had done that essentially on his own, financed by his then wife working as a stewardess.  I know this from OR, I personally competed with him back in the day.  Some other idiot challenged it and that point got removed from his article recently.  I can't source it--I digress, often.  Here's a little on the NSF:  Sports Illustrated], Chicago Tribune 1985 blog and LOC self promotion several articles from the Christian Science Monitor.  I'll get to those if I get a chance, but I only seem to be able to edit in short bursts right now, so I can't take on several articles that need writing.  You are welcome to show me how to archive. Trackinfo (talk) 22:31, 3 July 2013 (UTC)

Sand Dune Park
Was heavily involved in this issue for years, and wrote dozens of blog posts about it. Nearly all of them have links to contemporaneous news sources.

http://core4you.org/category/sand-dune-park

Specific posts of note: http://core4you.org/2010/03/free-the-dune-parks-for-the-people http://core4you.org/2010/03/free-the-dune-video-edition http://core4you.org/2011/10/resident-support-leads-to-expanded-dune-hours http://core4you.org/2010/09/september-dune-update http://core4you.org/2010/07/after-one-year-sand-dune-to-reopen-august-2nd-for-exercise http://core4you.org/2010/07/sand-dune-set-to-reopen-in-one-week http://core4you.org/2010/04/local-coverage-of-april-13th-meeting http://core4you.org/2010/04/dune-is-back-partial-victory-for-exercise-common-sense

Most of the photos are mine, if you want to use any in the article, just ask & I'll upload it with the proper license. Cheers! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jakerome (talk • contribs) 05:38, 13 July 2013 (UTC)

Athletics event articles
Hi! I've started a discussion on how best to present results of athletics championships here. Please feel free to contribute to the discussion. SFB 18:40, 15 July 2013 (UTC)

RE: Marlies Göhr
Most, if not all, information by Special:Contributions/99.234.1.84 is unsourced and sometimes false. I wasn't removed easily to find information, I was reverting this user's edits. AS you ask me to inform myself, I ask you to do the same. Tb hotch .™ Grammatically incorrect? Correct it! See terms and conditions.  23:43, 24 July 2013 (UTC)
 * If you don't tell me how to do my work, I won't tell you how to do yours. You demostrated you have the ability of reverting my reverts, then go ahead and revert them, and if you have found these facts to exist, at least include one reference. Tb hotch .™ Grammatically incorrect? Correct it!  See terms and conditions.  00:41, 25 July 2013 (UTC)

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BLP warning
You seem to under a belief that you can opt out of Wikipedia's core content policies if your original research is interesting enough and if you fix your factual errors when they are pointed to you. This is not the case. WP:BLP is very clear (as are WP:V, WP:OR and WP:CRYSTAL) and you are quickly closing in on an enforced break from editing. If you continue to add the unsourced speculation about living persons to IAAF Hall of Fame, I will take this matter to AN/I where you are sure to have no sympathy for your policy violations. Prolog (talk) 12:58, 1 August 2013 (UTC)

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Missing
Hey, can you complete the missing information in this article? Thanks! Banhtrung1 (talk) 09:35, 12 August 2013 (UTC)

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ALEC Staff at List of ALEC Members article.
Hi, you asked that I discuss this issue at talk. I just wanted to give you the heads-up that I did about a week ago, in case you hadn't seen it. Capitalismojo (talk) 20:09, 17 August 2013 (UTC)

August 2013
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 * In the final [Alysia Montaño] displayed tactics reminiscent of Johnny Gray, taking the race out in 26.80 and 56.06 splits

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Apologies
Sometimes people are wrong, or idiots. Sometimes they are both. In this case I was both. I must heartily apologize to you. I believed that I had properly notified you of the posting on NOR. Looking at my contributions, I see it did not post. That is my mistake and I am sorry. I really hoped for some input from other eyes on this since you and I seem to be the only ones that have been doing much at the article, I actually wondered why you hadn't responded there. Again, my sincere apologies. Capitalismojo (talk) 22:29, 23 August 2013 (UTC)

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Forbes Billionaires
Hey there,

I may not have sourced my edit on Forbes Billionaires list about Reggie Theus, but it is relevant and factual. If you had the inclination to do even menial research (e.g., google search Reggie Theus Bank) you would find my claims accurate. You are correct that I did not source my information, however, this is because I am not familiar with how to do so. In the future, I will teach myself how to do this. This is not a reason to flag my edit for vandalism, and call it "total BS". If you would like, I will add it back and put sources in too. Please don't revert people's edits with bogus reasons.

Thank you,

Tempuser00 (talk) 22:01, 7 October 2013 (UTC)

My Apologies
Regarding the above topic (Forbes Billionaires) you are absolutely correct, and I was quick to respond in a rude manner. I have not familiarized myself with many Wiki policies such as Biographies of a Living Person, and I also wasn't thinking about the significance of my edits, especially in the scope of the article. But, please believe me, what I wrote was true and not utter BS :) Just look it up Reggie Theus Bank Error, its interesting. So, my apologies, I will learn how to make proper edits in the future.

Thanks, Tempuser00 (talk) 23:04, 8 October 2013 (UTC)


 * Also, I accidentally changed the article to a version with no source, instead of the one I had prepared with a source, before it was reverted again. I now realize that even if I had a source, it would still be inconsequential regarding the scope of the article. Also, by saying "looks like a duck" are you insinuating that I am a vandal? Or more likely, I am misunderstanding the context of the saying... — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tempuser00 (talk • contribs) 23:12, 8 October 2013 (UTC)

October 2013
Thank you for contributing to Wikipedia. We always appreciate when users upload new images. However, it appears that one or more of the images you have recently uploaded or added to an article, specifically Athletics at the 1968 Summer Olympics – Men's 200 metres, may fail our non-free image policy. Most often, this involves editors uploading or using a copyrighted image of a living person. For other possible reasons, please read up on our Non-free image criteria. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Werieth (talk) 19:30, 11 October 2013 (UTC)
 * You need to stop before I take this to ANI and request your block, its obvious you do not understand our policy on non-free content. Werieth (talk) 20:14, 11 October 2013 (UTC)

Hello, I'm BracketBot. I have automatically detected that [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=578222751 your edit] to Jackie Joyner-Kersee may have broken the syntax by modifying 1 ""s and 2 "[]"s. If you have, don't worry: just [ edit the page] again to fix it. If I misunderstood what happened, or if you have any questions, you can leave a message on [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?action=edit&preload=User:A930913/BBpreload&editintro=User:A930913/BBeditintro&minor=&title=User_talk:A930913&preloadtitle=BracketBot%20–%20&section=new my operator's talk page].
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 * * Long jump : 7.49 m still currently #2 all time, 3 cm behind the world record and she did it twice

Talkback
Werieth (talk) 19:51, 11 October 2013 (UTC)

Amber Campbell
Thanks. The IAAF website is useless for telling you things like that :) Red Fiona (talk) 22:05, 17 October 2013 (UTC)

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Original research or victory of an user?
Gabre_Gabric ;) From this. Se also Question about the date of birth (in Italian), I can translate about: ''«In these years of masters athletics arose a dispute about the category of the old lady, for FIDAL ( and Registry ), born October 17, 1914 , but according to other sources born on October 14, 1917. In the following years he moved with his family from his native Imotski ( until the end of the First World War still in the Austro -Hungarian Empire ) , first in the United States of America ( November 1923 ), then in Zadar, who had joined part of the Kingdom of Italy , and it is these passages which many attribute a possible clerical error statistically. The documents kept at Ellis Island Foundation, New York (shown below) indicate that Gabre Gabric arrived in New York with his father, Martin Gabrich , November 20, 1923 on the SS President Wilson from the port of Trieste. The same documents show that the small Gabre, at the time of arrival in the United States was 9 years of age , confirming 1914 as the actual year of birth.»'' --Kasper2006 (talk) 06:20, 30 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Tnx ;-) even if there is a risk that the talk page has little visibility. --Kasper2006 (talk) 06:21, 31 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Sorry I only see now, I was out of town for a short vacation. From personal experience, I'm not going to be bold on an admin, I had asked for your cooperation for this. ;) --Kasper2006 (talk) 06:09, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

November 2013
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 * group, Peter B's Looners, which included Bardens on keyboards, Peter Green on guitar, Dave Ambrose who went on to become a legendary A&R man, signing the Sex Pistols and Duran Duran http:

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Disambiguation link fixing one-day contest
I have decided to put on a mini-contest within the November 2013 monthly disambiguation contest, on Saturday, November 23 (UTC). I will personally give a $20 Amazon.com gift card to the disambiguator who fixes the most links on that server-day (see the project page for details on scoring points). Since we are not geared up to do an automated count for that day, at 00:00, 23 November 2013 (UTC) (which is 7:00 PM on November 22, EST), I'll take a screenshot of the project page leaderboard. I will presume that anyone who is not already listed on the leaderboard has precisely nine edits. At 01:00, 24 November 2013 (UTC) (8:00 PM on November 23, EST), I'll take a screenshot of the leaderboard at that time (the extra hour is to give the board time to update), and I will determine from that who our winner is. I will credit links fixed by turning a WP:DABCONCEPT page into an article, but you'll have to let me know me that you did so. Here's to a fun contest. Note that according to the Daily Disambig, we currently have under 256,000 disambiguation links to be fixed. If everyone in the disambiguation link fixers category were to fix 500 links, we would have them all done - so aim high! Cheers! bd2412 T 02:08, 18 November 2013 (UTC)

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record progression
Hi Trackinfo, it seems that you are busy with an enormous project, I can't wait! Weia (talk) 18:38, 27 January 2014 (UTC)
 * By the way, I have yearly lists of all world records from 1996 onwards. Only when someone has broken a record more than once that year they are not in the list. Of my own records I do know them of course, but from others not. Weia (talk) 08:52, 28 January 2014 (UTC)

January 2014
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 * | [Arhus]
 * | [Brisbane]

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Figure Skating Olympic Medalists
Hi, you did misread the results for the 2006 men's event. I think you got the free skating results mixed up with the overall final results. The original version with the medalists as Plushenko-Lambiel-Buttle was right; Lysacek did not medal that year. I would try to fix it, but I don't have the skills to do that on my phone.Squeaky-chan (talk) 12:51, 15 February 2014 (UTC)
 * Nevermind, I figured out how to fix it myself.Squeaky-chan (talk) 21:52, 15 February 2014 (UTC)

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February 2014
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 * Ethiopia as the national governing body for the sport of [ Athletics (sport)|Athletics].

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 *  is the IAAF recognized National governing body for the sport of [ Athletics (sport)|Athletics]  for Indonesia.  They are a member of the Komite Olahraga Nasional Indonesia ('KONI'

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 * quote|"The person who wins the race is behind watching"|Filbert Bayi, former world record

Oxnard
You are absolutely right! I did not notice the added content on buses. I am going to re-arrange it with subsections on road, rail and public transit however. If you have access to sources, perhaps you could add some content on freight rail? John from Idegon (talk) 21:49, 19 February 2014 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Ken Dennis


The article Ken Dennis has been proposed for deletion&#32; because of the following concern:
 * Fails WP:ATHLETE and WP:GNG.

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. JMHamo (talk) 02:12, 24 February 2014 (UTC)

Nomination of Ken Dennis for deletion
A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Ken Dennis is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Articles for deletion/Ken Dennis until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article. JMHamo (talk) 02:16, 24 February 2014 (UTC)

Welcome to Wikipedia. Please do not remove Articles for deletion notices from articles, or remove other people's comments in Articles for deletion debates, as you did with Ken Dennis. Otherwise, it may be difficult to create consensus. If you oppose the deletion of an article, please comment at the respective page instead. Thank you. JMHamo (talk) 02:25, 24 February 2014 (UTC)

Ken Dennis
I have withdrawn my deletion nomination and it will be closed soon, but in future could you please work on new articles in your sandbox and not live. This will avoid situations like this from happening again. JMHamo (talk) 02:37, 24 February 2014 (UTC)

March 2014
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 * |Penticton

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 * When the mile was run, the race was four laps of a quarter mile 440 yard/(402.336 m) track.

CfR you might be interested in
Trackinfo, I noticed you have extensively contributed to Mt. SAC Relays, so I thought you'd be interested in this categories for renaming discussion that I opened up today. Cheers. Jrcla2 (talk) 14:48, 7 March 2014 (UTC)

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April 2014
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 * | Boston	28.03.1999
 * | Hamilton	17.06.1999

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 * | Boston	26.03.2004
 * | San Sebastian	29.08.2005

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 * as Richmond's postmaster, a member of its first school board, and an assemblyman representing [Contra Costa County]. Ells originally opened as a

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Slash
I see what your saying, but he has worked with other artists as well as Jackson. He has worked with Alice Cooper numerous times also and maybe has a better connection with him than Jackson. But it doesn't seem approiate, to me, to include an artist in the infobox who Slash had only did session work for, when it is already in the article anyway amongst other session work. Surely it should be better just to have the prominent bands? Not a big issue, but those are my thoughts anyway! Take care. HrZ (talk) 15:50, 10 April 2014 (UTC)

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Records
Is it standard here? MachoCarioca (talk) 06:17, 23 April 2014 (UTC)

Ok, you've got a point. Personally I think it is bullshit and not proper information if we have an article named "List of South American records in athletics" and some marks on it are not records. But if it is Wikpedia standard way to work, ok. But, by the way, South American records actually has a governing body. It is the Confederación Sudamericana de Atletismo and the official records are there. You can see it in "Records Sudamericanos" and choose what you want: "Pruebas de Ruta" (Road races), "Pista y Campo" (Track and Field), "Marcha" (Walk) and "Pista Cubierta" (indoor). Cheers. MachoCarioca (talk) 05:38, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

Yes, but not Carmen de Oliveira whose not ratified time is worse than Yolanda Caballero (2 not ratified marks here? Doesn't make sense for me). I don't know what is the criteria. MachoCarioca (talk) 06:36, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

Well, my will is remove both cause it means nothing. A 'records list' in my reasoning must have only what it says it has, 'records'. Maybe a footnote to "old records once recognized but not nowadays" or something not a mark-with-a-sign in the records table. Not recognized records aren't records. But if Wikipedia works this way, ok, keep that, keep both, this is not an academic site just a popular one. Just one is as bad information as two, anyway. Never mind. MachoCarioca (talk) 07:24, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

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No "A," eh?
Hi Track- this is my response to your note on my page, there too. Speaking of "page," usually we are on the same page, but not this time!

Track - there is absolutely no reason to post this "A" beside the record because altitude does not assist distance events. The IAAF list of records doesn't affix the "A" which underlines my point. The only times "A" are affixed are on affected events, like the sprint events, as these events are assisted at altitude. You might as well put a "B" for "barefoot" when Zola Budd and Abebe Bikila set their records, or an "R" when a record was set in pouring rain. It's trivia, it's interesting that in conditions which tend to work against record-setting, a record is nevertheless set. But that's shouldn't be on the page. Canada Jack (talk) 18:29, 28 April 2014 (UTC)

Appending the older discussion, I did find IAAF listing altitude notations on their lists here and elsewhere. It is notable. Unfortunately, Canada Jack's account seems to have disappeared.Trackinfo (talk) 00:01, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

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tenths, hundredths
Hi Track: Sorry, I don't want to come off like a jerk here, you have contributed enormously to the track pages here at wikipedia, more than me, and I don't want you to think I'm peering over your shoulder or whatever. But the abrievations page has several issues, and the 10ths/100ths issue is one of them. It was one of my pet peeves years ago here to see "hand-timed" records followed by "electronic" records in the progression lists here and this was typically inserted, in good faith, by editors who assumed that any time to the 10th was a hand-timed record. While this is generally true, there are numerous instances where an event was timed electronically but put in the record books to the tenths, sometimes the original electoronic time was lost. Like one of Henry Rono's 1978 records - it was something like 20 years later that the original 100th time was located but by the logic of the "hand-timed" editor, to the 10th equated to hand-timed.

To further complicate matters, because of the variance between hand and electronic times, there were weird adjustments made to "correct" the electronic times in the 60s to make the marks closer to the hand-timed ones. It wasn't necessarily simply reading the time. I wonder if someone has actually written a history of the use of electronic timing, that would help matters here. I know a few small pieces and inferred others.

But my point is that any time rendered to the 10th is not ipso facto hand-timed. It may be an accurate thing to say for meets these days, but the sport has a 140 year+ history involving timed events, and we need to be careful how we characterize the accuracy of past timed feats. Pick up an issue of Track and Field News from 1978, say, and look at the results listed from Europe. You will see nearly all the times for events over 400m listed to the 10ths, even though most of those times were recorded to the 100ths. Or, take a look at the result book from the 1968 Olympics. Even on-line, the results are listed.... to the 10th. And though from 1977 the sprint events were to the 100th, the longer distances were still to the 10th. So if one looks at the 1980 Moscow results, you will see up to 400m to the 100th, but the great Coe/Ovett duels to the 10th, at the official IOC site. Yet those times were recorded electronically as per the results listed here at wikipedia.Athletics_at_the_1980_Summer_Olympics

I'd say to make the page as good as it could be, we need to make sure claims as the "hand-timed" one are reliably sourced. The other one I flagged was the .24 second added for hand-timing, which is what TFN often did, but, again, the conversion issue is not so simple, and as I noted, expert hand-timers could get it to within .10 seconds using methods like the one I mentioned. World records in the sprints were improved by .1 second increments from the 1930s on, after all, despite the near-quarter second reaction time. Canada Jack (talk) 00:46, 7 May 2014 (UTC)


 * Got your message. Wow you must have seen that Liquori/Ryun race back then... I spent a summer in California in 1967 when Ryun did his 3:51.1 - but I was a kid in a small place where the largest town nearby was Bishop. As for our discussion, while you sure know your stuff, the text as it stands is not clear on when and where this 10th/100th applies. In the examples I mentioned it obviously does not apply, so we need some clarity on that. I mean the transition to electronic times was a process which took about a decade and was never as clear-cut as "10th = handtimed." That's all I'm saying. Canada Jack (talk) 02:14, 7 May 2014 (UTC)

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Patrick Carlin, Jr.
As much as I understand your efforts to add more sources and try to save the article, the simple fact is that primary sources and self-published sources do not add to notability. Third-party sources are needed for notability. While you have added reliable sources, they aren't third-party sources as they are either by him or someone closely affiliated with him. XXSNUGGUMSXX (talk) 01:46, 19 May 2014 (UTC)

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Nomination of April Jace for deletion
A discussion is taking place as to whether the article April Jace is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Articles for deletion/April Jace until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article. Hirolovesswords (talk) 23:09, 22 May 2014 (UTC)

Intentional disruption designed to illustrate a point
Constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, but your recent edits, such as those to Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/April Jace‎, appear to be intentional disruptions designed to illustrate a point. Edits designed for the deliberate purpose of drawing opposition, including making edits you do not agree with or enforcing a rule in a generally unpopular way, are highly disruptive and can lead to a block or ban. If you feel that a policy is problematic, the policy's talk page is the proper place to raise your concerns. If you simply disagree with someone's actions in an article, discuss it on the article talk page or, if direct discussion fails, through dispute resolution. If consensus strongly disagrees with you even after you have made proper efforts, then respect the consensus, rather than trying to sway it with disruptive tactics. Thank you. --Hirolovesswords (talk) 20:52, 23 May 2014 (UTC)

Edit warring
Your recent editing history at April Jace shows that you are currently engaged in an edit war. Being involved in an edit war can result in your being blocked from editing&mdash;especially if you violate the three-revert rule, which states that an editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page within a 24-hour period. Undoing another editor's work—whether in whole or in part, whether involving the same or different material each time—counts as a revert. Also keep in mind that while violating the three-revert rule often leads to a block, you can still be blocked for edit warring&mdash;even if you don't violate the three-revert rule&mdash;should your behavior indicate that you intend to continue reverting repeatedly.

To avoid being blocked, instead of reverting please consider using the article's talk page to work toward making a version that represents consensus among editors. See BRD for how this is done. You can post a request for help at a relevant noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, you may wish to request temporary page protection. --Hirolovesswords (talk) 20:56, 23 May 2014 (UTC)

Notice of Edit warring noticeboard discussion
Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion involving you at Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring regarding a possible violation of Wikipedia's policy on edit warring. Thank you. --Hirolovesswords (talk) 02:39, 25 May 2014 (UTC)
 * You have been warned per [//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Administrators%27_noticeboard/Edit_warring#User:Trackinfo_reported_by_User:Hirolovesswords_.28Result:_Warned.29 the result of the 3RR complaint] not to keep restoring the masterstrack.com source to the article. Thank you, EdJohnston (talk) 17:38, 25 May 2014 (UTC)

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 * List of North, Central American and Caribbean records in athletics (check to confirm | fix with Dab solver)
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Canvassing
Hello. It appears that you have been canvassing—leaving messages on a biased choice of users' talk pages to notify them of an ongoing community decision, debate, or vote—in order to influence Wikipedia:Reliable sources/Noticeboard. While friendly notices are allowed, they should be limited and nonpartisan in distribution and should reflect a neutral point of view. Please do not post notices which are indiscriminately cross-posted, which espouse a certain point of view or side of a debate, or which are selectively sent only to those who are believed to hold the same opinion as you. Remember to respect Wikipedia's principle of consensus-building by allowing decisions to reflect the prevailing opinion among the community at large. --Hirolovesswords (talk) 17:41, 27 May 2014 (UTC)

There is currently a discussion at Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you.

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June 2014
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 * is the progression of world record improvements of the 300 metres hurdles W65 division of [

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July 2014
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 * Championships]], before going on to take his outdoor crown. He also won sprint medals at the 2005 World Championships in Athletics|2005 World personal and national record for the 100m on the

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William Tomicki proposed deletion
Hello Track info:

Thank you. You are correct. I suggested deleting the article entirely out of sheer frustration with the process. I'd really just like to get the facts straight and get this in order.

I'd like to send you some additional information to bolster my case and set the facts in order.

Sincerely,

William Tomicki — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.99.125.71 (talk) 20:46, 18 July 2014 (UTC)

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William Tomicki
Hi, understood about frustration. The DRV might close better in our favor better if you'd maybe consider refactoring that comment. It puts a guilt trip on people who are otherwise working in good faith based on their belief on what is notable or not, which is entirely subjective, and needed. Comparisons to "death penalty" and "firing squad" are borderline offensive which they may use to derail and muddle the issue to play the victim. The idea here is we have the "law" on our side, cool and collected. Hotly pounding the table over AfD in general is a sign of a weak understanding of the guidelines. The point of the DRV is to show we have the better understanding of the guidelines than the closing admin did. Hope this comment isn't taken the wrong way, do whatever you like :) regards -- Green  C  18:31, 23 July 2014 (UTC)

Hey, I know you feel strongly about this.. maybe strike the part about slippery slope and Hitler and MH 17? Best regards.. -- Green  C  00:15, 24 July 2014 (UTC)

Driveby Refbots
Please do your homework.

I spend hours fixing badly formed references. If you had checked you would have noted this.

Refbot is not a fix all solution. Did you click on "Show view" afterward? Why did you leave in the errors? For someone else to fix? With your errors, you have created more "things to fix" entries than I did by adding the one tag to something on my watchlist.

It is okay, though. When I finish with Idaho National Laboratory, I'll clean up your errors.

Softtest123 (talk) 17:52, 24 July 2014 (UTC)

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Pfizer
Happy to discuss your concerns in a detailed way, or to see you re-add deleted material in a NPOV manner and with appropriate sourcing. The material I deleted had problems with sourcing or was obsolete. Admittedly I could hsve sesrched for better sources, but the article is unbalanced and my priority would be to add more information about the company's products. As it stands there is very little discussion in the article about what the company actually does to generate revenue, while the scandals it has beeninvolved kn are discussed in great detail. Thanks, Formerly 98 (talk) 23:04, 9 August 2014 (UTC)

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Please consider consolidating your Masters athletcis records into coherent articles with links from main article
For example, Masters M35 shot put world record progression is not worthy of separate article. It could be merged in a number of ways. Considering that you have created a number of these "table only" articles, I would suggest an overarching article Masters athletics shot put with all the age categories and have the Masters athletics link to it. Otherwise, it will be a merge or deletion candidate. Do the same for the roughly 240 other articles created that have no inherent notability without the Masters athletics top article and are broken down into sections by age. I suggested Shot put for the shot put related articles but that could easily be Masters athletics or a single shot put subarticle under Masters athletics --DHeyward (talk) 05:51, 13 August 2014 (UTC)

Your ANI report
Blocked, but it is usually faster to go to WP:AIV. No problem though. Dougweller (talk) 08:20, 13 August 2014 (UTC)

Jo(anne) Pavey
Had I expected any dissent or controversy I would have initiated a talk discussion, but I simply didn't view the move as controversial. I looked at the article just before the European championships 5000m, and was surprised how little it had on her earlier career considering her longevity. So I looked up some articles in Newsbank to start expanding it, and will probably continue the expansion in the coming days. She is overwhelmingly referred to as Jo in British media e.g Guardian Independent Telegraph. The news archive source Newsbank has 1,780 results for "Jo Pavey" athletics vs 126 for "Joanne Pavey" athletics. Most references to Joanne occur when she was a relative unknown. Athletics Weekly calls her Jo. So does the UK Athletics database. In short, I'd expect a little more good faith to have been assumed here. Oldelpaso (talk) 08:08, 17 August 2014 (UTC)
 * It strikes me that some databases will use a full length name irrespective of common usage. I'd take usage of a name in prose form over an entry in the name field of a database any day. Take the IAAF profile, the very first link to a story about her uses Jo . In the news section of Pavey's profile at all-athletics.com, of the ten news items, eight use Jo, and one uses Joanne (in the other one she isn't mentioned by name). The BBC routinely use Jo in their news stories e.g. - the search function on the BBC website gives 417 results for "Jo Pavey" ; a search for "Joanne Pavey" gives 13 . I just looked at three different editions of Eurosport, all of which used Jo in their news pages   . A comparator might be Pavey's male counterpart as European 10,000 champion, Mo Farah. His IAAF page calls him Mohamed, but most places, including Wikipedia, he is Mo. As an aside, I suppose we ought to use the article talk page if we continue this, and should perhaps copy over what we've already written. Oldelpaso (talk) 21:28, 17 August 2014 (UTC)

August 2014
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 * htm note: Barber's pole vault was measured in imperial
 * 46-61/4, 1.93/6-4, 52.3 [3765]

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 * ref>https://web.archive.org/web/20121004102203/http://www.alec.org/about-alec/state-chairmen/

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September 2014
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 * * Edgewood High School (West Covina, California) Edgewood High School

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 * County]], California. [Mercy High School (San Francisco)|Mercy High School of San Francisco]  is in San Francisco.

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 * of Yekaterina Podkopayeva who was battling to stay ahead of [Ravilya Agletdinova-Kotovich] .  On the final straight, Decker moved into lane 2 and started to make a run at Zaytseva, gaining

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Notability of CIF/High school leagues
Hi again, as you've seen I've been creating entries for the many CIF section leagues. While doing this, it appears that several of the pages had been created and subsequently deleted due to concerns about notability, and there also seems to be paucity of available sources on the internet. My question is, should each league have its own entry, or should there just be a consolidated page called something like List of CIF Southern Section leagues.--Prisencolinensinainciusol (talk) 23:58, 4 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Prisencolinensinainciusol I think each of these leagues, which in turn affect a multiple number of notable schools are themselves notable. I wouldn't spend my time creating them.  What leagues have been deleted?  I've been a little slow in following up on your work but I haven't seen any actually deleted.  I'll go to battle, though I hope you would also speak up.  I don't like the idea of lumping it all into one page and in a practical sense, what would make a giant list any more notable than individual articles.  So many of the leagues have not been created, but the ones that were created years ago attract a lot of activity from season to season.  Even our initiation of a stub article opens that door that many novice editors would be afraid to open.  If there is a red mark against a particular league, we as experienced editors need to put in that extra effort to show it is a notable league.  Include sources.  Include more sources.  Most leagues have a history that appears in print, maybe local print, but CIF Southern Section will invariably show up in the LA Times.  I just worked on CIF Central Coast Section.  If I get questioned there, I know there is plenty of press in the San Jose Mercury and San Francisco Chronicle.  Most important, don't lie down for the idiots that don't understand the subject.  Those are the ones attacking and we need to get rid of that kind of malicious editors.  They make wikipedia look bad. Trackinfo (talk) 01:29, 5 September 2014 (UTC)
 * I should clarify it that it wasn't my recent edits that were deleted, it was a previous revision. I think one of them was Hacienda League. Also Empire League was tagged for notability after I created it.--Prisencolinensinainciusol (talk) 01:35, 5 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Prisencolinensinainciusol I don't see anything wrong with Hacienda League, which I corrected one of the schools and is on my watch list. Empire League got a TAG complaint.  I'm going to clean that article up and will remove it.  That league is a major league.  Those are big schools.  So somebody who wants to remove it better roll up their sleeves. Trackinfo (talk) 01:44, 5 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Prisencolinensinainciusol WOW, you got the league teams wrong. Watch out what you get from MaxPreps.  Their information is good and valid, but you picked up a 2004 season.  A decade later, the league is different.  Be careful on all of California, several sections have re-leagued.  CCS has several leagues that re-league for each sport each season.  Southern Section re-leagues massively in 2014. Trackinfo (talk) 02:06, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

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Wondering
Should we bring Banner to RFC/U?--Tomwsulcer (talk) 19:49, 16 September 2014 (UTC) Or ANI?--Tomwsulcer (talk) 19:51, 16 September 2014 (UTC)

Phreaking
My edit reverted a long-term blocked IP-hopping editor. If you want to take credit for the link, please go ahead, but don't just revert because I cannot get "rollback all" to add edit summaries. — Arthur Rubin (talk) 08:55, 17 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Yup. That's what I came here to say too.  JohnInDC (talk) 23:54, 17 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Guys, it is honorable to chase after vandals. I do the same thing on reflex when I have a legit vandal, and I've had arguments because of it.  But try to look at the content.  Some IPs actually submit legit content. Trackinfo (talk) 23:59, 17 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Trying to look at context is impractical when a block-evading vandal edits at the rate of 70 pages an hour; it's just too time-consuming to review every one to assess whether there's something salvageable there. JohnInDC (talk) 00:11, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

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Dennis Kipruto Kimetto
hello. the source for his birthday ("International Association of Athletics Federations" website) can be found in the externel links, I don't see the point at making it a footnote. the issues with his birthdate can be explained instead, I guess. Yoav Nachtailer (talk) 17:10, 1 October 2014 (UTC)

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Sad...
You really have no arguments left, so you start digging through my archives and copy each and everything that suits your negative battleground mentality.

But I consider this as harassing and stalking, so be warned. <span style="font-family:'Old English Text MT',serif;color:green">The Banner <i style="color:maroon">talk</i> 10:44, 2 October 2014 (UTC)
 * I call it forensics. Collecting further evidence.  I do not have access to administrator tools to quickly jump to your history.  You have obviously been blocked and have had other editors tell you essentially the same thing I told you.  We can play this game for a little while.  I'm bending over backward to avoid more conflict while protecting wikipedia from your disingenuous editing on a case by case basis.  If you continue to behave in a fashion detrimental to wikipedia, I will have to go to the administration.  And I will have a nice package to show them. Trackinfo (talk) 10:56, 2 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Try it, I have by now a nice collection of personal attacks and following me around. <span style="font-family:'Old English Text MT',serif;color:green">The Banner <i style="color:maroon">talk</i> 19:37, 3 October 2014 (UTC)

MfD nomination of User:Trackinfo/sandbox/Banner
User:Trackinfo/sandbox/Banner, a page you substantially contributed to, has been nominated for deletion. Your opinions on the matter are welcome; please participate in the discussion by adding your comments at Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/User:Trackinfo/sandbox/Banner and please be sure to sign your comments with four tildes ( ~ ). You are free to edit the content of User:Trackinfo/sandbox/Banner during the discussion but should not remove the miscellany for deletion template from the top of the page; such a removal will not end the deletion discussion. Thank you. <span style="font-family:'Old English Text MT',serif;color:green">The Banner <i style="color:maroon">talk</i> 00:23, 6 October 2014 (UTC)

October 2014
You may be blocked from editing without further warning the next time you purposefully and blatantly harass a fellow Wikipedian, as you did at User talk:DGPatt. <span style="font-family:'Old English Text MT',serif;color:green">The Banner <i style="color:maroon">talk</i> 19:11, 6 October 2014 (UTC)
 * [User:The Banner]], as personal insults go, this is really quite mild ("the insults of"). But Trackinfo, I just deleted that attack page of yours, and I strongly urge you to start adopting a very different tone. The language you used in September and early October is unacceptable, and will get you blocked. If you disagree with an AfD nomination, argue against it and get the article kept. If you disagree with the methods or the volume or whatever, take it to ANI, maybe, or elsewhere--but don't resort to personal attacks. Thank you. Drmies (talk) 18:15, 14 October 2014 (UTC)

Hello, I'm BracketBot. I have automatically detected that [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=630744075 your edit] to List of world records in masters athletics may have broken the syntax by modifying 2 "[]"s. If you have, don't worry: just [ edit the page] again to fix it. If I misunderstood what happened, or if you have any questions, you can leave a message on [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?action=edit&preload=User:A930913/BBpreload&editintro=User:A930913/BBeditintro&minor=&title=User_talk:A930913&preloadtitle=BracketBot%20–%20&section=new my operator's talk page].
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Speedy deletion nomination of Section 4 (NYSPHSAA)
I guess New York isn't exactly your area of expertise, but I was just wondering if you could help me defend the notability of this article. Some info here--Prisencolinensinainciusol (talk) 04:03, 9 October 2014 (UTC)

James Buckley
I spent an hour scouring for reliable sources for James L. Buckley's participation in ALEC and came up empty handed. I'm as baffled as you are. Believe me, I want this info in our article, and I suspect you're right that his name was mistyped on the ALEC website. --Dr. Fleischman (talk) 06:04, 9 October 2014 (UTC)

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October 2014
Please do not add unreferenced or poorly referenced information, especially if controversial, to articles or any other page on Wikipedia about living (or recently deceased) persons, as you did to Erik Sowinski. Thank you.


 * And please don't add a CV-esque list of facts. This is not encyclopedic.  Lugnuts  Dick Laurent is dead 09:23, 10 October 2014 (UTC)
 * I'll revert your edit and snip out what might be controversial. Geez.  In your haste to remove 8K of content, you deleted a massive amount of what are essentially statistics, including supporting sources.  I have supported most of the other statistics with multiple sources . . . now you nit pick on one phrase but you deleted supported statements including his birthplace, college team . . . you deleted the college web page as a source?  You deleted an entire section of prose I added with multiple sources.  I may have neglected a few sensitive words left by a previous editor.  Lugnuts, you are a big time editor.  You should know better.  Your massive deletion of sourced content is irresponsible. Trackinfo (talk) 09:34, 10 October 2014 (UTC)


 * No, YOU should know better. Read the BLP policy. And read it again. And come back when you have a clue.  Lugnuts  Dick Laurent is dead 11:19, 10 October 2014 (UTC)


 * This content wasn't just unverified and written in an profoundly unencyclopedic way, it was also a copyright violation, having been copied by from this site. What remains is still, well how do I say this gently, not great. "he joined the Waukesha running store sponsored Running Wild" is ungrammatical/unpunctuated/awkward, "coached by World Championship medalist" is puffy (and vague--what medal? in what?). "Strategically following Duane and the unrelated Jarrin Solomon"--"strategically" following? and "unrelated" in what--blood? (Yes, but very awkward.) "running unattached in regulatory transition to professional sponsorship"--unclear. Anyway, copyvio. If you had looked for those sources you would have discovered that too. User:Lugnuts's point about the BLP is well taken. Drmies (talk) 18:12, 14 October 2014 (UTC)

THANGSING
The article and talk page are now deleted; however, neither is salted. Risker (talk) 04:16, 11 October 2014 (UTC)

Edward Burkes
I hope the new header is more satisfactory, and addresses your concerns. (I'm not bad with a hammer myself, for my age.) -- Orange Mike &#124;  Talk  21:45, 13 October 2014 (UTC)

October 2014
Please be careful about what you say to people. Some remarks, such as your addition to Wikipedia:Village pump (proposals) can easily be misinterpreted. Wikipedia is a supportive environment, where contributors should feel comfortable and safe while editing. Thank you. <span style="font-family:'Old English Text MT',serif;color:green">The Banner <i style="color:maroon">talk</i> 18:27, 20 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Trackinfo, I have had it with your insults. The only reason I'm not blocking you right now is that I didn't get to this earlier. Bring up Banner one more time in a negative way and I will block you for personal attacks. Don't ask me to define "in a negative way"--common sense ought to be enough here. Thank you. Drmies (talk) 22:02, 20 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Trackinfo, good idea to stop following you-know-who, don't mention any other users by name, since any comment you might make can be misconstrued as a "personal attack". Let the community deal with bad behavior, just as it can bring pressure to bear on abusive administrators. Focus on the encyclopedia.--Tomwsulcer (talk) 13:53, 21 October 2014 (UTC)
 * You too, Tom. And if you know of any abusive administrators, let me know; I'll be glad to take care of them. I'm sure you agree that civility is an important part of collaborative editing, and abusive behavior, as well as outright personal attacks and sly innuendo, do great harm to the collaborative project. Thanks, Drmies (talk) 22:12, 21 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Why are you writing messages to Tomwsulcer on my talk page? Trackinfo (talk) 22:18, 21 October 2014 (UTC)

Talk:Raining Men (song)
I invite you to join discussion. --George Ho (talk) 16:55, 26 October 2014 (UTC)

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iheart
I've restored here for you to continue working on. I've removed the text, which was pure spam. Good luck <b style="font-family:chiller;color:red">Jimfbleak</b> - talk to me?  08:29, 2 November 2014 (UTC)

Nomination of IHeart Radio Fiesta Latina for deletion
A discussion is taking place as to whether the article IHeart Radio Fiesta Latina is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Articles for deletion/IHeart Radio Fiesta Latina until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article. <span style="font-family:'Old English Text MT',serif;color:green">The Banner <i style="color:maroon">talk</i> 10:12, 3 November 2014 (UTC)

Doc Mentillo
I know that your are still hopping around me, so now let us turn this into something positive. I have recently send the article Doc Mentillo to AfD, with as arguments ''Fails WP:GNG and effectively an unsourced BLP. Most likely selfpromo. Copy Chris Mentillo of the same author is already redirected.''. To be true, the article is horrible and full of selfpromo. I have the idea that the author really has no clue how to prove notability and turn this into a worthy article. His request for adoption is already turned down by a few experienced guys, so I had to think of you. Perhaps you can help him and the article as I think that it is not unlikely that Mentillo is notable (although I have not seen proof of it). Something for you to take up this challenge and help out? <span style="font-family:'Old English Text MT',serif;color:green">The Banner <i style="color:maroon">talk</i> 10:31, 4 November 2014 (UTC)

Feedback for patrollers re speedy deletion
Re your thread at WP:CSD, are you aware of the existence of Wikipedia talk:New pages patrol and WP:NPP/N? VQuakr (talk) 08:34, 7 November 2014 (UTC)

Template:Rolf Geese M60 World Record Score
I came across the template Template:Rolf Geese M60 World Record Score. Unfortunately, it is a single use template. As such, it would be suitable for deletion, something you definitely don't like (seeing the comments on the talkpage.) But there is a plan B: use the template on more places. Could it be possible to create the article Rolf Geese? <span style="font-family:'Old English Text MT',serif;color:green">The Banner <i style="color:maroon">talk</i> 12:35, 8 November 2014 (UTC)
 * There is even a plan C: change the way List of world records in masters athletics is built. But that could really be a hell of a job. <span style="font-family:'Old English Text MT',serif;color:green">The Banner  <i style="color:maroon">talk</i> 12:42, 8 November 2014 (UTC)


 * There are certainly other pages where this particular template could be used. I could ask for you to be reasonable, but in terms of deletions, I know your habits too.  So rather than argue, I have started such a page and now the majority of such templates are now multiple use. Trackinfo (talk) 00:56, 9 November 2014 (UTC)
 * I am not as bad as you think I am. And this is just a request to avoid deletion. <span style="font-family:'Old English Text MT',serif;color:green">The Banner <i style="color:maroon">talk</i> 11:01, 9 November 2014 (UTC)

List of european records in masters athletics
This is an automated message from CorenSearchBot. I have performed a web search with the contents of List of european records in masters athletics, and it appears to include material copied directly from http://en.scio.pw/List_of_world_records_in_masters_athletics.

It is possible that the bot is confused and found similarity where none actually exists. If that is the case, you can remove the tag from the article. The article will be reviewed to determine if there are any copyright issues.

If substantial content is duplicated and it is not public domain or available under a compatible license, it will be deleted. For legal reasons, we cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other web sites or printed material. You may use such publications as a source of information, but not as a source of sentences. See our copyright policy for further details. (If you own the copyright to the previously published content and wish to donate it, see Donating copyrighted materials for the procedure.) CorenSearchBot (talk) 00:54, 9 November 2014 (UTC)


 * In reply to the above bot complaint. This page was essentially copied from the wikipedia page of masters athletics world records.  About half the content will actually duplicate.  There will now be considerable editing to update that information to conform to European records.  This will take considerable time and the page will not be accurate until that massive editing process is completed.  I created and have been a major contributor to the original page from which it was copied and know the amount of work this will entail.  Give it time. Trackinfo (talk) 01:03, 9 November 2014 (UTC)

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