Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Poland/Archive 16

Polish official population figures 2006 - Error 404
There are hundreds of such dead links produced by Kotbot. Xx234 (talk) 12:30, 19 December 2014 (UTC)
 * Since you didn't provide a link, I can hardly review it. Try to talk to User:Kotniski, I hear he is still occasionally active on pl wikipedia (pl:Wikipedysta:Kotniski), through even there he doesn't have an edit newer than 2012. Maybe email him. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 16:56, 23 December 2014 (UTC)
 * http://stat.gov.pl/45_655_PLK_HTML.htm in Koło County and many other counties.Xx234 (talk) 07:43, 29 December 2014 (UTC)
 * The best solution is to pipe them to Internet Archive. August 10, 2009 still produced a working page, next IA entry is for 13 September, 2009 and is broken. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 11:50, 29 December 2014 (UTC)
 * I don't know how.
 * There are pobably hundreds of such links, maybe for any county in Poland.Xx234 (talk) 12:05, 30 December 2014 (UTC)

Patrick Bashford
I can’t find a Wiki page on John Patrick Bashford. As he had an obituary in the Times should he have a Wiki page?

http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/opinion/obituaries/article3360999.ece

From the Times obituary:

Vogue model, man about town and familiar face in the Fifties and Sixties who had a second career as a teacher of classical guitar

John Patrick Bashford was born near Katowice, Poland, in 1929.Jniech (talk) 21:22, 22 December 2014 (UTC)
 * Perhaps, but keep in mind WP:NOTMEMORIAL - we need more sources than one obituary (through granted, the Times is pretty significant). Feel free to stub the bio, I can review it later. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 16:54, 23 December 2014 (UTC)


 * I will work on it tomorrow and update you when it is done Jniech (talk) 18:31, 23 December 2014 (UTC)

I have started work on a subpage here. Please let me know if you think it is worth continuing Jniech (talk) 12:50, 24 December 2014 (UTC).
 * Looks good enough to be moved to mainspace. A sentence or two more and you can nominate him at T:TDYK, too. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 13:02, 24 December 2014 (UTC)

The new page is here. If you can improve it then I would appraciate it. Jniech (talk) 21:09, 27 December 2014 (UTC)
 * He was born at Beuthen/Bytom, in Germany. It's interesting if his mother was Silesian or came from Poland.Xx234 (talk) 12:16, 30 December 2014 (UTC)

Feliks Nowowiejski
Hi. I translated a thorough German wiki article on Feliks Nowowiejski (a noted 20th-century composer) on his very scanty English page (Mind you, the Polish article wasn't much more). I haven't edited in a while, and I'd like a Polish expert to go over it. Thanks Beau Tibbs (talk) 15:03, 4 January 2015 (UTC)
 * The article needs Wikification and inline references.Xx234 (talk) 08:32, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

While traditionally Prussian
Many places in Poland are qualified as traditionally Prussian. Such statement doesn't explain much to a US/UK reader. The same Berlin was traditionally Slavic.Xx234 (talk) 09:17, 5 January 2015 (UTC)
 * It seems that many stubs about towns or villages of the Warmian-Masurian Voiv. contain the same stock phrase:
 * "While traditionally Prussian, with the Second Peace of Thorn in 1466 the area became part of the Kingdom of Poland until 1772; 1772-1945 Kingdom of Prussia and Germany (East Prussia)."
 * "Prussian" is pipe-linked to Prussia (region). A list of articles containing this phrase may be easily found in Google. It was added to all of them in early 2013 by User:Der Eberswalder with the comment "additional historical info". — Kpalion(talk) 14:19, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

It should be replaced with "The area lies within the historical region of Prussia." I didn't look into the articles in question, but what belonged to what and when must be traced on case-by case basis. E.g. if some populated place did not exist in 1466 (Mikołajewo, Warmian-Masurian Voivodeship??), the Second Peace of Thorn is hardly relevant. Staszek Lem (talk) 22:58, 5 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Agreed, it would be a less ambiguous phrase. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 12:48, 8 January 2015 (UTC)

House drafts at WP:AFC
Wikibenchris has written multiple drafts on houses in Bydgoszcz, such as: There are more drafts not yet submitted for review. They're beautifully illustrated, but the sources I could identify were mere phone books. It appears the goal is to go through a street of Bydgoszcz and create articles for almost every single house; compare pl:Kategoria:Ulica Gdańska w Bydgoszczy. I rather doubt many of them meet the English Wikipedia's standards of notability, but attention from someone able to read Polish may help. Thanks in advance, Huon (talk) 19:29, 6 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Draft:Tenement at Krasiński street 2, Bydgoszcz
 * Draft:George Sikorski Tenement in Bydgoszcz
 * Draft:Tenement at Gdanska street 33, Bydgoszcz
 * Draft:Julius Grey house in Bydgoszcz
 * Heinrich Seeling is notable. Xx234 (talk) 07:15, 7 January 2015 (UTC)
 * User:Huon, than you for bringing this here; it was on my to-do list. I think most, if not all, of his drafts should be accepted, and he should be encouraged to create new articles directly in mainspace. I think references such as are sufficient. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here  12:51, 8 January 2015 (UTC)

Gumkowski
Janusz Gumkowski is frequently quoted as Gumkowkski. Xx234 (talk) 11:34, 10 January 2015 (UTC)
 * I have corrected this error, please don't restore it.Xx234 (talk) 12:37, 10 January 2015 (UTC)

Marian Rejewski FAR
I have nominated Marian Rejewski for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Sandy Georgia (Talk) 10:37, 12 January 2015 (UTC)

Człowiek który się kulom nie kłaniał
"The man who didn't bow to bullets" ? Xx234 (talk) 13:24, 13 January 2015 (UTC)


 * I'm puzzled. – What is it? The above quote comes from a book about Karol Świerczewski, see Poeticbent talk  15:34, 13 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Janina Broniewska: O człowieku, który się kulom nie kłaniał. Wyd. Książka: Warszawa 1948 "About the man who didn't bow to bullets" ?Xx234 (talk) 07:33, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

WikiProject X is live!


Hello everyone!

You may have received a message from me earlier asking you to comment on my WikiProject X proposal. The good news is that WikiProject X is now live! In our first phase, we are focusing on research. At this time, we are looking for people to share their experiences with WikiProjects: good, bad, or neutral. We are also looking for WikiProjects that may be interested in trying out new tools and layouts that will make participating easier and projects easier to maintain. If you or your WikiProject are interested, check us out! Note that this is an opt-in program; no WikiProject will be required to change anything against its wishes. Please let me know if you have any questions. Thank you!

Note: To receive additional notifications about WikiProject X on this talk page, please add this page to WikiProject X/Newsletter. Otherwise, this will be the last notification sent about WikiProject X.

Harej (talk) 16:56, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

Wenceslaus III of Bohemia
I would be really grateful for any further (properly referenced) information on the early life and the rule in Poland of this young Central European monarch. Thank you for your assistance in advance. Borsoka (talk) 04:23, 23 January 2015 (UTC)

Poles in the Russian Army in Bulgaria
Talk:Russo-Turkish War (1877–78)Xx234 (talk) 07:19, 4 February 2015 (UTC)

Cities vs. towns
Even if there is no legal difference - Warsaw is a city and Pacanów is a town, aren't they? I have seen somewhere the idea that cities are city counties (Powiat). I'm not sure if a statement Pacanów is a city helps to understand. Xx234 (talk) 07:23, 20 January 2015 (UTC)

re: When is a Town a City?

Dear All,

The answer to "when is a town a city?" is currently simple. Answer: when it has its own cathedral church. In the future, if religion continues to decline, then there may be conurbations without such buildings which will nevertheless be referred to as cities. In history, before christendom, large urban settlements, like Troy for instance, are referred to as "cities". I hope this helps. --Po Kadzieli (talk) 22:04, 2 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Interesting, but would you have any reference for that? And while it can be true for Poland, please keep in mind such an operationalization is useless for non-Christian cultural regions. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 12:46, 3 February 2015 (UTC)


 * I'm afraid I disagree with User:Po Kadzieli. Today, seeing as new cathedral's aren't really being built any more this town/city divide is blurred even in the UK. Newcastle is a city by the Queen's decision, despite not having a cathedral. Milton Keynes is a self-declared city and is commonly considered one, despite it not having an official city status (despite applying several times). Guildford and Blackburn have cathedrals but are still towns, but the local football team is called Guildford City FC, whereas Blackburn has always been referred to and is seen as a town. Rochester officially lost its city status, Perth, Scotland lost in its city status and then recently regained it again. Of course these are all UK-based policies and definitions with no meaningful application to the wider world. I would agree that Pacanów is a town, and Warsaw is a city. I would say Gniezno is a city, and Jarocin is a town. Is Bytom a city or a town though? I'm not sure.


 * City status in the United Kingdom & City - these two articles might (or not) help.Abcmaxx (talk) 22:34, 9 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Bytom is a part of Katowice urban area.Xx234 (talk) 07:39, 10 February 2015 (UTC)

Dear Prokonsul and Xx, I have no reference other than being a UK citizen since birth and life-long listener to the BBC, known fondly as "auntie". All I am offering you is a rule of thumb. That means it is approximate and obviously does not prevent Xx rolling out his/her vast and detailed knowledge of exceptions which prove the rule. I learned something today, that MK considers itself a "city" according to one source. Xx, do you have references? Please carry on and don't mind me. --Po Kadzieli (talk) 11:29, 10 February 2015 (UTC)


 * @Po Kadzieli I'm pretty sure it's referenced on somewhere on the Milton Keynes article page. There tons of signs all around the city calling it so and in so many years of my affiliation with the place I have never ever heard MK be referred to as a town. The city is growing at an exceptional rate it is pretty much an amalgamation of smaller towns and villages (Bletchley, Stony Stratford, Wolverton, Shenley Church End etc. etc.), being a fusion of several towns in itself makes it hard to call it a town.
 * @Xx234 I realise that but Bytom is still a separate entity, I'm not sure what bearing does that have on its city/town status? Abcmaxx (talk) 19:40, 10 February 2015 (UTC)

Category discussion People from Congress Poland
See: Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2015_February_19. Thanks for joining the discussion. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:29, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

Polish sources for the The Japanese School in Warsaw?
Does anyone know if any Polish newspapers wrote about the The Japanese School in Warsaw? I know there is a Japanese academic article about the school but I'm checking to see if there are any sources from the Poland side. WhisperToMe (talk) 22:57, 20 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Not seeing any RS (heck, any sources) searching for the school's polish name in first 30 Google's and 10's Google's Books results. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 15:05, 24 February 2015 (UTC)

Edward Ochab
Edward Ochab is obviously no longer a Stub. What level should it be changed to and by whom? Orczar (talk) 12:57, 5 February 2015 (UTC)

Was Ochab a political prisoner? Communists were involed in terror and espionage, annexation of Poland (originally also by Germany). At that time the Soviets exterminated more than 100 000 of ethnic Poles. Ochab was twice convicted - for what, a political activity?Xx234 (talk) 08:24, 6 February 2015 (UTC)
 * C-class until it passes either ours or WP:BIO B-class assessment after a review request. You can also nominate it for WP:GAN which may be faster; nobody but me does B-class reviews here, and BIO is backlogged for months (more or less just as GAN is). --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 15:08, 24 February 2015 (UTC)

Ochab was a political prisoner under the repressive Sanation regime, which picked on a number of groups including the communists. That was before the war when the communists were not involved in any annexations or exterminations in Poland, they were a leftist opposition to the abusive regime. Ochab, Gomułka and others spent time in prison because of their beliefs and brave actions. Now, under the state-sponsored right wing propaganda, they're demonized again. The left, including the communists, fought for social justice in the completely backward by European standards Sanation Poland, now mindlessly glorified. Ideological disagreements are not proper issues for this discussion though, I was just concerned with classification of a biographical article. Orczar (talk) 14:05, 6 February 2015 (UTC)


 * 1) The Communists invided Poland in 1920 murdering and robbing.
 * 2) The Communists murdered many people in Eastern Poland which was the reason to create Border Protection Corps.
 * pl:Henryk Rutkowski, pl:Władysław Hibner, pl:Władysław Kniewski murdered several people in 1925.
 * 1) The Soviets murdered more than 100 000 ethnic Poles (including Polish Communists) in the SU before the war.
 * 2) Polish Communists survived in the terrible Sanacja prisons. Those lucky to live in the Soviet Union died there.
 * 3) European standards in 1935 between Nazi Germany and Soviet Union. You must be joking.
 * 4) The Communist weren't left, they were Soviet, they murdered and imprisoned many Polish Socialists after the war. Before the war they were routinely describing the PPS as fascist
 * 5) Gomulka was in some way independent so he was imprisoned in Communist Poland (It didn't help him to understand the system, Po prostu was closed down and its defenders brutally pacified in October 1957, just one year after Gomułka's rise to power - edit by Orczar).Xx234 (talk) 08:24, 9 February 2015 (UTC)

Is the Silesian Metropolis a Metroplex?
The statement (in Metroplex) is unsourced.Xx234 (talk) 12:09, 17 March 2015 (UTC)
 * It's an association, with political and economic aims, furthermore not all cities/town in the conurbation are members; in fact I'd slightly alter the page heading as it used to be called Silesian Metropolitan Association and remains an association rather than an urban area. Similarly Upper Silesian Industrial Region wouldn't qualify as it is an industrial term, similar to the English M4 Corridor.The Katowice urban area would qualify as a metroplex though.Abcmaxx (talk) 14:10, 18 March 2015 (UTC)
 * So, sadly, is most of Wikipedia. Is it controversial? --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 02:00, 20 March 2015 (UTC)
 * As far as I understand you can't have both, so yes, controversial. Xx236 (talk) 07:02, 23 March 2015 (UTC)

Vinzent Porombka
I've been working on translating an entry on Vinzent Porombka from German Wikipedia (and using one or two German language sources accessed with search engine) to English wikipedia. Some of the most eventful years of his life took place in Upper Silesia, then part of Germany. I notice that there appear to be some good sources on the fellow in Polish which, sadly for me, is a language which I understand much too little. I know that where History is concerned there is a massive concentration on the Second World War in the Anglosphere, which is fully reflected in English language Wikipedia. I think it's an over-concentration.

BUT, it was a very important period and is a very important part in what Europe has become subsequently. So .... if anyone reading this is interested in aspects of this stuff, and has access to Polish language sources, and the time available ... and if you are thereby motivated, you might be able to add usefully to the existing entries on Porombka (in English and/or in German) and indeed, maybe, to add to it using Polish language sources. The fellow might even "deserve" an entry in the Polish language but that, alas, is a consideration way beyond my own scope/grade.

Thank you (if you did) for thinking about it. Regards Charles01 (talk) 09:45, 28 March 2015 (UTC)
 * I am not really seeing many Polish sources. Some mentions in passing, a self-biographical chapter in memoir book (Porombka Vinzet, Burzliwe losy górnośląskiego komunisty. W: Wspom. op. kom. s. 161—177), an article by him in a communist magazine... He doesn't have an article on pl wiki. Can you link to any particular source you see? --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here  03:14, 31 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Two of the three books I listed under "further reading" near the end of the entry are in Polish. If I simply copy 'n paste chunks of their titles to Google, I certainly get results....   But the results are in Polish and I am not able to think in Polish, so I do not know whether any of those "google hits" is likely to lead to an online source. It might be that one would have to depend on people able to access printed books, which of course reduces the short-term possibilities for people not living in a library in Poland.   In the medium and longer term .... I guess nothing is impossible.   ?.
 * I agree it would be easier to track down more Polish language sources in the course of setting up (and building on) a Polish language translation from the German language entry and the sources referenced both in that and in some of my English language translation of it.  But to find someone with the necessary time and interest to start a Polish language entry on the guy .... well, this seemed like one place to see whether (or not) that person exists!   Regards Charles01 (talk) 06:38, 31 March 2015 (UTC)

How to oppose Grover Furr?
Grover Furr has proved that the Katyn crime was committed by Germans http://msuweb.montclair.edu/~furrg/research/furr_katyn_preprint_0813.pdf. I have removed the link from Katyn massacre but it can return. The Russians understand his ignorance ''В свободное время увлекается вопросами советской истории и политики. '' (His free time hobbies are Soviet history and politics).Xx236 (talk) 11:32, 30 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Neither Wikipedia, not this project, is in the business of opposing any academics. I do agree his self-published paper is not a reliable source, and support your removal. It was added to the KM article only once, so I don't see this as much of a problem. If it is readded, please start a discussion at Talk:Katyn massacre and ping us here. Criticism of his views, properly sourced and keeping WP:UNDUE in mind, can be included in Grover Furr. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 03:09, 31 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Furr is a historian of old English literature and a fringe expert in Polish history Did the Soviet Union Invade Poland in September 1939? NO!. If an academician believes that the Earth is flat it's not an academic opinion. Xx236 (talk) 07:06, 31 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Furr knows everything about Poland: Grover Furr. BLOOD LIES: The Evidence that Every Accusation against Joseph Stalin and the Soviet Union in Timothy Snyder’s Bloodlands Is False. Plus: What Really Happened in: the Famine of 1932-33; the “Polish Operation”; the “Great Terror”; the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact; the “Soviet invasion of Poland”; the“Katyn Massacre”; the Warsaw Uprising; and “Stalin’s Anti-Semitism”. New York: Red Star Publishers, 2014 Xx236 (talk) 11:06, 31 March 2015 (UTC)
 * The guy is not a historian nor is his historical work published by any remotely reliable historical source. It doesn't belong in wikipedia.  Any more than something self-published by, say, an English professor "debunking" evolution does.Faustian (talk) 11:55, 31 March 2015 (UTC)

Halina Poświatowska's goin' to FA!!
https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:WikiProject_Poland/Reviews&diff=654625029&oldid=633609599 Peas. --Mareklug talk 12:04, 2 April 2015 (UTC)
 * No it's not (see talk page). This is start/C class. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 06:39, 14 April 2015 (UTC)

Polish Austro-Hungarians
See discussion at Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2015_April_12. Marcocapelle (talk) 06:07, 14 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Thanks; wasn't on our article alerts due to insufficent tags (fixed). --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 06:41, 14 April 2015 (UTC)

Mauthausen-Gusen concentration camp FAR
I have nominated Mauthausen-Gusen concentration camp for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Sandy Georgia (Talk) 22:08, 14 April 2015 (UTC)

Let's get Irena Sendler to Good Article!
Irena Sendler is one of Poland's most popular articles (listed as 79 in the current WikiProject_Poland/Popular_pages). She was only a start-class article; I've improved her and I think she is ready for a B-class reassessment. I'd appreciate proofreading and copyediting before a Good Article nomination. Can anyone help? --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 07:36, 27 April 2015 (UTC)

Presidents of Poland
The early presidents of Poland have been removed from the article President of Poland. See Talk:President of Poland for a discussion. --Bejnar (talk) 19:13, 28 April 2015 (UTC)

Template:Monarchs of Poland changes
Somebody want to verify the changes made to Monarchs of Poland by new editor. --Bamyers99 (talk) 20:21, 29 April 2015 (UTC)

Otton Steinborn
Hello, surfing through some articles I came across Otton Steinborn, which looks like a very interesting Polish biography. However, I don't speak Polish, so am notifying here incase someone in this project is interested in this topic. Cleanup of redundant and slightly NPOV information, a better Polish -> English translation and more sources would be very useful for this article. I searched for additional sources in the Internet and already added a Polish-language link as external link (disclaimer: I do not know, if the article's text has been translated from this site by the contributing IP editor or if the site is reliable to begin with). GermanJoe (talk) 21:22, 30 April 2015 (UTC)

Talk:Lech Wałęsa
what is this meant to be? In ictu oculi (talk) 22:53, 8 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Editor is insisting on adding what looks like a mispronunciation as a pronunciation. In ictu oculi (talk) 01:06, 9 May 2015 (UTC)
 * I see several past attempts as well by more than 1 editor. But I don't see any discussion to not follow normal BLP practice and have what the article used to have Lech Wałęsa (IPA:About this sound [ˈlɛx vaˈwɛ̃sa] (help·info); born September 29, 1943). Do we really need "English pronunciation variants" for Polish bios? In ictu oculi (talk) 01:15, 9 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Yes, we do. "When a foreign name has a set English pronunciation (or pronunciations), include both the English and foreign-language pronunciations; the English transcription must always be first. If the native name is different from the English name, the native transcription must appear after the native name." (Manual of Style/Pronunciation ) But it would be good to cite a source (like this one). — Kpalion(talk) 07:35, 9 May 2015 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:Infobox PL constituency
Template:Infobox PL constituency has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. Ajh1492 (talk) 21:13, 18 May 2015 (UTC)

I don't think it should be deleted. Ajh1492 (talk) 21:13, 18 May 2015 (UTC)

2015 Knurów riots
Hello, I made a page about the recent murder of the Concordia fan at a football match and the subsequent 2015 Knurów riots, if anyone would like to expand the article please I would more than welcome it.Abcmaxx (talk) 18:59, 7 May 2015 (UTC)
 * murder? Xx236 (talk) 07:08, 18 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Yes, it's quite disconcerting to see such obvious POV-pushing even in talk pages (note: the word "murder" was never used in the article in question, which doesn't mean it doesn't suffer from POV issues). — Kpalion(talk) 14:19, 18 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Well an unarmed man was shot in the head and killed, and that is the definition of murder, unless proven that the man holding the rifle did not intend to kill and has done so accidentally, in which case it is manslaughter. Abcmaxx (talk) 18:10, 18 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Another Wikipedia POV nightmare. Please remember to mention in the blurb, what is being made crystal clear in the Polish media reports, that the police were shooting only rubber bullets ... maybe a dozen in total, using riot guns. Selection of reports is available at YouTube. <b style="font-family:Papyrus; color:darkblue;">Poeticbent</b> <span style="font-size:7.0pt;color:#FFFFFF;font-weight:bold;background:#FF88AF;border:1px solid #DF2929;padding:0.0em 0.2em;">talk 19:15, 18 May 2015 (UTC)
 * . – The clip shows a man right after he was shot by the rubber bullet. He wears a white hoodie and jeans, and walks back with another guy, blood stain on his chest at 1:18 - 1:26. The next take, at 1:28 shows him already lying on the field. He lost consciousness. At 2:23 - 2:50 we can see police medic trying to resuscitate him, unsuccessfully. <b style="font-family:Papyrus; color:darkblue;">Poeticbent</b> <span style="font-size:7.0pt;color:#FFFFFF;font-weight:bold;background:#FF88AF;border:1px solid #DF2929;padding:0.0em 0.2em;">talk 20:05, 18 May 2015 (UTC)
 * A masked man was running towards and tossing things at a row of armed riot police. To anybody with a bit of common sense, that's the definition of suicide by cop. — Kpalion(talk) 20:59, 18 May 2015 (UTC)
 * And you accused me of being POV!! Pitch invasion now = suicide by cop?! What next, unpaid parking ticket = reckless driving? I cannot see anything being thrown by the man that got shot, I saw in total 1 object thrown and that wasn't even at the police. To anybody with common sense that is police interfering with unreasonable force in an internal disagreement between 2 groups of fans. Abcmaxx (talk) 21:48, 18 May 2015 (UTC)

Wikipedia:In the news/Candidates#Polish presidential election, 2015
In the news/Candidates.

Can someone update Andrzej Duda from pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrzej_Duda

Thanks. -- Aronzak (talk) 04:56, 25 May 2015 (UTC)

Significance of John III Sobieski
I've finished expanding the article from PSB. It could use a copyedit, and I think the significance section can be expanded. --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 01:37, 16 June 2015 (UTC)

Thousands of Polish images may be deleted from Commons
Please see discussion at Village_pump_(miscellaneous). I think it is an item of major interest to the editors interested in this WikiProject. The (very underestimated) counts for how many images may be affected have been posted to commons:Commons_talk:Freedom_of_Panorama_2015. --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 01:00, 24 June 2015 (UTC)

Warsaw Water Filters Page
Hi everyone, was reading the mentioned page, under "Modernization" paragraph 3 is the following line. "After implementing the station, water from a pumping station was pressed into expansion weasels, then to rapid filters and slow filters." I'm thinking weasels may not be the correct word here, but I am not sure whether the replacement is "tanks" or something else, so leaving it to you... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 116.212.226.234 (talk) 08:30, 24 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Funny typo, well spotted! Obviously they meant Expansion vessels. Fixed Alex Bakharev (talk) 08:45, 24 June 2015 (UTC)

Bot was requested to tag pages related to this WikiProject
Please read Village_pump_(technical). Piotrus requested that Yobot adds banners of WikiProject Poland to pages that already have the milhist-Poland taskforce template. Any comments are welcome. IF there are no disagreements the bot will start the task in the next few days. -- Magioladitis (talk) 14:10, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Just for your information: Piotrus is a member of WikiProject Poland. -- Magioladitis (talk) 14:12, 1 July 2015 (UTC)
 * No objection. — Kpalion(talk) 15:56, 1 July 2015 (UTC)

Copyright Violation Detection - EranBot Project
A new copy-paste detection bot is now in general use on English Wikipedia. Come check it out at the EranBot reporting page. This bot utilizes the Turnitin software (ithenticate), unlike User:CorenSearchBot that relies on a web search API from Yahoo. It checks individual edits rather than just new articles. Please take 15 seconds to visit the EranBot reporting page and check a few of the flagged concerns. Comments welcome regarding potential improvements. These likely copyright violations can be searched by WikiProject categories. Use "control-f" to jump to your area of interest (if such a copyvio is present).--Lucas559 (talk) 15:48, 2 July 2015 (UTC)

Pierogi proposed merger
See Talk:Pierogi for a discussion on merging Varenyky into the article. μηδείς (talk) 20:11, 12 July 2015 (UTC)

Issue in the page
The subject content in the page is very less from the reader's perspective. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Biswa1991 (talk • contribs) 08:45, 21 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Errr, what? Try again, this reads as, in Polish, "belkot". --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 08:14, 13 July 2015 (UTC)

User:Silver seren/Ukrainian People's Militia
The article is about history of Poland. It was removed in 2010 after two votes. I'm for restoring it, maybe afer corrections.Xx236 (talk) 08:21, 10 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Where were the votes/discussion? --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 08:12, 13 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Articles for deletion/Ukrainian People's Militia (2nd nomination)Xx236 (talk) 12:37, 13 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Articles for deletion/Ukrainian People's MilitiaXx236 (talk) 12:39, 13 July 2015 (UTC)

There are three sources available online of the Polish article:
 * https://www.academia.edu/1314919/The_Lviv_Pogrom_of_1941_The_Germans_Ukrainian_Nationalists_and_the_Carnival_Crowd
 * http://www.uamoderna.com/md/199
 * https://www.academia.edu/1439240/Rites_of_Violence_The_Pogroms_of_Summer_1941 Xx236 (talk) 12:42, 13 July 2015 (UTC)

Thanks for bringing it to our attention. The article needs to be expanded and reposted. The formation, created in June 1941, preceded the official founding of the Ukrainian Auxiliary Police by Heinrich Himmler in mid-August 1941. Without this article, there's a gaping hole in the landscape of the Holocaust in occupied Poland. I would have never guessed the article was actually written once already, AfD twice, and deleted. Here's a reliable source. <b style="font-family:Papyrus; color:darkblue;">Poeticbent</b> <span style="font-size:7.0pt;color:#FFFFFF;font-weight:bold;background:#FF88AF;border:1px solid #DF2929;padding:0.0em 0.2em;">talk 23:49, 13 July 2015 (UTC)

Sour cucumber
Polish style pickled cucumber links to Pickled cucumber which describes both vinegar and without vinegar cucumbers, which are completely different to me Ogórek konserwowy. Both types of cucumbers are popular in Germany, where their names are fuzzy.Xx236 (talk) 08:39, 15 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Instead of creating a new article, it would be better to rewrite Pickled cucumber, so that it clearly describes the similarities and differences between vinegar and brine-cured cucumbers, as well as their culinary uses and geographic ranges. Please bear in mind that brine-cured cucumbers are not confined to Polish or even to Slavic cuisines. — Kpalion(talk) 09:20, 15 July 2015 (UTC)
 * The basic difference is Pasteurization/Fermentation.Xx236 (talk) 09:34, 15 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Yes, or more precisely: direct acidification with vinegar (usually together with pasteurization, but this is a relatively modern practice) vs. lactic fermentation (in brine). In the former process the pickles (cucumbers or other vegetables) get their sour taste from the acetic acid contained in the vinegar; in the latter, from the lactic acid produced through fermentation. Combinations of these two methods may be used as well (for example, cucumbers may be fermented in brine and then further preserved in a vinegar solution). (see also Handbook of Plant-Based Fermented Food and Beverage Technology) — Kpalion(talk) 11:20, 15 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Fermented food may be regarded as spoiled. Xx236 (talk) 11:38, 15 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Well, yes, wine may be regarded as spoiled grape juice. It probably depends on one's point of view. On a more serious note, the problem of spoilage in pickles and methods of its prevention (especially in mass-produced pickles) should be addressed in the article as well. — Kpalion(talk) 12:32, 15 July 2015 (UTC)

Should battle/massacre at Batoh be mentioned in the article on Khmelnytsky?
Please see the discussion at Talk:Bohdan_Khmelnytsky. --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 06:26, 19 July 2015 (UTC)

Bierut Decrees
The article presents German nationalitic POV.Xx236 (talk) 08:49, 29 July 2015 (UTC)

Bereza Kartuska prison
The article has been rewritten to concentration camp without new references or discussion. I have restored the former version. I believe that the Nazi crimes changed the meaning of the notion "concentration camp" and German Wikipedia supports me. It seems however that English language still assumes that any internment is equal.Xx236 (talk) 09:05, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
 * English language assumes no such thing. There are internment camps, concentration camps, death camps, forced labor camps, etc. In particular, wikipedia draws clear distinction between them, unless sloppy writing pops up here and there. Staszek Lem (talk) 19:14, 12 August 2015 (UTC)
 * Concentration camps is a redirect.Xx236 (talk) 06:02, 13 August 2015 (UTC)

Wiki Loves Pride
<div style="padding:3em; font-family:'Helvetica Neue',sans-serif; font-size:110%; line-height:1.75;"> You are invited to participate in Wiki Loves Pride!


 * What? Wiki Loves Pride, a campaign to document and photograph LGBT culture and history, including pride events
 * When? June 2015
 * How can you help?
 * 1.) Create or improve LGBT-related articles and showcase the results of your work here
 * 2.) Upload photographs or other media related to LGBT culture and history, including pride events, and add images to relevant Wikipedia articles; feel free to create a subpage with a gallery of your images (see examples from last year)
 * 3.) Contribute to an LGBT-related task force at another Wikimedia project (Wikidata, Wikimedia Commons, Wikivoyage, etc.)

Or, view or update the current list of Tasks. This campaign is supported by the Wikimedia LGBT+ User Group, an officially recognized affiliate of the Wikimedia Foundation. Visit the group's page at Meta-Wiki for more information, or follow Wikimedia LGBT+ on Facebook. Remember, Wiki Loves Pride is about creating and improving LGBT-related content at Wikimedia projects, and content should have a neutral point of view. One does not need to identify as LGBT or any other gender or sexual minority to participate. This campaign is about adding accurate, reliable information to Wikipedia, plain and simple, and all are welcome!

If you have any questions, please leave a message on the campaign's main talk page.

Thanks, and happy editing!

User:Another Believer and User:OR drohowa

Jan Nepomucen de Bobrowicz ??

 * This Polish composer appears in the French, German and Polish Wikipedias and in Polski słownik biograficzny as "Jan Nepomucen Bobrowicz"—not "de Bobrowicz".
 * Shouldn't the gratuitous, recently added nobiliary particle "de" be deleted from the English-language Wikipedia article?
 * Please see discussion on the article's talk page, here.
 * Nihil novi (talk) 19:31, 15 August 2015 (UTC)

Western betrayal

 * The article doesn't cover the Polish–Soviet War including the beginnings of the Curzon line.

http://www.wydawnictwoliterackie.pl/ksiazka/3480/Pierwsza-zdrada-Zachodu---Andrzej-Nowak Xx236 (talk) 09:20, 17 August 2015 (UTC)
 * neither it includes Partitions of Poland. Please explain how Polish victory is 'zdrada zachodu'. And how a popular science book with sensationalist statements is a reliable source for wikipedia. Staszek Lem (talk) 21:58, 17 August 2015 (UTC)
 * The Polish victory wasn't supported by Great Britain and Western left.
 * What is your source about sensationalist statements?
 * Does the Wikipedia allow academic sources only?
 * The subject is known, the book summarizes the facts. Xx236 (talk) 05:39, 18 August 2015 (UTC)
 * A serious opinion http://histmag.org/Andrzej-Nowak-Pierwsza-zdrada-Zachodu.-1920-recenzja-11397 "jest w moim przekonaniu dziełem wybitnym".Xx236 (talk) 06:57, 18 August 2015 (UTC)

AfC submission
See Draft:Marcin Przybyłek. Thank you, FoCuS contribs ;  talk to me!  16:05, 11 August 2015 (UTC)
 * Borderline. He does write books, published by reliable booksellers, but nobody has written about him outside publisher/event blurbs. I don't think he passes WP:AUTHOR yet, through some of his books have reviews, so with an inclusinist mindset we could stretch it to say he passes... --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 05:42, 17 August 2015 (UTC)


 * I might approve if nobody opposes this. It'd be nice to see other opinions. Let me know; thanks, FoCuS contribs ;  talk to me!  17:46, 17 August 2015 (UTC)
 * I've been working with the author of this article to find some good sources. It's hard because it's both Polish and somewhat underground. Have another look - I think it's getting there and I'm hoping the author will hook up with WikiProject_Video_games/Sources to both get and give info on RS for that genre. LaMona (talk) 19:41, 19 August 2015 (UTC)
 * Can nobody here help with that? FoCuS contribs ;  talk to me!  17:43, 21 August 2015 (UTC)

RfC: Jadwiga of Poland
All comments would be appreciated here. Thank you for your time. Borsoka (talk) 22:05, 25 August 2015 (UTC)

Help with a source translation?
Hey, just a question: is this written in Polish? It looks like it is, but I'll admit that I'm not entirely familiar with the writing. I need someone to give me a general gist of what is in this source since another editor is trying to use it to claim that Judo do has been an Olympic sport since 1964. I don't see this specific date in the section about the sport and I'm also not sure how much it's actually mentioned in relation to Judo as a whole. I'm not sure if the user supplying the source is fluent in Polish or not. I'll ask and if they are, then I'd appreciate someone coming in to help provide guidance in Polish since the user is not completely fluent in English and could better benefit from interacting with someone who speaks their language. I don't want to mention their name until I confirm this, though. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡)  09:41, 2 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Yes, the source is in Polish. The part of the article you've linked to makes a distinction between martial arts (focused on philosophy and ritual) and martial sports (focused on competition). It then says that Coubertin's "neo-Olympic" idea has transformed judo into a competitive spectator sport. Further, it introduces judo-do, meant to be an "extension" of judo, focused on "psycho-physical self-perfection", with an emphasis on ethics and co-operation rather than rivalry. It doesn't say anything about judo-do being an Olympic sport. Please let me know, if you need any more help. — Kpalion(talk) 12:04, 2 September 2015 (UTC)


 * Thanks!! That really helps out a lot! I haven't heard back from the editor, so I'm still not sure if they're a native speaker of Polish or not. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡)  13:13, 2 September 2015 (UTC)

Soviet deportations 1939-1941

 * I have been looking for articles about the deportations. June deportation completely ignores Poland and Poles.Xx236 (talk) 06:54, 25 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Soviet repressions of Polish citizens (1939–46), SybirakXx236 (talk) 06:59, 25 September 2015 (UTC)

Can this person be described as a Polish soldier?
Today's FA, a Polish (?) soldier-cannibal trivia story. Comments appreciated at Talk:Charles Domery. --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 08:38, 12 October 2015 (UTC)

House of Foo vs Foo family
We should standardize Category:Polish noble families. Any preferences? --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 09:11, 3 November 2015 (UTC)
 * I'd say "Foo family" for all except royal dynasties. — Kpalion(talk) 21:15, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

Article about Adrian Zandberg in Polish language Wikipedia
This continuous removal of an article about Adrian Zandberg in Polish language from Wikipedia is now a farce. After all, no one removes from the Wikipedia articles about Adrian Zandberg written in English or German. There is no other explanation than political censorship, as in the communist regime – many people in Poland clearly want Adrian Zandberg to be a “nonperson” or “unperson” - exactly as in Orwell's “Nineteen Eighty-Four”. After all, in editing Wikipedia, one can not be guided by personal sympathies or antipathies - neither in respect to persons, nor in relation to organizations or in relation to world-views. My only hope is thus in Wikipedia in other major languages, especially in English. Anyway, the high level of political censorship in Polish language Wikipedia is now such a problem, that it requires attention from the founders of this Encyclopedia, as otherwise the quality of the whole project will suffer.

lech.keller(at)gmail.com — Preceding unsigned comment added by 37.28.203.82 (talk) 19:13, 7 November 2015 (UTC)


 * Nonsense. Article Adrian Zandberg (in Polish Wikipedia) is alive and well/kicking.  Poeticbent  <span style="color:#FFFFFF;font-size:7.0pt;font-weight:bold;background:#FF88AF;border:1px solid #DF2929;padding:0.0em 0.2em;">talk 19:43, 7 November 2015 (UTC)

User:Belissarius, RIP
It is with great sadness that I bring (a bit late) news that User:Belissarius, an active editor on pl and en wikis and a member of this project, has passed away few days ago. He was a notable Wikipedian, too: Piotr Domaradzki. RIP. Anyone wishing to send his condolences or such is welcome to do so at pl:Wikipedysta:Belissarius/(Ostatnie) podziękowania. --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 01:17, 10 November 2015 (UTC)

Polish school in Paris: Does it serve high school students?
I am thinking about making an English article on the pl:Szkoła Narodowa Polska w Paryżu. I don't know Polish, so on the website http://www.paryz.orpeg.pl/ I would like for somebody to check if the school has senior high school/sixth form classes.

Thank you! WhisperToMe (talk) 01:29, 29 October 2015 (UTC)
 * Based on it seems to include a full high school (i.e. up to Lyceum). --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here  09:13, 3 November 2015 (UTC)
 * Thank you so much! I started Szkoła Narodowa Polska w Paryżu. Do you know if there are any other Polish international schools around the world? If so I would like to start a template grouping them, using the Polish Education Ministry and/or Ministry of Foreign Affairs lists of Polish schools worldwide as sources. WhisperToMe (talk) 10:41, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

Is it okay if someone checks if the Paris Polish school has "all days of the week" educational programs or if it only has Saturday/Wednesday classes? I want to see if this is a full day school or if it is only a weekend school. WhisperToMe (talk) 10:32, 4 November 2015 (UTC)
 * Their lesson plan link is broken, but I'd be surprised it if was a weekend only. To be classified as a school of that type, I think it has to have regular M-F lessons and such. --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 01:27, 10 November 2015 (UTC)
 * have you checked to see if the lesson plan links work on the Wayback Machine at http://web.archive.org ? WhisperToMe (talk) 02:42, 10 November 2015 (UTC)
 * It links to non-archived doc files :( --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here  02:58, 10 November 2015 (UTC)

I just found a Polish NGO listing Polish schools abroad:. Also, according to the Polish Ministry of Education page on this Polish schools abroad are under the care of this organization. It has its own list, through most of the materials are in Polish.
 * Do you know if the list has just full time schools, or part time schools as well? I would like to make a template for full-time Polish schools (with Paris being one of them) similar to ones like Template:Japanese schools in Europe. WhisperToMe (talk) 07:02, 10 November 2015 (UTC)
 * Unfortunately this is not clear from the page, and it is likely the list contains both. I also couldn't find any useful info (category, etc.) on pl wiki. --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 03:51, 11 November 2015 (UTC)
 * Thank you for your help! I may open a discussion about this at PLWiki's talk pages WhisperToMe (talk) 03:55, 11 November 2015 (UTC)

Seagoing cowboys
Perhaps somoene helps: http://trojmiasto.wyborcza.pl/trojmiasto/1,35636,19177850,niezwykla-historia-morskiego-kowboja-wrocil-do-gdanska-po.html?_ga=1.189111337.307008464800617150.1294645136 Xx236 (talk) 07:26, 13 November 2015 (UTC)
 * WP:SOFIXIT: why don't you add this reference to the article, for a start? --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 07:27, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Radwańska to Radwanska RM
Guess what; WP:TENNISNAMES again : Talk:Agnieszka Radwańska → Agnieszka Radwanska hey ho hey ho. In ictu oculi (talk) 10:36, 23 November 2015 (UTC)
 * Oh, see also current RMs at Talk:Ana Ivanovic and Talk:Marin Čilić for background In ictu oculi (talk) 10:38, 23 November 2015 (UTC)


 * Note - an editor requested that all of these three been considered together and closed together, a further issue of of MOS:IDENTITY has been raised about one of the RMs. In ictu oculi (talk) 15:30, 28 November 2015 (UTC)

Polish Communist Party Historian Jerzy Tomaszewski allegations that the 1931 Census was fixed.
The Polish census of 1931 is reporting conspiracy theories about the census originating from Polish Communist Party Historian Jerzy Tomaszewski. It claims underreporting ethnic minorities, without noting that they are unsupported by statistical evidence from a demographer, or that the census itself did not count minorities, (exactly as in the U.S.). To wit: "After World War II, Apolinary Hartglas reported that Edward Szturm de Sztrem, the pre-war chairman of the Polish census statistical office, admitted that the census returns, particularly those from the south-east, had been altered at the executive level. Another account alleged that he admitted "that officials had been directed to under count minorities, especially those in the eastern provinces"." The first claim is attributed to Apolinary Hartglas, by Joseph Marcus in "Social and Political History of the Jews in Poland, 1919-1939" (1983). Walter de Gruyter. p. 17. ISBN 978-90-279-3239-6, with a web link here: https://books.google.com/books?id=80r6Mbnxf8IC&pg=PA95&lpg=PA95&dq=Edward+Szturm+de+Sztrem+census&source=bl&ots=O_JJJ2M5oC&sig=98RkAiV0uwPcjRJQWe-pLS45zfE&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=6&ct=result#v=onepage&q=Edward%20Szturm%20de%20Sztrem%20census&f=false The exact quote from Apolinary Hartglas for the claim is not given. That book was published in Polish and the only review of it on Amazon makes no mention of any claims about the census returns having been altered: http://www.amazon.com/pograniczu-dwoch-swiatow-Apolinary-Hartglas/dp/8386678356/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1445009279&sr=8-1&keywords=Apolinary+Hartglas The second allegation falsely implies that Poland had attempted to count minorities, since, like the U.S. at the time in the 1930 United States Census, the Poles asked no such ethnicity/nationality question. The source for that is Richard Blanke (1993). Orphans of Versailles: The Germans in Western Poland, 1918-1939. University Press of Kentucky. ISBN 978-0-8131-1803-1, with a web link here: http://books.google.com/books?id=80r6Mbnxf8IC&pg=PA95&lpg=PA95&dq=Edward+Szturm+de+Sztrem+census&source=bl&ots=O_JJJ2M5oC&sig=98RkAiV0uwPcjRJQWe-pLS45zfE&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=6&ct=result The exact source for this allegation is not available from what is provided on line, so it is impossible to verify from what was given. I did check the bibliography (pg. 249) which is visible on line. Blanke does not list 1931 Census of Poland in that, but instead lists the tertiary Institute For The Study Of Minority Problems, "The Polish and Non-Polish Populations Of Poland: 1931 Census Of Poland (1931). From the bibliography, and by reading the census itself where it clearly only surveyed religion and "mother tongue", it is clear that Blanke never read the census itself. Therefore, what he wrote is clearly erroneous, and this work is thus a quadranary source of dubious value or note.

The source for this claim originated from Polish Communist Party Historian Jerzy Tomaszewski, who as editor  published an alleged confession from Edward Szturm de Sztrem, "Prawdziwa statystyka", Kwartalnik Historyczny 3 (1973) pp 664-7 (See Bogusław Kuźniar, "Mniejszość Ukraińska Międzywojennej Małopolski Wschodniej W Okowach Doktryny Dmytra Doncowa" Przegląd Geopolityczny (2014), Vol. 7, pg. 152.) So, the communists published the paper 11 years after the man died. The editor who published it, Tomaszewski, was a member of the Polish Communist Party. Tomaszewski would become the recognized "authority" on interpolating ethnicity from the census's enumeration of mother tongue and religion without taking into account that, in territories lost to the Soviet Union, at least one highly relevant archive had been destroyed in Lwow/Lvov/Lviv deliberately by the Soviets. (Norman Davies, God's Playground, a History of Poland, Columbia University Press, 1982, ISBN 0231053525, p.558.) So in this case, working back to the original source, we have an alleged statement by Edward Szturm de Sztrem (primary source), reported posthumously by Communist Party historian Tomaszewski as editor in "Kwartalnik Historyczny" ("Historical Quarterly"), a communist academic publication, (the secondary source), being reported yet again by other alleged academic publications (tertiary sources or beyond). It may be notable that the communists attempted to discredit Edward Szturm de Sztrem posthumously, but communist era publications did not have a reputation for fact checking and accuracy to be considered RS. They had denied the Polsih-Russian war in 1920, and the Russian invasion of Poland September 17, 2919. No serious person would dispute this.

Although not by burden to prove a negative, (i.e., that the census was not fixed), I think its really about math and statistics. What statistical analysis supports this conclusion? In comparison with the 1921 Census of Poland, (which had enumerated ethnicity) the 1931 did not. It enumerated mother tongue and ethnicity. So [using language as the implied indicator of ethnicity] in 1931 the Poles slightly decreased as a percentage of the population, as did Ukrainiains/Ruthenians, and the Jews [by religion] increased:

group 1921 1931 +/- %

Poles 17.789.287 (69.23%) 21,993,444 (68.91%) -0.32%

Ukrainians 0 (0.00%) 3,221,975 (10.10%) +10.10%

Ruthenians 3.898.428 (15.17%) 1,219,647 (03.82%) -11.35%

U + R = 3.898.428 (15.17%) 4,444,622 (13.92%) -01.25%

Jews 2.048.878 (07.97%) 3,113,933 (09.76%) +01.79%

(See diff here for chart calculating %: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Polish_census_of_1931&oldid=684704520#Results )

So, if we were to believe that the results had been rigged by the Polish Interior Ministry, by the numbers, the results were intended to decrease the number of Poles and Ukrainians/Ruthenians and others by increasing the number of Jews. [Note that I did not subtract the number of Jews by religion who spoke Polish, Ukrainian, or Ruthenian as a declared mother tongue. Had I done so the numbers would have illustrated this point more strongly.] So the implied conspiracy appears to be an anti-semitic smear that the "Interior Ministry" had favored the Jews. Just four years earlier, the communist government had deported most of the Jews that survived WWII.

Claims that a national census was intentionally altered, or under-counted its minority population, when it never asked a nationality/ethnicity question, should be regarded as WP:EXCEPTIONAL. As such this should be supported by a detailed academic study by a qualified demographer using statistical comparison of the population statistically with the previous 1921 Census of Poland, and not just rely on so much gossip and communist era propaganda. [Note that that without the quotes from the primary sources, it is not possible to verify that the secondary source has accurately reported the allegation and is thus RS of the same per WP:VERIFY.]Doctor Franklin (talk) 16:44, 20 October 2015 (UTC)


 * The majority of Polish historians was biased/terrorised/censored. Was Tomaszewski exceptional?Xx236 (talk) 07:34, 13 November 2015 (UTC)
 * Henryk Zieliński was murdered while working on the history of the Soviet invasion in 1939. Tomaszewski is notable because he was a member of the Polish Communist Party, and he shamelessly pushed that agenda, contrary to basic arithmetic and common sense.  He also remained prominent, especially on Jewish issues, until his recent death.  Hopefully a new generation of Polish historians will emerge to address these issues as the old communists retire and die off.  There is a reason that Polish history is now taught using translations of British historian Norman Davies work.  (Yes, he was recently awarded Polish citizenship for his contributions to Poland, but that proves my point:  He was not a native born Pole.)71.225.161.246 (talk) 03:20, 24 November 2015 (UTC)
 * It is worth noting that Dr. Robert Magosci has noted that modern Ukrainian is based on a dialect from Poltava, which is quite far from the borders of the Second Polish Republic. Kate Brown has noted a mixed Polish-Ukrainian dialect in the Kresy region.  It is not at all surprising that some had rejected the recent Ukrainian Poltava dialect as their language.75.137.139.185 (talk) 06:48, 26 December 2015 (UTC)

Oławski Bridge
Oławski Bridge needs attention: it was clearly translated by someone with inadequate English knowledge. Please see Talk:Oławski Bridge. --Thnidu (talk) 04:11, 2 January 2016 (UTC)

AfC submissions
See Draft:House of Spyra and Draft:National School of Public Administration. Thank you, FoCuS contribs ;  talk to me!  22:49, 11 January 2016 (UTC)

RfC: Should Poland be described as existing in "Central and Eastern Europe"?
There are a discussion and vote under way on the "Poland" talk page as to whether Poland should be described as being part of "Central and Eastern Europe'", rather than of "Central Europe" as is now the case. Nihil novi (talk) 11:03, 18 January 2016 (UTC)

Is a child support problem notable?
The subject has been started by tabloids, but recently discussed in a Plus-Minus ("Rzeczpospolita") interview. Xx236 (talk) 14:35, 18 January 2016 (UTC)
 * Do you mean "500 zloties for a child"? --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 11:53, 30 January 2016 (UTC)

Draft:Mariusz Piasecki - are there references in Polish?
Hello, Poland experts. Here's an article about a national champion fencer, but I can't find much about him in English. Can someone check to see if there are some in Polish? &mdash;Anne Delong (talk) 00:03, 30 January 2016 (UTC)
 * Sorry, Anne, a cursory check doesn't show anything else, and I make a point of not spending too much time on sportspeople articles (I think there are too spammy). Isn't there WikiProject Fencing? Huh, I guess not. Could try to ask at WP:SPORT I guess. --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 00:48, 31 January 2016 (UTC)
 * Well, there is, after I've corrected Piotr's typo. — Kpalion(talk) 23:21, 1 February 2016 (UTC)

Talk:Vietnam War
Edit request cites a source in Polish. Help! Thanks, Bazj (talk) 09:50, 3 February 2016 (UTC)
 * Replied there. --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 14:48, 5 February 2016 (UTC)

Reassessment request
Czesław Kiszczak article is rated as a Start-Class article. I have developed it recently. Could you check, whether it fulfills the C-Class criteria now? Thank you.Daniel (talk) 07:43, 13 March 2016 (UTC)
 * ✅ Thank you to Andrew Gugalo for a thorough c/e and reassessment. Daniel (talk) 05:19, 14 March 2016 (UTC)

Your project page is on overflow
Dear all. Your project page is on overflow and appears at Category:Pages where template include size is exceeded (see the corresponding talk page). As a result, some parts of your page are not correctly displayed. Perhaps, you should consider splitting this page. For example, the section Tools could be moved to it's own page. Best regards. Pldx1 (talk) 16:53, 14 March 2016 (UTC)
 * Seems to be fixed now, likely following those edits? --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 07:52, 18 April 2016 (UTC)

Category:Recipients of the Order of the Smile has been nominated for discussion
Category:Recipients of the Order of the Smile, which is within the scope of this WikiProject, has been nominated for deletion. A discussion is taking place to see if it abides with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. RevelationDirect (talk) 00:37, 15 May 2016 (UTC)

Problematic category renamed in a problematic way
I don't think Categories_for_discussion/Log/2016_February_9 ended in a right way, but I missed it when it was happening. Aside of not being convinced there were any POV issues, the renaming possibly moved some people who were said functionaries but not "ubeks" into an ubek category. Thoughts? --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 07:51, 18 April 2016 (UTC)


 * Just saw this, as someone who did participate in that discussion. The consensus was that the "Stalinist functionaries" terms were derogatory but there were various suggestions for "fixing" the category. I don't think it would go against that CfD if you need to remove an article or two if it is now factually incorrect under the renamed article or also to create new categories that are objective and avoid non-neutral terms. I'll ping the nominator,  in case I'm speaking out of turn. RevelationDirect (talk) 00:47, 15 May 2016 (UTC)

Jasna Góra Monastery
The Jasna Góra Monastery article is in need of a little work. It needs a good copy edit, additional referencing (and possible expansion with info from Polish article Jasna Góra) -- Marek . 69    talk  22:18, 17 March 2016 (UTC)
 * Which is why it is just start class, like tens of thousands other articles that need improvement. I am not sure what's your point? It's just like all the other articles in Category:Start-Class Poland-related articles. --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 07:55, 18 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Hi Piotrus, I think I was trying to point out that the Polish article Jasna Góra contained a lot of valuable info + references which could be used to expand the English version. -- Marek . 69    talk  18:07, 18 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Which is true for thousands of articles. Not trying to be an a$$ by pointing it out, just thinking loudly that if we were to report all such articles here, we would have thousands of threads. I do appreciate your comment here, because it's good to see people using this page, but I cannot think of anything more constructive then to direct you to Expand language. --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 04:21, 15 May 2016 (UTC)

Borscht FAC
Members of this wikiproject may be interested in the featured article nomination for Borscht. A source review would be particularly appreciated, especially of the Polish-language sources that are used in the article. — Kpalion(talk) 06:07, 19 May 2016 (UTC)

Ustawa ?
Is ustawa a law or an act of Sejm?Xx236 (talk) 09:39, 16 June 2016 (UTC)

Should "Jewish nose" be moved to "Jewish nose stereotype"?
A suggestion has been made to change the title of Jewish nose to Jewish nose stereotype. One participant, after thoroughly losing the argument went, in opinion of some, on selective forum shopping. Therefore I am reposting his invitation where I think Jewish history took part as well. - üser:Altenmann >t 20:25, 19 June 2016 (UTC)

Requested move discussion: Oyneg Shabbos
There's a discussion at Talk:Oyneg Shabbos concerning a proposal to move the article Oyneg Shabbos, about the group that chronicled life in the Warsaw Ghetto during World War II and the archive they accumulated, to a new title. Please provide us with the benefit of your thoughts. Thank you. — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 04:26, 22 June 2016 (UTC)

Katyn massacre is a featured article
Unfortunately the lead misinforms. I have removed the biggest statement but I would need some help to describe the victims. If such description exists inside the page, - please copy it into the lead.Xx236 (talk) 10:41, 24 June 2016 (UTC)

Polish Social and Cultural Association
According to a Polish journalists from London the theatr is used by local schools, Cameron's children including.Xx236 (talk) 06:17, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

Help on band article
I'd like, if possible, to expand the article on Cool Kids of Death, but I'm having trouble because all the sources I've found are in Polish, and I can't read them. If anyone is interested in helping, that would be great. Many thanks, Kafka Liz (talk) 14:54, 9 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Please ping me if anyone can help with this. Thanks again, Kafka Liz (talk) 16:19, 9 July 2016 (UTC)

Members of the Sejm by term
I have proposed renaming the by-term subcategories of Category:Members of the Sejm of the Republic of Poland and Category:Members of the Sejm of the Polish People's Republic to a shorter format. A discussion is taking place to see if it conforms with the categorization guidelines. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the categories for discussion page. Thank you. -- Brown HairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 20:11, 16 July 2016 (UTC)

Polish_heraldry and genealogy
Please join the discussion in Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Heraldry_and_vexillology about how to correctly handle historical Polish concepts "ród",  "ród herbowy" vs. "House" & "Clan", etc. Staszek Lem (talk) 18:13, 10 August 2016 (UTC)

Is the disapperance of Joseph Conrad's memorial in Vologda notable?

 * http://windowoneurasia2.blogspot.com/2016/04/whats-statue-of-joseph-conrad-doing-in.html Xx236 (talk) 10:15, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
 * http://www.interfax.ru/russia/513624Xx236 (talk) 10:16, 28 June 2016 (UTC)


 * Classic Stalinist style disappearance (two photos):
 * CONRAD IS THERE http://newsvo.ru/sites/default/files/cc1de281385e56346c6d8006873b7b43.jpg
 * CONRAD IS NOT http://s9.stc.all.kpcdn.net/share/i/4/1128920/wx1080.jpg
 * – No one could do this without a noisy backhoe. The stone's just too heavy.  Poeticbent  <span style="color:#FFFFFF;font-size:7.0pt;font-weight:bold;background:#FF88AF;border:1px solid #DF2929;padding:0.0em 0.2em;">talk 12:03, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
 * Allegedly found June, the 15 .Xx236 (talk) 12:48, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
 * For those who don't read Russian, the monument was temporarily removed to fix a leaking water pipeline that runs underneath. Definitely not notable. — Kpalion(talk) 13:34, 28 June 2016 (UTC)
 * On the other hand, this is Russia and it looks like the water pipe fix was just a pretext; a month has passed and the monument has yet to return to its place, while locals say they haven't seen any actual work on repairing the pipeline. That said, it still seems to be only local news in Vologda, but not national news in any country. I would still say it's not notable enough for a Wikipedia article. — Kpalion(talk) 14:21, 15 July 2016 (UTC)
 * While is is not enough for an article, IMO the controversy is notable enough to mention in Joseph Conrad and Polonophobia articles. It is not just sloppiness of repairmen, see for further progress of the accident. Staszek Lem (talk) 18:44, 10 August 2016 (UTC)
 * What did i tell ya? The bursting pipe story was a cover up for the monument removal which was ordered in retaliation for the local Polonia festival called Culture and Modernity. Joseph Conrad and Vologda (Культура и современность. Джозеф Конрад и Вологда), as soon as the local officials realized that Conrad actually wrote about repressed Polish Sybiraks in the Vologda region.  Poeticbent  <span style="color:#FFFFFF;font-size:7.0pt;font-weight:bold;background:#FF88AF;border:1px solid #DF2929;padding:0.0em 0.2em;">talk 19:40, 10 August 2016 (UTC)
 * Do you have a source for that? Overall, a list of subject's monuments and honors and such is common in articles, and I think we can have a short sentence that said monument was removed, causing a minor controversy, too. There is also the question of the monument itself being notable, if it was created by a notable artist (on whose page it can be discussed too), or was classified as a monument / object of historical significance. --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 09:12, 11 August 2016 (UTC)
 * Here is how I see it. Even the monumented person is unknown to locals or sculptor is nonnotable, people usually don't care is a monuments just sits here, if only as a change for urban monotony. However in this case the monument found itself a group of superactive and powerful enough enemies to uproot the monument, who worked on this for quite some time. Of course this incident may be called "minor" compared to, say, migrant crisis, but it was covered in multiple source, not all of which were local. Of course it was not covered by major Russian media outlets which are under tight Putinist control. Staszek Lem (talk) 16:26, 11 August 2016 (UTC)
 * This scandal is now all over the Russian news. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpbkDLwDPYc  Poeticbent  <span style="color:#FFFFFF;font-size:7.0pt;font-weight:bold;background:#FF88AF;border:1px solid #DF2929;padding:0.0em 0.2em;">talk 19:11, 11 August 2016 (UTC)

Notability of Voivodeship Marshals
What's your take on notability of Voivodeship Sejmik Marshals like Gustaw Marek Brzezin? I don't think they meed WP:NPOLITICIAN, through that really depends whether we classify Voivodeship marshal as being a "sub-national (statewide/provincewide) office". Thoughts? --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 13:01, 18 August 2016 (UTC)


 * As much as I don't like most of them, the WP:POLITICIAN is pretty clear on that. Voivodeships are provinces of Poland, so their voivodes, marshals and such definitely fall into #1 category.  // Halibutt 09:48, 22 August 2016 (UTC)

Translation help with short reference
I'm currently working on an article in my sandbox for an animated short film called Le Building. While the film itself is French, I've happened across what appears to be a Polish-language review of the film. I can't tell for certain whether the review comes from an RS. Google Chrome's automatic translation service indicates that the website does have an editorial policy, but it would be good to have someone fluent in Polish look over the details. I'd also like to have a better translation of the article, than what Google can provide - that way, if the website is indeed RS, I can add accurate quotes to article I'm working on. Thanks. --Jpcase (talk) 18:43, 20 August 2016 (UTC)
 * The site does not look very reliable, and the quality of the few sentences make it similar to a comment-level user review of a product. It essentially says "this is a funny animation, I think it is worth watching", just in 3 or so sentences. --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 14:02, 22 August 2016 (UTC)
 * Sorry for the late response - and thanks for looking over the article! Are you certain that it isn't RS? What does the editorial policy say? --Jpcase (talk) 20:33, 27 August 2016 (UTC)
 * It is pretty much a user review on a niche website. I don't think it qualifies for reliable, and certainly does not help to estabilish notability. --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 07:00, 1 September 2016 (UTC)
 * The editorial policy says they invite young aspiring journalists to submit their reviews for free. They explicitly do not plan to hire any professionals. — Kpalion(talk) 06:01, 2 September 2016 (UTC)

Request for Stanisław Przybyszewski
Hello. I wonder whether someone from the project might consider adding a correct IPA pronunciation guide to the Stanisław Przybyszewski article? Many thanks,  • DP •  {huh?} 02:28, 4 September 2016 (UTC)
 * ✅ — Kpalion(talk) 20:50, 4 September 2016 (UTC)
 * Thankyou very much. Happy editing.  • DP •  {huh?} 21:02, 4 September 2016 (UTC)

Talk:Dukes_of_Polish-Lithuanian_Commonwealth
I haven't started a WP:RM yet, but interested editors may comment at Talk:Dukes_of_Polish-Lithuanian_Commonwealth on whether this article should be renamed to Princes of Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth or merged to Princely Houses of Poland.--<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 05:39, 19 August 2016 (UTC)
 * User:Kpalion, User:Staszek Lem, User:Camdan, perhaps you'd care to comment? --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 08:11, 29 August 2016 (UTC)
 * I would support merging, perhaps under a new name, Princely houses of Poland and Lithuania. — Kpalion(talk) 08:24, 29 August 2016 (UTC)
 * I support Kpalion on this. Usage of Commonwelth only to the time of the Commonweath. User:Camdan (talk) 14:25, 06 September 2016 (UTC)

The 10,000 Challenge
Hi, I've proposed an idea based on The 10,000 Challenge for a long term goal to include your country and northern Europe/Scandinavia in combined challenge target. At present I don't know whether to make it a smaller target like 1000 for each country individually. If active editors here are interested in seeing mass improvements for their country please comment in the discussion at the bottom of Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Intertranswiki. Thanks.♦ Dr. Blofeld  16:50, 11 September 2016 (UTC)

Deletion review for Order of Smile category
Please see Deletion_review/Log/2016_September_20. I am reporting this here as it will not show on article alerts. --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 02:28, 20 September 2016 (UTC)

Discussion
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Military_history#Invasion_of_Poland.23Misconceptions Xx236 (talk) 07:57, 12 October 2016 (UTC)

Territorial Defence Forces
Hi!

Currently, there are two distinct articles that are very similarly named. One is "Territorial Defense Forces (Poland)" (which concerns the Obrona Terytorium Kraju from 1965 to 2008) and the other is "Territorial Defence Force (Poland)" (which concerns the nascent Wojska Obrony Terytorialnej). The distinction between defense and defence is mostly one of American English versus British English, and the distinction between using the plural and singular is similarly confusing. In either case, the older militia is also referred to as "Territorial Defence Force" is this paper, for example.

I suggest either article (or both) should be renamed. Question is: to what? Gabbe (talk) 05:56, 10 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Ueh. The Obrona one is translated as plural (Forces), and Wojska as Force, where I'd think it should be the other way around. Not that there is a good solution, for minor entities like that there are probably several different translations out there. What we need is a disambig gathering them. There is already a notice on the top. If the official English sources are using such similar names, shrug, I don't know what we can do. I'll ping User:Nihil novi for his view on the language here. --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 07:58, 10 October 2016 (UTC)
 * I agree: the article titles (and the respective names of the two entities) should be reversed.  Nihil novi (talk) 00:24, 11 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Poland is a member of NATO. There should exist some documents in English.Xx236 (talk) 07:59, 12 October 2016 (UTC)

Invitation to Women in Food and Drink editathon
(To subscribe, Women in Red/Invite list. Unsubscribe, Women in Red/Opt-out list)

Title and POV of 1946 massacre of Belarusians by the Polish Cursed soldiers
Those issues may need discussion, see Talk:1946_massacre_of_Belarusians_by_the_Polish_Cursed_soldiers. --<sub style="border:1px solid #228B22;padding:1px;">Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 07:57, 25 October 2016 (UTC)

PROD: Bartłomiej Sipiński
FYI on the article that is within the scope of this project. K.e.coffman (talk) 07:20, 29 October 2016 (UTC)

Residential architecture in Poland
Unsourced disaster.Xx236 (talk) 07:03, 8 November 2016 (UTC)

Polish mythology redirects
There is currently a discussion at WP:RfD about several topics relating to Polish mythology and folklore. We would certainly like to hear the perspectives of editors who are familiar with Polish folklore. You can contribute to the discussion at Redirects for discussion/Log/2016 November 11. Best, -- Notecardforfree (talk) 03:21, 11 November 2016 (UTC)